More about Klobuchar

[question everything]

Last edited Sat Feb 9, 2019, 11:50 PM - Edit history (1)

Edit to clarify what I meant by "Trump territory."

She was just re-elected the third time, With a large margin. Won in areas that Trump won.

If so many of her staff hated her so much, if members of AFSCME refused to endorse her when first ran - how come none of this was used by her opponents?

I read, again, the HuffPost piece - am not sure what they have against her - and all the sources are anonymous. Do we really trust any such report? Franken "accusers" all over again?

[Sugarcoated]

1. This doesn't ring true about her

I'm willing to bet it's a disgruntled former aid or two putting this out

[DURHAM D]

2. Same here. nt

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

6. These claims are not new.

They first came up in 2002 when she ran for re-election to her county attorney position (even though she was unopposed), and again in 2006 when she ran for the senate for the first time. There is clearly some basis for them and she will have to get ahead of them.

[question everything]

17. But not in 2012 and not in 2018?

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

18. I really don't remember; she was so far ahead in both of those elections

that she might as well have run unopposed so I didn't pay much attention. IIRC she won both by about 30-35%. The GOP offered up their sacrificial lambs - I don't even remember their names. I think the state GOP didn't want to waste money or effort on lost causes; in any event I don't remember any significant opposition. The 2006 allegations might not have come up at all but I don't know.

[radius777]

27. Just because a meme has been around

for a long time doesn't make it true. It could just be effective (at swiftboating) so they dust it off each cycle and give it a whirl.

Remember the 'Al Gore exaggerates' meme - cut to his strength of being the humble 'boy scout' type, where in reality his accomplishments far exceeded his desire to talk about them. But the meme worked, so it was used over and over, until it cost him the 2000 election, hanging chads aside.

[tinrobot]

3. Being "nice" has been her trademark.

So attacking that trademark is certainly one way to knock her down a peg.

I do find it interesting that this accusation came out now (as she's announcing) rather than a year or two ago. Seems to suggest there is more of a political motive than anything.

[question everything]

33. And the irony is that many claimed she was not tough enough..

[democratisphere]

4. Anonymous sources usually mean it is total BS.

I'll go with THAT until someone with a name puts their own reputation on the line. Remember, the redumbliCON Russian propaganda machine is operating in overdrive.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

5. It *was* used by her opponents.

The local right-wing blogs and GOP politicians tried to make a big deal of it when she first ran for the Senate in 2006. In particular there was a guy named Michael Brodkorb, a blogger at the time, who flogged the story all over the internet (later he became embroiled in a sex scandal and hasn't been heard from in several years). Her opponent, Mark Kennedy, never had a chance and despite the persistent claims that she was a bad boss (the same issue had previously come up in 2002 when she ran for re-election as Hennepin County Attorney but she was unopposed so it had no effect), she won quite handily. Kennedy was such a weak candidate that despite the GOP's best efforts Klobuchar was pretty much a shoo-in. By the way, Minnesota is NOT Trump country. Clinton won Minnesota, though it was closer than usual. Minnesota has gone blue in every presidential election since 1972.

[question everything]

15. Sorry. Edited. I meant that she won in areas won by Trump, that flipped its congressman

from D to R 8th district.

[dflprincess]

7. I heard about in 2006 from a Hennepin County AFSCME member who is a very active DFLer

But since then, I haven't heard much about it though now I wonder if this is why her staff has such a tendency to be rude when you call her office.

Historically the media in Minnesota doesn't report things like this about local politicians. Rumors might float around, but they get ignored unless they're really outrageous (like the Republican candidate for governor cavorting in a swimming pool with underage girls).

It's probably coming out now because Amy is moving into the big leagues. It's not even impossible that she had her staff leak it so it comes out now rather than at a more critical point in her campaign.

[PatrickforO]

22. If Klobuchar and her people are that astute,

the future looks bright.

[fishwax]

8. Trump territory? Minnesota?

Clinton won the state in 2016. Republicans don't hold any state-wide office. They last won the governor's office in 2006, and I don't think they've won a state-wide race since, though I could be wrong. Not that this has any bearing on whether the claims are true, but she was hardly bucking huge odds to get elected as a DFL in the state.

[customerserviceguy]

12. Yeah, that's what I thought, too

Perhaps the GOP didn't bring this up because they thought their base wouldn't give a hoot about complaining government workers. And, in a pretty much blue state, it can be difficult to use it in a primary, especially since it might damage the incumbent in a general election.

[question everything]

16. Sorry, edited for clarification

I meant areas that won by Trump.

[Awsi Dooger]

19. I knew what you meant

Nate Silver had a comparison of how 2018 Democrats fared in net relationship to Hillary 2016. I think Amy was #1 or close to #1. That's one reason she is considered to have more crossover potential than other Democrats.

I didn't realize George Will touted Klobuchar's chances but I read it in one of the recent threads here. She definitely is a much greater threat than conventional wisdom allows. Until a few days ago she was ahead of Warren on Predictit toward the 2020 nomination. Now slightly below.

[fishwax]

39. If you want a sure bet, bet on a DFL running for re-election in Minnesota

Because they pretty much never lose. It's never happened in the Senate (The only time an incumbent DFL has lost such an election is when they were appointed and were running for a first full term.)

I haven't seen the Silver comparison you mentioned, but I'd be interested in it. I saw where he said her biggest appeal in the primary was among party loyalists. She did fare much better in her re-election than Hillary did, but (a) Minnesota was also one of HRC's worst states in the primaries, and was by far her worst showing in the Midwest; and (b) Klobuchar's numbers were also significantly lower (in both raw votes and percentages) than she did in 2012 (when she won almost every county ... this time around she carried around 40-45% of the trump counties). Of course, an off-year election is going to have an entirely different dynamic. She wasn't exactly facing a heavyweight either time, but her opponent in this last round was particularly bad.

On edit: none of this is to say that I think she's a bad candidate. She'll be formidable in the primaries, and if she wins she'll have a great chance in the general.

[radius777]

28. Trump swung the Midwest

and similar areas (western PA, upstate NY) that historically voted for Dems... these are your socially moderate/economically populist white Dems.

Hillary barely won MN, it could've easily gone the way of WI and MI.

That's why a candidate like Klobuchar is so appealing, it would instantly lock up that region for us.

[fishwax]

38. Trump swung the rust belt ... he didn't swing Minnesota

He swung Michigan, where he drew about 200,000 more votes than Romney, and Pennsylvania (300,000 more) and Ohio (200,000). Wisconsin swung, but it wasn't him--he actually got a few thousand fewer votes there than Romney did. In Minnesota he got about 2000 more votes than Romney did. Clinton (as she did throughout the midwest) trailed Obama's numbers, but she was closer in Minnesota than any other Midwestern State.

My point is not that Klobuchar isn't a good candidate, but rather that the idea that winning Minnesota (even the rural parts of it that voted for Trump) isn't evidence that she can compete better in Trump territory.

[radius777]

40. Trump cracked the blue wall

in the Midwest by (A) doing better there than the typical GOP nominee (independent or Dem voters who crossed over), while (B) Hillary did worse than the typical Dem nominee (Dem voters who stayed home or voted third party).

A Democratic nominee from that region would certainly improve upon (B), and likely also get back some of the (A) voters.

[betsuni]

9. Sounds like they're trying to "The Devil Wears Prada" her.

[jberryhill]

10. She shot a man in Reno...

...just to watch him die.

[babylonsister]

30. ...

[2naSalit]

11. Is anyone noticing a pattern here?

[Sneederbunk]

14. Only those paying attention.

[brooklynite]

24. The media looks into the background of people who run for President?

[tinrobot]

26. Perhaps if they're Democrats.

I don't see much of this on the other side.

[Mr. Quackers]

36. Weaponizing decency, empathy, compassion

full well knowing, they can give their "librul" fantasies, caricatures, and mischaracterizations/lies life in everyday reality regardless of truth value. And it pays well.

[brush]

13. The repugs have figured out how to go after Deds...

even the "nice" ones. All Dem candidates everywhere need to be prepared for this from now on.

[Awsi Dooger]

20. This will be addressed within days

Once she announces tomorrow a media tour will begin, and every journalist will pose the question early.

I expect a strong likable response.

Then it's up to the anonymous sources whether or not they want to come forward. Not unlikely that some Amy staffers who hold a favorable view will come forward.

[PatrickforO]

21. There's already a lot of rat-you-know-what happening.

Our candidates now actually have a populist platform - green new deal, healthcare - lots of money will be lined up against them.

They will begin with ridicule.

Then when that doesn't work, there will be attempts to frame them.

Then there will be the lies, lies and more lies, just to see what might stick.

The whole strategy will be to divide us so we can be conquered. This has happened to us over and over and over and over and over.

Think we'll be smart enough as a party not to allow it to happen in 2020?

[certainot]

23. one of these days dems will realize it doesn't matter at all what the facts are if you have

a couple hundred think tank-scripted liars on 1500 radio stations dominating buzz in 40 states with 80 senators

[mudstump]

25. It's a very clever tactic...

it like asking someone if they stopped beating their wife. It's an accusation that can't be easily refuted by the accused.

[GulfCoast66]

29. My wife is a successful executive in her company.

It’s taken 34 years and has not been easy.

One pattern that has not changed. If an employee, male or female, is professionally dressed down for not performing by her, it’s an insult. If done by a man, all is good.

Not saying this is the same situation. But our experience is that if that a woman is not always pleasant and deferential she is a bitch.

[redstatebluegirl]

31. You get my last heart for this!

I was a manager for 8 years this is fact.

[question everything]

32. And we've seen it with Hillary, certainly in 2008 when she tries to stick to the points

in a "relaxed" debate - sitting at a table - while the men just schmoozed.

[IluvPitties]

34. It's demeaning and abusive either way.

No one should get a pass for demeaning people. I believe in appreciative leadership, personally.

[GulfCoast66]

37. My wife is appreciative. As am I for that matter. To people doing their jobs.

But if someone is not performing you have let them know. And if the behavior continues you lave to make it clear there will be consequences. Then you may have to terminate their employment.

I have never done the above and had people leave the conversation feeling good about it. I think when women do their job of holding others to account their gender gets blamed.

[treestar]

35. I agree. She might have just had bad karma with some people

Nobody is going to get through life without clashing with someone.

[Alhena]

41. She was in my top 3, no longer ...

though I don't think this is disqualifying, strictly speaking. It just makes her seem like considerably less attractive a candidate, precisely because the "nice" vibe was her biggest asset, in my mind.