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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsAlexandria Ocasio-Cortez-Cortez is Terrifying Fox News
Fox loses its damn mind over a freshman Democratic Congresswoman.
jaysunb
(11,856 posts)foil of the right wingers. Bet on it.
Gothmog
(144,005 posts)AOC has no power and there is no reason to fear her
ProfessorPlum
(11,252 posts)Pelosi, Clinton, Waters, AOC .. .Imagine how they would have treated Bella Abzug in the day.
don't underestimate their power to multitask when it comes to hate
Voltaire2
(12,629 posts)Victor_c3
(3,557 posts)Gothmog
(144,005 posts)Fox is using AOC to stir up the base. No one thinks that AOC will have any real power in the new congress other than the power to stir up hatred in the fox base
Fox and the GOP are not scared of AOC
libdem4life
(13,877 posts)like she was elected to do. Her youth and hubris is showing. I hope she gets it right before she loses her seat in 2 years. At this point, I'm not betting on it. This is going to be quite a Democratic Soap Opera, I fear.
They actually need her now. To stir the pot and inspire the base.
libdem4life
(13,877 posts)Just hope not a stumbling block. There is no doubt she packs a punch with her formidable personal and political qualities. It's hard to handle all of that so young. How many times have we seen it before? Celebrities, rock would-be stars, etc. Some learn and make it big. Some come back later. Others don't. But you have to pay the dues and put in the time, in the end, no matter what.
empedocles
(15,751 posts)'Abolish Ice' and 'Socialism'.
I suspect in the latest group of 'anti-pelosi's' some are hoping for similar to AOC promotion of their name by fox. Negative promotion could work for them as it did for AOC .
Gothmog
(144,005 posts)AOC is helping Fox by making ill advised statements
empedocles
(15,751 posts)fox, et al, presented AOC as the horrid face of Democrats running for office.
R B Garr
(16,920 posts)love her and she makes it easy for them,
Gothmog
(144,005 posts)Fox is using AOC to make its viewers afraid
AOC has no power and will get nothing done
empedocles
(15,751 posts)Kaleva
(36,147 posts)justie18
(169 posts)The only way to be effective in Congress is teamwork!
sheshe2
(83,355 posts)You are correct. Welcome to DU.
DownriverDem
(6,206 posts)just be about her so nothing gets done.
libdem4life
(13,877 posts)I'm starting to warm up to her.
It was at the turn of the century, when Elizabeth Cady Stanton and Susan B. Anthony clawed their way...literally...into our social consciousness . They were skewered as witches and heretics. That time in history is deplorable. Children were dying working in dangerous factories for pennies a day. The corporations must exist at any cost. Those women had the nerve....
Women of my age grew up with the notion you had to "go along to get along". My final college class...at a liberal arts college...was the first course ever offered in Feminism. 1971.
Same story, umpteenth verse...you must be patient. I see it as perhaps a paradigm shift. Maybe that's a good thing...they are setting the stage for generations to come. The old guard...male and female...are aging and dying. The laws of culture. Hell, we are paving our way to extinction...via the corporate mindset...and there is urgent cause to push hard.
samnsara
(17,570 posts)..I need to see results not just hear them....
samnsara
(17,570 posts)..gives them the honor of serving....now they have to earn the right to be leaders.....and not by preaching (loudly) to the choir. I find such rhetoric to be insulting. I know this is what got them elected..in their district...but that loud obnoxious rally cry doesnt sit well with other parts of the country. It can actually be a turn off.
libdem4life
(13,877 posts)Just goes to show how powerful she is. I've not seen the likes of this in my years here. Doesn't mean it hasn't happened, but wow...a 29 year old Latina. I'm impressed.
Fullduplexxx
(7,818 posts)bhikkhu
(10,708 posts)I've read more disappointing tossed-off smears and passive-aggressive patriarchal advice here than I would have expected. To the point that it reminds me of 2008, Hillary vs Obama, when I was on more juries than I care to remember. And clever trolls were in abundance, and it took a long time to get rid of many of them.
In any case, I'm a long way from discouraged. I would wish, as at any other time, that people might check themselves and their assumptions and judgments; think a bit first before obnoxious posting. She's on our side, and her most important goals and objectives line up with the Democratic party platform quite well.
DownriverDem
(6,206 posts)as long as Nancy is Speaker. She's going to mentor and put newbies in leadership positions. In 2 years we will be ready with a progressive platform that wins.
Gothmog
(144,005 posts)Most of the Democrats who I know do not care what a brand new congressperson thinks. It takes time to build up power and I doubt that AOC will be able to get any legislation through a committee much less the floor of the House
still_one
(91,965 posts)melman
(7,681 posts)Oh yes they are. They are terrified of her and others like her.
Gothmog
(144,005 posts)Last edited Sun Nov 18, 2018, 08:34 PM - Edit history (1)
There is no need to beafraid of her. It is doubtful that she will get any legislation passed in the new congress
Fox is using her to stoke up the base.
Eliot Rosewater
(31,097 posts)goes the right will just demonize whoever replaces her, so whoever replaces her better have skin like an elephant and several years experience.
Gothmog
(144,005 posts)melman
(7,681 posts)How so? Just what is it about her that 'stokes up the base'?
Would it be preferable to have someone Fox viewers find appealing?
Gothmog
(144,005 posts)Voltaire2
(12,629 posts)boogeyman Fox uses to scare its base, right? And in fact Pelosi is used far more frequently than Ocasio-Cortez. So by the logic Ive seen here both Pelosi and Ocasio-Cortez need to sit down and shut up.
Or not. Actually as far as I am concerned they both should continue to make lots of noise.
Gothmog
(144,005 posts)Nancy Pelosi is a very effective leader and helped elect a ton of democrats. The GOP has reason to be afraid of her
I do not care if AOC makes noise. She is a baby congresscritter with no power who appears to be alienating her fellow Democrats (threatening to primary you fellow Democrats is not a smart move). AOC has no power and will not get any meaningful legislation passed. Reminds me of someone
Voltaire2
(12,629 posts)JustAnotherGen
(31,688 posts)You know - if they target her and the rest of her squad - then Speaker Pelosi is off the hook.
Eliot Rosewater
(31,097 posts)and to NOT have a group that stops us from progress.
What would have happened when a public option was NOT possible and IF people had DEMANDED it back when, there would be no Obamacare, that is what.
Gothmog
(144,005 posts)AOC has no power and cannot pass any legislation. No one is paying much attention to her other than Fox and the GOP idiots because they rely on fear
RKP5637
(67,032 posts)melman
(7,681 posts)They would not make her into a boogeyman if they were not scared of her and what she represents.
It's the Karl Rove strategy in action: Attack the opponent's strengths, not their weaknesses. They do this 100% of the time.
Response to Hassin Bin Sober (Original post)
Post removed
Hassin Bin Sober
(26,273 posts)SixString
(1,057 posts)Autumn
(44,762 posts)might decide would benefit them has to be destroyed or shut down.
murielm99
(30,657 posts)How tiresome. She needs to be quiet and learn her job. The other newly elected members are doing that.
JCanete
(5,272 posts)melman
(7,681 posts)Sit down and shut up? Lovely.
murielm99
(30,657 posts)Don't try to twist my words. I did not say sit down and shut up. The other newly elected people are learning their jobs without creating such division in our ranks. She should be doing the same.
She can listen and learn. She can ask questions, like most people learning a new job.
melman
(7,681 posts)That's close enough.
murielm99
(30,657 posts)I started out liking this woman. She has earned my suspicion and distrust.
melman
(7,681 posts)Yes you absolutely did.
murielm99
(30,657 posts)And she does.
She has complained about how she cannot afford to find a place to live in Washington. Yet she is running around the country making appearances. Who is paying for that? Is any other newly elected Congress person complaining about how they cannot afford rent?
She is speaking up about primarying sitting Democrats. Are any other newly elected Congress people doing that? Most of them seem to be concentrating on learning their jobs with little fanfare. She could take a hint from them.
I stand by what I said.
essme
(1,207 posts)you are earning mine.
murielm99
(30,657 posts)Feel free to think what you like of me.
Voltaire2
(12,629 posts)USALiberal
(10,877 posts)murielm99
(30,657 posts)She may end up with just one term, and lousy committee assignments. Sound OK to you?
USALiberal
(10,877 posts)murielm99
(30,657 posts)behavior, or the behavior of any other elected official.
USALiberal
(10,877 posts)to expand on that a bit: Congress has an approval rating that is barely out of single digits and has had for years. Maybe it isn't AOC who needs to learn something.
Ferrets are Cool
(21,063 posts)her voters did not vote her into office for her to BE QUIET. And how do you know WHAT other elected members are doing? Are you in daily contact with each of them?
murielm99
(30,657 posts)I will stand by what I have said.
I HATE it when that happens. Why don't you "be quiet" and watch history unfold like so many others are doing?
murielm99
(30,657 posts)You hate it when people stand by what they say?
Cuthbert Allgood
(4,867 posts)She is doing her job.
I know why millennials are frustrated. Most of the time it's "They don't care about anything. They just want trophies." And then when a millennial actually starts fighting for the change they want, they are told they are too young and need to shut up.
Fuck that. She needs to fight for the people that voted her in. THAT'S her job and she seems to be doing it.
BamaRefugee
(3,476 posts)REPUBLICANS!
Response to Hassin Bin Sober (Original post)
Post removed
JCanete
(5,272 posts)go right ahead. But apparently the agenda of money out of politics, higher minimum wage, medicare for all, free college tuition...is scary to you. Cool...
murielm99
(30,657 posts)She is not saying anything new.
JCanete
(5,272 posts)to people, nor Ocasio-Cortez. Please don't tell me there isn't a difference between campaigning on something and simply having it typed somewhere on your platform.
I guess you don't remember all of the unicorn comments out of the mouths of DUers, as well as Clinton herself when it came to Sanders platform. You want to stand by your comment?
murielm99
(30,657 posts)Who mentioned him?
JCanete
(5,272 posts)I did just that.
JCanete
(5,272 posts)The post of mine you responded to is literally in response to somebody saying that Ocasio Cortez is scary because she's adhering too tightly to a Sanders agenda.
JCanete
(5,272 posts)shanny
(6,709 posts)in case that wasn't clear
SidDithers
(44,228 posts)Sid
George II
(67,782 posts)...and #40.
JCanete
(5,272 posts)that hadn't happened, but it doesn't change the fact that my post #30 that muriem responded to was literally in response to a mention of Sanders.
thanks though, for doing the research!
lapucelle
(18,040 posts)So it's 5 mentions in a thread of 79 posts.
Two of the 5 mentions are from people asking why the politician in question is relevant to a discussion in which no one is discussing him.
Two of the 5 mentions are from a single poster.
One of the five mentions is hidden.
That's 6.25%, if we count the hidden post and your inadvertent use of the politician in question's name.
It's 4% if we don't count the invisible hidden post. (Do invisible things count?)
George II
(67,782 posts)JCanete
(5,272 posts)one originally being challenged by muriem. I would think that if somebody is going to question why I'm mentioning Sanders, they might just look up through the very tree we're talking in, hell, at least to the one right above mine. It was not hidden at the time.
lapucelle
(18,040 posts)It's probably good policy to read through the posts to see if any of them have gone missing before one jumps in to berate someone for not reading something that wasn't even there.
JCanete
(5,272 posts)muriem to it.
R B Garr
(16,920 posts)Now we have to figure out why the same group keeps dragging Fox News here.
emulatorloo
(43,982 posts)It is over.
This is 2018 and there are plenty of good things to say about Rep Ocasio-Cortez right now (without needlessly sullying her with DU melodrama from 2 years ago)
JCanete
(5,272 posts)refighting the primaries. I'm talking about our opinions on things here and what is being claimed about what they are and have been.
Response to JCanete (Reply #60)
Eliot Rosewater This message was self-deleted by its author.
emulatorloo
(43,982 posts)There isnt anything relevant about rehashing that nonsense.
Why cant you support Rep Ocasio-Cortez on her many merits here and now in 2018? She has a ton of potential, and while she isnt my rep I like her a lot. She doesnt have a damn thing to do with DUs past bullshit. I want to hear positive stuff about her in the here and now.
JCanete
(5,272 posts)If you disagree with a specific point I make, then challenge it. If you can't challenge because you don't have the ammo, then I suggest you reevaluate your position. If you don't want to engage on it for other reasons, that's entirely valid. What I was talking about seemed relevant to me in the context of the conversation, and I haven't changed my mind on that point, and you berating my post hasn't exactly done that work either.
emulatorloo
(43,982 posts)I guess you don't remember all of the unicorn comments out of the mouths of DUers, as well as Clinton herself when it came to Sanders platform.
Dont be disingenuous or try to gaslight me about what you wrote in that post. You are clearly relitigating the 2016 primary with that statement.
We arent talking about the 2016 primary at DU anymore. It is over. It is dead. Admins are definitely done with it. DU is way beyond that.
JCanete
(5,272 posts)the actual history should be off limits in challenging that statement? That sounds ridiculous.
emulatorloo
(43,982 posts)It is not productive.
And I am saying 2) Rep Ocasio-Cortez is her own person and a great addition to Congress.
Why not talk positively about AOC rather than trying to tie her to old and irrelevant DU melodrama and butthurt?
JCanete
(5,272 posts)honesty to have a real conversation here, what we say we are about versus the evidence, is something worth being brought up...because this is about making claims about who dems are and have always been...what we've always fought for.
if somebody wants to pretend like "we've always been at war with East Asia", that the progressive wing of the party is just stirring shit up for no reason since everybody is and has always been on the same page, that statement does warrant a challenge.
as to your personal opinion of AOC, I agree with you there and I'm glad we have some common agreement.
emulatorloo
(43,982 posts)I think we all pretty much agree here on our goals. You are surrounded by left-liberals and progressives here. There are no doubt differences in opinion about roadmaps and strategies but to me that is something we can work out.
Rep. Ocasio-Cortez is a proud Democrat and I look forward to a long productive time for her in Congress.
https://democrats.org/about/what-we-believe/
What We Believe
Our full party platform is available here but for the sake of time, heres a condensed version of what youll find on the platform page:
Raising wages, closing the wealth gap, strengthening Social Security
Lowering health care costs; ensuring all Americans have access to quality, affordable health care; stabilizing Medicare and Medicaid
Sensible immigration reform that keeps Americas promise
Defending our borders, our ideals, and our institutions
Supporting our veterans and military families
Fixing our criminal justice system to eliminate systemic racism
Guaranteeing rights for minorities, people with disabilities, the LGBTQ community, and all Americans
Acting to advance womens rights, protect access to reproductive care, fight for equal pay, stop violence against women, and elect more women to public office
Protecting and promoting every Americans fundamental right to vote
Advancing clean energy and climate change action
Common-sense gun reforms
Smarter infrastructure investments
Advancing access to liberty and equality for all
Investing in modern education and jobs programs that prepare our kids for tomorrows challenges
JCanete
(5,272 posts)emulatorloo
(43,982 posts)Have a good night
Squinch
(50,774 posts)Why do some people absolutely refuse to see this?
I am sick to death of the stupidity of some people who insist that all Democrats must tailor their message to them personally, rather than tailoring their message to the voters in their own districts who will actually vote for them.
JCanete
(5,272 posts)will go for, but you kind of have to give people there an option if you want to know. And sometimes some issues take time to build momentum, but again, that never comes if no energy is put into that momentum.
Careful of the strawmanning. Those of us on DU at least, you should be able to safely assume, vote blue no matter what in the GE.
Squinch
(50,774 posts)that's what primaries are for, and I can't recall a time when we haven't had primaries, can you?
So what is your point? Surely you don't mean to say there were no options before Sanders and OC.
Or were you saying the options that were offered were not acceptable to you? Or that not enough energy was put into your favorite issues to allow them to build momentum? If so, re-read the comment you responded to.
JCanete
(5,272 posts)by suggesting they will support different candidates in primaries against other sitting members if they feel these members are in the way of the things they are fighting for.
What's funny is people take issue with this, but seem to gleefully suggest that it would totally serve Cortez right if Pelosi punished her by not giving her any good committees...
politics is politics.
George II
(67,782 posts)....anyone calling for primaries two years before an election cycle.
samnsara
(17,570 posts)DownriverDem
(6,206 posts)You are so right. We just didn't have any power to get anything done. Sometimes when folks attack the Dems that have been there, they seem to forget what the tone was.
murielm99
(30,657 posts)PaulX2
(2,032 posts)No surrendering before the battle begins
Crush the swiftboaters
Squinch
(50,774 posts)JCanete
(5,272 posts)the person literally said he or she was going to make a claim and then entirely walk away from it and not respond to anybody who challenged it.
It was strawmanning though...sure. I'll cop to that and will agree that even there it wasn't appropriate.
Squinch
(50,774 posts)said obnoxious things, then when you were called on them you said how wrong you were to say them, but you didn't take them down.
That also shows bad faith.
There's nothing to be gained by engaging with that nonsense. Buh bye.
JCanete
(5,272 posts)example as a way to be going forward, thank you!
As to taking down things I say that I later regret...I don't take them down because I feel like that's scrubbing. I'd rather leave my mistakes than hide them.
Squinch
(50,774 posts)JCanete
(5,272 posts)that my reasons there weren't good enough for doing so. I'm just not going to accept your indignance regarding my decorum any more than you're going to accept my comment about your own straw-manning. . Still, that only leaves one of us who has ceded any ground and taken any personal responsibility. Not sure that counts as "I know you are but what am I."
Squinch
(50,774 posts)Have a nice life.
JCanete
(5,272 posts)Algernon Moncrieff
(5,780 posts)I hope she keeps wearing the coat everyone is criticizing, much as Nebraska State Senator Ernie Chambers shows up in a T-Shirt for the legislature.
oberliner
(58,724 posts)JCanete
(5,272 posts)easy prey while she's still a pup and that they can catch her slip ups and look the fool before she grows real teeth. On the other hand, the rule for a long time has been to push the left off the map entirely and to pretend Pelosi and Clinton were as far left as has ever been.
I'd argue that was a far better strategy, and that the only reason it isn't being employed now is that Cortez has too much name recognition to simply be ignored.
Whatever the reason though, the case they've been making has flailed pretty wildly, and it has allowed her to get a few good haymakers in on them. Not sure that nervous system is connected to the typical FOX viewer though, but its still good for energizing her base, and presenting as a strong, unapologetic progressive who can and will fight.
oberliner
(58,724 posts)How soon before we hear chants of "lock her up" or Trump calling her "low-IQ" etc.
JCanete
(5,272 posts)that Fox News went after the latter two when the conventional wisdom was to ignore unseemly attacks, OR to even be apologetic about liberalism and distance ourselves, "no we are progressives..." rather than to say "Damn fucking right we are...and this is our platform. Try to pick that apart."
And in that lies the flailing that has been occurring against Cortez. Maybe they can catch her not being overly adept at one policy question or numbers question here or there, but if they want to attack her they have to go at the issues that they don't really want to bring to their audience, and it has been utterly hilarious when they've attempted to do so thus far.
shanny
(6,709 posts)SimpleC
(279 posts)Is ok with me...
klook
(12,134 posts)Pepsidog
(6,252 posts)PaulX2
(2,032 posts)Scares the crap outa more than fox. See Corporate America.
Take the borrowed trillion and help the poor then watch the economy really explode. Stock buybacks dont do much at all.
Eliot Rosewater
(31,097 posts)zentrum
(9,865 posts)Fearless. Authentic.
Iggo
(47,489 posts)She's everything they've trained their brain-dead viewers to be afraid of: Woman. Minority. Democrat.
DFW
(54,057 posts)They were probably getting tired of beating on Pelosi. Like with Hillary, they were running out of bad things to say about her that they hadn't repeated ten thousand broadcasts ago. AOC can decide whether to feed them their next meal or not. She could also decide to drive Fox and Frauds crazy by working discreetly for her goals without giving them a free target on her back, too.
I don't think she has made that decision yet, and I don't think she's worth all the posts about her until she does. She hasn't even taken the oath of office yet, so who knows WHAT her agenda will be as a member of the House? I'm talking reality, not boastful posts on some website. She certainly seems to have the energy. It could take her to the speaker's chair in fifteen or twenty years, or it could take her out in the next primary in less than two years. I THINK she is smart enough to realize this, but I'm not convinced yet.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)or perhaps brother, organization) wants to defeat Republican politicians by uniting right wing and left wing populists against them. The same for Democrats they don't like, of course, which would be all who wouldn't align with Brand New Congress.
Trump's and Sanders's campaigns in 2016 were of course both powered by appeals to populist passions. Sanders tried to draw social conservatives away from Trump, and no doubt succeeded with some. Trump drew more away from Sanders, including those famous white working class male Democrats who turned out to lean socially conservative and were primarily motivated by loss of both white and male privilege.
Some observers are confirming these organizations' stated goals of trying to build a large left-wing tea party movement by drawing away large numbers of dissatisfied right-wing populists to whatever leader they put up. After all, populist organizations get a large part of their energy from the passions of those social conservatives who favor progressive government programs. And the right has a bunch of them, who'll all be looking for a new leader after Trump.
The strategic thinkers both within and behind Fox and the Republican leadership have to be very aware of this , and Ocasio is currently strongly associated with these groups.
(Btw, on another line of thought, my question is if they succeeded which side the new leader would come from. Given their outstanding success with the tea party movement, it would be entirely predictable if right-wing billionaires secretly helped create and took over and chose leaders for a unified populist movement. The more politically extremist people get, the less difference there is between right and left, so those involved might have no idea for some while.)
DFW
(54,057 posts)So, I went to look at their website. Brand New Congress sounds like Same Old Sanders.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)at least not as their main candidate. Been there, moved on. They formed formally right after his concession.
But for now, I'm thinking this all helps explain Fox's "blowing hot and cold" behavior toward Congresswoman-elect Ocasio: Her current connection to radical left-wing organizations that are helpful against Democrats but which intend to develop into a threat to Republicans.
GulfCoast66
(11,949 posts)Young Black Woman who actually is a socialist.
They love her.
Their viewers? She does terrify them which is why Fox loves her.
R B Garr
(16,920 posts)UTUSN
(70,497 posts)Liberal In Texas
(13,455 posts)Fox is using her to scare the base. They're all about keeping the fear going.
fescuerescue
(4,448 posts)AOC and Fox news are in different busineses. AOC is in politics, Fox News is in advertising.
AOC brings viewers to Fox news, and Fox news focuses attention on AOC. It's symbiotic.
They aren't terrified. They are thrilled. As is she.
NoMoreRepugs
(9,260 posts)Response to Hassin Bin Sober (Original post)
Name removed Message auto-removed
Hekate
(90,202 posts)Enjoy your stay.