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Sat May 25, 2019, 12:18 PM

You're Pro-Life until ... it affects you personally.


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Reply You're Pro-Life until ... it affects you personally. (Original post)
kpete May 2019 OP
calimary May 2019 #1
sharedvalues May 2019 #19
Texin May 2019 #24
sharedvalues May 2019 #34
Ohiogal May 2019 #2
Nasruddin May 2019 #3
uriel1972 May 2019 #4
Bernardo de La Paz May 2019 #5
maddiemom May 2019 #7
TexasBushwhacker May 2019 #14
Delmette2.0 May 2019 #6
spinbaby May 2019 #8
WhiskeyGrinder May 2019 #13
uriel1972 May 2019 #15
They_Live May 2019 #22
gopiscrap May 2019 #9
UniteFightBack May 2019 #10
Freddie May 2019 #28
pdsimdars May 2019 #11
rickford66 May 2019 #12
VOX May 2019 #16
Billy Ray Joe Bob. May 2019 #17
D_Master81 May 2019 #18
littlemissmartypants May 2019 #20
Whatthe_Firetruck May 2019 #21
lostnfound May 2019 #23
judy May 2019 #25
Farmer-Rick May 2019 #26
Collimator May 2019 #30
Eyeball_Kid May 2019 #31
Collimator May 2019 #32
Eyeball_Kid May 2019 #27
Collimator May 2019 #29
lunasun May 2019 #33

Response to kpete (Original post)

Sat May 25, 2019, 12:31 PM

1. That's how it is with people who have no compassion, and sneer at

the whole idea of empathy.

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Response to calimary (Reply #1)

Sat May 25, 2019, 11:35 PM

19. You mean, Republicans?

The Catholic Church has poisoned this country with its focus on abortion over all else, including women, and making sure little kids have healthcare.

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Response to sharedvalues (Reply #19)

Sun May 26, 2019, 10:53 AM

24. Actually the rethugs have co-opted "religion" (not just Catholicism) to control a swath of voters.

They've used religion and this specific issue to do that, as well as other hot button issues, such as race and gender identification, and (white) male patriarchy. It's their "Southern Strategy" writ large.

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Response to Texin (Reply #24)

Mon May 27, 2019, 09:00 AM

34. +1

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Sat May 25, 2019, 12:42 PM

2. I wish I could rec this 1000 times.

So f-ing true.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Sat May 25, 2019, 01:18 PM

3. Going back to the well

We had this whole discussion 50 years ago.
Some people, and some cultures, seem incapable of learning.

Some people, and some cultures, seem incapable of learning at all until they have personal, direct, physical experience of something. They cannot learn from being told, they cannot learn by observation, and they cannot imagine themselves in the position of somebody else (ie empathize). Their minds are closed until the frying pan clouts them in the head.

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Response to Nasruddin (Reply #3)

Sat May 25, 2019, 01:21 PM

4. I wish the frying pan would be an effective tool...

there are many hit on the head that still don't have empathy for other people.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Sat May 25, 2019, 01:24 PM

5. Also, they are pro-life until their mistress gets pregnant. So many have mistresses! . . . nt

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Response to Bernardo de La Paz (Reply #5)

Sat May 25, 2019, 01:38 PM

7. Didn't Trump want Marla (pregnant while he was still married to Ivana, I believe)...

to terminate her pregnancy? That was the story at the time, but never mentioned now, probably in deference to the daughter in question, who seems to be a bright, worthwhile young lady.

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Response to maddiemom (Reply #7)

Sat May 25, 2019, 07:53 PM

14. His response when he learned of the pregnancy

"What are we going to do about this?"

Sounds like he would have welcomed an abortion.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Sat May 25, 2019, 01:37 PM

6. I must have been about 5 years old...late 1950's

Our new neighbor was pregnant and for some reason i must have asked when will the baby arrive. My Mother told me the baby had died. But she was still pregnant! Mom said there was nothing the doctors could do and she would deliver the dead baby later. The woman must have been 7-8 months along and she just had to wait it out.

Year's later I asked Mom what happened to the neighbor. She didn't know, they just moved out.

The fact that the baby died in utero was sad, but it's that she had to carry it for gawd knows how long is imbedded in my memory. If that memory can stay with a child for 60+ years, I can't imagine how the parents got through the contiuning grief and and beyond.

But it's what gawd wants. The medical science that brought us ultrasounds prove that a heart muscle is starting to work will not be used to confirm death.

Are those ultrasound wands used for anything else other than to prove conception happened? Can they be used to determine of the Repub. Legislators have a heart? I know where we can use them and start checking.

Story and rant over.


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Response to kpete (Original post)

Sat May 25, 2019, 02:42 PM

8. You shouldn't need an extenuating circumstance to get an abortion

A woman in early pregnancy should be able to get an abortion for any reason or no reason.

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Response to spinbaby (Reply #8)

Sat May 25, 2019, 07:40 PM

13. Free, on demand, without apology.

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Response to spinbaby (Reply #8)

Sat May 25, 2019, 08:18 PM

15. anytime a women wants an abortion...

she should be able to get one, without question. Early pregnancy, or no.

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Response to spinbaby (Reply #8)

Sun May 26, 2019, 03:08 AM

22. agree n/t

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Sat May 25, 2019, 02:48 PM

9. Exactly

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Sat May 25, 2019, 02:50 PM

10. Please, please, please it is FORCED BIRTHERS or PRO FORCED BIRTH. That is how it should be referred

 

to ALWAYS going forward.

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Response to UniteFightBack (Reply #10)

Sun May 26, 2019, 11:53 AM

28. Forced Birth Extremist

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Sat May 25, 2019, 03:19 PM

11. That seems to be a pattern with many, like the anti-LGBT, until it's their daughter, etc.

 

They don't seem to be able to think outside their own interests until it smacks them in the face.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Sat May 25, 2019, 07:34 PM

12. My wife had an illegal abortion before I met her.

There was no way she could continue the pregnancy for many reasons. This was back in late 60's. I know it affected her in so many ways for all her life. She should have been able to have a legal medical procedure by her choice instead of the shame and lies she endured. There are no laws controlling men's bodies. Maybe there should be.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Sat May 25, 2019, 08:44 PM

16. Pro-life advocacy ceases immediately upon birth.

After that, youíre not only on your own, youíre now a target for the right wingís favorite method: birth control after-the-fact: anti-vaxxing, zero child services, no healthcare, education cuts, cannon-fodder for illegal wars, capital punishment, etc.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Sat May 25, 2019, 10:00 PM

17. Men pregnant?

 

If men could get pregnant there would be drive up abortion clinic's on EVERY corner in the bible belt. It's all about control. I hope woman wake up or the Christian Taliban will destroy everything woman have worked for. Next,, should woman vote?

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Sat May 25, 2019, 10:32 PM

18. Know someone exactly like this

We were good friends years ago, have since kinda parted ways. But he is staunchly Republican and staunchly Pro Life. Like he's the type thats never voted for a Dem at any level of office in his life. I remember him
finally coming to our group of friends and having to admit and get it off his chest that he got a girl pregnant and then paid for her to get an abortion. He felt terrible about it, but it was too late at that point. So yes, its easy to say you're against abortion. But how do you react in the moment?

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Sun May 26, 2019, 01:38 AM

20. K and R. nt

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Sun May 26, 2019, 01:58 AM

21. The only "moral" abortion...

I have been pointing people to this article for years. It's just as relevant and true as the first time I read it.

The only moral abortion is my abortion!

http://www.prochoiceactionnetwork-canada.org/articles/anti-tales.shtml

At times, clinic staff understandably become frustrated and angry when they have to deal with abusive, hostile, or hypocritical patients. And it is rare for anti-choice women to express appreciation for the service they've received. But most clinics perform abortions on anti-abortion women because they feel it's their obligation to help all women. They provide more thorough and specialized counseling to these women to ensure they take ownership of their decision, as far as possible. Here's a couple of examples of counseling techniques:

"When a patient comes in with my 'favorite' sentiment: 'The only moral abortion is my abortion,' I try to expand her understanding that a few more of us have had and deserve a 'moral' abortion. When a woman expands her need for care beyond herself, you no longer have an 'anti'." (Clinic Administrator, Louisiana)

"Sometimes I say to patients who have that 'I have no choice, I know I'll regret it, just do me' attitude: 'You may not care, but we do. We only do abortions on women who want our services. We will not knowingly contribute to any possible trauma of any woman.' They seem surprised that we care how we do our work, but they also accept it." (Counselor, New York)

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Response to Whatthe_Firetruck (Reply #21)

Sun May 26, 2019, 09:36 AM

23. Deeply held belief?..omg. "I know I'll regret it"

So bizarre. If a woman is against abortion, then I assume itís because she considers it murder. Yet your example patientís attitude is ďjust do it, time for regrets laterĒ??

How messed up. And sad. Unexamined beliefs. The guilt, and fear of exposure, must be debilitating.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Sun May 26, 2019, 11:29 AM

25. I hate to be a broken record

But seeing the term "pro life" really turns my stomach. I understand the post of course, but it hurts to see the way right wing language has seeped into everyone's language.
Other than that, it is true, you're anti choice until it affects you personally.
Maybe I wouldn't be as upset if the author and tweeter had put quotes around the infamous Frank Luntz creation. Yuck.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Sun May 26, 2019, 11:38 AM

26. There are so many instances of where carrying a fetus to forced birth is so dangerous

It is dangerous to the woman's health and to her sanity. The religiously insane and misogynist think these occasions are rare, they are NOT. Just ask around. How many horror stories of pregnancies gone bad or deadly have you heard?

When my wife was pregnant, she complained that every woman had some horror story to tell her and make her afraid. Yes, birth can be easy and fulfilling and rewarding. But it can also turn dangerous very easily. It's not because pregnancy is a disease or something. It's because evolution designed a system where there are many pitfalls. Just standing on 2 legs changed our biology and made childbirth more difficult.

I had a doctor walk me through the evolution of reproduction when I wanted to know why my wife was having so many problems. There are so many problems built right into our reproductive systems. I had no idea. Just look at how often women died in childbirth before the germ theory and cesareans were developed.

Forced birthers are opening up a can of misery for women and families.

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Response to Farmer-Rick (Reply #26)

Sun May 26, 2019, 12:15 PM

30. Many women like to tell their "war stories".

I'm not sure why. For many women in the post WWII period, maybe it was their response to the attention that their husbands received from telling about their actual war experiences.

Maybe some women are just seeking a sense of validation and credit for what they went through, and the people in their lives closest to them aren't giving them what they need.

It would be interesting to learn about the sorts of stories that women in different cultures share. I bring that thought up because I re-read your points about evolution. In one joint biology/anthropology class, we were shown drawings of three female pelvises (pelvi?) with an infant's skull emerging.

The first was a chimpanzee. From the point of view of the drawing, it was clear that there was plenty of room between the pelvic bones and the hard skull of the infant.

The second was Austrolapithicus, (excuse me while I look that word up), Australopithecus. The drawing indicated that the fit was considerably tighter between momma's bones and baby's bony head. It still looked doable, however.

Then there was Homo Sapiens. Based on the drawing, it appeared to be an impossible feat of physics for that head to emerge from that pelvis. The fact that it has happened literally billions of times on this earth doesn't diminish its essential illogic. It cannot be done. . . And yet it is.

There are some Biblical scholars who say that the story of Genesis and the curse laid upon Eve that her childbearing should be in pain is an allegory. Our big brains, which are the source of our "Knowledge of Good and Evil" are what make the prospect of giving birth so dicey. Getting kicked out of the Garden where life was simple is also seen as an allegory when we went from being animals with limited knowledge who lived directly with nature, to complex, moral beings who had to alter nature and its gifts to survive.

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Response to Collimator (Reply #30)

Sun May 26, 2019, 12:26 PM

31. The skull of a newborn is somewhat soft and

flexible. It adapts to the narrow birth canal. And the birth canal is also flexible. This is not a miracle by any means. Unfortunately for the case of overpopulation, conception is far too easy.

Since the rise of conservative Christianity, no one in the media EVER talks about overpopulation. Yet itís likely a major factor in making the planet uninhabitable.

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Response to Eyeball_Kid (Reply #31)

Sun May 26, 2019, 12:39 PM

32. Yes, I know that there is some flexibility to an infant's skull.

And maybe the fleshy parts of the birth canal has some flexibility. Even the actual pelvic bones loosen and widen during earlier stages of pregnancy. But the bones themselves are not rubbery by any means.

I wasn't suggesting any miracle. But it looks impossible if you see the dimensions drawn out in a sketch of the bones. As for the pain associated with pushing something the size of a human infant's head through a human pelvis. . . I had an early miscarriage once, and the uterine cramps were insane. And all I was passing was blood. While I don't think giving birth should be looked upon as any woman's greatest accomplishment, I do give credit where credit is due.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Sun May 26, 2019, 11:39 AM

27. Men are 100% responsible for pregnancies,

but the anti-choice MEN blame women for getting pregnant when itís time to choose. And then they want to criminalize DOCTORS, further distancing themselves from responsibility. The whole issue isnít about accountability. Itís about power. And women are once again shoved to the bottom.

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Sun May 26, 2019, 11:56 AM

29. Mentioned this in another thread.

In high school, I was very active in Campus Life Youth for Christ. Just a year or so after graduation, I was talking to another member of my local group. She was unmarried and had gotten pregnant. She explained that she "didn't have an abortion" but rather was given an injection to cause miscarriage.

She was given the money for the procedure by one of the young men in our group (not the father) who was sympathetic because his girlfriend had two abortions.

Years later, I heard that the young woman had a baby, technically within wedlock but the father was out of the picture. She received support from another friend in the group--which is good, of course. But I wonder if she spent any amount of time protesting clinics.

If she did, she probably justified it as having learned from her own "sin" and wanted to help others avoid that guilt. But hey, as long as everything was safe and legal when she needed it . . .

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Response to kpete (Original post)

Sun May 26, 2019, 01:28 PM

33. Selfish small minded assholes but still manage to make judgement and declare I'm a prolifer

Itís one thing if they are selfish and only care about themselves and make no push back on anti choice measures that do not concern them and have been neutral then come around when it hits them
but when they are declared prolifers and actually support anti choice action and then do a 180 because it is now them or their family I say fuck them

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