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Louis1895

(768 posts)
Sat Dec 8, 2018, 10:58 AM Dec 2018

25th Amendment Question

Sorry if this has been asked before.

Section 4 of the 25th Amendment of the US Constitution says:

Section 4.

Whenever the Vice President and a majority of either the principal officers of the executive departments or of such other body as Congress may by law provide, transmit to the President pro tempore of the Senate and the Speaker of the House of Representatives their written declaration that the President is unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office, the Vice President shall immediately assume the powers and duties of the office as Acting President.

Thereafter, when the President transmits to the President pro tempore of the Senate and the Speaker of the House of Representatives his written declaration that no inability exists, he shall resume the powers and duties of his office unless the Vice President and a majority of either the principal officers of the executive department or of such other body as Congress may by law provide, transmit within four days to the President pro tempore of the Senate and the Speaker of the House of Representatives their written declaration that the President is unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office. Thereupon Congress shall decide the issue, assembling within forty-eight hours for that purpose if not in session. If the Congress, within twenty-one days after receipt of the latter written declaration, or, if Congress is not in session, within twenty-one days after Congress is required to assemble, determines by two-thirds vote of both Houses that the President is unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office, the Vice President shall continue to discharge the same as Acting President; otherwise, the President shall resume the powers and duties of his office.


Does the underlined, bolded, and italicized section above (my emphasis) provide an easier and faster way around impeachment, if such "body" existed? Can Congress create a body to remove the President in this way? Would the "law" be subject to veto by the President? If so, is it easier to override the veto in the Senate than convict after impeachment?

Is some law already on the books that says a President can be considered "unable to discharge the powers and duty of his office" in a way that does not involve medical or physical incapacitation and Congress has already established "body" to make such a determination? You know, like when he is the asset of a hostile foreign power?
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25th Amendment Question (Original Post) Louis1895 Dec 2018 OP
Since Republicans control the Senate, these wistful fantasies are pointless.nt procon Dec 2018 #1
Answers onenote Dec 2018 #2

onenote

(42,598 posts)
2. Answers
Sat Dec 8, 2018, 11:24 AM
Dec 2018

While Congress could pass a law designating a "body" that will take the place of the Cabinet with respect to invoking the 25th amendment, its unlikely that doing so would make Trump's removal via the 25th amendment quicker or easier than removal via impeachment.

First, you'd have to get a majority in the Senate to go along with such a law and to agree to the qualifications/ membership of this "body" -- would it be medical doctors, psychiatrists, psychologists, lay persons who consult with medical personnel? How many? Who would appoint them? For how long?

Second, Trump could veto the law and then you'd need the numbers in the House and Senate to override.

Third, after the body was authorized and named, and conducted whatever medical/psychological examination (and would the President be compelled to submit to such an examination), you not only would need a "majority" of whomever made up this "body", but also would need the concurrence of the Vice President. He alone could scuttle the invocation of the 25th.

Finally, in the end, its all temporary unless both 2/3 of both houses vote to override the president's insistence that he is not unable to carry out the duties of the office.

So impeachment, as unlikely as it is, is easier and faster.

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