I'd rather the Dems win the WH, the Senate and keep the House than impeachment...

[cynatnite]

As long as the repubs hold the WH and the Senate, impeachment is not going to happen. If the Dems get their way at this point in time, it could help tRump and in no way do I want that. No fucking way.

That's a more realistic solution in getting tRump out. Even if he wins 2020, the Dems could win the Senate. Impeachment's back on the table.

tRump is trying to run the clock by delay, going to court and everything else he and his criminal lawyers can manage.

It seems to me, that the most realistic is to win the whole fucking thing in 2020.

Just my two cents. Flame away.

[Bettie]

1. If he "wins" in 2020

we'll very likely have lost the House and Senate...our nation will be done.

[watoos]

3. Bingo, bye, bye democracy.

[qazplm135]

2. People want blood

I think it backfires quite frankly but it's inevitable now, people are just too angry to do anything but try and make Trump pay...which I totally get, the guy is an abomination.

[watoos]

4. People want justice, want accountability,

it's why we won a blue tsunami in 2018.

[brooklynite]

24. No, people want their economic issues dealt with...

THAT's why we won in 2018: centrist candidates in suburban districts who talked jobs, health care and education, not Trump, Russia and Mueller.

[mcar]

31. And this is what voters still are concerned with

According to pretty much everyone.

[cynatnite]

7. That he is....

I get it. The fucker needs the boot out of the WH along with the rest of criminals.

I'd just rather do it reasonably without going all gung-ho. There are better and more expedient ways of doing it given this political environment, IMO.

[Honeycombe8]

30. We can't remove him from office thru impeachment, because of the Senate.

Just reminding folks about that. Impeachment would be for the historical record. That's why Trump is okay with it, I guess. He could use it as a rallying cry, and in the end, impeachment won't remove him from office. At least he thinks it would help him. Who knows.

This does not mean I think we shouldn't impeach. I keep changing my mind on that. I just don't know.

[cynatnite]

33. I'm about in the same boat...

I go back and forth. Impeachment is the right thing to do, but I want it to go all the way and not stop because the repubs have the senate.

The repubs have abdicated their responsibility to the country in favor of their political survival. They won't even make the attempts. Those assholes know deep in their hearts, but they'd rather listen to their bat-crazy base than do the right thing. Unfortunately, that's how it's been for a long time now. Reason has completely left the building.

I hope things change enough that it becomes more realistic to impeach without it being a failed effort.

I'm not convinced even a smoking gun would change the political dynamics right now.

[Honeycombe8]

34. OTOH, I can hear McConnell's arguments, if we DON'T impeach...

(Imagine his unpleasant grumbling voice) "Well, if the Democrats in the House thought the President had committed some crime or other egregious behavior, why didn't they impeach? (pause) They had every opportunity to do so, but didn't. They try to blame it on the Senate, saying we wouldn't have approved it. But they didn't even give us a resolution to vote on. Nothing. If the Mueller Report had said what they say it said, why wouldn't they have impeached him? (pause) That's because...it didn't say what the Democrats said it did."

[Generic Other]

37. This

Risky either way. Best start investigating. We have plenty of time for constant revelations of wrongdoing as his presidency unravels.

[Honeycombe8]

40. Yes. They started investigations back in Feb., when they sent out over 80 document requests.

They are working incredibly hard. I imagine their staff are dirt tired. They are doing an excellent job, IMO.

[uponit7771]

5. False dichotomy, the party of the impeached has never fare well post impeachment. Clinton was also

... relatively popular with republicans at the time of the impeachment vote in the 90s.

There's ... NO ... cogent political reasons NOT to impeach

[Honeycombe8]

35. I think the Republicans lost seats in Congress the next election after impeaching Clinton.

They maintained control in the Senate or House or whatever they had. But they lost some seats. It may not have been because of the impeachment, though. Maybe those were special districts/states that they would have lost, anyway.

GWB won the election after Clinton, but I don't relate that to the impeachment because after 8 years of a Democratic President, the country usually elects a Republican next. Not always, tho. FDR served 3 terms, then his VP served 2.

FDR/Truman
Truman
Truman
Eisenhower

JFK/LBJ
LBJ
Nixon

Clinton
Clinton
GWB

Obama
Obama
Trump

[uponit7771]

36. Doesn't matter that reps lost seats they didn't lose control of either congressional house. Losing

... the game by a little less is still losing the game.

That's not a good argument against impeachment.

Also, Clinton was relatively popular among republicans at the time while Red Don is historically unpopular among democrats.

No way Red Don's popularity grows with democrats or independents while being impeached.

[LAS14]

6. K & R

[uponit7771]

8. Why do you believe 2020 will be more free and fair than 2016 or 2018 senate races? thx in advance

[John Fante]

13. So we shouldn't even bother with 2020 because it's already rigged?

How did we win in 2008 and 2012 then? How did we retake the house in overwhelming fashion in 2018?

[uponit7771]

25. Not rigged just don't trust Red Don wont accept assitence from Russia again in 2020. 08 and 12 there

... is no indication that Russia helped anyone

18 there was no federal level elections that places like the IRA could focus on but there's no doubt Russians hacked into Florida in 18 and Georgia was stolen.

No, after Rudy G said ... 'there's nothing wrong in getting help from Russia' there's no reason to believe they wont be all up in 2020 elections too.

[trev]

9. Unfortunately, I think regaining the Senate is a long shot.

We need to work with what we have, right now.

[John Fante]

14. It isn't a long shot at all.

[trev]

21. A tremendous effect on the HOR in 2018

while the Dems lost 2 Senate seats.

And the GOP was caught by surprise.... Now they're gearing up.

Going to be difficult for us.

[John Fante]

23. The Democrats had the most unfavorable senate map in

50 years going into 2018. All things considered, the result was terrible for the GOP.

I agree that 2020 will be difficult. Sorry, I was just nitpicking the word "longshot". Slight underdogs, perhaps. But if the Democratic nominee wins by a large enough percentage (5% or more) the senate can be had.

[trev]

32. I hope you're right.

[Fiendish Thingy]

10. I'd rather the Constitution survive until 2020

Without a relentless impeachment inquiry, that is not a given. Any political risks of impeachment pale in comparison to the risk to the rule of law by allowing Trumps obstructions to go unchecked, and not use the most powerful tools in the congressional arsenal.

Surrendering to fear based defeatism is a violation of our reps oath of office, IMO.

[spanone]

11. I think the rule of law is more important than anything. Without that elections may cease.

[kentuck]

12. In my opinion, Trump and Republicans will be stronger if there is no impeachment...

They can accuse the Democrats of running a witch hunt.

They can proclaim their innocence.

They can shout that there was no collusion. There was no obstruction. There was nothing but a waste of money.

It is the easy way out.

[Delmette2.0]

16. I agree.

If the House Committees stand their ground AND counter the R's lame, cherry picked arguments.

I listened this morning to Nadler give his opening statement. Then the Dipshit from Georgia went on a rant about how Nadler didn't didn't give the full story (not true to my thinking). Dipshit proceeded to do the same. He focused on what Barr stated in his first review of the Mueller Report. What the Mueller Report actually stated is that about collusion isn't a legal term and obstruction couldn't be proved because of all the lies, deleted text messages and deleted emails.

We need about 6 staff members taking notes and passing the Dems talking points to fact check the half lies the R's spew out for their base. Either that or as each side takes turns asking questions every Dem needs to pick out one lie and fact check the previous speaker. Then the Dems can go on to their questions.

Do your job protect our Democracy and our Constitution.

[uponit7771]

26. +1

[Johonny]

29. Yeah, Wouldn't you rather run against a Senator that voted for Russian interference,

is pro-money laundering, and for special privileges for rich people? Than a Senator that never had to make that declaration.


I believe one of the Dems winning issues is applying the rule of law equally to rich and poor . It's a message that works across a large segment of society.

[BootinUp]

15. Ready for a roast. Just kidding.

[The_Counsel]

17. This Shouldn't Be About "Getting Trump Out..."

...it should be about bringing him and his minions to justice.

The law is the law is the law.

At least that's how it should be.

No president--whether the name is Trump, Clinton, Bush, Nixon, Obama, whatever--should be above the law. For obvious reasons. If that weren't true, then maybe they should have just let King George III do what he do all those years ago.

I can't believe this still has to be pointed out in the year 2019.

[Vinca]

18. I'm more worried that people who voted for Democrats in 2018 because they wanted action will

stay home in 2020 if we don't impeach. That's why I've changed my mind on impeachment. In addition, an impeachment hearing that stretches on for months in an election season isn't going to be a good thing for Don. Democrats don't have to solely focus on Russia, they can get into his financial dirty dealings, emolument violations and sexual misdeeds if any of the many women who've accused him want to come forward.

[standingtall]

19. There is no scenario where we take that Senate and Trump gets reelected

And even if by some miracle that were to happen. If we don't impeach Trump in his first term we will no impeach him in his 2nd term, because we still wont have enough votes to convict in the senate it will be same excuses all over again.

Besides it's not an either or choice. We can impeach Trump and after the republican senate acquits him we can use the energy of our base after that to win the Presidency and take back the senate.

[Generic Other]

38. Senate failure to impeach

Will cost GOP seats.

[bamagal62]

20. Impeach!

I think we have no choice. If we don’t, what will the next crazy one do??? We have to show the American people what criminals they all are.

[lunatica]

22. Say he loses the election but goes scott free

So the next President who tries another coup will not have any fears about paying any other price than to lose his/her election. But, and this is a big fucking deal but, why leave at all? Why hold elections? Why bother to even pretend to be Democratic? Who the fuck will stop him?

But if we impeach asshole Trump then the message is crystal clear. Wannabe dictators run at their own risk. Impeachment becomes a real thing. A real possibility.

Criminals are emboldened when they don’t get punished. Their decency meter doesn’t exist.

Trump and the Republicans are throwing up every block they can because to lose means really bad news for them, so why not throw everything they have at us. It might work, but that’s better than what they’ll get if they give in to the law. The Republicans have nothing left to lose if they don’t cling to their power. Why would they ever want to give in?

If Trump wins in 2020 all our arguments are moot.

[Raven123]

27. Conviction requires 2/3 vote in Senate. Might be more realistic if Dems takeover Senate,

But also unlikely as I doubt we take the Senate and lose the Presidency.

[marlakay]

28. If you look at it from another perspective

If the dems don’t impeach they can look weak and he might get re-elected.

[gldstwmn]

39. That scenario presumes

There will be free and fair elections in 2020 or an election at all.