The Platform of The Movement for Black Lives

[Garrett78]

Do centrists support this: https://policy.m4bl.org/platform/

???

[MuseRider]

1. A very hurried reading

and I think this is very good! I will read it better with less noise and distraction and will likely sign into it.

This makes me happy, that and the new app in KC to support black businesses.

It is way passed time we all get behind this in a big way.

[NCTraveler]

2. For those not aware....

The Movement for Black Lives is a coalition of just over 50 organizations including Black Lives Matter.

One of this groups main goals is to coordinate with others in order to put up a united front and to establish a platform.

To answer your question about centrists supporting this platform, this centrist would. I do know some to the left of me who would call this a white jobs killing program. Directing questions like this at centrist is the wrong way to go. Many further to the left are about as racist as they come. Was it Joe Manchin who blocked a pathway to citizenship because it threatened jobs being held by whites?

We need to stop whitewashing racism.

[Tom Rinaldo]

3. Manchin isn't to the left of centrist. He defines it.

He might only seem left of center at times to some because of how dramatically the Republican Party has veered hard Right.

[NCTraveler]

4. I never said he was to the left of centrists.

I didn't even insinuate it.

The answer to the question is no. You have presented the appropriate person for the answer.

[Tom Rinaldo]

5. Sorry that I misunderstood n/t

[Garrett78]

8. There are certainly those on the left who underestimate racism's role.

I've written about this at length. And there may even be *some* self-proclaimed leftists who are "as racist as they come," though there's no doubt *some* self-proclaimed centrists who are also "as racist as they come." So, I'm not sure that's useful hyperbole, especially when we haven't defined the terms (see below).

My mentioning centrists in the OP stems from the recent discussions about "centrists." A posted article made the claim, based on survey results, that "centrists" are possibly a greater threat to democracy than "extremists." Those criticizing the article weren't defining the terms, nor did the author of the article define the terms. So, I started a thread asking people to define the term "centrist." I mostly just got vague platitudes in response. Only a few mentioned specific issues (with nobody defining "centrist" in terms of numerous specific issues). These terms get tossed around haphazardly without any thought.

Thus my question regarding The Platform of TM4BL. I could also ask, Is The Platform of TM4BL so 'radical' that only "extremists" support it?

Because when we live in a society in which the dominant narrative says the likes of Collins and McCain (or Manchin) are "moderates," while The Platform of TM4BL is "extremist," something is really, really wrong. Wrong beyond words. There has not been sufficient pushback against this narrative, ceding turf to the GOP.

[NCTraveler]

9. "So, I'm not sure that's useful hyperbole"

You cannot agree with the sentiment in one sentence and then call it hyperbole in the next. Fact is that it isn’t hyperbole.

And if you want to have the conversation in terms of centrism, comparisons as to why that poses little significance outside of deviceveness should be fully acceptable conversation. Specially when the darling of the left blocked over ten million people from a pathway to citizenship in order to protect predominately white jobs.

“Is The Platform of TM4BL so 'radical' that only "extremists" support it? ”

You and I seem to be in a different place. I don’t find this to be an extremist organization as you do. I think it’s a fair assumption that the organization has overall support for the platform. That is the metric you are trying to use as an indicator of extremism.

Again, this centrist is on board for a lot of the platform. The items are nothing new. They haven’t been sold to the public in mass and that is a big part of systemic racism. It’s all of our jobs to sell it. There is some great stuff here but unfortunately it isn’t being shared as a way to debate its merits. It’s being shared as a way to explore division.

Do centrists support this. This centrist supports a majority of it. Even that to which I think would never work are great for reading and education.

Centrist this. Centrist that. All while the isolationist left spews racism daily.

We have racists in or ranks. Racism knows no political ideology. Some are able to look past their inherent racism in a way to see how items like this fit into their ideology. Our ranks are full of those as well.

[Garrett78]

10. Misunderstanding.

The quotation marks around "as racist as they come" indicate disagreement in this case, and not agreement (so, no, I'm not agreeing in one sentence and then calling it hyperbole in the next). I agree that there are *some* very racist leftists, just as I think there are *some* very racist centrists (that's a given, I think). But what you wrote is hyperbolic, and it's not useful precisely because the same phrase could be applied to self-proclaimed centrists or any other group. I've been critical of Sanders and his supporters (see the first link in my previous reply), but any suggestion that he's "as racist as they come" (see KKK and neo-Nazis) is hyperbolic. And your average Bernie Sanders supporter (outliers aside) has got nothing on the likes of Stephen Miller or Steve Bannon (much less your average KKK member).

But let's put aside the question of whether or not what you wrote is hyperbole, as that's beside the point. Of course I agree there are self-proclaimed leftists who are racist. No doubt about it. There are racists in every group, as you suggest, though there are without question far more among self-proclaimed conservatives/Libertarians/Republicans. This is a white supremacist, patriarchal society in which we live, after all. Hell, there are racists who voted for Obama.

As for The Platform of TM4BL, I don't think it's extremist. I think it's perfectly reasonable, incredibly thorough and something that should be read by everyone (that's why I've posted a link to it in a variety of posts/contexts). But the dominant narrative in this society would say it is extremist, while the likes of Collins and McCain are "moderate," which is absurd. People need to recognize that allowing that narrative to take hold has ceded turf to the GOP.

Really, the main point I've been making is that people are using these terms haphazardly without defining them. As I posted in my thread asking people to define "centrist":

I'm wondering what everyone considers to be a centrist position on specific issues. Everything from health care to taxes to higher education to climate change and environmental protection in general to gun control to equal pay for women to wages in general to immigration to capital punishment to drug laws to defense spending to LGBTQ rights to all that which is in the platform of The Movement for Black Lives.

Nobody seems willing to do that, which suggests most who use terms like "centrist" or "extreme left" haven't thought critically or specifically about what those terms might mean. If we hope to combat the narrative mentioned above, which has unfortunately established roots, we need to stop and think critically instead of going along with said narrative. But, instead, mostly you just see vague comments like "centrists are those between the extremes." What the hell does that actually mean?

[Tom Rinaldo]

6. It's a good Radical Platform

It reminds me of my youth, seriously; late 60's early 70's. Our organizing was hard against the system, and the system was often described in terms then that only those who were already opposed to it could relate to. It strengthened our internal cohesion around values and goals - but only worked as outreach with those with similar predispositions. I very much doubt that many centrists will embrace this platform upon reading it, though many of them could support some initiatives consistent with parts of it.

[Garrett78]

7. That radical platform sure seems common sensical to me.

But we live in a society where the dominant narrative says the likes of Collins and McCain are moderates. That's effed up beyond words.