I think some people are reading far too much into the fact that Manafort helped pick Pence as VP

[Tommy_Carcetti]

Last edited Mon Dec 10, 2018, 01:42 PM - Edit history (1)

I’m not necessarily saying it’s impossible that there couldn’t be something more to that fact, but you have to consider that Manafort was the campaign manager for Trump at the time candidates traditionally vet and pick their VP nominees.

So while people might rush to conclusions that Manafort helped push Pence for reasons relating to Russia, right now there’s nothing that specifically indicates that to be the case.

Currently it looks like Pence’s most significant exposure in the Trussia probe is that he might know more about Flynn’s activities than he let on.

That’s definitely not a good thing for him, but I don’t necessarily think that alone pulls him into Trump’s inner circle of Russia conspirators. Whether that alone places him in any realistic legal jeopardy without something more substantial coming to light is somewhat doubtful.

I’m not trying to be a downer here, nor am I trying to excuse a rat bastard the likes of Pence, but I do think we need to keep certain expectations realistic.

I know people are rooting for a Trump-Pence “two-fer” after January 3rd that leads to both being simultaneously impeached and removed and we get President Pelosi. And as much as I would love that, just like a notion of a redo election for Hillary, that sadly just will never happen.

[mucifer]

1. he would be a huge idiot if he had no idea treason was happening when

so many people on the transition team which he was in charge of were in their roles were committing treason.

[zipplewrath]

2. He wasn't in charge

Christy was in charge for a long time. Pence was his replacement, but it was a bit of a "figure head" position really. Jared was really running things. Which gets us back to the "huge idiot" part.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

5. I think lingering questions about his knowledge will be enough of an issue to haunt him...

...if Trump is disposed of and he runs in 2020.

I don’t know if it alone creates the political will for impeachment.

[Bleacher Creature]

3. Agree. Manafort may have just viewed Pence as easy to manipulate.

And I doubt we'll see a smocking gun indicating otherwise.

[dansolo]

9. And he would get the evangelicals on board

The Pence pick was most likely tactical. The Russian involvement came later.

[Beakybird]

4. I agree.

Ig he lied to investigators about Flynn, there might be perjury. I don't see Russian connections though.

[unc70]

6. Bit of a Russian link through his brother

[wishstar]

7. Agree, and I think Kellyanne and Mercers pushed for an evangelical to cement conservative votes

Knowing that Pence was such a diehard dominionist that he would overlook everything sleazy and unethical done by Trump and gang just to promote the evangelical cause and push them into influence in WH.

[onenote]

8. Thank you.

Some of the posts on DU indicating that Pence is on the verge of going down are based largely on assumed facts not yet in evidence. (To be sure, any number of pundits and "experts" do the same thing). But if there is one thing that has become clear over the past year, it is that when Mueller acts, it typically is based in large part, if not entirely, on specific evidence that was not previously known to the public.

[Garrett78]

10. Agreed. More than likely it was a purely political decision. Boost evangelical turnout.

[LeftInTX]

11. I have always thought Pence was brought in because he was an Evangelical

and because he actually had some experience.

We had wild and crazy Trump paired with a pencil.

[ffr]

12. Except that the timeline doesn't support your hypothesis.

July 15, 2016
Trump Picks Pence as Running Mate

July 15, 2016
Flynn Denounces Turkey’s Erdoğan

Oct. 14, 2016
Pence Denies Coordination With WikiLeaks

Nov. 8, 2016
Flynn Publishes Op-Ed on Turkey

Nov. 10, 2016
Obama Warns Trump Not to Hire Flynn

Nov. 11, 2016
Pence Replaces Christie as Transition Team Chair
Now heading the Trump transition team, Gov. Chris Christie (R-NJ) had warned Trump not to give a high-level administration position to retired Gen. Michael Flynn, who is not on any of the team’s long lists for government appointments. While Christie is chairing a meeting of Trump’s transition team, Flynn and another retired general, Keith Kellogg, enter the room. Neither is a member of the team. When Christie asks if he can help them, Ivanka Trump, who is a member of the team’s executive council, says she invited them to attend.

Praising Flynn’s “amazing loyalty to my father,” Ivanka asks Flynn what job he wants. Flynn expresses interest in becoming secretary of state or secretary of defense.

Hours later, Mike Pence replaces Christie as head of the transition team.

Nov. 14, 2016
Flynn’s Lobbying Activities for Turkey Resurface

Nov. 18, 2016
Democrats Denounce Flynn in a Letter to Pence

Nov. 18, 2016
Trump Names Flynn National Security Adviser

Nov. 28, 2016
Trump’s Team Acknowledges Cummings’ Letter

Late November 2016
Flynn Tells Senior Trump Advisers He’s Scheduled Kislyak Meeting

Dec. 1, 2016
Kushner Suggests Using Russian Embassy as Safe Communication Channel

Mid-December 2016
Flynn Reportedly Discusses Kidnapping Turkish Cleric

Dec. 28-29, 2016
Flynn Discusses New Sanctions With Kislyak

Dec. 30, 2016
Putin Announces Russia Will Not Retaliate Against Sanctions

Dec. 31, 2016
Flynn Relays Kislyak Talks To Trump Team

Jan. 15, 2017
Pence Says Flynn’s Calls to Russian Ambassador Were Unrelated to Sanctions

Jan. 15, 2017
Pence Denies Contacts Between Russia and the Trump Campaign

Jan. 22, 2017
Flynn Sworn In as National Security Adviser

During the week following the Jan. 20, 2017, inauguration
President Trump Considers Lifting Sanctions on Russia

Jan. 26, 2017
DOJ Says Flynn Lied; McGahn Informs Trump

Jan. 27, 2017
DOJ Warns White House That Flynn Is Vulnerable to Blackmail

Feb. 19, 2017
Priebus Can’t Get the Story of Flynn’s Firing Straight

March 2, 2017
New York Times Reports on Undisclosed Meeting Between Kushner, Flynn and Russian Ambassador

March 9, 2017
Pence Says He Had No Idea About Flynn’s Lobbying in Turkey

March 22, 2017
House Oversight Committee Requests Information About Flynn’s Foreign Lobbying Activities

April 19, 2017
White House Won’t Release Documents on Flynn’s Foreign Lobbying

April 28, 2017
Senate Intelligence Committee Demands Records From Trump Campaign Advisers

May 6-7, 2017
Trump Decides to Fire FBI Director Comey

May 8, 2017
Trump’s Team Develops Cover-Up for Comey’s Ouster

On the Monday after his weekend at Bedminster, Trump meets with senior White House officials, including White House counsel Don McGahn and Vice President Mike Pence. According to later reporting by The New York Times, Trump announces his decision to fire James Comey and reads aloud from the multipage termination letter that he had drafted with Stephen Miller — described by sources to The Times and The Washington Post as a “screed” and a “rant.” McGahn counsels Trump to delay dismissing Comey and begins an effort to stop the letter, or at least pare it back.

May 10, 2017
Pence Says Rosenstein Recommended Comey’s Firing

Vice President Mike Pence says repeatedly that James Comey’s firing occurred because Jeff Sessions and Rod Rosenstein recommended it: The deputy attorney general “came to work, sat down and made the recommendation for the FBI to be able to do its job that it would need new leadership. He brought that recommendation to the president. The attorney general concurred with that recommendation.”

May 10, 2017
White House Says Trump Wanted to Fire Comey Since He Was Elected

May 10, 2017
Reports Surface That Trump Was ‘Impetus’ Behind Firing

May 10, 2017
White House Struggles to Justify Comey’s Firing

May 10, 2017
White House Releases Confusing Information About Comey’s Firing

May 11, 2017
Trump Says He’d Decided to Fire Comey Before Rosenstein’s Recommendation

May 17, 2017
Rosenstein Names Former FBI Director Robert Mueller Special Counsel

[Hugin]

13. This neglects the fact Manafort feigned a problem with Trump's jet delaying him long enough for a...

dinner with Pence.

At the time Trump had no idea who Pence was and was leaning toward Christie.

That changed overnight after the dinner meeting Manafort arraigned.

Pence being VP was totally the work of Manafort.

[rusty fender]

14. I agree with you

It seems more like wishful thinking about Pence being indicted. I would love for that to happen, but no one outside of the special counsel’s office knows what Flynn has said about Pence’s role in Russiagate

[ChoppinBroccoli]

15. Trump Had Never Even Met Pence Before Manafort "Suggested" Him

Trump was all-in on somebody else (I suspect Newt Gingrich) until Manafort came to him with Pence.

[Hortensis]

16. VP is a big-power choice, and Manafort was a hired man.

Note this was VP to a POTUS who showed big promise of being removed from office.

No doubt Manafort was involved in helping maneuver Trump into accepting Pence.