There is literally NO LIMIT to their evil!!. US is confiscating rosaries of immigrants at border!!!

[bobbieinok]

PZ Myers has a link with picture of some rosaries confiscated. A worker posted this to inform people/YOU and ME. Meyers has this at his blog at freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula

[3catwoman3]

1. Why?

eom

[MineralMan]

2. How about posting the link, OK?

Never mind. I posted it downthread.

[Bob Loblaw]

3. How long before they start

extracting gold teeth?

[Croney]

4. I think taking a person's rosary is almost as bad as

yanking off a person's hijab. (And I'm an atheist.)

[MineralMan]

5. OK. Here's a much better link to this story, from the New Yorker

https://www.newyorker.com/culture/photo-booth/a-janitors-collection-of-things-confiscated-from-migrants-in-the-desert

It's not just rosaries, but all sorts of personal items. You can see several photos at the link above.

And here's the actual pharyngula link, in case you want to read it:

https://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/2018/05/28/this-is-what-we-do/

[Hortensis]

40. Yes, this has been done somewhat for years. Despicable.

There are bag eggs in any group, but work that requires cruelty and satisfies bigotry must draw a lot more than usual.

[Achilleaze]

6. Catholics aren't "christians" in the eyes of fungelicals

Kinda sick. Just like the sick split in Islam.

They forget that the so-called Puritan christians fled europe to America to get away from the persecution by other sects of christianity that held the power. So now the fungelicals persecute those who they deem to be the wrong brand of their "faith." Their whole thing is either whining about being persecuted, or ganging up to persecute others.

#Basta

[Drahthaardogs]

17. They forget that Coptic Catholicism is the oldest Church

In Christianity.

In fact, if you are inclined to study theology, one could argue rather well that Christianity ends where Calvinism begins.

[PatSeg]

36. It doesn't appear to be selective

They confiscated everything: wallets, IDs, debit cards, keys, birth control pills, toothbrushes, sunglasses etc. It is a dehumanizing tactic used by the Nazis.

[oberliner]

7. This is from 2015

What garbage at a US Border Patrol facility reveals about the migrant journey

October 09, 2015 · 1:00 PM EDT

Tom Kiefer worked as a janitor and groundskeeper at the US Customs and Border Protection processing facility in Ajo, Arizona.

It’s about 40 miles from the US-Mexico border and it’s where migrants detained by agents at the border await their next step in their either successful or failed journey to the United States. Many will face deportation back home, mostly to Mexico or parts of Central America.

It was sometime in the fourth year when Kiefer, a photographer, started noticing — and photographing — trends among the items tossed into the trash at the holding facility. Like being processed at jail, migrants are stripped of their personal belongings.

https://www.pri.org/stories/2015-10-09/what-garbage-us-border-patrol-facility-reveals-about-migrant-journey

Here's his photo of the rosaries (from 2015):
?itok=0uG-RIrR

[GoCubsGo]

13. Yet, not a peep from the Catholic Church...

Local or the Vatican. If they are on it, they need to be a hell of a lot more vocal about it.

[Demsrule86]

23. However, the policy began and was in place since Bush as noted...

The New Yorker is a better source than the one you provided as dates are included.

"Kiefer, who is now fifty-eight, had moved to Ajo from Los Angeles, in 2001, hoping to simplify his life, purchase a home, and focus on his passion: taking pictures. (Previously, he’d been a collector and dealer of antique cast-iron bed frames, and, before that, a graphic designer.) He took the C.B.P. job, in 2003, for purely practical reasons: it paid ten dollars and forty-two cents an hour, and it seemed unlikely to steal mental space away from his photography projects. Now he began photographing his C.B.P. collection in his studio, arranging and rearranging items, sometimes putting a single stuffed animal or T-shirt in the frame, more often capturing like with like: dozens of roll-on deodorant sticks, hundreds of nail clippers. Today, he has taken hundreds of photographs of objects he brought home from the processing center. Together they make up “El Sueño Americano” (“The American Dream”), an ongoing project that, thanks to its unconventional perspective on U.S. migrant policies, has launched Kiefer into a photography career he’s dreamed of for decades."

https://www.newyorker.com/culture/photo-booth/a-janitors-collection-of-things-confiscated-from-migrants-in-the-desert

[oberliner]

24. Yes, indeed

Things have been ugly at the border for a long, long time.

[Demsrule86]

28. So perhaps we should give Trump cover by making a Democratic president share the blame for such

abuses. Trump's policies are very different from Obama's.

[hexola]

31. And posts like the OP mask that difference...they fell for the mis-info

And that's what you want...you want the totality of all immigration atrocities attributed to Trump...?

You are comfortable with dems being manipulated with lies?

[hexola]

32. Unfortunately these photos evoke an image of

Selective persecution...like the guards were "check them for Rosaries...!"

And if they found one - they put in a barrel with all the rest.

Its sounds more like they took EVERYTHING - (not surprising - basic protocol for taking people in custody)

And this odd fellow - plucked this stuff out of the dumpster and aggregated it for his photos.

Taken as a whole - the photos are indeed powerful and sad...

[left-of-center2012]

8. Your linked article links to this New Yorker article

Rosaries were one of many items confiscated.
They were not ‘singled out’.

From the New Yorker article :
He’d always known, technically, about the C.B.P.’s strict confiscation policies, which were posted on bilingual signs and applied to all items classified as either “non-essential” or “potentially lethal.”

many of the confiscated items—including cell phones and wallets, many still containing I.D.s, prepaid debit cards, and cash—were ending up in the trash, never to be returned.
..........................

The policy makes no sense to me,
but again,
rosaries were not singled out.

[oberliner]

9. Also his photos were published in 2015

He received an award for those photos at the time.

Folks can learn more about it here:

El Sueno: An Americano Project

https://www.lensculture.com/articles/tom-kiefer-el-sueno-an-americano-project

[Demsrule86]

25. That is so different...they took everything not just one thing

or The policy was in place under Bush.

[Kirk Lover]

10. "They are discarded" like the migrants themselves. nt

[Demsrule86]

11. They stole everything from the Jews too.

[oberliner]

15. The Nazis then systematically exterminated said Jews

Not a remotely apt comparison.

[dawg]

19. And did they start that extermination right away?

No. They did not.

It started with shit just like this.

Personally, I think Godwin's Law has been, of necessity, utterly repealed.

[oberliner]

22. Yes

The actions of the Border Patrol during the Bush and Obama administrations (which is what the OP is about) are not similar to the actions of Nazi Germany and did not lead to the extermination of anyone.

[Demsrule86]

30. No they didn't start the slaughter right away...there were attacks and theft and then the

extermination began.

[oberliner]

35. US Border Patrol agents have been confiscating items for decades

This has not resulted in mass extermination of millions of people - which occurred within less than ten years in Nazi Germany.

[Demsrule86]

39. Ah but now they have their 'Hitler' Trump...there were pogroms and discrimination leading up to the

slaughter of Jews...but it really began with a disinformation campaign begun by Hitler to turn the Jews into 'animals' sound familiar? How about "even the children aren't so innocent" (Trump said that) than the imprisonment and theft began and then came the death squads...before there was organized genocide you had brown shirts (like ICE) killing individuals...did you hear about the woman shot in the head by Ice? It is exactly the same path, and it should scare the crap out of all of us.

[dawg]

33. No, they did not. Read some history.

"The Third Reich first used concentration camps as places of unlawful incarceration of political opponents and other "enemies of the state". Large numbers of Jews were not sent there until after Kristallnacht in November 1938.[174] Although death rates were high, the camps were not designed as killing centers.[17"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Holocaust

[oberliner]

34. Yes, they did

Border Patrol agents confiscating items has been going on for decades on the US Border.

The systematic extermination of millions of Jews began within less than ten years of the Nazis taking power.

By the way, consider consulting sources other than "Wikipedia" to learn about the Holocaust.

[dawg]

37. Within 10 years is "right away" to you?

Give me a fucking break.

And now you don't care for Wikipedia as s source? Read any fucking book on the holocaust and Nazi Germany. You'll find the same information.

I don't even understand why you want to argue about what is established history.

Terrible things like Nazi Germany don't happen all at once. And they begin with the exact same sort of shit that we are beginning to tolerate in this country right now. Why the hell do you even want to argue against this?

I'm not saying that it's a sure thing that we're going to continue down this terrible path. Only that we have started.

And if you can't see that, it's only because you are choosing not to.

[Demsrule86]

20. I think it is apt...already some have died in custody which is what happened in Germany

before mass exterminations began. It is a dangerous path...and I can't understand how you miss the similarities.

[oberliner]

21. It's not

The actions of the Border Patrol during the Obama administration (which is what the OP is about) are not similar to the actions of Nazi Germany in any respect.

[Demsrule86]

26. It is apt. This is how it began for the jews...for they were robbed and then they were murdered.

[left-of-center2012]

14. Is this still happening? This is from 2015

[Ms. Toad]

18. Yes.

Here's an article about it. The study referenced was completed in 2013, but the article indicates it is a continuing problem.

One of the contributing factors is that belongs are supposed to be destroyed after 30 days, on the presumption that they will be released and have time to retrieve their belongings - but the current detentions are far longer than 30 days, with no formal means to preserve their belongings beyond 30 days.

http://arizonasonoranewsservice.com/immigrant-possessions-disappear-during-deportation/

[Ms. Toad]

16. As in other recently posted rants of outrage at Trump, most of the story predates Trump.

One day in 2007, he was rummaging through these bags looking for packaged food, which he’d received permission to donate to a local pantry. In the process, he also noticed toothbrushes, rosaries, pocket Bibles, water bottles, keys, shoelaces, razors, mix CDs, condoms, contraceptive pills, sunglasses, keys: a vibrant, startling testament to the lives of those who had been detained or deported.

. . .

Kiefer, who is now fifty-eight, had moved to Ajo from Los Angeles, in 2001, hoping to simplify his life, purchase a home, and focus on his passion: taking pictures. (Previously, he’d been a collector and dealer of antique cast-iron bed frames, and, before that, a graphic designer.) He took the C.B.P. job, in 2003, for purely practical reasons: it paid ten dollars and forty-two cents an hour, and it seemed unlikely to steal mental space away from his photography projects. Now he began photographing his C.B.P. collection in his studio, arranging and rearranging items, sometimes putting a single stuffed animal or T-shirt in the frame, more often capturing like with like: dozens of roll-on deodorant sticks, hundreds of nail clippers. Today, he has taken hundreds of photographs of objects he brought home from the processing center. Together they make up “El Sueño Americano” (“The American Dream”), an ongoing project that, thanks to its unconventional perspective on U.S. migrant policies, has launched Kiefer into a photography career he’s dreamed of for decades.

Yes, it is evil - but we all bear some blame for remaining silent all these years when our administration was involved it similar or identical practices.

Here's a 2015 CNN photo collection that includes a photo of confiscated rosaries: https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/cnnphotos-american-dream-mexico-migrants-items/index.html

[Demsrule86]

27. It was in place under Bush. So personally I won't blame Pres. Obama like

Trump is doing.
https://www.newyorker.com/culture/photo-booth/a-janitors-collection-of-things-confiscated-from-migrants-in-the-desert

[sl8]

29. "Bordering on Criminal: The Routine Abuse of Migrants in the Removal System"

Link to PDF:
https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Daniel_Martinez55/publication/280133501_Bordering_on_Criminal_Routine_Abuse_of_Migrants_in_the_Removal_System_Part_2/links/55ac0beb08ae481aa7ff4971/Bordering-on-Criminal-Routine-Abuse-of-Migrants-in-the-Removal-System-Part-2.pdf

Bordering on Criminal:
The Routine Abuse of Migrants in the
Removal System

Part II: Possessions Taken and Not Returned

by Daniel E. Martínez, Jeremy Slack, and Josiah Heyman

About This Series
This is the second in a series of three reports we will be releasing that highlight findings from the
second wave of the Migrant Border Crossing Study (MBCS). Wave II of the MBCS, currently
housed in the Center for Latin American Studies at the University of Arizona and the Department
of Sociology at George Washington University, is a binational, multi-institution study of 1,110
randomly selected, recently repatriated migrants1 surveyed in six Mexican cities between 2009
and 2012 (see las.arizona.edu/mbcs for the full report and methodology).

This report focuses on the issue of repatriated migrants’ belongings being taken and not
returned by U.S. authorities. Overall, we find that the taking of belongings and the
failure to return them is not a random, sporadic occurrence, but a systematic practice.
One indication of this is that just over one-third of deportees report having belongings taken
and not returned. Perhaps one of the most alarming findings is that, among deportees who
were carrying Mexican identification cards, 1 out of every 4 had their card taken and not
returned. The taking of possessions, particularly identity documents, can have serious
consequences and is an expression of how dysfunctional the deportation system is. Our study
finds that migrants processed through Operation Streamline, or held in detention for a week or
longer, are most likely to have their possessions taken and not returned.

...

[sl8]

38. I'd think that the confiscation of their money and IDs would be a more pressing problem for them.

Imagine finding yourself in an unfamiliar town or city with no money or identification.

[Autumn]

41. They have for years that picture was from 2015.

It's disgraceful now and it was disgraceful then.