Why Linux is a desktop flop

[DainBramaged]

<snip>But on the desktop, Linux's numbers barely register. Gartner predicts that Linux penetration on the desktop will remain below 2% for the next five years.

For example, the Dell Latitude 2120 with Windows 7 Home Premium is $494, while a similarly-loaded Ubuntu Latitude 2120 is $434 -- a savings of just $60.

In addition, the free versions of Linux are only supported with free fixes for about a year, says Michael Silver, an analyst with Stamford, Conn.-based Gartner group.

"You have to switch to the new version of Linux every year," he says. "Microsoft supports each version of Windows for ten years -- I don't have to pay any more money, and I still get security fixes. Even vendors that do offer extended security fixes for Linux, like Novell or Red Hat, they're going to charge every year for the privilege." <snip>

The idea that Linux is free and companies can save a lot of money by switching is a myth


http://www.networkworld.com/news/2012/043012-linux-desktop-258724.html?page=1


Have a wonderful evening.

[Electric Monk]

1. Trolling for a flamewar. Are you bored?

[Speck Tater]

2. I tried very hard to like Linux but

it fought my efforts every step of the way! In the end, it beat me.

[Egalitarian Thug]

3. The article is straight-up BS., but something tells me your not interested hearing facts. n/t

[Downwinder]

4. I normally only see the application program.

Looks the same on Windows or Linux. Much peppier on Linux.

[Zalatix]

5. Every version of Linux is as loaded as Windows 7 Ultimate Edition

What you usually get bundled with a PC is Windows 7 Home Premium or Starter. You don't typically get the Pro or Ultimate unless you pay for the upgrade. The Ultimate edition comes with stuff you find exact equivalents for in most flavors of Linux. For instance, XP Mode, which you can only get in Pro or Ultimate, can be achieved with VMWare Player or VirtualBox, which are free. Backing up to a home or business network, only available in Pro or Ultimate edition, is an old feature in Linux, and only Ultimate edition supports working in the language of your choice - that, again is an old feature of Linux. Bitlocker has long-standing equivalents in Linux and is only available with the expensive Ultimate upgrade.

You don't HAVE to switch to a new version of Linux; it is suggested that you do. Security fixes come automatically through patches. You don't have to go through RedHat or Novell for support, either; there is a lot of community support for Linux.

The truly damning issue with Linux is the command line, and its heavy reliance upon this. Graphical user interface applications don't always address everything you need to tinker with in Linux and therein lies its Achilles Heel.

For instance, when you install any flavor of Linux you will probably need to add in Shockwave/Flash and MP3 support, your choice of video players, and a whole host of things, mostly because it's closed/source or patent-encumbered. (Linux OSes typically do not come with closed-source or patent-burdened features.) The command line will most certainly become a daunting problem for Grandma&Pa at this point.

For a business, though, these are one-time problems. Most businesses will need to hire a sysadmin-equivalent to deal with Windows or Linux alike. A competent sysadmin, being on call or working onsite, will handle these issues right off the bat. Once you have a system working to your specifications you can automate it across all the servers and workstations in the office. At this point users don't need access to a command line. This is where Linux utterly stomps Windows - it dominates when it comes to security, stability and in the area of resistance to viruses, too.

If you need to switch to a new version of Linux you can do it on a test machine that runs the specs of the computers in your office, which are all uniform because your competent admin made sure of this. When you figure out how to upgrade without drama, you shut the office down overnight and mass upgrade. Done by morning.

Been there, done that.


Edit: What's killing Linux on the desktop is its lack of games...

[bhikkhu]

7. Good points - but the command line is pretty much in the past

I don't even remember how to install a program via command line, and I think its been a year or so since I had to use Terminal. I might get a little nostalgic about some of the complicated geeky stuff I had to do years ago, but that's way back. I can imagine using 12.04 for anything you needed, from install through whatever customization and use, and never even needing to know what a command line was, much less what "sudo" means!

[Zalatix]

9. Ubuntu? Not sure about that distro. I heard it's pretty restrictive, but I admit that's hearsay.

Far as I know, for other distros, if you want mp3 support you gotta go to the command line in Fedora and install a few Repo's and do a bunch of light surgery on the system. Then you gotta also install Windows codecs for playing certain movies you can get online.

NOT something that ma and pa want to do.

[bhikkhu]

12. Easy in Ubuntu

you go to the "software center" and install a "restricted extras" package. Or you go to Synaptic and search for codecs manually, but either way its just select and install. My kids figured it out pretty quick on the older set-up, and its easier now.

[JCMach1]

19. Exactly...

Ubuntu rocks. I was shocked in the latest versions when I found my printer was true plug and play. I simply didn't need a driver. Plug it and it works in a few secs.

[flobee1]

43. I do that all the time!

even if its something you don't download from the software center, you can still install it through there. I think the real issue is lack of DRM support. The moment they release itunes for linux, windows is toast.
its the only thing I use windows for now.

[Egalitarian Thug]

10. And active collusion/coercion from (primarily) M$. Don't forget the elephant in this room.

You have what, half a dozen, maybe eight giant corporations that control the software industry, and they work together to keep that control.

[Zalatix]

16. Yup

Plus they also market like crazy and even tried to sue "Linux" for patent infringements back in the day. The latter tactic was hilariously ineffective - dramatically unlike the former.

Still, Linux soldiers right on through.

[Prophet 451]

76. It's the games that prevent me from switching

I just did a big upgrade to my pc and, since my father's a Linux guy (almost to the point of being cult-ish), I gave it a look but I'm a pretty serious gamer so decided on Win7 Ultimate (since I also needed encryption and software RAID capabilities). I was also unsure if the stats packages I need to study would run on Linux (mainly SPSS).

[BumRushDaShow]

78. You could dual-boot and try running the windoze apps in WINE

http://www.winehq.org/

[bhikkhu]

6. I've been using it for 6 years

The thing about new versions is baloney - you just do regular updates like you do in windows, or you don't. Either way your stuff still works, and new versions are about the same as updates - you either install them or put it off. I get around to updates every month or two. There have been some trials along and glitches and annoyances along the way, but the current version 12.04 is pretty much flawless, and has addressed everything complaint I might have had. It just works, there are zero worries about viruses or internet use, the interfaces are easy, and its a beautiful piece of work overall.

Windows, on the other hand...I figure I've bought windows about 8 times in my life and that was plenty. The last time I had an unrecoverable crash due to viruses I tried to reinstall, but MS wouldn't let me re-activate without paying $139 for a new license. I switched the machine to Ubuntu and it worked flawlessly for years. Another machine I lost a hard drive, and the OS. The recovery disc didn't work for some reason and I wasn't about to buy windows again, so it was Ubuntu for that as well.

I don't know whether companies save money or not, but Ubuntu works great for everything I do. I've got it on four computers my family uses and one at work (the one we use on the internet). I can see needing windows if you have to use Quickbooks or Autocad or something, but for word processing and general use, and definitely for the internet, its just stupid to pay for whatever glitchy buggy virus-addled Windows product is currently out.

[SnohoDem]

14. Ubuntu is nice

Last edited Fri Aug 17, 2012, 02:26 AM - Edit history (1)

I used it on an old laptop I keep for browsing when out on the porch or whatnot. I took it off to try the free trial of Win 8, but didn't like that very much so will probably reinstall Ubuntu this weekend.

As we had more and more less sophisticated users, using a command line became progressively more foreign to a typical user, and Linux commands lines can be a bit cryptic.

I was using the last Ubuntu LTS and I don't think I did ANYTHING on the command line. Don't remember if I was using any kind of media player, though.

(Edit to change LTR to LTS)

[UnrepentantLiberal]

31. Is it possible to buy a laptop that doesn't have

windows pre-installed? For instance, could I order one from HP's website without Windows? How do you order Linux online? Can you just put the Linux disc in and fire it up?

[nebenaube]

58. I run Ubuntu

and I have several flavors of it that I run off the USB. Not to mention Eclipse et al. Windows would cost me $3k a year just for software.

[bhikkhu]

64. Yes, you just boot from a Linux disc and click through the install menu

and it is quicker and easier than installing windows. I only know the Ubuntu version, but in that you can find a "Live CD", that lets you put the OS on a disc. You can run it from the disc if you want to try it for awhile, but of course its faster if you install it on a hard drive.

On my main computer I have a couple of hard drives, one with Ubuntu and one with Windows, and I just plug in whichever one I need to use before startup - but I haven't used the windows one for 6 months now.

[madokie]

26. I'm running AutoCad 2000 on my ubuntu machine

AutoCad was written for winblows 98 so it has to run in compatibility mode even on XP, the last windows I bought, and using Wine on ubuntu my AutoCad 2000 works flawlessly. I do a lot of menu work in AutoCad and I find that to not be a problem either.
For those who don't know better AutoCad 2000 is the best version of AutoCad yet, everything newer is simply adding more bloat. I've been running AutoCad since 10 came out with true 3-d capabilities. I'm a self taught AutoCad users who does all my drawings in 3-d. I build many of the things I draw and I've yet to find a flaw in any of the drawings I do.
Yes it was a pain in the ass to install it but not really, a little googling and critical thought and I was up and running and haven't looked back. I used to dual boot with XP so I could run AC but once I decided it has to work on Linux and set my mind to figuring out how to get there I deleted my XP partition and if I buy a new computer today the first thing I'll be doingi is wiping the hard drive clean of anything microsoft and installing Ubuntu. Linux always finds my hardware without a glitch, once I thought it had a problem but turned out it was a fried board in my machine from a lightning strike.
Who ever wrote this piece of garbage has no idea as to what they are talking about.
I'm not talking about you bhikkhu nor DainBamage, (altho I do expect better of you DB,) but I see this thread as a fools errand and flame bait and should be deleted.
Peace to all

[longship]

8. Flame bait.

He had two posts jury hidden on his own Windows thread. He's pissed about it. So he strikes out against the folks who posted responses reminding him that there are alternatives.



Meanwhile he posts a post about Getting Parse Errors

Maybe he ought to lighten up a bit, be more friendly, and get the chip off the shoulder.

I am willing to be friendly. Is the OPer?


BTW, I was highly tempted to recommend Linux to solve his/her parse errors. I resisted, but it took considerable personal restraint on my part. Plus, a desire to get along with other DUers.

[Electric Monk]

11. Ah, that explains a lot

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=1147427
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=1147505

Elad replied about the parse errors
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1240135184#post2

[Egalitarian Thug]

21. I'm guessing this is a case of PUI. He freaked out at the Linux replies to the call out

from his windoze buddy.

Everybody has a bad day now and then.

[longship]

22. That's why I don't want to be so hard on the guy.

Last edited Fri Aug 17, 2012, 05:09 AM - Edit history (1)

I didn't alert on him.

But I've never had a post hidden by jury, before so I wouldn't know what that's like.

DainBramaged, I hope you realize that there's no ill intent.

[madokie]

28. Longship you are a saint!

[longship]

33. I looked for the sarcasm thingie...

I am no saint. I just don't like DU chair throwing. I'd rather that we all get along.

Yes, I get my nickers in a bunch occasionally.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=1148248

But, I try to get along the best I can, as we all do here, one would hope.

I am no saint. Thanks for the complement, even if you did mean it sarcastically.

[madokie]

55. I know how to use that sarscams thingy

and it wasn't called for here.
Peace

[freshwest]

72. I never use :sarcasm: on other members, but plenty on repukes. We're all DU, right?

If I can bear to read someone's stuff, or see them mocking other members, there's always Ignore.

[freshwest]

71. Ah, yes, we all have those days. Appreciate your posts. And I don't alert posts, either.

[Zalatix]

46. Hey be nice, Linux lacks some critical Windows features.

Such as Superfetch, the Windows Genuine Advantage, Windows Media DRM, and access to a whole host of spyware and viruses. And all those choices you have with regards to Desktop Manager Environments is dizzying!

[longship]

49. I really wish Linux had that DRM thingie.

That way, some company could extort money from my wallet for permission to view or hear my own multimedia content.

Alas, with Linux I have to suffer with playing the CDs and DVDs I've purchased without paying additional money to the producer.

Whatta ya gonna do?

[muriel_volestrangler]

48. Your contribution to that other thread was particularly self-regarding

No, you're not willing to be friendly. You just posted there to make the claim "I'm superior, and have been for years". It was about polishing your own ego. And you look pretty ugly for coming here to gloat about his posts being hidden.

And, by the way, "his/her parse errors" were errors on the DU servers (which are running some form of UNIX). Someone who knew what they were doing with computers would have known that. I suggest you dial down your admiration of yourself.

[longship]

54. Well, I posted in his thread about those errors.

I get them, too. DU upgrades their servers late at night. I didn't mention Linux in my response since it would be a non-sequitur.

But since I was part of the other thread where the OP and a follower on did a preemptive attack on Linux users before any of us even jumped into the discussion, I felt that a response was justified, and that the Linux hate should be schooled, so to speak.

I am sorry that I come off as a Linux pedant, but I have worked in the Linux community for many years. I do not like it when people speak false bullshit about it. I am not ashamed of my expertease. No! I am not a kernel programmer. But, I have extensive experience as a high end user at a very high level.

When somebody spews BS, I am going to call them on it.

I do try to be friendly, but the thread mentioned above was not friendly at all, and the OPer did have two post hidden by jury. I was not the Alerter.

I am a very reasonable person. I listen and take in counter arguments. But I just will not suffer bias based on blind ignorance. Then, I will make a strong, and hopefully respectful counter argument.

About Linux, I know whaT I am talking about. It might not be for everybody, but damn, it is good. If you have somebody to help configure it, meaning installing the right software, maintenance and reliability is a no brainer. Plus, you'll never have to worry about another malware intrusion again. Plus, you won't be obsolete when a new version comes out.

It's win-win. Unless you are a gamer. Then, Windows is your choice.

[freshwest]

73. OS fights leave me cold. It's a matter of choice, not religion.

I've heard good things about Linux, and its use in developing countries. I don't have time to play with programming as I did many years ago. So it's plain old Mac OS for me, and it works fine for most of what I want to do.

I started out years ago before Windows with PCs, and had Windows machines, but was taken into the 'Cult of Mac' by friends and children, and I've never looked back.

I wish the two giants had played a bit better with each other and made more applications compatible. My state gov sites makes everything in Windows which doesn't work. OpenOffice doesn't even handle all of those files, so far. I end up having to do all sorts of work arounds for them. Frustrating.

[SoDesuKa]

13. I'm Not Geeky Enough to be Bothered With Linux

Linux true believers will write their own hardware drivers and smile through the whole process. Not me - I couldn't be more bored with that side of computing. I don't look forward to challenges that true Linux-ers seem to relish. That's why there's a Linux community and a community of people who aren't.

Linux natively supports the vanilla-est of plain vanilla apps. Anything remotely flavored gets an installation error.

[longship]

15. I've used Linux continuously for 15 years or so.

Last edited Fri Aug 17, 2012, 03:10 AM - Edit history (1)

I have never written a driver and I started with Slackware back in the early days where you had to actually compile source code to install it.

Today, with distributions like Ubuntu, Linux installation is a breeze, as easy as Windows actually, maybe easier. There's no security bullshit. You want an Office app? No problem! Select Sun Office, or one of the others and you're done. No secret codes. No DMCA climbing up your ass. Easy-peasy.

Microsoft is a software Ponzi scheme.

on edit: and I havent seen an installation error since I switched away from Red Hat packaging. Solution, use Ubuntu, or another distribution with Debian packaging.

[Zalatix]

17. Linux has made big strides in enhancing productivity.

And... installation error?

[SoDesuKa]

27. Installation Error

Maybe the problem is the installation CD's I'm using. There's always something Linux won't do. Something important. It's been a while since I hacked at it, but I don't have a big frustration threshold with Linux anymore. I know all the Linux songs, too! L-I-N-U-X, it's free, delightful and fun . . . Linux is for me-e-e-ee.

Sorry. Just the memory of the O/S refusing to do something important is enough to keep me from experimenting with it again. Maybe next month.

[longship]

35. Try Ubuntu and keep it up to date.

It is the easiest, by far. It also has a very advanced software repository and uses Debian packaging, which makes Red Hat look sick. All the good distributions use Debian. Trust me on this.

Once you have your software installed, upgrade is a single click. I have never seen a failure since I started using Ubuntu, years ago.

BTW, I also have a Gentoo Linux box, which has got to be the geekiest of all the distributions. Everything is compiled from scratch. An install can take days. Geek love there! You control everything including custom Linux kernel compilation which requires somewhat intimate familiarity with the hardware. Not for the faint of heart. But it's FAAAAST! I run it on an AMD Opteron twin core and it all runs at native 64 bit. I'd put it up against any Windows machine on any CPU.

But my quad core Ubuntu laptop beats the pants off it. My CPU meters (GKrellm) have eight meters, two per core (each with hyper threading). I have yet to saturate the CPU bandwidth. It just cruises along. Complex compilations don't even phase it.

Linux rules, my friend. It multitasks like nothing Microsoft has, or likely ever will have.

Peace, my friend.

[hobbit709]

41. I've seen plenty of installation errors with Windoze.

All you need is a dirty disk, flaky memory, flaky hard drive or optical drive.
Considering that I do new installs on a custom build or reinstalls on older machines by the dozen, my percentage of install errors is about the same with either M$ or Linux.

[Zalatix]

50. I do totally understand that. Linux sometimes burps on you.

Any Linux-related problems will heavily depend on which Distro you're using. I wish I knew which program or functionality you had a problem with...

[JCMach1]

20. in many respects current distros are easier than the alternatives

As for apps... Vanilla? I have everything I need and more. UBUNTU IS great for breathing life into pooched windows machines. Steam I think is doing some great things with games now too. LINUX gaming will change the percentage of users in a flash.

[madokie]

29. And you still live way back in the past.

The Ubuntu project made all that obsolete but you don't know that do you

[blogslut]

18. Whatever

I just bought a laptop with a SATA drive. My Windows XP disk won't recognize it unless I install a driver via floppy. Now I have to go buy a floppy drive plus a floppy disk just to install an operating system I have to use because of a handful of software programs with proprietary bullshit.

Both Linux Puppy and Ubuntu had no trouble recognizing the SATA.

[Warren Stupidity]

40. XP is over 10 years old. Try win7.

Ubuntu is fine. Linux on the desktop is going nowhere. It continues to fail the grandmother/pointy haired boss test.

[blogslut]

77. I refuse to spend upwards of $100.00 for a freaking OS

My XP disk came with an old computer and I've used it to install on every machine I've bought since. I'm not paying for the "privilege" of upgrading until I'm absolutely forced to. I have two programs that won't work on Linux and the day they do, it's goodbye MS - forever.

[Warren Stupidity]

89. Fine but your 12 year old os is not going to support some stuff that is newer than it is.

It is really silly to complain that xp doesn't support technologies that didn't exist when it was released.

[blogslut]

90. Windows 7 doesn't automatically recognize SATA drives either

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AHCI#Operating_system_support

[Warren Stupidity]

91. Um yes it does.

Your link is referring only to booting win7 with bios settings enabling ahci mode after installing win7 with the bios settings in legacy mode. win7 won't boot if you do that because the ahci driver wasn't enabled for boot load during install. If you install in ahci mode you won't have that problem. In either case win7 supports sata disks, obviously, as that is all that there are on any new desktop or laptop pc.

[blogslut]

93. Oh well

Still not buying Win 7 or 8 or any further Win OS's.

[malokvale77]

83. Yes and you can run...

Puppy right from the CD without installing. It's super fast and I've been known to repair friends Windows with it.

[cbgberlin]

23. Changing software..

I have changed so many times my software..from Linux,Windows to Macintosh..Computers are not for me..

[madokie]

24. Bull fucking shit

Who ever wrote this has no idea of what they write.
Totally completely a tool for microsoft this Gartner person
I've not read so much claptrap in my life. Its like the author has never used a Linux operating system. I give this a fail.

[sendero]

36. Disputing his reasoning is fine..

.. but are you disputing the 2% penetration? I'm betting that's about right.

I'm a long time not fan of Microsoft but there is a simple reason I continue to run Windows now, even after having run Linux at various times in the past.

1) Windows is finally stable. I can run my system for weeks without rebooting. Linux might still be a little better, but not enough to matter

2) The overall UI experience in Windows is finally pretty good. I like W7, the new taskbar,etc.

3) Linux can make a really fine system but you have to have time to tweak it, a lot of time in fact, to get everything installed and configured the way you want. Some people have more time for that than others. I recently replaced my desktop and I'd say I spent less than an hour getting everything installed and working.

4) The office clones and other freeware is good, but you will still find the occassional file they will not open for one reason or another. For those of us that consider our computer to be a tool like a car or a hammer, this is an unacceptable time waster.

I no longer think that Linux will ever be a force on the desktop. For servers and the like, well Linux is doing fine.

[Zalatix]

51. Windows 8 might do it for Linux.

Forcing people who just moved from Windows XP to Windows 7, to jump right to Windows 8? In such a short time? That's stupid. Linux already does what 8 wants to do and the cost factor will catch up to Microsoft.

Linux has two barriers to acceptance: installing/tweaking, and games. Once the former is dealt with, it will grow; Windows also invites a lot of tweaking and app installations, it's just a lot easier to do with a click of the mouse. Once the latter is dealt with, it will dominate.

The installing/tweaking barrier for Linux is eroding rapidly, with Ubuntu leading the way according to a lot of opinions. As for games, well, the gaming companies don't care about Linux. Except World of Warcraft, of course, they've got a Linux client.

[madokie]

56. Not disputing the 2%

pretty much everything else though.
I'll put my 11 year old computer up against any of the newer computers running windows7 for speed and ease of use any day
I tweak my Linux by adding and taking away but other than that I leave it as it comes.

I tried windows7 when it was in pre-release and I wasn't impressed, in fact after that was when I got serious with trying ubuntu and I've not looked back.

Down thread I mention my experience with a new computer running 7 so I won't add more here.
but hey whatever floats ones boat is fine with me just don't talk shit about what one doesn't understand or like is my opinion

[sendero]

60. I've been gainfully employed as..

.. a software developer for 25+ years. I was running Unix (not Linux at home in 1991. I like Linux and I really don't like MS but I've played around with installing and running Linus several times and I always find that it's just more trouble than it's worth.

As for performance, I replaced my desktop with a $320 Best Buy retail machine a couple months ago (W7 Home) and it is fine. Fact is, hardware performance has increased to the point where unless you are gaming any POS computer will do (thank you Moore's law).

I'm merely commenting on the idea that Linux is ever going to take over the desktop. It's not going to happen.

[madokie]

62. Thats funny as I just reloaded my ubuntu this morning

it took all of about 35 minutes to do complete, updates and all. No glitches at all either.
I'm not saying that linux will take over I'm saying that the person who wrote the article is full of shit, that is all.

I'm surprised you have problems with a Ubuntu install or Mint for that matter.

My computer is 11 years old btw

I done this reload as this thread was active. I wanted to change some things so I went with a fresh install instead as its so easy and quick to do.

it matters not though as I couldn't care less what the problem you have is, I'm relating my relationship with my computer and operating system and stating that the person who wrote the article doesn't know his shit.
I bought my first computer in '89 running msdos 3.1 so I've been around the block a few times.

[eShirl]

25. I use a Linux in-between the free preview versions of Winning!-doze.

Looks like I'll have to install some form of Linux again before long.

Probably Ubuntu: [link:http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2012/07/valve-announces-ubuntu-port-of-steam-source-engine-and-left-4-dead-2/|Valve announces Ubuntu port of Steam, Source engine, and Left 4 Dead 2
The company is also looking at porting additional titles to the platform.]

[kraj8995]

30. Its not a good OS.

The main reason is the user interface of this OS is not good in comparison to the Windows and Macintosh but it is highly secured because of its kernel structure.

[JCMach1]

37. I found the latest versions of Gnome

Extremely good.

[longship]

44. User interface has nothing to do with Linux OS

Linux is the kernel. The X Window System is the server that handles the graphics, which is separate from the kernel. The user interface operates in user space and lays on top of Linux and X. You can even replace the entire user interface without shutting down the computer or even logging off.

So if you do not like the user interface, try another. No big deal, you don't even need to reboot. You can have multiple user interfaces on a single machine and can try them out until you find the one you like. You're not stuck with what Microsoft wants to send you.

What I really like is to run a program on one machine and display it on another. I have a lot of movies on my desktop. Sometimes I want to watch on my laptop. I log onto my desktop from my laptop and run the video program to play a movie. It displays on my laptop; the video streaming across my internal network. This is a standard X Window System feature and Windows cannot do it. It just works on Linux.

I can operate any Linux boxen on my network like it was sitting in front of me. I can do nearly everything with complete transparency and Linux has been this way from the beginning. Anything I can do on a box, I can do from a connected box.

And yet it is secure! Try that with Windows.

Sorry for evangelizing here. But Linux fucking rules. It does things Windows never dreamed of.

[Spider Jerusalem]

70. There are multiple user interfaces

KDE is probably as good as the Mac or Windows UI; it's very polished with an integrated suite of applications. GNOME is another reasonably good choice.

Here's KDE:

The only "user interface" issues that Linux brings is that some things are still better done via a terminal/command line.

[2on2u]

32. Why the low numbers are not bad at all....

http://royal.pingdom.com/2011/05/12/the-top-20-strongholds-for-desktop-linux/

Why these “low” numbers are not bad at all

Linux may currently be a niche desktop OS, but that doesn’t necessarily have to be a bad thing. It’s often described as the “tinkerer’s OS,” and it’s hard to see how it could go mainstream and retain that quality. If you keep that in mind, it’s quite possible that Linux will never go mainstream on the desktop, but will continue to flourish in a similar way it is now, with a relatively small but very dedicated community of users.

And when we say “relatively small” we really mean relatively. The worldwide Linux desktop OS market share (0.76%) coupled with the number of Internet users (1.97 billion) indicates that there are at least 15 million active desktop Linux users out there.

We say “at least,” because that number is probably significantly higher since there is a lot of overlap in these stats with people who use more than one OS and more than one computer.

That’s not a small community by anyone’s standards (except maybe Facebook’s ).

[JonLP24]

34. I don't understand the anger here

Who cares if someone prefers Linux or dislikes Microsoft. It wasn't even a Linux user that brought up linux in that thread.

[ikri]

74. It's a really tedious argument

I've used plenty of different OS's during my time and every single one sucks in different ways.

[TheManInTheMac]

38. "You have to switch to the new version of Linux every year,"

Ok, just with that statement I can tell that Michael Silver doesn't know what he's talking about. Even if it were true, installing Linux is now easier than installing Windows; has been for about the last ten years now.

[smaug]

86. Really?

I find that amusing -- 'switch to the new version of Linux' - as far as I can see, Linux is the same across all the distributions. Now, the distributions are different - but incredibly flexible - which is the problem!

I've used Linux since 1994 - in fact, at our resource center, our groupware system, Moodle server, and most of our web servers run on some form of Linux (or BSD - including our MacOSX server). I use all kinds of distributions, and have even built them from scratch (that'll learn ya on *exactly* what hardware you have!). Do my users realize they're using Linux?

No.

But the sites down the road, with Windows servers, spend a significant amount of time fixing problems with their so-called 'standard' systems. Our system admin mail list for sharing problems stays full of problems I haven't ever seen.



I came from higher ed, using UNIX (Sun and HP) so Linux wasn't a problem. It's actually modeled on the Minix operating system, which is a good one for teaching operating systems (disclaimer: I used to teach systems and programming in college).

Yes, I've written hardware drivers. No, there shouldn't be any need to do so with any modern system. What confuses many people is the idea of freedom to do whatever you need to do with your computer. This was the norm in the personal computer world until the advent of the IBM PC and MS-DOS. The true perversion of personal computing was the Microsoft marketing that convinced rational people that they had to buy their software.

[JCMach1]

39. I would not keep windows at all

If it were not for gaming. And even that is starting to change.

[Upton]

42. I bought an Acer netbook a few years back..

has some Linux distro on it called Linpus Linux Lite..piece of garbage. I've used the thing less than 15-20 times. Fuck it. I'll take Windows 7 or whatever anytime.

[longship]

47. Try Ubuntu with Sun Office.

It is awesome.

[DiverDave]

45. Jeez, my head is spinning

who are you guys? and what planet are you from?
Writing your own sourcecode is FUN???
Oh, and please dont take offense, I really wasnt calling anyone names,
well maybe just me, as I am such an idiot at times.


Jeez, I took a few courses in netadmin awhile back and I havnt a clue what you guys are talking about.
I would love to get away from M$ but the couple of times I tried
Ubantu is was slow and froze at the logon screen.
also what the heck is up with that start screen?
Just a few symbles that I dug around trying to find
out what the heck they meant.
I really want it to work...
I will dive in again.
Any boards that might be a help for me?

[DainBramaged]

52. All of you combined are a tiny percentage of the overall user base for PC's

yet the apples are bullshit, Gartner doesn't know what he's talking about, yada, yada, yada. Amazing how angry you become. If you don't believe the article, do your own research. But the statistics below are telling.


Sorry your egos are tweaked.

By the way, Gartner isn't a hobbyist or a guy.


http://www.gartner.com/technology/home.jsp



Operating system statistics on Wikimedia

Windows 7   37.94%
Windows Vista   7.64%
Windows XP   23.40%
Other Windows   1.44%
Mac OS X   7.46%
iPhone   7.00%
iPad   2.98%
Android   4.73%
Linux   1.53%
Other   5.85%

Usage shares of operating systems as of June 2012


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_share_of_operating_systems




Have a nice day.

[blogslut]

79. Don't you think that

...the fact that the majority of off-the-shelf PCs sold in the last 15 come bundled with MS might have something to do with their OS's "amazing" market share?

[tridim]

53. The real reasons: No Word, no Office, no Photoshop.

GiMP has about 20% of the functionality of photoshop. It's amazing for a free program, but it's not even close in functionality and features.

Open office is fine, but it's simply not MS Office with Outlook integration. Office is what average employees know, and thus what businesses use.

[Zalatix]

85. Open Office is unequal to MS Office exactly how?

[ReverendDeuce]

57. Linux has no policy management framework, their "solution" is a heap of hell...

Pick one of several dozen (hundred?) directory services for Linux/UNIX and then pray that everything is compatible. Or, you can run a Windows ActiveDirectory setup and buy some third-party GPO stuff for every one of your Linux servers. But again, pray your version of Linux is supported by the tool or else you're dead in the water.

Oh, and the dependencies! Sweet holy shit, don't you EVER fuck up a library dependency! "DLL hell" on Windows was eradicated well over ten years ago. Linux still pisses itself if you have a version mismatch of any sort. SUSE is the worst offender.

Every Linux has a different package management system, too... although it does seem to be settling down a bit, and I think there are only three or four "major" package management tools.

Any way you look at it, Linux for the desktop is a bad, bad idea.

[BumRushDaShow]

59. I've been using some iteration of Suse (now openSuse) for 14 years

as my primary desktop, and some iteration of Red Hat or Debian for several years before that. It has definitely come a long long way. It took many years of mass penetration of *nixes on the internet to get M$ to finally address their virus-infested OS and take security seriously.

[slackmaster]

61. Ubuntu is not a good choice for a desktop system

It gets updated and patched waaaaay too often. Stuff that you had working perfectly breaks when you need it to be stable.

[2ndAmForComputers]

67. CentOS

Rock solid. Free. Guarantee of security patches WITHOUT major version updates until 2021. Highly recommended.

[FarCenter]

63. In IT, most of the interesting stuff is not popular; most of the popular stuff is not interesting.

[datasuspect]

65. n00b

[2ndAmForComputers]

66. Did Linus Torvalds run over your dog or something?

Dude. It's just software. Chill the fuck out.

[LanternWaste]

68. I imagine many people believe More Popular is equivalent to Better.

I imagine many people believe More Popular is equivalent to Better; and become embittered, vulgar and minimizing towards any who may disagree with them.

Corporate Branding is little more than a popularity contest-- yet many adults fall for it, and declare Coke is the better beverage than Pepsi, by a three to one margin-- and nine out of ten doctors recommend Coke...

[Spider Jerusalem]

69. This is a very poorly informed article, sorry

first: Ubuntu at least has a "long term support" version that's supported for three years for desktops/workstations and five years for servers. You don't have to switch to a new version every year. And in place upgrades are very simple even if you did have to; when a new release is available, the update manager notifies you, and you can install with a click as long as you have sufficient bandwidth. However I agree that the big thing holding back Linux adoption is a) the lack of games for Linux (which will change with Valve porting all the Steam content for Linux); and the lack of certain commercial applications (Linux versions of Photoshop and MS Office for instance).

[hunter]

75. Anybody who loves Windows is a masochist.

I won't touch Windows unless someone is paying me.

Seeing Gartner flogging Windows like this made me lose my appetite.

It's a tool, not a sports event

I've bought Windows twice for myself, version 3.1 and version 98SE.

I used 98SE on my best home machine for a few years before I switched to Debian and I've never looked back.

I'm not an unbiased observer, however. The first real operating system I used regularly was the Second Berkeley Software Distribution. I wrote dozens of term papers using vi. I wrote a lot of software and little tools. Debian was like going home. All that stuff "just worked" in Debian.

The first modern macintosh operating system, OS X, is built on a BSD foundation. Microsoft didn't have their own modern operating system until NT (OS/2 was a Microsoft-IBM collaboration). Until NT, Widows was a pretty shell pasted over MS-DOS. MS-DOS is not really an operating system at all, it's just a bag full of primitive tools. I'm probably a little rusty but I could write decent code for DOS in assembly language or Turbo-Pascal.

A modern distribution of debian-based ubuntu is the equal of modern microsoft or macintosh operating systems. The only thing ubuntu can't do is run certain proprietary software like Microsoft Word, Internet Explorer, Photoshop, and many newer games. The companies that make those products could publish Linux versions, but they don't, and Linux users tend to get irritated with Digital Rights Management obstructions anyways. Some of us will install Adobe Flash for Linux, but Flash is on the way out. Most of YouTube now works without it.

Older Windows and DOS games run fine in Ubuntu once you've got wine and dosbox figured out.

Day-to-day desktop computer stuff like web browsing and word processing in Ubutu are pretty much the same point as Windows. Firefox is a good browser, and for most people LibreOffice is an adequate substitute for Microsoft Office.

One problem novice linux users have is the behavior of linux gurus who say things like "open a terminal and type unintelligible stream of syllables while a windows guru will say "click this, that, and that, and then check this." There's probably a point and click way to do what needs to be done in ubuntu but the guru linux user never did it that way while the long time windows user has always used point and click.

For me the best thing about linux is I can install it on as many machines as I like without worrying about licenses, "activations," and all that other proprietary nuisances. It's also pretty common for me to take a hard-drive from one computer and put it in an entirely different machine and have it boot up as if nothing has changed. Windows doesn't do that. Transferring my home directory to a newer machine and distribution is also trivial.

I'm a packrat. When I build a new computer for myself, I transfer everything from my old computers over. I can run software I wrote for the atari 800 and play games I bought thirty years ago on my current desktop. I couldn't do these upgrades as quickly or as easily if I'd stayed with windows, nor could I afford to. I build my computers out of junk, and I'm pretty sure installing Windows 7 or 8 on the machine I'm writing this on would be a futile and miserable experience and I wouldn't end up with a machine that did what I want.

If a machine doesn't do what you want it to it's no good. If it does, well then, it's just doing what it's supposed to do. I use Linux because it does what I want it to do. Other people use Windows because it does what they want it to do.

[madokie]

82. I don't have the experience that you do

but I did start with DOS 3.1 and didn't start using windows until win98 and only grudgingly at that. Only because I wanted to connect to the Internet did I do it otherwise I'd have stayed with dos 5 as I felt comfortable with it and could do anything I wanted to do starting at the dos prompt. When RoyBGiv, not sure I have his moniker spelled correctly but anyway only after he explained to me that Linux has a dos box, if you will, the Terminal, did I feel comfortable with trying Linux. No way would I consider ever going back to a microsoft operating system now. My computer is 11 years old and because I use ubuntu I have no need to buy a new one and won't until this one dies graveyard dead and I'll more than likely resuscitate it with a transplant of whatever fails. Its not a money thing for me its a pride thing. All in all I've given microsoft over $1200 of my hard earned cash since 1989 but no more will I.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

80. Linux is OK

[malokvale77]

81. You don't have a clue what your talking about

[Initech]

84. Most hardcore Linux users aren't buying Dells.

As a DIY PC guy I can tell you that's the wrong indication of how successful an operating system is going to be. If you're buying Dell crap, chances are good that you don't know or care how to use Linux.

The other big factor is the gaming industry. It's like the porno index of how successful a given video format is. If games were more available on Linux - you between your ass that Windows wouldn't be as popular. But with a lot of developers beginning to denounce Windows 8 and the Xbox Live subscription service - expect those numbers to greatly flip in the next couple years.

[Riftaxe]

87. Linux is good

as long as your hardware is 2 years behind the current distro.

[foo_bar]

88. I don't really think of Linux as a desktop OS to begin with

(Yeah, I suppose Linux isn't technically an OS either, but when people say "Linux" they usually mean "a Linux-based distribution" not "the freakin Linux kernel itself".)

I guess Fedora/Debian have desktop pretensions, or at least GNOME and their app developers do, but it's hard to compete with Apple's design gurus or Megahard's Borg-like scale, so the result can feel clunky and amateurish (not that wordpad.exe surpasses anything Apple was doing in 1984 human interface-wise, but Ubuntu can feel a bit like Windows 3.1 minus Minesweeper.) But then I wouldn't try to run Apache on a Windows box (actually I would, but then I'd port it to CentOS or whatever and marvel at the difference), so I think it's like comparing a Silicon Graphics workstation to a Sega Dreamcast; obviously you don't want to play games on Linux unless you like Quake3-on-WINE (exaggerating only slightly), nor would you want to run a LAMP stack on Windows (or IIS and SQL Server for that matter unless you have hardware and micromanagers to burn), so I think the two can coexist without all the fanboy-fatwas typical of the mac vs. pc flamewars (and even there I think you're comparing distinct ecological niches: I'd rather use a Mac for graphic design or homey iPhoto type things, and Windows for the latest Bioware diversion or the preponderance of proprietary win-only apps, but if you're basically browsing the web and running a word processor then it boils down to an aesthetic choice, or more mundane cost-of-ownership calculations like clapboard vs. vinyl siding.)

[eridani]

92. Silly wabbits! Linux is for programmers!

My DH loves it, but then again when he says "user" it reminds me of a Hell's Angel sayin "citizen".