How much of the "Dems are WEAK! and "We're DOOMED" rants

[StarfishSaver]

being hammered here and elsewhere on social media isn't really concern but is, in reality, a concerted and smooth part of a nefarious effort to undermine Democrats in 2020.

I'm having trouble understanding how anyone who really cares about Democratic success and taking our country back from the brink would devote this much effort to trashing our own - sometimes in language and with a hostility virtually indistinguishable from our political adversaries - while apparently doing nothing productive to support their efforts or make it easier for them to get the job done.

It makes me wonder.

And it makes me work even harder to stay focused and encourage other like-minded activists to do the same.

[DBoon]

1. all of them

i would bet money on this

[DownriverDem]

51. Also

Even though there is often good ideas brought up, I hate when folks say "the Dems should do this; the Dems should do that". My response is "why don't you tell them". Many of the Dems we see on tv are former prosecutors. They know what they are doing.

[demosincebirth]

66. I think we still should be pushing them. Sometimes they get stuck in the mud and need a good push to

to keep them on the right track and in the right direction. And don't forget who we're up against - the crooks, cheats, hypocrites, AKA, the GOP.

[we can do it]

2. Bots and trolls for the most part, I believe.

[TwilightZone]

3. They're quite tiresome.

They're also often rather transparent, though not always. There are DUers with thousands of posts who have lately posted little but whining about how weak and ineffectual Democrats are, contrary to evidence.

It got old a long, long time ago. This is just the latest version, it seems.

[Ponietz]

21. Question, if you know..

There was one poster I was curious about, 25k posts, so tried to check their profile. It was hidden or unavailable—still is. Is that what happens when one is ignored? Is it possible that everyone couldn’t see a profile? Is our IT good enough to prevent that?

But I don’t think this OP helps. There are genuine and legitimate feelings of disappointment when we get bad news.

Inviting others to hate on them is absolutely destructive. Propose a vision instead OP. I get my inspiration in these times from my Democratic representatives and candidates, not aggression.

[TwilightZone]

25. Not sure on the profile.

If someone's posting privileges are revoked for too many hides or trolling, the profile will usually indicate that. You could ask the the Admins about that particular profile here: https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=ata

As for your comments, I think the OP is specifically referring to the few, very vocal posters who do little but berate Democrats and not those who are voicing understandable frustration or constructive criticism. There is a difference, and I'd argue that posting the same "Dems are weak" nonsense in nearly every post doesn't accomplish anything.

[Ponietz]

39. Thank you for your help

+1 for your second paragraph, too

[Perseus]

61. No, I am starting to see more people frustrated with the inaction to do the right thing

I know I am pissed, and every time I read "BAM! Schiff said that..." I get more pissed knowing Schiff decided to go against impeachment and leave things the way they are which will not work well for Democrats.

I want action, I am very angry of the threats, things need to happen.

I won't repeat myself as I just entered a post at the end, but I don't think this is about trolls so much as frustration from Democratic supporters.

Republicans don't care what people say about them, they continue to work towards their goals and their agenda, talk is cheap, and I personally have had enough of it.

Just because someone is angry from the Democrats inaction to bring charges, to Impeach Barr, the buffoon, that doesn't make one a troll. This is not about "you are with me, or against me", ideas need to flow, they need to be discussed, well understood to make sure they are not taken out of context. There is anger and I am hoping Democratic leaders learn about it sooner than later.

[LiberalLovinLug]

72. +10,000

Couldn't have said it better myself

Now if you are asking "will Republicans use any and all infighting against us, no matter what the issue?" Of course. But we cannot make internal decisions based on what Republicans will do, or what Fox News will say about it.


If you boil it right down, its a choice for party leaders between doing nothing, ignoring his traitorous crimes, accepting the new normal, and instead working WITH Trump on things like infrastructure spending....or going all in, starting with impeaching Barr for lying.

The former will garner less deplorables in the streets and Democratic disdain, might gain a few more conservative independents votes, and make Fox News dial it down from 11 to 10.

But they will lose many Democrat's votes that have given up on them as being leaders in defending the constitution and its institutions and ethics.

The gamble is hoping they don't lose more traditional Democratic votes than they will gain independents that think Democrats have been picking on Trump.


And the latter would do the opposite. Fox News foaming at the mouth. Probably more death threats against Democrats. Making a few more deplorable snowflakes melt.

But they'd solidify their base, and probably add a lot of more moderate independents, youth, new voters that would admire their chutzpah.


My question would be, why not trust your own base and those that know the danger Trump represents, over some unknown segment that may come over because you weren't as mean to the President as you could have been?


To those of us that want action, we just cannot see why you'd choose the former. It is also risky. and it does make them look weak.

[TwilightZone]

75. There's more to "action" than impeachment.

There are a few posters who post little other than Democrat-bashing on the sole basis that anything short of filing articles of impeachment immediately constitutes doing literally nothing. No ideas, no suggestions, no discussion. Just the same nonsense in thread after thread.

You may disagree, but I personally think that intentional ignorance is not a compelling argument. I don't think playing dumb accomplishes much of anything, really.

[Trumpocalypse]

83. Well said nt

[StarfishSaver]

28. I've been proposing a vision, sharing examples of positive activism, encouraging others to do the sa

With a few exceptions, I've gotten little response.

So I will ask you a question I've repeatedly asked here: What are YOU doing to help build public support for impeachment (and removal) and to help ensure a Democratic win next year?

[StarfishSaver]

38. That's great!

(Except the tax part - pay your taxes!)

[Ponietz]

48. 😑

You presume way too much to give me advice—and so flippantly.

[Hekate]

77. There's an old story about 2 beachwalkers at low tide who didn't know each other...

The one ahead was seen to lean down periodically and toss a starfish back into the ocean. This went on for awhile, until the watcher finally said: "Why are you doing this? It doesn't matter. There are millions of starfish in the sea." The answer: "It matters to the ones I save."

I don't know this poster, and who knows why s/he really chose their name -- but that's what comes to mind for me.

[Ponietz]

78. I've heard it, I'm a country trial lawyer

There. Now everyone knows.
I wanted the poster to reflect on his words.
I’ve appreciated your posts since I first joined.
Thanks.

[Hekate]

81. Very kind of you to say so. See you around...

[StarfishSaver]

87. Yes, that's why I chose this name

A little girl, walking with her father along a beach strewn with starfish that had been washed ashore by the incoming tide the night before, began tossing starfish back into the sea.

Her father said, “Honey, there are too many starfish. You can’t save them all.” The little girl
nodded.

“You’re right. I can’t.” Then she picked up another starfish and threw it
back.

“But I saved that one.”

(I'm a she)

[DontBooVote]

22. You know what was tiresome? I worked by ass off and had blisters pop while I walked the

Last edited Fri May 3, 2019, 02:11 PM - Edit history (1)

streets of my precinct knocking doors. I worked my ass off, as did hundreds of people who worked with me and beside me to win the House! The summer of 2018 was the hottest, most physically demanding time of my life - to win the House. Every last Democrat I worked with for the House win wanted a lot of things but one god damned sure thing we all worked for was OVERSIGHT!

So far, that debt has not re-paid to any of us and all we've gotten is WORDS!

So you take your "tiresome" and....

[TwilightZone]

33. I think you mean 2018.

We didn't win the House in 2016. As for hard work getting people elected, you don't have an exclusive on that, so perhaps you should stop acting like you do.

As for tiresome, yes, the constant bullshit about Democrats doing nothing and Democrats being weak is tiresome. And it's bullshit, regardless of the source. You just choose to ignore it, apparently because that fits your agenda.

Which, again, demonstrates the OP's point perfectly. The fact that you took general assertions that the OP made as a personal attack is also rather telling. Not everything is about you.

[treestar]

59. But what do you want?

Your criticism is vague. What do you want them to do in terms of what they can do?

[TwilightZone]

79. The $64,000 question....

[Trumpocalypse]

86. What debt?

No debt is owed to you. I worked last year for love of my country not for some imagined debt in my head.

[Vinnie From Indy]

4. Some would offer that a post like yours is delivering that exact message.

Albeit in a concealed manner.

Cheers!

[spanone]

10. 👍🏼

[StarfishSaver]

12. Does that "some" include you

hoping to deliver a message in a concealed manner?

[DontBooVote]

14. Who are you to tell us how to feel and how we react to the destruction of our democracy?

[TwilightZone]

15. This is a discussion board.

The OP has as much right to his/her opinion as you do to yours.

In my opinion, the constant drumbeat of "Dems are weak!!!" that a few selected, but very vocal, posters constantly spew *is* tiresome, pointless, and counterproductive.

Your mileage may vary.

[DontBooVote]

16. You show me an example, just one, of strength, so far.

[TwilightZone]

18. Thanks for proving the OP's point.

Have a nice day.

[DontBooVote]

19. I note that you failed to provide that example. My point is valid. You have a nice day, as well.

[TwilightZone]

29. The examples are everywhere.

You just choose to intentionally ignore them. Funny, that.

[DontBooVote]

31. Name one. And, I thought you had dismissed me for the day?

[LanternWaste]

23. You will of course, support your premise with objective evidence. yes?

It can't be that difficult to crunch the numbers and validly illustrate there is zero strength or will within the Democratic leadership, right? Otherwise, no... your point is certainly not valid by any standard, metric or measure.

Or is yours simply another tired allegation tiny enough in both thought and wit to be colorfully printed on a meme?



Khoroshego dnya!

[DontBooVote]

24. Ok, I'll put the same question to you: Where's the beef?

[Rambling Man]

84. Well, there is the picture of Speaker Pelosi putting her sunglasses on . . .

[Bradshaw3]

55. Physician heal thyself

If you truly do want people to have non-hostile and positive exchanges, then you should set a good example.

[DontBooVote]

13. OP is discouraging the real emotions that many of us feel as we watch our democracy

crumbling while nothing but strong words are the counter strategy of our leadership.

[onecaliberal]

70. That.

[H2O Man]

52. Thank you!

[VOX]

58. Thank you #2. Nothing like major concern...

From a 12-day-old member.

[TheRealNorth]

5. Convincing Democrats voters not to turn out

Is the treasonous GOP's only hope in 2020.

[LakeArenal]

11. Point!

[Fiendish Thingy]

20. A newbie criticizing others who don't share their fear based defeatism is curious indeed

Op after OP warning against fighting back and impeaching as being too risky, then complaining when those who feel we should fight with every ounce of strength and power that the Congressional majority can muster.

Exactly who wants a weak Democratic Party?

[sinkingfeeling]

37. +1

[DontBooVote]

44. I note that OP has completely ignored this particular post of mine, a first by OP. Curious.

[VOX]

60. Classic "your concern is noted" material.

Not the first attempt at wrangling, either.

[LakeArenal]

7. Just read the title. Then choose to pass it.

[Iliyah]

8. And GOPs are

traitors, corrupt, greedy, don't care assholes is also out there in the social media world.

They also have doom and gloom social media talk against Republicans and really, if there is a contest of truth factor concerning who cares for the USA, Democrats wins hand down.

Going into 2020 election Dems look fairly good. 2016 per Republicans - same handbook but this time they have the DOJ in their pocket. Russia will be there as well to help try and steal it again. They have corporate media as well.

[Freethinker65]

9. We won back the House which was critical. We should have taken back the Senate as well.

We WILL be doomed if we do not take back the WH, hold the House, and flip at least some seats in the Senate the next election.

[MineralMan]

17. DU is complicated and sometimes hard to figure out.

Once you've been here for a month or so, you'll be able to discern the underlying meaning of posts here. Then, you'll be able to detect people who really care about getting Democrats elected and discern who is here to disrupt.

Give it some time. Be patient. That's my advice. You'll learn the ropes within a couple of months here.

[ismnotwasm]

26. Wise advice.

[MineralMan]

30. Well, I know it took me a while, and I was glad for all the regulars

who took the time to educate me. I'm just paying it forward-like.

[TwilightZone]

27. That's good advice.

Some of the posters who are here to disrupt are pretty obvious about it, and some are much better at hiding their true intentions. Over time, it becomes easier to discern the latter, though the system also tends to work some of that out.

[MineralMan]

32. Yeah, a guy's got to be careful and not jump to conclusions

before getting a solid feel for the place.

[watoos]

40. I bet if Maxine Waters posted here

under an anonymous name, she would get tongue lashed.

I'm an Auntie Maxine supporter, all of her views and opinions.

[MineralMan]

41. I'd love to see her posting here.

[watoos]

49. Great to hear,

I shouldn't be condemned if I push for impeachment hearings now. I will even agree to wait if it is certain that Mueller will testify in public on May 15th, but that's my limit.

Who controls the narrative is very important. In my rural area in central Pa. the media is pushing the narrative that the Mueller investigation is over and it exonerated Trump. They want the FBI and Democrats investigated for carrying out a witch hunt against Trump. If we were having impeachment hearings we would be able to counter that narrative. I almost cancelled my local newspaper subscription because it has gotten so disgusting, so full of right wing propaganda. I wrote letters to the editor, the editor would email me back and call me his commie pinko buddy.

I served on borough council for 2 terms back in the 70's and 80's. The last election, in 2018, Republicans outvoted Democrats 4 to 1. Back in the 70's for our 4th of July parade we had Republican Snuffy Smith and Democrat Pat Stapleton ride through main street in the same convertible.

What happened that Republicans became so vile? They met in secret when Obama was elected president and agreed to obstruct everything that Democrats did, they made everything political. I never thought it would work, but it did mainly because Republicans are complicit with the M$M.

I'm sorry but Republicans don't play fair. The House needs to look seriously at defunding the AG's department and others that defy our rule of law.

Desperate times call for desperate measures. I have only seen 4 of our presidential candidates take on Trump, seriously take him on. Why not more?

[StarfishSaver]

89. Thanks!

[playaseeker]

34. Not undermining, just illuminating the seriousness of the issue

I have made a few comments on the "pearl clutching" approach of the Democrats. Not because I am a closet Republican or a borscht chomping Russian, but because I want to see a more muscular response from the Dems. This all goes back to Al Gore and "we'll let the system make the right choice". I am just sick of seeing evil conservatives continually take the lunch money from Boy Scout Dems.

Let's understand what is stake, let's be bold and let's restore democracy.

[Perseus]

62. Well said

Very elegant and to the point.

[matt819]

36. Kind of a non sequitur

Partly because I have no idea what you're talking about.

That said, the questions I think you're referring to are valid.

The Democratic leadership in Congress is threatening but nothing more.

Pelosi is telling all that impeachment is off the table, until maybe, at some point, for some reason, it's on the table.

Congresspeople are calling for impeachment proceedings, but without the leadership on board and driving it, that's just more threatening.

Democratic Congresspeople are threatening contempt of Congress. Threatening. That's it. Taking real action has teeth - maybe not as much teeth as we would like, but, still, there are penalties: https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/contempt_of_congress. But there are no penalties if they take no action.

Everything seems, at the moment, to be waiting on something else. First, it was Barr's testimony. Now it's Mueller's testimony. Then it will be McGahn's testimony.

Maybe Pelosi has a massive "if this, then that" flow chart on the wall in her office. Maybe. To the rest of us, however, it seems as if there is no plan. And the damage continues. And books will be written about how "ordinary Americans" stood by and allowed the destruction of the world's greatest democracy and the installation of a fascist dictatorship.

[stillcool]

42. I think it's necessary to be skeptical..

these aren't just freepers any more Russia is playing the long game.

HOW RUSSIAN TROLLS USED MEME WARFARE TO DIVIDE AMERICA
THERE’S A MEME on Instagram, circulated by a group called “Born Liberal.” A fist holds a cluster of strings, reaching down into people with television sets for heads. The text declares: “The People Believe What the Media Tells Them They Believe: George Orwell.” The quote is surely false, but it’s also perfect in a way. “Born Liberal” was a creation of the Internet Research Agency, the Russian propaganda wing that might as well be part of Oceania. In other words, we live in a time when American democratic debate is being influenced by liars spreading memes about our inability to understand the truth.


The report by New Knowledge is based on a review of 10.4 million tweets, 1,100 YouTube videos, 116,000 Instagram posts, and 61,500 unique Facebook posts published from 2015 through 2017. This is not a complete data set of Russian influence operations, but it’s still the largest such analysis to take place outside of the companies themselves. And it shows that the Russians weren’t just running a bland content farm, churning out propaganda in broken English. The operation was deeply sophisticated, and at times, downright funny. As the report’s authors note: “The IRA was fluent in American trolling culture.”https://www.wired.com/story/russia-ira-propaganda-senate-report/

https://www.cjr.org/analysis/tweets-russia-news.php
Most major outlets have used Russian tweets as sources for partisan opinion: study
By Josephine Lukito and Chris Wells
MARCH 8, 2018

[BadgerMom]

45. Oh, so glad to read this.

I’ve wondered if I’m the only one suspecting targeted trolls and bots. I refuse to do “woe is me.”

[pdsimdars]

46. There are very many historians and legal minds who are saying they must impeach

and they don't seem to take it seriously. I wonder why one side of the Democratic party holds the other in such contempt. Especially when scholars are speaking out. Time to listen maybe instead of holding the line.

[Bayard]

47. I'm not saying Dems are weak....

I'm saying, not getting more hard-nosed toward witnesses ignoring subpoena's makes them LOOK weak.

I admit, I'm getting a bit frantic about how we seem to be spinning our wheels. Call me an impatient life-long Dem.

[yaesu]

50. Frustration from years of our party trying to work with, get along with a criminal oraganisation

who's only goal was to destroy Democracy may have something to do with the concern. I don't think that is our party today, bloodied & wounded, they have finally figured out that working with these monsters is a high road to hell.

[Dream Girl]

53. I think most of them are real. People get freaked out and want to feel better. That said they are

unhelpful and exacerbate the sense of hopelessness. However, some of them (e.g. "that'll never happen", "Trump will never be held accountable&quot reflect a generally cynical mindset. Those are also unhelpful. But I think these posts are real...

[zentrum]

54. I don't think so.

I think it's (mostly) ordinary Dems who are scared to death. Just terrified. For their kids and for the planet. For immigrants, for checks and balances, for the court/justice system.

And who really do believe that against these unscrupulous, sociopathic Repugs we have to be extremely fierce. We're always losing the frame of the narrative and I think too many good Dems are really scared s***less and feel there's no time left.

Wish we had Ted Kennedy back. And Franken. And more Adam Schiffs. And Warrens. Mayor Pete is great and I think he'll really help the party establish its bold 2020 narrative even if he's not the candidate.

[Perseus]

56. Sorry, but I strongly believe there is anger from inaction

DISCLAIMER: I am not a troll.

Anyone who has read my contributions to discussions of different topics, almost 2,000 of them would know that I am all for getting rid of the buffoon and my support for the Democratic party at this time, and I say at this time because I am proud to not be a fanatic, if the bahaviour of the Democratic party became what it is the republican party today, I would support someone else.

Having said that, I am angry from the blah, blah, blah, the threats, the continuous "We are going to explore all options", the lack of action, the "Impeachment is not an option, we shall defeat them in 2020"...You may not like that I, and many others, are not happy about this, but the fact is that if we wait until 2020 without impeaching, without subpoenaing and incarcerating those who refuse to comply with the subpoenas, then we are conceding defeat, we are telling the crooks that it is OK to do and say what they want because we will look the other way, yes we will "BAM! Schiff said this, BAM! Pelosi said that,, BAM! Nadler is 'threatening' with so, and so" then wait for something to happen but then the following week more of the same; Democrats threatening, Republicans ignoring the threats and continuing with their destructive agenda.

All of you, go and take a look at Barr's demeanor throughout the hearings, he doesn't care, he doesn't feel threatened, he is insulting, he refuses in plain daylight to not cooperate, he feels entitled. You put his ass in jail and all that bravado will vanish, but do nothing and expect worst. Lets be real, we cannot accept inaction, to do that is to become accomplices of the crooks.

Unless we start getting angry and we let Democrats understand that either they take solid and consistent actions, or we are all hosed, and many people, whether you think it will happen or not, will abstain from voting because of the dissolution from Democrats lack of action.

No, you don't support people who do not do the work that "we the people" are asking them to do. If you own a company, do you give raises, or even keep them employed if they constantly do not meet their deadlines and their lack of effort is causing your company to loose money? I don't think so.

The lack of action will be disastrous to our democracy, so I say, speak hard to the democrats, maybe it will help them wake up and do their job as we, their supporters, want them to. The buffoon must be impeached. I used to be one who was against impeachment because of Pence, but I think we have gone past the threshold where the buffoon must be taken out of office, they will cheat in 2020, and there is a very good possibility they will win, why? Because while Democrats have been playing their threatening games, the crooks have been planning on how to hack the elections to stay in power.

Democrats never took action when the president of Diebold said he was going to do everything in his power to make sure GW Bush became president...I mean, how much of a warning is that, was anything done? NO! And I know republicans are not sitting on their hands, they don't legislate, what do you think they do all day? They make plans on how to stay in power.

So please, stop this that we cannot be angry, that we cannot express that anger, that we have to support our Democratic leaders because...No, lets get VERY angry and lets let them know it, otherwise we will be pissed come 2020.

[BigOleDummy]

74. Yes!

I think and feel exactly the same way, well said

[aikoaiko]

57. Haven't seen it here and I avoid Twitter

Nothing on FB.

[struggle4progress]

63. "We are the Borg!"

[struggle4progress]

64. Gloom, despair, and agony on me!

[VOX]

65. That's some serious preaching for an 11-day DU "vet."

There are many savvy, intelligent, *experienced* Democrats who’ve been here for nearly two decades. They’ve seen and heard it all.

The OP might want to dial down the upper-case CONCERN a tad, and learn how DU functions best, without the need for border collies.

[EffieBlack]

88. Seriously?

I guess he hasn't been on DU long enough to qualify to be one of the cool kids who gets to have an opinion, right?

Given some of the posters I've encountered over the years - and I think I've been around long enough to be permitted to have an opinion - longevity and number of posts is not a determinant or indicator of any member's intelligence, experience or political savvy ... Some long term members are still clueless as stumps and newer people are sharp as they come and a breath of fresh air.

[Kurt V.]

67. lol. i see much more pollyanna naive rants. but thanks for your concern.

[Brawndo]

76. Pollyanna notions like, "tRump will let go of power after an electoral loss"

[gordianot]

69. As one who remembers Nixon I lived through the drama decades ago.

Republicans were just as despicable and corrupt 100 years ago. Russia and their government was a problem 150 years ago under the Czars. Same old same old the actors are very similar.

[Paladin]

71. Everybody please be skeptical of the gloom&doom threads turning up, lately.

There is every reason to believe that DU is being manipulated by enemy forces---just like 2016. Report overt problems to management. And keep your chins up---like I keep saying, trump's ability to fuck himself up knows no bounds; we need to be ready to take advantage of the opportunities that come our way.

[malaise]

73. Hehehehehe

Rec

[coti]

80. I'm sorry- if you were right, I'd agree with you.

- Robin Williams

[YOHABLO]

82. Democrats believe in the Constitution and the rule of law. So far our hands are tied.

We are up against a cobal of criminals and foreign infiltrators. We should not mince words, Impeachment is our duty.

[EffieBlack]

85. +1

I agree with you completely and so do a lot of other people. But it won't go over well in some quarters around here (because it will definitely hit some nerves), so be prepared to duck!

[ehrnst]

90. Thank you!(nt)