The US is firing rubber bullets and tear gas at migrants and their children on Thanksgiving weekend.

[milestogo]

Shame on our country.

US Border Patrol shot tear gas and rubber bullets at a group of migrants, including toddlers, as members of the caravan tried to storm the border.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6427735/Border-Patrol-fires-tear-gas-migrants-tried-open-small-hole-Mexican-side.html

[Beartracks]

1. Just like the Indians did to the Pilgrim immigrants... Oh, wait. n/t

[raging moderate]

28. Well, they did at first. Briefly.

Before they realized the Pilgrims were not the usual pirate bands they were used to fighting off. Before they watched the hapless Pilgrims wandering about trying to find food while pretending they were not starving, obviously with no idea what to do in this emergency.

[still_one]

2. Supply the link. The only reports I have seen is tear gas, nothing about rubber bullets

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-46339085

[Jarqui]

4. Local news KBPS

https://www.kpbs.org/news/2018/nov/25/officials-close-san-ysidro-border-crossing-amid-ca/

American authorities used tear gas and rubber bullets to keep members of the caravan back from the border fence, according to Brendan Cassidy, an organizer with the San Diego Migrant and Refugee Coalition, who was near the scene.

[still_one]

5. Thanks, appreciate the link. Brendan Cassidy is a bias source. I want to see confirmation

The videos and photos show no indication of rubber bullets. Doesn't mean they didn't use rubber bullets, but that detail should easily be confirmed from other sources on the scene

[Jarqui]

11. Here's some video claiming it and showing a shot

It's rough so not absolutely conclusive or reliable.

Here's a tweet of that

Link to tweet

This one has sounds like shots fired

Buzzfeed
https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/adolfoflores/migrant-caravan-tear-gas-border-san-ysidro?bftwnews&utm_term=4ldqpgc#4ldqpgc

With helicopters circling overhead, US border authorities fired tear gas and, according to witnesses, rubber bullets as some of the marchers approached the United States at a metal fence where train tracks run through.

[still_one]

13. Understood. I still want to see what other accounts come out on this. I really do appreciate

your follow through

[Jarqui]

17. I have no problem with your caution

I've passed on that it has been claimed but I have not seen absolute definitive proof.

Maybe those pops were cannisters of tear gas.
Maybe what that policeman shot was a cannister of tear gas.
I honestly don't know.

Regardless, I cannot conclude much good about what I see there. Clearly, there are young children in harms way being run off. Not a proud moment. There is no way that reflects well on America.

[still_one]

20. I didn't say it was good. I also didn't say I agreed with the policy. We should be processing the

migrants through the U.S., but thanks to 2016 we can forget that until maybe 2020

[Jarqui]

21. Sorry if you think I'm implying you said "it was good" or you "agreed with the policy"

I saw absolutely no evidence of that.

I just added some of my own thoughts on what I saw.

I'm agreeing with your caution. We have to be careful on the internet of our facts.

[still_one]

23. I just wanted to make my position clear because it could be misinterepted. You presented the facts,

and you did good. I sure didn't take it that you were implying anything negative regarding my position on the migrants


They're desperate

[Initech]

3. Theee war crimes at the border won't soon be forgotten.

Fuck Trump, fuck Fox News, fuck the deplorables.

[still_one]

6. These are not war crimes

[Initech]

7. Then what are they?

Crimes against humanity?

[still_one]

9. Firing tear gas canisters are NOT crimes against humanity. Read the Geneva convention. Your

hyperbole does not help the situation, or you argument

The rubber bullets needs to be confirmed. The supposed witness is a bias party. Brendan Cassidy


https://www.kpbs.org/news/2018/nov/25/officials-close-san-ysidro-border-crossing-amid-ca/
American authorities used tear gas and rubber bullets to keep members of the caravan back from the border fence, according to Brendan Cassidy, an organizer with the San Diego Migrant and Refugee Coalition, who was near the scene.

[KelleyKramer]

10. Umm, YES, using tear gas in war is a war crime

"Read the Geneva convention"


You should have followed your own advice


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geneva_Protocol


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tear_gas

[Quemado]

12. The use of tear gas across the border needs to be investigated as a war crime.

[Igel]

14. Wiki's hardly authoritative.

Under "tear gas" it makes the claim that this is an example of the prohibited "use of asphyxiating gas, or any other kind of gas, liquids, substances or similar materials", but tear gas isn't asphyxiating.

The verdict's not in, but chemical agents are generally avoided in actual war. If you're doing real fighting close enough for tear gas to be used, you're really close. And if you're depending on tear gas to take out the enemy, well, that's not going to happen, and if the wind shifts (and in urban terrain it can be really iffy) suddenly your surprise weapon is drifting off in the wrong direction, and isn't a surprise any more.

In their place, of course, are substances permitted by the Geneva Protocols. High-speed lead slugs, for example, and bombs, for example. True, lead's a toxic metal, but that's not the main effect. "Damn, they want to cause my kids to have genetic defects, they're shooting lead at me at high speeds and in great quantities." It's just not cricket of them.

However, this isn't warfare so it's really an irrelevant point. Tear gas is perfectly fine for riot control and preferable--although we can agree to disagree on this point if you want--to bullets and bombs.

[still_one]

18. Warfare is different then riot control, and that is what the Geneva Convention is based on, warfare

[still_one]

16. That is for warfare. Riot control is NOT the same thing

[KelleyKramer]

19. Here is what you said ...

Response to Initech (Reply #3)Sun Nov 25, 2018, 10:05 PM
Star Member still_one (59,806 posts)

6. These are not war crimes

[still_one]

22. In the context of what is happening at the border. The context was clear. from the thread. You

want to word parse, ok. You're right.

Let's run this as part of the Democratic campaign for 2020 that the U.S. is comitting war crimes by firing tear gas at migrants trying to breech the border fence to the U.S. and see what happens.


Let me make one thing VERY CLEAR though. I didn't say I approve of what is happening. The U.S. should be processing the migrants IN THE U.S., but thanks to 2016 that is NOT happening, and the only chance to remedy that will most likely be 2020

[ProudLib72]

15. Don't worry Initech, I'm with you on crimes against humanity

I just sent my friend a text using that exact phrase.

[DownFromTheMountain]

8. Wel, in a moment of clarity, I think this is his war against the Poor.

What he uses the office for is to attack these poor people who have Left Their Birthplaces to seek some safety...did his own Mother not question "What kind of person have we created?" Or something like that. He Hates Poor People. He hates Working People. Impeach, Convict and Imprison.

[Jarqui]

24. Asylum Eligibility and Applications

https://www.uscis.gov/humanitarian/refugees-asylum/asylum/questions-and-answers-asylum-eligibility-and-applications

You may apply for asylum if you are at a port of entry or in the United States. You may apply for asylum regardless of your immigration status and within one year of your arrival to the United States.

I just thought I'd remind that these people HAVE to go to a port of entry to apply for asylum. If they won't see them, they have to enter the US illegally and request it when they are caught.

I'm maybe stating it too simply but these people are pretty desperate and they seemed to be doing what they need to do in order to have a shot.

[sarcasmo]

25. NATO should intervene.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

26. Aren't those people on the Mexican side?

Did our border patrol REALLY fire shots and tear gas across the border? Isn't that an Act of War? In which case, why hasn't the Mexican government declared war on us?

Just asking.

[gopiscrap]

27. this is so fucked up

[uponit7771]

29. +1

[Socal31]

30. The story is bad enough without clickbait editing.

If the full summary was presented in the OP, we could be properly debunking the actual narrative and demanding the body cam video. The administration painted itself into a corner with easily proven/disproven info.