Why Do US Carmakers Only Offer 3-year/36,000 Mile Warranties?

[MineralMan]

My wife and I took a look at a couple of smaller GM crossovers. It was time to replace our 2013 KIA Soul after 7 years. Since I was roundly criticized for choosing that KIA Soul back in 2013, I decided to look at US option.

The warranty killed the deal. We bought a 2020 KIA Soul this afternoon. 5-year, 60,000-mile overall warranty and 10-year, 100,000-mile power train warranty.

Sorry, but I buy what I need and what I like.

[PJMcK]

1. Good question

I bought a Hyundai Elantra a few years ago. The warranty sealed the deal: 10 years or 100,000 miles. I've been very happy and comfortable with this car.

Enjoy your new auto! It's always fun to get a new car.

[MineralMan]

7. Well, we enjoyed the 2013 Soul for almost exactly 7 years.

Zero repairs. A couple of minor recalls that were handled right away. Comfy, roomy, quiet. With luck, the new one will behave just as well for just as long.

[obamanut2012]

9. I still have my 2013 Kia Soul

Only issues were the recalls, including the extended warranty for the steering coupler. Literally nothing major. I'll get another Soul or a Kia Niro in a couple years.

[TheBlackAdder]

28. They want to discharge that liability, add profits for extended warranty plans.

.

Since a lot of people only put on 10-12K a year, and own their cars for 3-year periods, this helps promote churning to newer vehiles.

.

[LexVegas]

2. Honda and Toyota are 3/36 with 5/60 limited power train.

[doc03]

14. My 2006 Toyota Tacoma and my Ford Fusion also came with

3/36 and 5/60 on the power train. In fifty years I have owned numerous cars and only once have I had a claim on the 3/36
warranty and once I got the extended 5 year warranty and never made a claim. The one time I had a problem was with a 1986
Ford Ranger, the Japanese Mazda manual transmission went out at around 2 years and 25000 miles.

[LexVegas]

17. Kia extended my warranty to 120k miles because they are having QC issues with engine bearings. nt

[doc03]

19. Toyota put a new frame and springs on my Tacoma when it was 12 years old.

Never had to have the frame replaced on any American car.

[underpants]

3. Gwangju

Gwangju Plant
Edit
South Korea: Located in Gwangju on approximately 1,022,244 square metres (11,003,340 sq ft) of land, the facility produces the Kia Soul, Kia Carens/Rondo, Kia Sportage, and Kia Bongo/K-Series, as well as buses and military vehicles. The plant will commence production of the Kia Seltos in mid-2019.[13]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Kia_design_and_manufacturing_facilities

[Scruffy1]

4. Auto manufacturing is a global business.

Kia has a factories in the USA, India, and Mexico besides their other plants.

[customerserviceguy]

5. That's why they push leases so hard

The cars can't stay reliable beyond a three year period. That's why I went for a hybrid Hyundai Sonata in 2012, 85K miles, and still drives like new. The only inconvenience was when the standard 12-volt battery went dead after the car was not driven for about a month in the cold of a New York winter.

[MineralMan]

11. This past winter, I replaced the battery and all four tires

on our 2013. I never spend a penny on any repairs in seven years. We had a service package that handled all routine maintenance for $8/month. Drive to the dealer when an oil change is scheduled, no appointment, and you're out of the waiting room in less than 45 minutes, every time.

A very decent trade-in amount, too on the new one. The dealer guy said that our old car would sell within a week of going out on the lot.

I see what you're saying about leases. Kia and Hyundai offered those 5/60k and 10/100k warranties from the very beginning. It was a selling point for a newly introduced car company. Apparently it wasn't too costly for them, so they still offer it, along with the lowest prices of any car in each class. An unbeatable combination.

[customerserviceguy]

21. Yes, truly

That Sonata may be the last car I ever need to buy, now that I'm retired. Eight bucks a month sounds pretty good, but since I don't drive much anymore, I usually get Jiffy Lube oil changes about twice a year, maybe a bit less often. With the hybrid, I can go a lot of miles between changes, a third of the time that I'm driving, the electric motor takes over, and the gas engine gets a rest.

But early Hyundai models (they were offered on the West Coast in the 1980's) had a fair amount of problems, but Hyundai stepped up their game, and the warranties must have become part of the corporate culture.

[Disaffected]

6. Lucky USA,

in Canada the overall is the same but the power train warranty lasts only 5 years with same # miles. Must be due to the harsh Canadian climate

[TreasonousBastard]

8. Hyundai/Kia got in trouble years ago with a bad rap for reliability, so they put their money...

where their mouths are and sent out cars with the best warranty in the business.

Mercedes, btw, has a 4yr/50K warranty and they will happily give you up to 100,000 miles for a price. A big price.

My 2019 Chevy has 36,000 miles, with 60,000 powertrain, and something else for emissions. GM has extended warranties, too, but not as expensive as a Benz.

[MicaelS]

10. Because dealers make more money on service than sales.

Always remember one thing about the American car business. The Big 3s REAL customers are the dealerships, not the car buying public. So the B3 are going to make their real customers happy.

The EV business is going to be a major disrupting force to this business model since EVs require much less maintenance. One of the appeals to Tesla is their very low maintenance schedule / costs.

Tesla has quietly changed its EV maintenance policy, going from regularly scheduled service to an "as-needed" model, according to its "Car Maintenance" page. Before, it called for "recommended" service every 12 months and 12,500 for the Model S and X, and 24 months or 25,000 miles for the Model 3. Now, however, it simply says "your Tesla does not require annual maintenance and regular fluid changes," and instead recommends periodic servicing of things like brake fluid, air conditioning and filters.

This makes a certain amount of sense, as EVs are much less maintenance intensive than regular vehicles. That's because electric motors have no fluids, nor the thousands of moving parts of a gas motor. They also lack transmissions, packing just a single reduction gear. On top of that, much of the breaking is done by a regenerative system that recharges the batteries, reducing wear and tear on brake pads and lines. Finally, Tesla's app keeps track of service issues and can notify the owner when repairs are needed.

[MyOwnPeace]

24. THIS might be a problem..............

"On top of that, much of the breaking is done by a regenerative system....."

Wow! They know where the problem is already - better make sure that your "breaks" don't get you into trouble!

[WhiskeyGrinder]

12. Because when it comes down to it, the warranty is a selling point, not necessarily a reflection on

the quality or longevity of the car. Toyota, which has a reputation of reliability, also has a 3/36 (5/60 powertrain) warranty. What it means is that you paid more up front than the car may be "worth" for peace of mind.

[MineralMan]

16. Perhaps. However, I've not heard of a lot of people having

issues with their KIAs, and I'm on an active KIA board frequently. The car seems very well-designed and manufactured.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

20. Right. And if it's well-designed and manufactured, then you're paying for a warranty that you might

not need.

[MineralMan]

42. Well, since the warranty cost is part of the purchase price, it's hard to

break down how much it costs. However, KIA models are consistently the lowest priced in each class of vehicle they sell. In many cases, their base trim features rival other manufacturers' higher trim levels. So, how much am I paying for the long warranty? I don't know. From a consumer point of view, the price you pay is the price you pay. There is no lower-priced equivalent car being sold today. I looked at other cars in the same price range (there are very few, frankly) and none of them offered the comfort, space, etc. of the Soul.

Go have a look. I like my boxy, spacious Soul. Even in the base model (LX), it has all the bells and whistles I could want, and some I don't even care about. Go sit in one and take it for a test drive. Or rent a Soul the next time you rent a car. You'll be pleasantly surprised, I guarantee.

[roamer65]

13. I have a 5 year/120k full warranty on my 2017 Cruze.

Only 20 bucks a month thru GM financial.

They offer it when u are talking financing.

[MineralMan]

15. No charge for the Kia's warranty.

They do sell some other warranty protections for things like small dents, paint scratches and alloy wheel damage, but the sales guy said nobody buys them. My base LX model doesn't have alloy wheels, though.

[roamer65]

18. Def buy what u like.

The Cruze for me is a very comfortable car, was #2 in CR and assembled in the USA.

With it gone, my next sedan will probably be a Subaru Impreza if I find it comfortable.

[customerserviceguy]

22. I've never

turned down an extended warranty and then regretted it later. I have bought a couple of extended warranties in my life, and regretted them.

[Skidmore]

52. We bought that warranty too.

I love my Cruze and am so disappointed they stopped making them.

[Ilsa]

55. My extended warranty was a no-brainer as well, and I don't think

it was even that much on my Impala.

[wishstar]

23. Hope to keep my 2009 Kia Sedona for many more years

The 10 year warranty is almost up, but I only have 42000 miles and the only maintenance so far has been a new battery and new tires and new cabin filter. Kia Dealer did try to rip me off at 15000 miles recommending an injection cleaning for $150 which I refused and at 30,000 miles an alignment job for $150 which I also refused. Several years ago I switched from Kia dealer to Hyundai dealer for my annual oil changes and Hyundai service manager said the van didn't need either of those Kia dealer ripoffs.

I bought the van new for $20,000 after trade- in and got a price of $20,000 this week on a new Kia Sedona with trade-in of the 2009, so if I get a blown engine or van gets totaled in accident, I will get another Sedona which will be nice for rear camera and temperature gauge. Only drawback is mileage, but we haul passengers and bicycles and lots of construction and garden materials in a mountainous area for which the V6 van excels.

[Kaleva]

25. Sounds good but the nearest KIA dealer to me is 122 miles away.

[MineralMan]

43. Yeah, that's too far to go for routine service, etc.

I wouldn't do that, either. Mine is five miles away.

[mcar]

26. We have a 2003 Kia Sedona minivan

180,000 miles and still runs great. Looks like hell (two sons learning to drive in it).

[Wiseman32218]

27. Here in Jacksonville FL

We have a Toyota and a Chevrolet Dealership (not MFG) offers a 20 year/200,000 mile warranty. I am looking at my next purchase to be from them!!!!

[awesomerwb1]

29. Few years ago rented a car to drive in LA

and when I got to LAX I was told they were out and the only car left was a Kia Soul. I wasn't very happy because I' wasn't a huge fan of its looks.

Well took the car, drove it a couple days and was very pleasantly surprised. It's surprisingly spacious inside, comfortable and quiet. I turned down an upgrade that was offered to me a couple days later. Seemed like a very well designed car to me.

Congrats on your brand new car.

[MineralMan]

31. Thanks. KIA Souls are great little cars,

especially for their price. That's why they're selling well, and to a wide range of buyers. KIA began marketing them to cool younger people, but senior citizens started buying them for their ease of entry and exit and very reasonable pricing. Their seat height is just right for most people, so you don't have to sit down low in them or climb up into them.

The sales to the over 60 set surprised KIA, but the company and its dealers don't mind one bit.

[jberryhill]

30. I used to have a soul...

But I didn't pay the exorcist, so my soul was re-possessed.

I would have sold it for a longer warranty.

[SweetieD]

32. Kia is the better choice. Imo. And Kia actually will fix your car under warranty whereas

a lot of car manufacturer warranties exclude a lot when it is actually time to get fixed.

I've only owned kias for the last 22 years.

[MineralMan]

33. I haven't had any warranty repairs on my earlier Soul.

However, there have been two recalls on my old one, and my dealer took care of them promptly and without any complaining. One was for inadequate rust-proofing, and I got a full undercoating and rustproofing treatment at no charge. The other one was for an obscure problem with the catalytic converter overheating under some rare situation. The dealer re-programmed the car's computer and found another minor problem I didn't know about and fixed that as well. Again, fast service and no cost to me.

Part of it is the dealer you choose.

[SweetieD]

36. I had a sephia for 12 years that was fixed under warranty. I have had a forte for the last 10

Years and have not had to do any other than basic maintenance. No warranty issues.

My boss bought a fancy lexus and he was always in a loaner car while his Lexus was being repaired. Just anecdotal.

I'm just going to drive this forte for as long as I can since it is paid off.

[MineralMan]

38. Well, the 2020 Soul has a first-year new engine and transmission, so

there may be some shakedown issues. I don't know. I doubt it, but I know they'll take care of them quickly if problems develop.

I have a lot of confidence in their engineering and testing program, though, so I don't expect any issues.

[MineralMan]

34. I really like my KIA dealer, too.

We called to set up an appointment to buy a car in their inventory, scheduling it for August 1. The dealer told my wife that if we bought before the end of July, there was an incentive from KIA Finance that would cut almost $1800 off the price, but that expired on August 31, so we changed the appointment to yesterday.

Also, the salesman told her about a military service discount of $400, so I brought my DD Form 214 with us. There was also a $500 loyalty discount for being a current KIA owner. Altogether, $2700 got knocked off the sticker price right from the get-go. On a $20,000 car, that's significant.

Trade-in value for our 2013 model was exactly what I had estimated it to be before going in. No surprises there. the car had been smoked in and had some scratches in the paint.

The whole process took 2.5 hours from the time we walked in the door to the time we drove off the lot. Interest rate on the loan was just fine, and about what I expected, given our credit score.

No pressure, no hassle, no up-selling. We got the exact car from inventory I requested. No problem. A good dealer makes a big difference.

[Polybius]

35. It's not a good idea to have just a FWD vehicle in Minnesota

AWD works much better in the Winter.

[MineralMan]

39. Well, we drove the 2013 Soul year-round for seven years.

It was never a problem during the winter. With it's ABS braking and stability controls, all you have to do is drive sanely during the winter. Since we don't have a commute, our tendency is to wait until streets are plowed to venture out, and that happens very quickly in St. Paul.

We've lived here for 15 years now, and have never had an AWD vehicle. We're used to winter driving.

[Hugin]

40. So that they can make bucks financing a longer warranty.

Only the best.

[MineralMan]

41. KIA's warranty is included in the price of the vehicle.

No extra charge. And, KIA's cars are consistently among the lowest priced vehicles in their individual classes. So, I'm not sure that what you say is true, frankly. KIA and Hyundai are made by the same company, which has offered the 5-year/60,000-mile bumper to bumper and 10-year/100,000-mile warranties all along. They did it, at first, to inspire confidence in a brand new car company, but continued to offer the same longer warranties right up through the current model year.

The sticker price on the 2020 KIA Soul in the LX or base trim, with automatic transmission, is right at $20,000. If you choose the manual transmission, which we did on our last Soul, the price goes down to about $18,000. Current incentives, brought the list price of the automatic trans model down to $18,000. The base LX trim includes everything I need. Higher trim levels bring different tire and wheel options, some additional autonomous driving features which I don't want, things like power and heated seats, a larger touch-screen system, sunroof, and there is a turbo engine option in the top level trims that I don't need. The top-of-the-line trim package has a sticker price of $28,000 or right near that.

But, all models come with the same warranty, for which there is no additional charge.

[Hugin]

46. You asked why US car makers only offered 3yr/36000 warranties.

I was answering that question, which is to sell you a longer warranty added into the financing of the vehicle purchase.

Kia and Hyundai are S Korean companies.

[MineralMan]

44. A couple more things about the 2020 Soul:

The 2020 KIA Soul has a new engine and transmission. The combination was in the 2019 KIA Rio, so it's had a year to sort itself out. Normally, I'd be a little hinky about new designs for those two things, but KIA's history is not one of faulty new introductions, so..

Anyhow, the engine, which is the same in all models except the highest trim level, is a 2.0 liter Atkinson-cycle four-cylinder engine. Developed for their hybrid models, they have standardized on that engine for many of their cars. It makes 147hp with 134 pound-feet of torque. It's peppier than their old 1.6 liter base model by a good bit. I haven't driven the new car far enough to comment much on its performance, though...I've just given it a couple of full-throttle acceleration tries, and it's definitely faster on the takeoff.

The transmission, on the other hand is a whole new animal. Our 2013 Soul had the standard 6-speed manual transmission, which is still available on the base trim model, and which I dearly loved driving. However, my wife said, "Automatic transmission, please," so there it is. Anyhow this new transmission is a CVT (Continuously Variable Transmission) unit, and only in production for a year. As such, it has variable gear ratios, and is driven by a pair of pulleys that adjust to provide the variable ratios. I was definitely somewhat alarmed, since the CVT-transmission cars I've driven in the past have felt and sounded odd, since they had no fixed ratios or shifting.

KIA had a different idea. Their CVT, which they call an IVT (Intelligent Variable Transmission), offers fixed ratios, controlled by a computer, so when you accelerate hard, it gives the impression of shifting through the gears. It feels just like a normal automatic transmission. As you drive normally, however, the tachometer demonstrates that the transmission is constantly changing ratios to match the speed, throttle setting, etc. to use the best match for fuel economy and performance. Since the engine is quite quiet, you don't notice this, unless you're looking at the tach.

So, I'm not so worried about this transmission. In most cars with CVT, a heavy-duty composite belt runs between the variable pulleys. In the KIA, it is a complex metal chain, built to last at least 120,000 miles, so there are no service intervals recommended. The ITV transmission also has a torque converter, like a typical automatic gear-driven transmission.

How will I feel after driving this car for 5 years? I suspect that I'll soon no longer notice the transmission at all, which is a good thing. I will, however, miss shifting that nice little 6-speed manual tranny from the old car. Except, of course in traffic, where shifting gears gets annoying at times.

[ErikTheMagnanimous]

45. Americans offered Lifetime

After Chrysler got out from under foreign (Daimler) control, they offered unlimited lifetime powertrain warranties.

Once Chrysler was given to a foreign owner, they took those away.

[gopiscrap]

50. welcome to DU

[Codeine]

47. Because when Kias and Hyundais first hit the US market

they were hot garbage, and that initial run of poor build quality and questionable reliability left a sufficiently bad taste in everyone’s mouths that the company was essentially forced to create that massive warranty incentive in order to sell their car — which in all fairness had made great strides.

And now they’re pretty much stuck with the plan. Kia/Hyundai buyers are motivated by the warranty package so they really can’t drop it now. It’s the only thing that distinguishes them in a very same-y automobile environment.

[pintobean]

48. And some wonder why blue collars walk away.

[Everyman Jackal]

49. We bought a 09 Kia Optima new.

The warranty was good but we went the whole hog and bought an extended warranty from them for $2,000. The warranty coverers everything except for things that normally wear out. I have 143,000 miles on it and I figure I will eventually have to use the warranty. My wife now drives a 2015 Kia Optima bought new. Total price $23,500 which also includes a forever warranty but she has only 55,000 miles on hers.

[Tikki]

51. It appears that the KIA Soul EV will be covered under the same..

warranty as the gasoline engine KIA Soul.
https://www.kia.com/us/en/content/ev-faqs_2016/soul-ev-specifics/warranty

In two to three years we will be buying an EV car. We will
check out all EV's, but a long warranty is promising.

The Tikkis

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

53. Says a lot about how much confidence each company has in their cars,

doesn't it?

In reality, the only reason U.S. cars have gotten as good as they have in recent decades is because of how phenomenally good the Japanese cars became starting in the 1980s. I recall my husband telling me around 1984 or so that the U.S. automakers were very nervous about the Japanese cars, which about that time had morphed from being tin cans of basic transportation, to having features that very much competed with the domestic ones.

And they just get better and better.

Last September I bought a 2017 Honda Fit, and just checked the service contract that came with it. It expires 6/28/25 or at 100,000 miles, which will probably come first, since I make several fairly long trips each year.

This car replaced a 2004 Honda Civic that I'd been driving since 2007. I am in awe of the technology in my new car. Keyless entry. Back-up camera. Passenger side camera that was originally set to turn on whenever I activate the right hand turn signal. I changed that so it only goes on when I press a button now. It tells me when I need an oil change, which is apparently every 10,000 miles, because that was how much I drove it before it told me it was time.

My sister bought a Soul two or three years ago and she absolutely loves it. Everyone I know who has a Kia loves it. I happen to be a Honda fan myself, and had long wanted a Fit and it's the perfect car for me.

[Algernon Moncrieff]

54. Historically, GM has done 5/60 when it is phasing out a brand

They did that with both Olds and Saturn.

[ancianita]

56. Good for you. I got a Tucson last fall. Hyundai has the longest warranty in America.