Leahy and Feinstein are getting old.

[mobeau69]

Leahy should be doing a much better job imo.

[ksoze]

1. Was just thinking the same thing

They need to go at him like a republican would to a Dem AG.

[sarabelle]

66. They were pretty useless. Just like with Kavanaugh.

[hlthe2b]

2. Actually no. He is right on target and holding Barr's feet to the fire. Knock off the blatant ageism

It is really ugly.

Do you say this about Ruth Bader Ginsburg--the absolute jewel of the SCOTUS?

[mobeau69]

19. Come on! Different talents required to excel in different positions.

[hlthe2b]

20. yet YOU boil it all down to age. How damned ugly, mobeau69. Shameful

[mr_lebowski]

23. Would it be better if mobeau69 had instead said they suck at their job?

Just askin

[hlthe2b]

25. Do you really need an answer to that, mr_lebowski? Really? What bullshit to suggest

that ageism is not an issue or that it prevents one from critiquing performance on purely objective, age-independant review.

[mr_lebowski]

28. *I* didn't *suggest* anything, I merely asked a rhetorical question ... (nt)

[mobeau69]

27. No. But I believe in science and the science of aging.

Why do you think a lot of careers have mandatory retirement ages?

Your ad hominem attack on me is an ad hominem attack!

I'm old so I do speak with some personal experience.

[hlthe2b]

31. Obviously not, given you fail to appreciate that aging varies dramatically among individuals

You offer the ad hominem attack on anyone based on age and our Democratic Senators specifically. I said NOTHING regarding you personally. I find your and other's ageist comments and attitudes to be ugly and uninformed. I am sure you, on the other hand, are a "lovely" person, but you really ought to do some research and self-exploration before deciding to judge everyone's abilities purely on age.

[Demit]

49. You seem to concede that ageing CAN affect some individuals adversely.

If it varies—dramatically, as you say—then some older individuals will exhibit a physical and/or mental slowing down. Noticing it in someone isn't an attack, it's observation.

[hlthe2b]

51. Lack of of experience, training, practice, and qualifications affects far more.

and yes, THAT varies among individuals TOO.

[hlthe2b]

52. As does Youth and Inexperience (affect some individuals adversely). Can YOU deny THAT?

[Demit]

53. Good grief. I missed where the subject turned to youth and inexperience.

Except as a way to divert attention from you conceding that ageing does sometimes have dramatic effects.

[hlthe2b]

55. Oh, no... Ageism is just fine apparently. Good gawd. So, now we can't talk about the flip side

That not only does age vary in its effects among individuals, but so too does the impact of youth and lack of experience, practice, education, and qualifications.

[Demit]

60. So that would make the flip side of ageism...youthism?

The scourge of youthism! Yes, of course youth implies a lack of experience, unless you are Benjamin Button. But lack of experience and the other things you list are not physical and biological characteristics.

[hlthe2b]

62. Your attempts to excuse the outrageous ageism demonstrated on this thread is noted but ineffectual

including your feeble attempts to deflect. I had thought better of you.

[Demit]

69. "aging varies dramatically among individuals." Your words.

Wouldn't want to deflect from what you originally said!

[hlthe2b]

71. Yes... And? You keep deflecting from that.

I find it unconscionable that anyone here would defend ageism. That you seemingly are doing so surprises and disappoints me, but I'm done.

[Demit]

72. That's a relief, that you're done. Having to point out what you said was getting old.

[hlthe2b]

73. I never denied what I said.. you fail to make any point.

[MarcA]

70. Good points. Those opposed to "ageism" should have no problem approving 18

as the age for running for Any Office including House, Senate and President.
Also, 16 if you join the military or national service. After all to do otherwise is
"ageist".

[lunatica]

38. You shouldn't have said that

Trying to dissimulate after the fact to pretend you don’t understand why anyone would criticize you just makes you look foolish.

I’m old too but I’m quite capable of holding my own with any young person. I also have self respect, which makes me wonder why you are obviously an ageist.

[vsrazdem]

39. Agree, but the problem is, he mumbles so much, I can't understand half of what he is saying.

[DURHAM D]

3. It would be more appropriate if you commented on

Senator Grassley's senility.

[a kennedy]

6. Ditto that......

[BeyondGeography]

7. Grassley was very shaky

Good to see.

[mobeau69]

21. So you agree, age can be a consideration.

Why would I critique Grassley's ability. He's a rethuglican. Let them figure it out on their own.

[DURHAM D]

24. No.

This is Democratic Underground. Here you should be attacking Republicans not Democrats.

Thought that was obvious but perhaps not for some people.

[mobeau69]

50. Wasn't "attacking" anyone. Just stated my honest opinion.

I hope that's still allowed.

[Kilgore]

77. Bravo

[geardaddy]

61. +1

[BeyondGeography]

4. Leahy got under Barr's skin in a big way

He still takes no prisoners.

[Chin music]

35. +1

[marlakay]

5. I just told my husband this

Dianne is saying the right things but we need more force to go up against someone like him.

[hlthe2b]

8. It isn't her age. She's not an attorney so is always more reticent. She was prepared, however

and there was nothing held back by Leahy.

[marlakay]

10. I like them both and I didn't see Leahy

Just was wishing for more fire.

[StarfishSaver]

34. This is not the time or venue for "fire"

This is serious stuff and the Democratic Judiciary Committee members are trying to get to the bottom of some things and also create a record to lay the groundwork for impeachment.

Grandstanding and yelling at the witness might make some of us feel good, but we already know this is a criminal administration and don't need to be convinced of anything.

Let Trump and his Republican enablers try to confuse and obfuscate with thunder and bluster. I appreciate thr thorough and thoughtful approach our Senators are taking.

[vsrazdem]

41. I hope Kamala is there. I wan't to hear her question him.

[Joe941]

59. Leave age out of it. If you don't like how they handled Bar - fine...

but leave the age out of it. It has nothing to do with anything. So just stop.

[LakeArenal]

9. Quit. Just quit.

This old thing gets so old.

[Sunsky]

11. I think Leahy did a wonderful job

of showing Barr's inconsistencies. Barr was clearly flustered, trying to avoid the questions and searching for excuses.

[Boxerfan]

12. And they have so much experience...wasup with that?

Fogies-harumph.

[awesomerwb1]

13. So science is ageist?

No offense or disrespect meant, but if science/doctors have proven mental decline the older we get, are they being ageists???

You guys don't see a difference in questioning between say a Katie Porter or Al Franken vs Diane Feinstein? Please.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

15. Or others like Whitehouse now! Succinct and effective.

[treestar]

18. And specific proof that these individuals are

not the same as they were before?

[hlthe2b]

22. they aren't about to address the lack of factual basis for this...but yes, it is totally lacking

Comparing different individuals with different skill sets hardly proves an age decline argument.

[emmaverybo]

74. Also have proven the brain is plastic

Example, personal one, but not the only one: my mom at 90 got pretty forgetful on minor things, but she sure could give a great analysis of a play, a political figure—and at the time of her death was reading a book about North Korea.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

14. My dear Mobeau, don't you know you can't make

purely observational comments here. Without getting the word police after you? You are very right. You just can't say it.

[lunatica]

40. This comment really surprises me coming from you.

Generalized Ageist derogatory comments show the mentality of the user. No word police are needed to show the biased ignorance and stereotyping prejudice of the commenter, no matter his or her age.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

57. I was referring to the word old. Can't say that here

or you get pounced on. But everyone can use common sense to know what old means without getting all upset about it. I don't think everyone who is older is the same though. Age affects people differently. Some people remain sharp, effective, and eloquent. Some do not. I believe the OP was trying to point this out. It could also be a bit of boredom and lack of preparation mixed in.

[lunatica]

58. OK. I misunderstood your comment and I apologize

I’m glad my respect for you can remain intact.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

63. Thanks. Probably not a good day for me to be here.

Might be nicer...just frustrated to the nth degree. Feel trump gonna get away with everything.

[lunatica]

64. The Trump issue is stretching everyone's patience to the breaking point

We’re definitely living in historic times.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

75. Yes Lunatica ! For me, I was stupid to put all my hopes on Mueller report. Geez

it is happening NOTHING like I naively expected. I think Trump much more of an evil master of it all than I ever dreamed. Wish Dems would get the very best political minds (carville, for instance) + nyc ad men + hollywood creatives with access to lots of money and go away for a retreat weekend and figure this MF out - and how to proceed. Normal ain't good enough.

[hlthe2b]

81. You aren't alone...

I feel like the "protective armor" I've worn the past two years has been ripped away by disillusion. Trying to hold onto what is left, though.

[karynnj]

16. I thought they were both excellent

It seems you might prefer fireworks ... And that would get huge applause here ... But both if these people are former prosecutors, acting professionally and getting facts on the record.

[treestar]

17. If they were younger they would still get called weak

[WeekiWater]

26. Leahy is great.

Then again, I dislike reality TV shows and drama for the sake of drama as well.

[StarfishSaver]

29. They've both been excellent

[redstatebluegirl]

30. As an old woman, I am growing weary of the constant age bashing going on here.

Guess what folks, all of us get old, you will as well, no matter how vegan you are or how much exercise you do, it comes to get you. You won't like being told you are not worth listening to once you reach a certain age anymore than I do.

[LovingA2andMI]

32. Agreed....

The Age Discrimination posts here are getting beyond TIRED!!!

[redstatebluegirl]

33. My mind works just fine thank you very much.

My body hates me, but my mind is great. I still work, I write and edit educational papers and I will hold my work to anyone of those bashing Nancy and Chuck.

[lunatica]

43. I'm right there with you.

It’s time to put a halt to these derogatory insults.

[pazzyanne]

76. I'm a member of your team, too, redstatebluegirl.

At 75 years young, my brain is one thing that still works very well. My 94 year old mother was also still sharp as a tack. And yes, my doctor has told as well that my brain is still hitting on all 8 cylinders. I believe that there is a place for experience and wisdom as well as a place for new ideas and high energy in any discussion. In my experience those things do not come all rolled up in one body!

[mobeau69]

37. It's not bashing. Its just a fact of life (as you point out).

40 years ago I hiked down Bright Angel Trail in The Grand Canyon all the way to the Colorado. Down and back up in one day. I just tried it last fall and nearly killed myself! I was able to stay overnight at Phantom Ranch, thanks to a very nice Ranger. Took all the next day to get back up to the rim. Thought i was gonna die!

The mental and the physical eventually are the victims of time. To try and deny it is pure folly.

[lunatica]

48. Then I suggest you go to a doctor for a checkup

[nolabear]

56. Hiking and questioning are rather different.

I can’t run a marathon either but I can darned we’ll get yet another advanced degree and chair a board of directors.

It’s not the age. It’s the health and condition.

[llmart]

45. I am so with you on this post.

I'm also getting sick of the "get off my lawn" responses which we all know is a snide way of saying that what us older people post is not relevant any longer.

I've never heard the phrase "with youth comes wisdom" but I sure have heard "with age comes wisdom". We need to have more emphasis on pointing out ageist comments here on DU. Some posters need to be made more aware of it.

[emmaverybo]

68. Good these folks still around because there's a certain segregation

between older and younger people. We oldies leave the workforce, so you don’t interact with us there. We take classes at the senior center, among our own, so as not to stand out, perhaps embarrassingly, in groups of young learners, whom we are told are the future. We have been told our future is not worth investing in, so we often hide our dreams, our plans, our desire to continue growing from society. We take Great Courses online, exercise with the Silver Sneakers crowd, sometimes wonder ourselves if we have a right to take up singing, learn a new instrument, write a book.
What is great—for us and for youth—is that politics shows us old people at the peak of their productivity, when experience, knowledge, intelligence combined with true devotion to public service all comes together. The old warriors might not speak as fast, as loudly, as sharply as the young Turks, but finesse is their specialty, and they know where the land mines lie because they have driven over them before, like the new ones do now and then wonder at the explosion.
So I enjoy seeing Leah, Feinstein, Pelosi, Cummins still fighting, still standing up to fight, if not as erectly as they once did.
I’m glad to see Biden and Bernie get in the race for the highest office in the land.
They could be cruising the world, not trying to save it according to their lights.

[Glimmer of Hope]

78. I am so sorry! Everyone should feel welcome on a progressive discussion forum.

The fat shaming makes me sad too.

[highplainsdem]

36. They did very well. AND they have seniority, which is extremely important in the Senate.

[lamp_shade]

42. Did you listen to their questions?

I don't think you did.

[mobeau69]

46. I tried but it was a little difficult. I'm old and my hearing ain't what is used to be!

[oasis]

44. Both senators have excellent staffers. nt

[LanternWaste]

47. Pre-pubescent doctors and tween lawyers would be fab!

Experience is over-rated, practice is a waste of time, desire for maturity is anti-youth ageism...




and patience is certainly not a common thing these days.

[MineralMan]

54. As will you, one day, if you are lucky.

[emmaverybo]

65. People tend to do that

Age, get older, then get old. Like death, happens to everyone. But until death, most retain their individuality, creative and intellectual gifts, sense of humor, ability to love, capacity for joy; even dementia does not erase many of these qualities.
Even illness, disability.
You will get old too and just as you notice the outward signs in others now, you will notice them in yourself.
Hopefully, you will understand that becoming old need not diminish you.
Good way to prepare for age is to work on your attitude while you are young.

[ismnotwasm]

67. You think age is impairing their ability to do their jobs.

Interesting. Obviously, while this does happen—I hadn’t noticed it this case. It seems more of a question of style.

[walkingman]

79. I just think they are from a generation that finds it distasteful to act like an ass in public.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

80. I did not watch any of the hearings today,

so I cannot comment on that.

But there's a certain denial here that age really can matter, and that someone pushing 80, or well into their 80s may not really be quite as sharp and as on top of things as someone a couple of decades or so younger. Yeah, I know experience matters. But it's not the only thing.

I recall Democrats complaining bitterly about Strom Thurmond, and hearing stories that the last years he was essentially so senile he had no clue who he was or where he was.

Now I'm not suggesting that the two people mentioned are in that category, but Jesus H Christ! If you're going to propose a term or age limit on Supreme Court justices, which has often been brought up here, maybe the same thing should apply to members of Congress.

I'm 70. I no longer go to a job every day. And it's wonderful! I can't imagine trying, even at this relatively young (compared to some in Congress) age trying to do half of what's needed to be a decent Representative or Senator.

The other issue that is overlooked is the need to cultivate the younger generation to move into positions of leadership. That's something the Republicans have done an excellent job of. Meanwhile, if certain older Democrats were to have something terrible happen, well, too bad. There's no one in the pipeline.