A question about Contempt of Congress

[flyingfysh]

Could Triumph get Barr out of this by using his pardon powers? I don't think any president has tried that before. It would be grounds for impeachment, but that would not be new for Trump. He would be making subpoenas useless.

[leftieNanner]

1. Good question

Don't pardons usually apply for people who have been convicted of a crime? I guess there is no usual in this administration. It also involves admitting guilt. No?

[ProudMNDemocrat]

2. Accepting a Pardon is an admission of guilt....

[flyingfysh]

3. Maybe not

I don't remember anything in the Constitution about the pardoned person having to admit guilt.

[ProudMNDemocrat]

16. The Supreme Court decision in 1915 says otherwise.....

Burdick vs. the United States states otherwise that "acceptance of a Pardon does indeed result in and mission of guilt for which one is being pardoned."

Also, pardons have been issued over the years in cases where the pardoned was actually innocent as well.
[link:http:// https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2017/08/26/is-accepting-a-pardon-an-admission-of-guilt/?utm_term=.726e2a41aec3|

Scroll down to read Myth #4
][link:http:// https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/five-myths/five-myths-about-presidential-pardons/2018/06/06/18447f84-69ba-11e8-bf8c-f9ed2e672adf_story.html?utm_term=.64300adf98d2|
Thee is even mention about self pardons as well.

More....][link:http:// https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burdick_v._United_States|

[VarryOn]

7. I've also heard one doesnt 'accept' a pardon....

The President pardons, and that's it. For example, if you happened to be in prison, you'd be turned loose. You couldnt refuse the pardon and demand to stay behind bars.

[unblock]

9. Not exactly. A pardon is a private grant to the recipient.

It's true that most patrons are public knowledge, and therefore a prosecutor would not likely was time and effort indicting or trying a case where the recipient was known to have received a pardon.

However, technically, the court doesn't officially know about the pardon unless and until the recipient produces it and asks for favorable treatment based on the pardon.

So in your example, no one would order an early release of a prisoner who has not yet produced a pardon, afaik, assuming the pardoned prisoner was mentally competent.

[VarryOn]

11. Thanks for the additional input nt

[unblock]

10. See #8

[unblock]

8. A pardon can be granted at any time after the alleged crime has been committed.

Neither indictment nor conviction is required.

You do not have to admit guilt. That obviously would make no sense for someone pardoned after a wrongful conviction, e.g., after dna evidence exonerated then.

The "admission of guilt" concept really only relates to a specific case where an unwanted pardon was thrust on someone in order to compel self-incriminating testimony. The court ruled that a pardon could be refused, in part on the basis that accepting it would say something about the recipient's guilt. But it clearly doesn't apply in all cases.

[Instant Liberal]

12. Presidential pardon powers are not unlimited

The president’s pardon power cannot be used to: (1) pardon state crimes, (2) remove federal civil liability, (3) pardon impeachment, or (4) pardon crimes that have not already occurred.
This fourth limitation is important because it constrains Trump’s ability to protect co-conspirators from federal criminal liability for a conspiracy that involves the use of the pardon power. A conspiracy to obstruct the investigation that includes the use of the pardon power could not be subsequently pardoned by Trump; a pardon can only apply to actions that occur before it is issued, but in this case any obstructive pardon would be a continuation of the conspiracy, so the crime would be ongoing. Put another way: you cannot pardon a crime when the pardon itself continues the crime.
Because conspiracy is an ongoing crime, an obstructive pardon for actions related to a conspiracy involving the president would not eliminate legal liability. Either the pardon would be a continuation of the crime, and thus the pardon itself would be an invalid attempt to pardon actions that were ongoing, or the pardon would be a new conspiracy and thus a new crime—in either case, Trump and his accomplice or accomplices would still be subject to legal liability for conspiracy.
A conspiracy is an ongoing crime:

Since conspiracy is a continuing offense, United States v. Kissel, 218 U. S. 601, 610 (1910), a defendant who has joined a conspiracy continues to violate the law “through every moment of [the conspiracy’s] existence,” Hyde v. United States, 225 U. S. 347, 369 (1912), and he becomes responsible for the acts of his co-conspirators in pursuit of their common plot, Pinkerton v. United States, 328 U. S. 640, 646 (1946).

The 2018 U

Generally speaking an exceptance of s presidential pardon implies acceptaince of the crime if only to receive clemency for it

[leftieNanner]

14. Thank you for this excellent explanation

DU is such a terrific resource!

[LibFarmer]

4. Methinks it would be obstruction of justice

on the very face of it.

[flyingfysh]

5. Of course it would

Trump had several of those already. What's a few more?

[VarryOn]

6. Are contempts of Congress meaningful?

Did Holder serve ably under a contempt of Congress charge?

I dont think they mean much, really.

[DFW]

13. Ford pardoned Nixon in advance of any indictments being brought.

It can be done.

Wikipedia puts it into concise language:

The pardon of Richard Nixon (Proclamation 4311 Wikisource has information on "Proclamation 4311&quot on September 8, 1974, by President Gerald Ford granted Nixon, Ford's predecessor as president, a full and unconditional pardon for any crimes he might have committed against the United States while president

Not even "did commit," but "might have committed."

"I'm not saying he DID commit any crimes, but just in case, he's hereby pardoned for any crimes he MIGHT have committed."

Actually, my brother is convinced that Trump will resign in early January of next year so that Pence can pardon him before both of them ride off into the sunset.

[DVRacer]

15. He already tested this theory and it was upheld

https://www.cnn.com/2017/08/25/politics/sheriff-joe-arpaio-donald-trump-pardon/index.html

He pardoned Joe when he was held in contempt and it stuck. So yes he can just pardon anyone held in contempt of Congress.