Schumer- Democrats not budging on the Wall

[DemocratSinceBirth]

[GoCubsGo]

1. Good.

Nor should they.

[SWBTATTReg]

7. ditto! nt

[Silver1]

2. Caving ...

Caving in to the wall would be caving in to insanity.

One of our parties is long down that path. The dems are struggling too right now, but I see a strong future for us as long as we keep our heads in the clear and stick to our principles.

That is one of my all time favorite bands!

[DemocratSinceBirth]

4. I would give him The Wall for a path to citizenship...

I would give him The Wall for a path to citizenship for all undocumented workers without criminal records.

[lunatica]

6. That would defeat the whole reason for his wall

He wants to get rid of anyone who isn’t white. Assuming he built the wall, who do you think his base would want him to go after next? It’s not just Mexicans they hate. I’d say us Liberals would be a target for elimination pretty quickly because we oppose him.

[Silver1]

9. I agree with you, the wall is the first step.

Who knows what's next in the plan.

In East Germany, after the wall was built, armed guards were posted to shoot at anyone who tried to get across. And they shot a lot of people. The ones who survived were imprisoned for who know how long.

Not to justify it, but the wall in Germany was built for ideological reasons. The Trump wall is meant to keep out the poor and the desperate! Can't we do better for crying out loud.

I am so horrified and embarrassed by this.

[Silver1]

12. Crazy times ...

I just don't see this wall happening. Honestly, I just can't imagine that we're actually capable of it.

At least not without a moat. ...

... kidding.

[stopbush]

5. The Dems are not "struggling right now, too."

Please stop it.

[Silver1]

11. Look at my response below. And please don't be rude.

[GulfCoast66]

8. Care to expound on how the Democratic Party is struggling too right now?

Cause unless you have thought of something I haven’t, I’m calling bullshit on that statement.

[Silver1]

10. Well, please don't be rude. You could have asked politely. I'm happy to explain my view.

The democrats ARE struggling to find a new voice. And that is not a criticism, it's an observation and it's good thing it's happening.

We read and hear about it every day. The younger reps especially, they speak with clarity and energy the older generation just doesn't. It's no accident people are responding to Harris, Beto, others like them.

It means they're not complacent but are changing with the needs of these times. And they need to be up to the task of dealing with hidden racism, hidden poverty, a crap public education, a country where corporations are pulling the political strings, lobby and SI groups coddle willing politicians, the renewed nuclear, healthcare is in the toilet, good jobs are rare if not permanently gone, several trillion dollars of corporate earnings are stashed away abroad, untaxed, while our infrastructure is crumbling.

The environmental crisis for example, where many dems have not been as outspoken as they should be. This is really a critical time. If we don't act fast we are looking at real chaos in the future. Add to it everything above.

And then there are the ideological conflicts within the party. Personally, I'm in favor of the progressive and liberal dems, the ones not afraid to speak out. The right leaning democrats are too close to republican ideology. That's another struggle in the party.

[GulfCoast66]

13. You have a different perspective than I. What you see as a sign of struggle,

I see as our greatest strength.

Same with the old blood vs new. It is easy to holler and shout and do sit-ins and otherwise raise a ruckus. It is what we often do when young and I love seeing it and the energy they bring.

But it takes experience and wisdom to forge a policy on which all branches of the party can agree, with no one getting everything they want and both sides needing to compromise. Because that is so difficult I will always defer to those who have proven they have that ability. And realize I am talking about compromises within our party. I am much less sympathetic to compromising with republicans although it has in the past been necessary.

The one thing I will never support is putting someone with no experience in a leadership position. In all of life’s endeavors that is a recipe for disaster.

Sorry if my original post was a little brusque. I misread your meaning. The danger of internet communication!

You have a nice evening.

[Silver1]

16. Struggle does not imply a negative state. On the contrary.

Last edited Fri Dec 21, 2018, 11:29 PM - Edit history (1)

"But it takes experience and wisdom to forge a policy on which all branches of the party can agree, with no one getting everything they want and both sides needing to compromise. Because that is so difficult I will always defer to those who have proven they have that ability. And realize I am talking about compromises within our party. I am much less sympathetic to compromising with republicans although it has in the past been necessary. “

I could not agree with you more.

I'm not young and I'm not old either. I'm in the middle. My kids are babes and I hear what they have to say and I agree with them. They hope for a future WORTH having and they don’t like the complacency of some of our politicians. They’re scared about their future and I am too! They want to see our problems actually dealt with.

I see our country as a whole with many moving parts, like a living body. Those parts compete for nourishment, but are always synchronized and balanced, and most importantly are able to adapt to changing needs and what’s going on around them. The most adaptable organisms survive and stay healthy, and each part has an important role to play. This thing in the WH, has thrown our country completely out of balance, but has also caused an awakening, and galvanized a movement against idiocy and tyranny. I think this movement is here to stay! People are actually talking about things that matter.

I see the dem party in the same way, a body that can thrive with even divergent voices. I see this as a good healthy thing. When I said dems were struggling, I meant it in that light. They’re struggling because they’re searching for an appropriate voice to respond to where we are now. I wasn’t dissing the dem party. Good for us!

Maybe there are people who come to DU to just stir up trouble, but I’m not one of them.

It’s OK you questioned me, I get it. With what you said I see we’re on the same page though. That’s why I come to DU … it's the conversation I want! I often hesitate to post anything though, too easy too misunderstand, especially with my low post numbers.

I think I'll add one of those lines at the bottom of my name, the signature thing, explaining my position. Then I won't feel like I have to justify every single word in what I post. Nothing against you, it just can be tiresome.

Onward we go.

[GulfCoast66]

18. DU can be great. Especially when we can talk about our disagreements politely

But I think live internet conversation is one of the largest factors in the splintering of society.

So much of human communication is based on Visual cues. That is totally lost over the Internet. If you and I were to discuss the issues in a bar we would leave as solid allies.

But when all we have is written communication the differences quickly manifest themselves and become the focus of the entire discussion. It takes discipline to keep the conversation at that point from descending into insults. Lord knows I have been guilty of this. So I share your trepidation about airing disagreements on DU.

[Demsrule86]

15. I find y0ur post divisive, and I must say if one looks at the situation, we don't have a one

size fits all kind of party. We are a big tent or we lose...everyone has a voice including moderates who are nothing like Republicans by the way. It is this sort of thinking that helps Republicans win by having some sort of litmus test for 'good' Democrats. You ever want another judge or health care than we have to win. We need all sorts of Democrats to do that...many of the seats won in 18 were in red areas and moderates won them mostly.

[Silver1]

17. I did not intend to sound divisive.

You completely misread my post.

I could have worded what I said differently, but I was just sitting at my computer, commenting on how dems should not cave on the Trump Wall, and off the cuff said dems are struggling too to find their voice in these political times. What in the world is there to interpret as wrong there?? Have you been alive very long? Do you know history? Are you paying attention? This is their JOB - to find the voice which reflects the needs of the times, and right now these are unprecedented times. If dems weren't struggling, I would be really worried! And yes, this is a struggle for politicians - This is their JOB and this is what we elect them for.

I'm sick and tired of having to explain every damned noun and adjective I write here when I think I have come to a place of forward thinking people who want to talk. What I'm finding is frustrated people eager to pounce on anyone not typing the status quo one-liner. How boring and unproductive.

If you need to dump somewhere, I'll tell you right now, don't waste your or my time. Go do something meaningful. I am not the enemy.

[Demsrule86]

14. Democrats are not struggling. We just won a great victory more seats

than any party took in a midterm in 50 years or so. Don't compare Democrats with Repugs...

[bluestarone]

3. OK by me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!