I'd be okay with Beto, or Booker, or Harris, or Brown, or Gillibrand, or...

[Bucky]

Or Klobuchar, or Warren, or that what's-his-face Congress guy from California, or that kooky good old boy from West Virginia. Really, anyone but Avenatti (who my voice-to-text still writes out as "have a naughty" ) but he was never really a thing.

And yeh yeh, I'm good with Hillary, Joe, and Bernie too, even if I personally think it's past time to pass the torch. Whoever. At some point I'll land on a preference, I reckon, but I trust this party not to nominate a bum steer, and I'm pretty damn comfortable with our range of options.

One thing I'm not gonna tolerate is a circular firing squad. None of our major candidates are unacceptable. We need to disagree agreeably here, and get out there and fight like hell next year.

[Wounded Bear]

1. I think you mean...

disagree "agree-ably."

[Bucky]

2. Ha!

Yes, I should fix that so poeple dont' think I'me a bad proffreader

[Hermit-The-Prog]

3. you misspelled peeple

Gives me an excuse to K with the R.

[msongs]

4. the kooky boy from VA that says he voted for trump? nt

[Glamrock]

5. Respectfully, I disagree.

We nominated a bum steer last election. I know I'm gonna get flamed for this, but it's true. We new about the gerrymandering, we knew about the voter suppression. And we chose a candidate (who was the most qualified and who I was proud to vote for) who had 20+ years of bullshit scandals associated with her. Yes, it's bullshit. Yes, it's unfair. But we have to play the hand we're dealt. Choosing someone who was upside down in popularity with the Supreme Court in the balance was stupid. I hope and pray we choose more strategically next time.

[pnwmom]

6. She wasn't a "bum steer." And she wasn't "upside down" in popularity.

She was more popular than any other candidate in either the primary or the general.

She won by 2.9 million votes, despite millions of votes affected by voter suppression. Overall, she had less than 80K votes fewer than Obama in 2012, despite Russia, and voter suppression, and the Comey letter.

We don't need to "choose more strategically" next time. There is no candidate they won't fight dirty against. We need to fight like hell to overcome voter suppression.

But I do think the time for Hillary, Bernie, or Joe is past. And we have plenty of other excellent candidates to choose from.

[Sherman A1]

8. I did vote for the candidate in the general, however

I agree that we would have likely done much better with another choice. I believe you are correct in your viewpoint regarding popularity, because all the qualifications in the world do you no good if you are not popular enough to carry the states you need to carry to win the election.

You will not get flamed by me, although we may get flamed together.

[Glamrock]

15. Thanks sherm

Nice to know I'm not alone.

[brush]

23. Have to disagree. Repugs would've slimed Sanders as a socialist with Russia connections...

with wild plans with no way to pay for them.

And Hillary actually won the popular vote.

We all know by now, and many of us knew the day after, the election was stolen.

[Glamrock]

24. I don't disagree with that.

I do disagree with sliming anybody else would have been nearly as effective. They had 20+ years of Hillary sliming to fall back on. Just my opinion....

[brush]

25. Sanders has some rather unflattering things in his background...

too that repug oppo researchers were ready to divulge if need be.

[Glamrock]

26. No doubt no doubt.

But he didn't have 20 years of false allegations against him. As I said, I was arguing against Democrats, trying to get them to vote for her. That BS worked. And for the record, it ain't about Sanders. It's about strategy. I firmly believe O'Malley would have been a better choice. I'm sorry, you can hate me if you wish, but choosing Clinton when the Supreme Court hung in the balance was an epic failure.

[Mike Nelson]

9. Respectfully, I disagree

… Trump and the Republicans would have dumped decades of scandals and smears on ANY nominee. If there were no scandals, they would MAKE THEM UP. They would have made any nominee a character they ridicule and despise. And, they will DO IT AGAIN.

[Glamrock]

14. True that

But there were 20+ years already built in with Madame Secretary. To the point that I had to argue with fucking Democrats to turn out the vote.

[recentevents]

10. I agree

Which is why it pains me to say I'm not so sure about Bernie. I supported him in the last election, still support him and his policies. But I'm hesitant to support a Presidential run this time. The baggage he's picked up in the last few years may be too much. There are many who have picked up his momentum, it may be time to take a look at them. Still love the man but I'm keeping my options open at this time.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

13. Anyone with positive approval ratings will mop the floor with Trump's rat's nest hairdo.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

11. Yep. It shouldn't have been close enough to steal.

[Bucky]

19. I'm not a fan of candidates bringing in lots of baggage. I think all our septugenarian candidates do

Even my beloved Joe Biden.

I'm definitely wanting to see the torch passed. But that said, for a such a shitty public speaker, Hillary Clinton is a formidable candidate. She got the nomination against Bernie and it wasn't all that close. If she's nominated, I'll grit my teeth and cowboy up.

[Glamrock]

21. Me too brother, me too.

And I'll be proud to do so. But, goddamnit, we have to be strategic. And there was no strategy in the last election. It was, who's the best candidate instead of who can win. I adore Secretary Clinton. That's no shit. Speaking truth. But I never felt she could win. I know conservatives who hated pulling the lever for Trump. But they'd crawl over broken glass to vote against Madame Speaker. 20+ years of bullshit accusations and 7 House investigations into Benghazi were successful. Fuck man. I had to argue with goddamn Democrats to try to turn out the vote! What were we thinking? Ya know?

[jillan]

28. Agreed

[Hekate]

30. She won by 3 million more votes despite everything the GOP, Trump, AND the Russians could throw...

...at her.

She got substantially more votes -- and some days, knowing that is all that gives me faith in my fellow citizens any more. WE did not elect HIM. So don't excuse your opinions by saying it was her fault or she was a bad candidate. It simply is not true.

[Glamrock]

31. Not where it mattered

It’s great she ran up the score on the coasts though.

[Hekate]

32. The cheating wasn't happening on the coasts, was it? It was places where Jill Stein's voters...

...could make a difference. It was places that ethnically cleansed their voter rolls. It was places where suppression efforts coud make a difference. It was on the effing margins.

AND SHE STILL WON.

[Glamrock]

33. Which was my point

We knew that shit was happening and we needed to overcome it.

[betsuni]

34. In 2014 a New York Times/CBS News poll found that 82 percent of Democrats favored Clinton

over both Joe Biden and Elizabeth Warren. A Quinnipiac poll reported that registered voters in Ohio chose Clinton over Jeb Bush, Marco Rubio, Rand Paul, Ted Cruz, John Kasich. Hillary's popularity rate was over 60 in 2015.

"'If the election were held tomorrow,' John McCain said, 'Hillary Clinton would most likely be President.' ... In April of 2015, Hillary announced her candidacy, and within weeks, John McCain's prediction was replaced (by the press) with her annoying 'presumption of inevitability,' and her GOP colleagues began to alchemize everything good that she had accomplished while serving her country, transforming the gold into ashes. Her tenure as secretary of state became 'Benghazi' and then 'the email scandals.' Her years of experience trying to find common ground in a highly polarized government became evidence of her enmeshment in 'establishment politics.' Her ability to moderate between progressive goals and the necessities of working within a consumer capitalist society (yes, like it or not, that is what we are) became 'being in the pocket of Wall Street.' And every time she tried to explain -- anything -- she was branded as 'lying,' 'deflecting,' or 'covering up.' It was relentless, ... take a look at the June 2016 report from Harvard's Shorenstein Center which showed that even when 'scandals' were not involved, 84 percent of Clinton's coverage was negative compared to 43 percent of Trump's and 17 percent of Sanders's."
From Susan Bordo's "The Destruction of Hillary Clinton."

[Glamrock]

35. Thanks betsuni

[betsuni]

36. Oops, left out a sentence, had to edit. You're welcome!

I finished this book today and want to quote the whole thing.

[RandiFan1290]

38. Amen. nt

[EricMaundry]

7. Yes

I agree.

[scheming daemons]

12. I'd vote for a ham sandwich with a (D) next to it on a ballot against Trump.

And so would most Americans.

[Bucky]

20. This comment is insensitive to vegan-Democrats

[scheming daemons]

22. Even vegan-Democrats would vote for a ham sandwich over Trump.

[Dopers_Greed]

16. I disagree

We need the strongest possible nominee.

Being OK with the nominee NO MATTER WHAT, caused the few Repugs with consciences to hold their nose and vote Dump.

Also, the extremely crowded Repug field in 2016 allowed Dump to win the nomination. He was able to differentiate himself, while the other candidates split the majority of the vote.

[Garrett78]

29. Proportional allocation of delegates, as well as superdelegates, could have prevented Trump's nom.

[peggysue2]

17. Agree wholeheartedly

Unless, of course, we want to commit political suicide before we even get started. Be it Kamala Harris, Beto O'Rourke, Elizabeth Warren et al, the negative comments and articles have already begun. Warren for her DNA snafu, Harris for a sin by association, O'Rourke for supposedly vague stances on Single-Payer and other progressive issues.

And, of course, it doesn't stop there.

We really, really need to put a lid on these targeted attacks, particularly within our own tent. The GOP will attempt to smear any and all Democrats; we don't need to do their work for them. All these candidates require a fair shot of rising or failing on their own merits until the best, the strongest emerge. Once the field is narrowed then we get to parry on the plus and minuses, ultimately choosing the best candidate to defeat the Trumpster and his odious acolytes. If, in fact, Trump is even on the ballot.

I would ask: who benefits from kneecapping all these potential Democratic candidates?

I have my own suspicions.

[TryLogic]

18. The Republicans always attack, usually dirty. It will be difficult for anyone.

We cannot be so anxious to beat Trump or who ever becomes the nominee that we rush to jump onto a popularity wagon. We need a highly qualified candidate who can also campaign effectively. We need large numbers of individuals thinking, thinking clearly, about what our nation needs. It is the people's job to identify and elect a good president. It appears we will have several excellent possibilities.

This time around we need NO FORGONE CONCLUSIONS. We need a clean process, not infected by money or emotion. We need the democratic wing to do its job, unhindered.

[Liberty Belle]

27. I am hoping Bernie will find someone to get behind who is young and can ignite his base.

He was drawing huge crowds and can get them behind the right candidate. We need that.

We also must get someone who will support healthcare for all and not waffle about it.

It's best for the old guard including Hilary and Biden and Bernie to ALL unite behind someone a little bit younger but who can CONNECT with voters. The corporatists need to give progressives a shot within reason, though there may be a few fringe things progressives may have to wait on to bring in the moderates this election.

The way we wound up with Bill Clinton was because he could connect with voters and "feel their pain." Bernie had that connection. On the TOP side, George W. Bush was the guy everyone "wanted to have a beer with." Reagan was known as the "great communicator" because even though it was acting, he came across as genuine to the average voter.

We need those blue collar votes in places like Michigan and Wisconsin. Anyone who seems artificial or stilted would have a much harder time of winning.

Of course we cannot give up on Democratic values. A big problem Hilary had, besides the past scandals (even if bogus) was all her donations and coziness with Wall Street that sends the disaffected off to go vote Green and some swing voters to vote Republican.

Please, no corporatists, and nobody who won't fight 100% for single payer healthcare for all, and for the rights of women, minorities, etc. and come across as likeable and genuine even to those who may disagree wtih some policies. CARING about people, and making them believe it, is the real key to winning.

[oberliner]

37. "that what's-his-face Congress guy from California"

Who is that?

[louis c]

39. Otto Wels in 1932

When deciding on a leader in a constitutional democracy, I always like to cite the German election in 1932,

Otto Wels was the standard German politician representing the standard German political party, the Christian Democrats.

Mr. Wels would speak in superlatives, he was a key negotiator for Germany during the despised Versailles Treaty that ended WWI. He represented the status quo during turbulent times and a worsening economy.

So, the German's turned to the alternative. They gave his opponent a plurality that he later used to gain complete power. But, there was an election.

Too many Germans thought it would be wise to try something different, to take a chance. After all, what did they have to lose (where have I heard that before?).

Sometimes, we need to recognize a binary choice. Sometimes, the gamble is far too risky.

Unlike the Germans of 1932, we will get another chance. Let's not fuck this up.

I don't give a fuck who the Democratic candidate for President is in 2020, I'm working my as off for him or her. I may even sit out the primaries and keep my powder dry for the General, because the life of this country depends on that outcome and not any other.

This country will survive and prosper with any of the Democratic candidates as President. It will not survive a second Trump term.