Puzzle me this, how is it that we are in a War and its not mentioned in either Presidential campaign

[1-Old-Man]

Afghanistan, remember it?

[Fumesucker]

1. Neither campaign disagrees with the war..

What is there to talk about?

[woo me with science]

65. In a nutshell.

No need to talk about police state legislation either, or the coming new round of austerity budget cuts.

[Octafish]

73. 'Money trumps peace' is buy-partisan.

Big Time.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=2177500&mesg_id=2177669

[hedgehog]

2. Obama is on track to get us out of Afghanistan.

Romney wants to go to war with Iran.

Any questions?

[1-Old-Man]

6. Yes, what in hell is 'on track' supposed to mean?

Are there fewer troops there this month than last, have fewer people been killed this month than last, have we stopped sending replacements for troops who are rotating to other posts, has the funding for the war been decreased or have we halted military aid to the country, have war equipment shipments to the country ended, are we flying fewer drone missions there now than in the past? Tell me, just how in hell are we on track to get us out?

[lunatica]

11. Troops will start coming home from Afghanistan this month

"Of the 91,000 troops currently in Afghanistan, 23,000 will return to the U.S. by the end of the summer; the remaining 68,000 will gradually come home through December 2014."

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/05/02/11507282-troops-returning-home-to-strained-veterans-affairs-system?lite

[1-Old-Man]

12. So they're not actually on track yet, but they should be next month? Is that the answer?

[pnwmom]

16. Since they will be starting to coming home this month, they're already taking steps to get them out.

You can't move that many people instantly. So, yes, they're actually on track.

[lunatica]

19. Equipment has been coming home

It takes time.

I suggest you answer your own questions. Google is your friend.

[woo me with science]

32. "Equipment has been coming home."

US Sends Ships, Planes To Persian Gulf As Tension Mounts' - NYT
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/48054863/ns/world_news-the_new_york_times/

US Sends Sea Drones to Persian Gulf
http://www.thedailybeast.com/cheats/2012/07/12/u-s-sends-sea-drones-to-persian-gulf.html

War in August? US sends fourth aircraft carrier and dozens of underwater drones towards Iran
http://rt.com/usa/news/war-sub-drone-iran-066/

So now we're going into Syria
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021060673

[lunatica]

43. Tension mounting and actual war aren't the same thing

We are not at war with Iran at this moment. That's another fact you seem to want to ignore.

[woo me with science]

46. Unreal. Absolutely unreal.

Multiple wars and proxy wars going. We are going into Syria and beating the drums on Iran. The MIC will be sustained, as it always is....as it always is....as it always is.

This is a nonsensical, Alice in Wonderland conversation. You want to argue that the sky is green and the grass is red, and the chocolate ration has been increased.

Read the papers. Count the wars. Count the drones. Count the dead. Look at the new wars coming. Look at the military budget, which has crept beyond the military budget and now includes attempts to conceal military funding all over the place.

Wake up, for god's sake. This is silly. This is beyond silly.

Wake up and face reality.

[whatchamacallit]

50. +1

[datasuspect]

60. a-fucking-men

enough with the PR and marketing bullshit.

shit's gonna get real pretty damn soon and people need to wake the fuck up.

[Octafish]

74. +2

Thank you for putting it into words, exactly, woo me with science.

[Oilwellian]

77. +3

There are none so blind as those who refuse to see.

War has been a racket for my entire life. It's no surprise the propaganda over the past 50 years has conditioned the American people to accept it as just a part of life. We don't need to discuss it in a presidential campaign. Sheesh.

[sibelian]

80. Thank you.

[SammyWinstonJack]

44. Granddaughter's husband stationed Ft Bliss is scheduled to leave for Afghanistan in Dec. for a tour

[woo me with science]

66. Shh.

Doesn't fit with the messaging.

(Thank you.)

[emilyg]

76. We just heard a local

young soldier killed. Wonder how his family feels about on "on track".

[nichomachus]

36. Obama has already gone to war with Iran

He ordered a wave of cyberattacks against them. If someone did that to the US we would call it terrorism and delcare war against the guilty party.

[woo me with science]

75. THANK YOU.

Last edited Thu Aug 9, 2012, 11:39 PM - Edit history (2)

If we have any proof that our media is utterly worthless except as a tool for the one percent, it's the fact that this was reported as a trivial blip and NEVER MENTIONED AGAIN.

[RC]

70. No need for a war in Afghanistan, when can have clean Drone Wars in Pakistan and elsewhere.

Our troops are safe. The drone murders are secret until the target country objects, then it is too late. The MIC gets their pay off. What could be better?

[slackmaster]

3. Romney won't bring it up because it's Bush's fault. Obama won't because he has failed to end it.

There's no mystery.

[Bonobo]

4. Republicans can't be against the war

because they are well, Republicans.

Democrats can't be against the war because Obama has claimed the war as his own and escalated it.

Any more questions?

BTW, those who wish to claim that Obama is "getting us out of it" have to contend with:

A) The fact that he escalated it including in terms of troop numbers and drone attacks, and
B) The fact that he had 4 years to get us out and has not done so -even if he does "get us out" in a few years, it will not erase A)

[lunatica]

8. Troops will start coming home from Afghanistan this month

"Of the 91,000 troops currently in Afghanistan, 23,000 will return to the U.S. by the end of the summer; the remaining 68,000 will gradually come home through December 2014."

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/05/02/11507282-troops-returning-home-to-strained-veterans-affairs-system?lite

[Bonobo]

17. He escalated the war and it has spread to multiple countries.

THAT is what is not being discussed.

If it is worth getting out now, why was it not done earlier?

[lunatica]

22. You're ignoring the facts

He's bringing the troops home. That's a fact too.

[woo me with science]

25. Good grief.

Talk about ignoring the facts.

[lunatica]

41. How about paying attention to ALL the facts

Instead of nit picking your favorite ones because they justify your rage? I'm perfectly aware of the rest. Did I need to repeat all of the rest to get your damned approval? I don't believe so.

[woo me with science]

47. Good god.

The level of denial would be funny if it weren't so fucking sad...

[area51]

28. +1 n/t

[ananda]

5. "A" war ??

I thought it was at least five.

[1-Old-Man]

13. Dam good point.

[woo me with science]

24. Thank you. And don't forget the brand new...

Syria, anyone?

[lunatica]

7. Obama is already getting troops out of Afghanistan to end that war

And Obama has mentioned ending the wars quite a few times.

"Of the 91,000 troops currently in Afghanistan, 23,000 will return to the U.S. by the end of the summer; the remaining 68,000 will gradually come home through December 2014."

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/05/02/11507282-troops-returning-home-to-strained-veterans-affairs-system?lite

[woo me with science]

26. They always "mention" ending the wars...especially during election years.

Meanwhile, they start new ones.

Good grief, pay attention.

[lame54]

9. Because Obama has him on the ropes with his tax returns

[Liberal Veteran]

10. We have always been at war with Eastasia.

Or at least it feels like it.

[woo me with science]

27. No shit. The denial in this thread is stunning.

The chocolate ration has been increased, too.

[MichiganVote]

14. Pfft...its only death and trillions of non existent Bush money. Is this the fault of the schools?

[MrDiaz]

15. it is simple really

Both candidates like wars. If Obama doesn't we wouldn't be in them! WE are currently implementing sanctions on Iran that will eventually lead to war. Lol war is one thing they both agree on.

[AnotherMcIntosh]

31. Only "one thing they both agree on"? >

What about another let's-send-more-jobs-to-foreign-countries "free-trade" agreement? The pending NAFTA of the Pacific?

Trans-Pacific negotiations have been taking place throughout the Obama presidency. The deal is strongly supported by the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, the top lobbying group for American corporations. Obama's Republican opponent in the 2012 presidential elections, Mitt Romney, has urged the U.S. to finalize the deal as soon as possible.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/13/obama-trade-document-leak_n_1592593.html

If anyone is going to opposition to the pending job-transferring "free-trade" agreement, it may be the Democratic Senators. It is not going to be the presidential candidates. This may be our last chance to influence and vote for Democratic Senators who might vote against the pending job-transferring "free-trade" agreement.

Here's the let's-send-jobs-to-foreign-coutries "free-trade" agreements that have been signed so far:
1994 - NAFTA

2001 - Jordan – United States Free Trade Agreement
2004 - Australia-United States Free Trade Agreement
2004 - Chile - United States Free Trade Agreement
2004 - Singapore – United States Free Trade Agreement
2005 - Dominican Republic–Central America Free Trade Agreement (DR-CAFTA; incl. Costa Rica, El Salvador, Guatemala, Honduras, Nicaragua, and the Dominican Republic)
2006 - Bahrain – United States Free Trade Agreement
2006 - Morocco - United States Free Trade Agreement
2006 - Oman – United States Free Trade Agreement
2007 - Peru – United States Trade Promotion Agreement

2011 - Panama - United States Trade Promotion Agreement
2011 - Colombia - United States Trade Promotion Agreement
2011 - Republic of Korea (South Korea) - United States Free Trade Agreement

[woo me with science]

35. War policy, economic policy, police state policy.

On these the Third Way and Republicans agree and are complicit.

All the other vicious disagreements between corporate Democrats and corporate Republicans are for our consumption and to distract from the steady progress in these three areas...

[AnotherMcIntosh]

62. In the last election, Insane McCain and Caribou Barbie did not seem to be real candidates ready to

discuss and make policy decisions on real issues. McCain's claim to fame was that his grandfather was a famous admiral in WW II and he was a prisoner after downing five planes. (All five, including the one that he lost in flight school, were our planes.) Caribou Barbie's claim to fame was that she could wear designer glasses, smile, and say stupid things with no inhibition.

Now we have Etch-a-Sketch Rmoney. His claim to fame on political matters seems to be that (1) he was responsible for the adoption of Romneycare in Massachusetts by which the purchase of health insurance from private profiteers is mandatory and (2) he's a Republican.

Are these real candidates? Or just token representatives? Thinking people probably know the answer.

[Proud Liberal Dem]

34. I don't get that President Obama LIKES wars

but he inherited two from Bush and he felt obligated to wrap them up in an orderly manner. I am concerned about the Iran situation but if he really wanted to go to war with Iran, we'd probably already be in it- though how any sane or reasonable person could want a military entanglement with Iran (which would likely go regional) is beyond me. I just have a bad feeling that we're going to get dragged into something there by Israel, whose current government seems to be chomping at the bit to pick a fight with Iran. I would suspect that we would see an attack on Iran as a near certainty under Romney.

[woo me with science]

37. It has nothing to do with "liking" wars.

It has to do with serving corporate masters. It is a deeply systemic and structural problem related to corporate money flooding our government and determining policy. The Military Industrial Complex is a massive center of power and profit for the one percent, and it is deeply embedded in our economy and governmental structure. There have been plans in place to restructure the Middle East to the advantage of the corporate one percent for decades, and anyone who aspires to be President faces massive financial and political pressures to continue the march and grow the MIC.

Not to mention that our electoral system is so purchased by the one percent and so driven by massive amounts of money that it is virtually impossible to get the backing for a Presidential race without the support of the one percent who demand these wars.

We get candidates who are already on board.

This is about people finally acknowledging the truth: that military policy does not change significantly from administration to administration....that all the predictable talk we hear every election cycle about drawing down troops and ending wars never comes to pass once the broader picture is considered, that our tax dollars are poured into bloody empire for the profit of a few...while Americans at home are increasingly desperate...that nobody in Washington is taking on this corruption, because they are deeply embedded into the system....and that it will take the outrage of Americans finally standing up and saying "no more" before it will ever end.

[morningfog]

18. Nor do we hear of acts of war in multiple other nations.

Recent strikes in Pakistan and Yemen get nary a mention.

I am sure we will get discussions on striking Iran and Syria, though.

[woo me with science]

29. Nope, we don't talk about drones and proxy wars.

Tax dollars of the desperate pouring into bloody wars of choice...That is so inconvenient to shiny political campaigns.

[sendero]

20. Because pointless counterproductive..

... "wars" are the new normal. Nothing to see here.

[Yeah Its Spin]

21. Old Man must be a General on the ground

[SammyWinstonJack]

45. ...

[msanthrope]

52. 101st Chairborne. nt

[woo me with science]

23. MULTIPLE wars. And silent on the police state, too.

They don't talk about the massive new spy center in Utah to allow warrantless access to all our emails and phone calls. Or the militarization of our police forces.

We are in a theater campaign run by the one percent.

[Junkdrawer]

30. From "The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy"

...

And so this is the situation we find: a succession of Galactic Presidents who so much enjoy the fun and palaver of being in power that they very rarely notice that they're not.

...

http://absolutelypointless.net/hhgttg/guide_g.html

Looks like an actor, but not really....

[sarcasmo]

40. +1

[stuntcat]

72. +1

Word for word

We will never not be at war again.

[woo me with science]

33. K&R We get all theater, all the time.

Have we had it with the Kabuki theater yet, America?

Are we awake yet?

[Bragi]

38. There is bipartisan agreement that war is the natural state of affairs /nt

[sarcasmo]

39. This country is numb to war. I would bet you that a high parentage of

the population doesn't even know we are at war.

[woo me with science]

51. We don't declare wars anymore,

and we certainly don't advertise them. The MIC does whatever the hell it wants, and the people have nothing to do with it...

except for the fact that they are taking the money we desperately need for our cities, our schools, and our families to do it, that we are being impoverished and other countries being devastated for the profit of these warmongers, and that we are increasingly hated by the rest of the world.

They don't even ask us anymore. They just let us know after the fact. If we ever had a representative government, it is long gone.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

42. Neither of them want to admit we lost another war.

[nadinbrzezinski]

48. What war? Go shopping!

Which is part of the problem.

[woo me with science]

53. Oh, our media keeps us VERY aware of politics!

We know exactly how long Anthony Weiner's wiener is!

[nadinbrzezinski]

61. Not long enough

That olympic rower, yowzers!

Some of the issues they run up the flag pole are just weird, but make sense in a puritan society, I s'pose.

[kestrel91316]

49. We have ALWAYS been at war with EastAsia.

[cr8tvlde]

54. The US has been at war/regime change/paying off friendly dictators/whatever

Since we got hooked on the economic largess that mushroomed in WW II. Building military bases for fun and profit, providing a jobs and education program for young Americans, soaking the American taxpayer to pay for it, and becoming the global currency/policeman. What's not to like for the 1%

[RBInMaine]

55. Guess you aren't listening. Obama mentions it ALL THE TIME and that he is working to END it.

[whatchamacallit]

56. Too real for American Political Reality TV

Hell, we don't even care about that shit in here. It's all about Romney's bitch-wife's horse...

[Scuba]

57. It's the "new normal"...

When your choices are to let your wife die without healthcare or join the military, what do you do?


http://abcnews.go.com/WN/health-insurance-unemployed-man-joins-army-coverage-wifes/story?id=9420613#.UCPe06GPWW0

"I was concerned she was going to need continuing treatment, and with the lapse in coverage, I didn't want that lapse," said Bill Caudle. "That's what everyone told me," said Michelle, "with the cancer, don't let the health insurance lapse." The Caudles have three children -- Alycia, now 21; Bill Jr., 18; and Chelsea, 14.

...

Bill Caudle worked as a raw materials coordinator for a firm called PolyOne. He had been on the payroll there for 20 years when he was laid off, another victim of the fragile economy.

The Caudles say the doctors and staff at the Aurora West Allis Medical Center have been wonderful. But there is only so much they can do to keep Michelle's cancer in check, and the medical bills are staggering.

Bill is now in basic training at Ft. Knox, Ky. He is 39. Some of the drill sergeants are half his age.

Emphasis mine. Desperate people will continue to "volunteer" to die for their Country as long as they are destitute.

[NNN0LHI]

58. Let me ask you something 1-Old-Man

Were you initially for or against invading and occupying Afghanistan?

Don

[1-Old-Man]

68. Against - I have been against wars, all wars, since my 3rd tour in Viet Nam ('69-70)

[datasuspect]

59. because getting fat white haters to eat more chicken sandwiches is more important

or dancing with the stars

or sarah palin's latest verbal diahrrea.

[barbtries]

63. another marine just died there.

he was from NC. NPR still reports the deaths; they occur quite frequently.

[BrendaBrick]

78. Yes.

I noticed that too. PBS also has a moment of silence during their broadcast listing the pictures, name, age, rank and hometown of the deceased.

[SCVDem]

64. I thoughr this was about

The senseless War On Drugs.

The Stan is not quite as bad.


Both suck!

[just1voice]

67. because "the war" is against the American people

and that wouldn't sell well in our propaganda press.

[progressivebydesign]

69. We have a timeline to end Bush's war, and the President isn't the GOP and wont' exploit it. n/t

[Martin Eden]

71. Because mentioning it helps neither campaign.

The Romney campaign doesn't mention it because advocaing the expenditure of more blood & treasure in Afghanistan would be highly unpopular, and also because Obama killed Osama.

Obama doesn't mention it because the war is very unpopular with his base, and trumpeting his current policy would only serve to suppress voter enthusiam.

All of which begs the question:
If the war is so unpopular, why doesn't one or both of the candidates advocate getting us out of there ASAP?

Well, Romney won't advocate that because his real "constituents" very much want perpetual war, and doing the old "cut and run" would not sit well with flag-waving teabaggers who don't like him much to begin with.

For Obama, accelerating the withdrawal of troops before this election would win him very few voters sitting on the fence, but would revive the rightwing meme that Democrats are weak on national security. Scaremongering about the consequences of letting the Taliban retake Afghanistan would shift focus away from a lot of things that are playing out in Obama's favor right now.

Disclaimer:
In this post I am not advocating any course of action, either with foreign/military policy or political electoral strategy.
I am attempting to answer the qustion in the OP as best I can.

[woo me with science]

79. kick

[woo me with science]

81. kick