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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWhy John Roberts' goal is not what you think
Roberts is a smart Republican operator.
He realizes that now and for the next few decades, the large large majority of unqualified partisans on the courts will be Republican ideologues.
Roberts wants to head off all political criticism of judges because criticism of politicizing the courts would damage Republicans.
- Gorsuch: Fed Soc, in bed with Anschutz
- Thomas: wife is an insane conservative fascist
- Alito: Fed Soc, climate change denier, invited /Janus/
- Kavanaugh: Fed Soc, insane rant re leftists
- Roberts: voter suppression activist in Reagan White House, worked for Rehnquist, voter suppression activist himself in AZ in 1970s
Heres the GOP strategy that Roberts is executing:
Pretend Republican judges are just calling balls and strikes while the Republican Trump judges eviscerate rule of law, help billionaires, and harm average people.
Democrats will want to call out the Republican ideologue judges.
And Roberts is trying to head that off.
Kavanaugh and the five Fed Soc judges are going to vote to repeal Roe, to hurt unions, to rule enviornmental regulations unconstitutional, and in general produce twisted-logic pro-billionaire decisions.
And we're going to want to say
And the rightwing media will say in response.
Remember this in the future. Don't be afraid to criticize Bush and Trump judges for being chosen by extremist presidents.
C_U_L8R
(44,997 posts)Watch what they actually do. It's horrifying.
mitch96
(13,891 posts)Proven by history....
Never trust these guys... follow the money and power..
m
mr_lebowski
(33,643 posts)Ya can't truss em ...
Garrett78
(10,721 posts)It's not unlike the projection tactic, whereby Republicans accuse Democrats of misdeeds carried out by Republicans. When Democrats point to those misdeeds, they come off as being defensive and Republicans successfully obfuscate.
Or the decades-long attack on the media for being "liberal," whereby Democrats are put on the defensive and reluctant to offer what would be a valid critique of the mainstream media (we see this in action here at DU when people are accused of aiding Trump by criticizing the media).
Or establishing a narrative that says right wingers are "moderate" if they seem relatively sane.
When we're relying on John Roberts or the late John McCain or James Mattis, you know we're living in dangerously maddening times.
dalton99a
(81,450 posts)RockRaven
(14,958 posts)is it worth it? It certainly would be worth considering as a trade-off (if that were the reality in play).
It is not at all obvious to me that the answer is "no" but I would agree that we need to keep our eyes open.
As with Michael Avenatti, Rick Wilson, James Comey, etc. the enemy of my enemy is NOT necessarily my friend. But I'll take their enemy-enmity if I can get it, thank you very much.
redstateblues
(10,565 posts)It changes nothing. Elections have consequences.
sharedvalues
(6,916 posts)Remember, Michael Cohen stood in a court under oath and said he had conspired with trump to break the law to get him elected.
Trump is illegitimate. So are his judges.
We will build a groundswell to impeach them. Join us.
Awsi Dooger
(14,565 posts)Far too much cynical thinking going on, per norm.
Roberts properly attacked Trump's comment. It should be happening on a daily basis from fellow Republicans, regarding one Trump comment after another. Roberts wasn't thinking 25 years down the road or 5 minutes down the road. He heard the latest outrageous comment and this time it happened to relate directly to his position. It wasn't strategic...it was pushed too far.
sharedvalues
(6,916 posts)Inside John Roberts Decades-Long Crusade Against the Voting Rights Act
By ARI BERMAN
Mike Niendorff
(3,459 posts)These guys are getting ready to go on a rampage.
The one critical thing they NEED is for the public to accept their credibility while they do it.
This is a PR move in advance of the storm.
MDN
Hamlette
(15,411 posts)I've known many judges in my time, most of them appointed by Republicans. They are all concerned about being overturned on appeal so don't color outside the lines. Generalizations about judges and political party doesn't work. Fun Fact" Judge Robert Shelby was the trial judge who decided preventing gay marriage is unconstitutional. He is a Republican appointed by Obama.
question everything
(47,468 posts)And it is not as if Roberts had his say out of the blue. Trump attacked an "Obama judge" and Roberts felt that he had to respond.
So I still like him, for now. Also, he made that ACA the law of the land.
EndGOPPropaganda
(1,117 posts)localroger
(3,626 posts)If you ask "who judges the judges," in the case of those with secure lifetime appointments the only answer is "history." I think Roberts is unpleasantly concerned with the judgement history already seems to have made on Gore v Bush, and he may not want to risk that happening again.
EndGOPPropaganda
(1,117 posts)This is my experience too:
[url=https://ibb.co/gHvSsA][img][/img][/url]
In top legal circles, its widely discussed that Clarence Thomas is ... well, a mediocre mind. At best. He was installed by the precursor of the Federalist Society to help the billionaire donors to the Federalist Society.
For whatever reason, the vast majority of those with good LSAT scores are liberals. The Fed Soc finds the few who are willing to take pro-billionaire stances and promotes them.
Trump and the illegitimate GOP Senate have installed dozens of unqualified partisan hacks on the bench. This is going to be devastating for America. It will be the biggest consequence of the Trump farce.
Scruffy1
(3,255 posts)Amazing to me how many fall for the Kubuki the Republicans engage in, especiallly the press. Well I expres to be lame, but Democrats should know by now . There are no good fascists.
Hassler
(3,373 posts)EndGOPPropaganda
(1,117 posts)Yavin4
(35,434 posts)The judges added to the federal court system are there to serve the interests of the wealthy donors to the Republican party not a president. These judges may not be loyal to Trump, but they will do the bidding of the wealthy.
LeftInTX
(25,245 posts)He's trying to defend the image of the judiciary as an impartial branch of the government.
(I was gonna say neutral, but the correct word is impartial...in that the judicial branch base decisions on rationality and not emotion. Of course, any well educated judge can come up with an opinion on any side of the political spectrum and have it backed by laws, facts, history and/or the constitution)
EndGOPPropaganda
(1,117 posts)The Fed Soc agenda is to help billionaires and hurt average Americans like you and me.
Theyre planning to bust unions, restrict abortion, limit health care, allow corporations to run amok, and generally oppose any policy that helps average Americans.
We are in for a bad bad time with the judicial system with all these Federalist Society hacks on the courts now.
https://www.newstatesman.com/world/north-america/2018/09/who-are-federalist-society-inside-right-wing-group-picking-trump-s
elocs
(22,566 posts)Because I do love it when someone wants to straighten out my thinking.
Jersey Devil
(9,874 posts)When they fully entered the "political thicket" in Bush v Gore and, in a fully partisan vote, awarded the Presidency to George W Bush in a partisan vote SCOTUS brought upon itself the belief that the Court was just another political tool.
EndGOPPropaganda
(1,117 posts)UniteFightBack
(8,231 posts)but we shall see what his true intentions are. Perhaps he is realizing that this has all gone too far.
sharedvalues
(6,916 posts)The biographies of Roberts, describing his voter suppression work in the Reagan White House and with Rehnquist, are really not a source of hope for his lack of bitter partisanship.
UniteFightBack
(8,231 posts)like this because I can be cautious about this optimism. This post also filled me in on the history...which is of course important. So perhaps Roberts concern is genuine....there are a lot of people genuinely concerned. We shall see.
awesomerwb1
(4,267 posts)beachbum bob
(10,437 posts)on judiciary will have a very negative impact just like his attacks on the media. Unfortunately elections of consequences and having batshit crazy judges appointed is one that too many jill stein voters could care less about.
I don't buy this conspiracy based theories, never have.......................
empedocles
(15,751 posts)sharedvalues
(6,916 posts)Politico
https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2015/08/john-roberts-voting-rights-act-121222_full.html
Mother Jones https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2016/10/colorblind-justice-john-roberts-voting-rights-north-carolina/
TPM, links Perlstein on Roberts history with voter suppression, dating back to Reagan.
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/the-origins-of-modern-voter-fraud-propaganda-going-back-t0-1960
Incorrect view of the law - McCutcheon
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/john-paul-stevens-campaign-finance-mccutcheon-john-roberts
Stevens: And, as for John Roberts, he is much more in the direction of protecting the rights of very rich people to donate money to campaigns than [former Chief Justice] Bill Rehnquist ever was.
Honest historians will lay the Republican success at voter suppression squarely at John Roberts's feet.
https://abovethelaw.com/2018/11/the-racism-exposed-in-the-midterm-election-was-brought-to-you-by-john-roberts/
https://rewire.news/article/2018/06/15/justice-roberts-lands-another-blow-fight-voters/
https://washingtonspectator.org/cohen-voting-rights/
If Crawford implicitly sanctioned a new generation of racist voting laws in jurisdictions run by Republican lawmakers, Shelby County virtually guaranteed that some of those laws could nonetheless be enforced, for years, as federal litigation wends its way through the courts. It is possible, perhaps, to see Crawford as a naive decision by six justices unable in 2008 to see or imagine how fragile voting rights really were back then. Of the majoritys ruling in Shelby County all I can say is that it is the Courts least defensible decision since Plessy v. Ferguson in 1896 gave us the separate but equal doctrine.
empedocles
(15,751 posts)'shared values',
That was an extensive, very good response to my post, which I very recently discovered, and I agree with you. I feel like I owe you a return courtesy, by explaining further my perspective - which I don't have the time to do now. [As the thread sinks into DU archives].
Will say now, it involves an old incident where a younger Clarence Thomas [he was well into the 'con 'special program' at the time] came into my young attorney office seeking legal advice on an issue totally in conflict with the ideologies he is known for. Please do respond and I will likely get to your response sooner.
empedocles
sharedvalues
(6,916 posts)Would love to hear more about Clarence Thomas.
Ive heard some recent stories about his wife and her frankly insane ideology that give me serious pause. And Thomas votes in Heller and McCutcheon and Cit U and Shelby County too give me serious pause.
Rightwing billionaires have built an insane echo chamber in the Federalist Society, and the echo chamber gets filled with rightwing attorneys that benefit from conservative legal affirmative action (the large majority of those with high LSAT scores are liberals, but half the top judicial positions are conservative so liberal attys have to be far far better than the average conservative atty to get ahead in the federal and appellate world.)
empedocles
(15,751 posts)Will be back. Lot of stuff to get done before 5p around here and out.
empedocles
(15,751 posts)I was responding to your fine detailed remarks on Roberts the committed ideologue. I don't doubt that he worked hard to show how conservative he is. My point was that self interest for Roberts et al, may in several ways supercede ideology. The obvious case was Roberts upholding Obamacare against the rage in Court from Scalia, as well as 'cons everywhere - his fear seemed to be the ghost of Chief Justice Taney's inhuman decisions and ugly reputation. Also, Roberts the would be history professor, is quite aware of the Trump threat to the SCOTUS, - ideology be damned.
My arguments though, having seen DC politics here for a long time, I've always been surprised at how self-interested many of the players are. I used Thomas, because in my meeting with him was totally against what he professed to be, on the fast track up the 'con ladder. His famous, 'no Supreme Ct bench comments for 10 years' [wow! ] seems to confirm his limited, actual interest in principle, ideology, etc. [The general judicial gloss on his career also confirms that].
Squinch
(50,948 posts)in a poison pill that he thought would kill it.
This is what he will do until he leaves the court.