Evangelicals slowly turning against Trump... for the most pathetic reason imaginable.

[DetlefK]

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/08/12/trump-evangelicals-blasphemy-profanity-1456178

Paul Hardesty didn’t pay much attention to President Donald Trump’s campaign rally in Greenville, N.C., last month until a third concerned constituent rang his cell phone.

The residents of Hardesty’s district — he’s a Trump-supporting West Virginia state senator — were calling to complain that Trump was “using the Lord’s name in vain,” as Hardesty recounted.

...

Here’s what he would have seen. Trump crowing, “they'll be hit so goddamn hard,” while bragging about bombing Islamic State militants. And Trump recounting his warning to a wealthy businessman: “If you don't support me, you're going to be so goddamn poor.”

To most of America, the comments went unnoticed. Instead, the nation was gripped after the rally by the moment when a “send her back” chant broke out as Trump went after Somali-born Democratic Rep. Ilhan Omar, an American citizen. But some Trump supporters were more fixated on the casual use of the word “goddamn” — an off-limits term for many Christians — not to mention the numerous other profanities laced throughout the rest of the speech.

...

“I’ve had people come to me and say, ‘You know I voted for [Trump], but if he doesn’t tone down the rhetoric, I might just stay home this time,’” Hardesty said in an interview, adding that he has yet to hear back from anyone inside the White House after urging the president in a formal letter to “reflect on your comments and never utter those words again.”

...

For evangelicals, however, Trump’s indelicate language has frustrated religious fans who have otherwise been true blue supporters of his agenda. They agree with his social policies, praise his appointment of conservative judges and extol his commitment to Israel — often tolerating Trump’s character flaws for the continued advancement of all three. But when it comes to “using the Lord’s name in vain,” as Hardesty put it, “the president’s evangelical base might be far less forgiving.”

A lying, stealing philanderer who has never shown an ounce of decency, whose policies hurt the least among us, who stole from his own charity, who mocks and insults and attacks, who cannot even quote the Bible properly.

Evangelicals were fine with all that, but saying "goddamn" goes too far.





These f*****g hypocrites adopted this man as their champion and leader. This man, who is so amoral and anti-thetical to the spirit of Jesus Christ, it borders on the satirical.

These f*****g hypocrites INVITED the money-changer into the temple and WILLFULLY betrayed everything their religion stands for in exchange for political favors.

But saying "goddamn" goes too far.

[wysimdnwyg]

1. Was coming here JUST to post about this...

Callously separating kids from their parents - some permanently - is fine. Raping numerous women is fine. Lying to everyone about everything on a constant basis is fine. Profiting off the American people and foreign diplomats through his office is fine. Helping to destroy the environment is fine..... Oh, how I could go on. But a few curse words thrown around? Oh, that's just too dang far.

[DENVERPOPS]

30. Okay everyone take a big step back

Okay everyone take a big step back, get a reality check by taking a look at the big picture:

They will get the evangelical sheep followers back in short order..........

Okay picture this: In some small group of Republicans somewhere that are running this show from the shadows.......
(Think about it people, Trump, McConnell etc don't have the brain matter to have organized and orchestrated this. Think Cheney Rumsfeld etc? I mean really people, have you heard anything from those people since Trump got elected??????) They, or a similar group of no-gooders, all met quietly and designed this whole thing while the Clinton period delayed them: think PNAC. Anyone re-read that recently???????? Then they illegally pirated the election from Gore and Kerry with the assistance of their Supreme Court and Diebold voting machines, then they installed themselves and all took over the Federal Gov't and rolled out all their 60+ year old wet dreams one right after the other. The massive upset by Obama delayed them, but the successfully thwarted anything and everything he tried to do.

Anyway, imagine this going on right now somewhere: "they" are all gathered in some remote clandestine back room and talking: "Okay, this is about to spin completely out of control.....a complete conflagration of the "pseudo" American Democracy. We have literally shoved thru a TON of our wish list agenda these past years while we used Trump to divert the people and extremely Republican owned mass media's attention away from our skulking around in the shadows and getting things done out of public sight. We need to figure out, before we kick Trump and his entire family and advisers and appointees etc to the curb, what are the most important things we need to get done in the shadows before we lower the boom on him. What are the most important remaining items, and how quickly can we direct Mitch and the Republican owned senate to get it done, then do it. We will con Mitch to doing whatever we want and then kick him and a bunch of other Trump following Republican Senators to the curb also......."

Once that is done we can drop the bomb on Trump, tell the Republican voters that WE are the heroes for seeing the problem and acting on it, getting back our mainstream republican voters (and Trumpites). We quickly install Pence and appoint a similar politician to the VP then have him quickly replace any and all the people Trump has put into power with the ones we want for the long term. It will be months to rig the election and we then have eight more years plus of near tyranny guaranteed........We will still have the Senate, and can con the masses once again to give us the House.......Several Supreme Court Judges will be retiring or croaking, so we will be able to guarantee a full house for unanimous decisions for decades to come. We also will be able to preserve the thousand things we have already shoved thru and tons more with the use of "executive order" which our Supreme Court will uphold.......

"Of course, we will have to do this covertly with great secrecy. Clue in the secret service, the military, etc etc etc in advance
If Trump gets wind of this, he is such a narcissistic psychopath he will quickly grab the "football" and think: Okay I'll show you MF'ers to double cross me. Screw the earth and all you assholes. If I'm going down, I'm taking all you and the world down as my last great feat.

[Jedi Guy]

55. To be honest, that seems fanciful in the extreme.

Real life isn't the Political X-Files. I doubt there's a Republican mastermind out there manipulating the entire world from the shadows. Your scenario would also require that hundreds (or more) of people be in on the conspiracy. The odds of a secret being blown are equal to the square of the number of people who know about it, to quote Tom Clancy.

The more likely scenario is that Trump got into office thanks to Russian connivance (and other factors), and the GOP is taking advantage of the situation like the vultures they are. In their calculus, the damage Trump is doing to the country and the world is acceptable as long as they get what they want. This isn't surprising, since we've long known that they're ruthless, amoral assholes.

[DENVERPOPS]

58. Jedi Guy

I don't know what the X-files even are..........Seriously

Weigh the historical facts........look at Bush Sr, Cheney, Wolfowitz, Pearl, etc etc.
A hundred of them nearly got convicted or did at the end of the Reagan Period, Bush Sr. pardoned them all and brought them into his administration, then the whole group got together during the Clinton Administration and wrote the PNAC and distributed it, then they Illegally put W Bush in office twice for eight years and the above mentioned were all brought back in for his administration.
I think that he most common theme is Bush Sr./Cheney thru the entire period from Reagan years on.

I totally agree with you that the Russian/Putin aberration was merely helpful as a means to an end.
For years all of us have watched while all this unfolded.............We have said, a hundred times over, "they can't do this or that".
The full "roll out" was/is using Trump the narcissistic and psychopath to divert attention from all they have and are doing in the shadows. All this didn't just happen Jedi Guy. This has been extremely well orchestrated and implemented for decades and is just now reaching the crescendo and their efforts coming to fruition.
I remember a W Bush guy telling a democrat: we DO, and you WATCH or something like that.
In my opinion the Coup is nearly complete and the Dems can do nothing except stand back and watch.
They are trying to hide NOTHIN at this point, no need for your secrecy. They are so blatant in their actions at this point it is absurdly ridiculous.
While the world slept, (title from a past book?) would be a great book to write at this point in History.
If you don't think that "some" group engineered this all, do yourself a favor. Go up and get Project New American Century off the web an read it, written by the top end Republican group in the late 90's. ps: not a "theory", or a "conspirator"making it up.... the Repubs distributed it after they wrote it.
In my comments, I am merely speculating on how this is most likely going to play out.......Keep it in mind over the next 24 months.

[blugbox]

2. But but but

donald tRump loves the bible more than anyone!!

He said so himself! No sarcasm thingy he really did say that haha

[Wounded Bear]

5. Yeah, The Bible sells almost as well as The Art of the Deal...

Evangelicals, doing the wrong things for the "right" reasons for 2000 years.

[bearssoapbox]

3. As long as it gets even one of them to turn on him

And they vote against him

I don't give a good goddamn why they turn on rat bastard SOB.

[TreasonousBastard]

4. So, only the third commandment counts?

[TlalocW]

6. Yes, it's extremely hypocritical of them

But if it works against Trump, great. Oklahoma representative and right wing darling, Steve Largent, lost his bid for governor partly because he cursed (not even a gd) during an interview.

TlalocW

[Initech]

7. The sad thing is, they won't learn their lesson.

They'll still vote for Chump or someone worse because they would prefer to be led by a dictator than someone who embraces the values of freedom and progress. Keep digging your own political grave, evangelicals. And may you answer to Satan when it is all over.

[Vogon_Glory]

8. Orange Julius has been busting Scripture six ways to breakfast

Even BEFORE he was inaugurated and the Evangelicals are only NOW clutching their pearls and saying “Oh, my!”, and not about his horrible actions and horrible character, but about the g•d words?!!!

Surprise, suckers! That’s the sort of person he was, and is. That’s what a lot of us told you and many of us invited you to learn for yourselves before you blew us off!

You all truly are people who’d swallow a camel, but strain for a gnat!


Maybe next time you should look at a man’s or woman’s character, then prayerfully decide before voting for them instead of falling for a pile of excrement!

[ginnyinWI]

9. It's because it's proof.

It’s proof that he’s not the Christian he says he is.

All the rest can be blamed on the media or his administration. He was misled, he didn’t know, etc. He’s a poor victim of circumstances and is trying his best, they think.

But here’s something coming straight from his own mouth. Not a prepared speech. There’s no way to excuse him for saying a word that they would never, ever use. It proves he’s not one of them.

[lark]

10. This is not true of all evangelicals, just the hypocrites, which truly are way too many.

The mega church in Jacksonville is First Baptist, it takes up a huge swath of downtown and regularly has thousands of attendees. I had the tv on Sunday a few weeks ago and this was the next program. I heard the minister talk of American leaders who do not tell the truth and who live lives of sin and talk bad about people based on their race should not be supported and need to be removed because they are a blight on this country. I almost fell down I was so shocked. I called my sister because she's a believer and actually went to that church for years. She said this is the new pastor, but the old pastor totally was anti-Trump from the minute he announced his run. This is in conservative NE FL, which went Dem for the first time in 2018 since Clinton's first run for office. So, yes, there are way too many rw political evangelical churches who will support orange traitor tot, but anyone who truly believes in the Bible does not support him. That is per my sister, who was an Independent but now votes only Dem because of the danger of drumpf.

[Brawndo]

14. That's nice, but it's anecdotal

July 22 2019
tRump has 73% approval rating among white evangelicals

[link:https://www.newsweek.com/nearly-three-quarters-white-evangelicals-approve-donald-trump-1450610|

Is 27% worth your defense effort?

[lark]

16. Yes

[Brawndo]

17. Fair enough, but that minority should branch off into yet another denomination

if only to avoid damnation by association.

[Mariana]

49. You're right, they should.

"Evangelical Christians" will be associated with Donald J. Trump forevermore. And they should be, since the overwhelming majority of them voted for him in 2016, and still enthusiastically support him today. Any Evangelical Christians who don't want that association applied to them should call themselves something else. It wouldn't be the first time such a thing has been done - hardly any decent people call themselves Fundamentalist Christians anymore, because it's entirely too embarrassing to be one of those.

[dsc]

18. actually that is a drop

he was in the 80's.

[empedocles]

29. Need every vote we can get

[NewJeffCT]

21. I'm guessing that the approval rating

was in the 80s back in 2018.

In states with a big evangelical vote like Pennsylvania, 5% of evangelicals deciding not to vote can make a difference. (Not to mention, North Carolina, Florida and Georgia)

[Brawndo]

25. If that makes a difference then great

but the vast majority have shown me who they are and I believe them.

[keithbvadu2]

23. To his evangelicals/Christians, Trump is so devout

To his evangelicals/Christians, Trump is so devout

[Joe941]

40. they should loose there exempt status for that speech.

[lark]

41. What?

If you were trying to state that anything that even mentions leaders from a pulpit should be cause for a church to lose its tax exempt status, I'm a little torn. Yes, those churches that openly support a particular politician should lose their tax exempt status - I agree with that 100% and have often called for that change. Churches that talk about real morality, such as feeding the hungry and taking in the stranger; and holding our leaders accountable for their words and actions, could keep their status, in a perfect world and IMO.

[Mariana]

50. Plenty of Christian churches are preaching support for Trump as a tenet of the faith.

They know nothing will be done about it.

[Proud Liberal Dem]

11. IDC what the reason is TBH

If his support among Evangelicals is softening and fewer people vote for Trump in 2020, then I'm perfectly fine with that.

[Hortensis]

12. May seem pathetic, but it's like a little cross on a necklace

Last edited Mon Aug 12, 2019, 10:34 AM - Edit history (1)

as a first clue. It's not just a piece of jewelry. What's behind it is huge.

The outraged moral stands coworkers took on language, which was to me strictly a matter of personal style, were what finally caused me to read about what the fuck was going on in their minds. I mean, a table full of women seemed to care far more about vulgar language than child sex trafficking in a nearby city. What the hell?!

I recommend it. I thought they were changing the subject. They weren't.

For just one thing, conservatives and liberals literally see morality and our roles in and duties to society differently, leading people on both sides to leap to assumptions that the others are morally bereft. I don't admire those aspects of conservative morality that deviate from our many shared principles, but I'm now able to understand they exist and why, and even that they can have validity when properly applied.

And this sounds very encouraging! These people are realizing that trumpism and political corruption of religion has been leading them, and no doubt some of their churches, down the wrong path -- and are saying so. If the complaint seems simple-minded, well, not everyone is capable of discoursing on complex moral issues, but this is a stand everyone can state and all those like them at least feel its very broad implications.

[Wayoff]

13. I married into a very Conservative, very Evangelical Christian family.

Over the years, I have learned not to be surprised by viewpoints they have that go against Christian teachings. However, their decisions to vote for and to continue to support this idiot continues to shock me everyday. A couple of weeks ago, at a family lunch, my wife's 90 year old grandmother, looked up from the table and said that Donald Trump is a raciest and that she would not make the mistake of voting for him again. While she did receive some push back from others at the table, I told her she was right and thanked her for stating the obvious.

[FakeNoose]

33. +1000 They are getting it - slowly but surely

It seems there are evangelicals who think for themselves, when they're willing to look around. The grandmother finally gets it, and that's an awesome thing!

[Mariana]

59. Theirs is actually the mainstream Christian position.

The majority of Christian voters cast ballots for Trump in 2016. It was not just the white Evangelicals, although their support for him was and still is overwhelming. It was the majority of Christians overall.

[andym]

19. Trump has been receiving the benefit of the King David defense by evangelicals

King David was an adulterer and murderer-- actually had a woman's husband killed so he could have her. But because he stated that he loved and served God, he was considered a man of God in the bible. Just as King David served God in battle, Trump has been as well (in their minds) by appointing judges who will end abortion and non-traditional marriage. So some evangelicals compare Trump to King David-- but taking God's name in vain is direct proof to some that he does not love God, thus the loss of enthusiasm. However, Trump would have to go a lot farther to lose the majority of evangelicals-- mocking Jesus for being poor or that Trump had bigger crowds or even better saying that Trump is a better savior than Jesus might do the trick for many, but he probably won't go this far.

[Vogon_Glory]

22. King David Had At Least Some Prior Credit With The Big Guy

I don’t recall Bonespurs stepping out in the face of the Philistine Army and taking out their best known fighter with a slingshot.

These people’s judgement is incredibly flawed. I’m no fan of OT Israelite autocracy, but the ex-sheepherder could at least FAKE being righteous and look credible before he cleaned up his act!

[andym]

24. Many evangelicals think Trump is getting such credit up there right now

through his appointment of conservative justices. For many evangelicals, abortion is the key issue and a religious one at that.

[cheezmaka]

61. But they don't realize that at least King David knew how to REPENT...

which is one word that is NOT in Trump's vocabulary. He has too much PRIDE to do so which is the one thing that most evangelicals "grossly" overlook....

[Ilsa]

20. How can we get him to say "goddamn" more,

like in front of their kids? Get him to use the c word or f bomb, once again, in front of the kids?

[cheezmaka]

62. Let Pelosi continue to hold on to the Articles of Impeachment

LOL! And his Senate pals in the purple states start to worry him about what him and Mitch are doing to sabotage the Republican party.....

[keithbvadu2]

26. Like today's evangelical/religious right supporters, Trump is a Political Christian, not a Christian

Like today's evangelical/religious right supporters, Trump is a Political Christian, not a Christian of faith.

Evangelicals/religious right are easily able to spin their beliefs for political expediency.

The Donald who does not have to ask Jesus for forgiveness.

The Donald who ridicules Holy Communion.

Trump: Drink my little wine, have my little cracker

http://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2015/08/13/donald-trump-religion-serfaty-dnt-erin.cnn

[UniteFightBack]

27. This used skankbag is pissing off Americans one a time. nt

[empedocles]

28. Dems need all the help we can get. No purity tests should get in the way

[dlk]

31. There is a Special Twist to this Particular Mindset

It’s a personality disorder in and of itself.

[PatrickforO]

32. Wow. Taking the Lord's name in vain!

I knew THAT would shatter his Christian evangelical support!

[Kaleva]

34. If that's what it takes, I'll be happy with that.

[Blue_Tires]

35. Make no mistake, they'll still vote for him...

[BigOleDummy]

36. Goddamn if you're not right!

For emphasis

[ancianita]

37. Do not be surprised at all to learn that Russian money flows into theocratic organizations. Using

religion is what Putin does to solidify a theocratic base in Russia, and the Russian Orthodox Church's use of Putin increases their wealth.

So that model exists here. Believers together want a global theocratic fascism.

[Lars39]

47. "Build it and they will come"

Remember several years back on a thread about mega church buildings being built even though there wasn’t enough of a congregation to support it? Doesn’t even have to be a big church either. My inlaws helped build a small SBC church when there still isn’t even enough people to fill a trailer.
Money was flowing alright...Russian bribes maybe?

[ancianita]

48. Plausible.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

38. Big picture, though.....

....if "Goddamn" is the reason that someone who would normally vote for Trump stays home, then I say he should continue to swear up a storm.

[JHB]

39. If they stay home, great. I'll take it.

Better still that it doesn't involve trying to pander to them.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

42. Kick

[krispos42]

43. {sigh}

That's not "using the Lord's name in vain", that's blasphemy.

[UTUSN]

44. K&R

[NCLefty]

45. superstition (noun) - excessively credulous belief in and reverence for supernatural beings.

They think god won't be mad at them for supporting a horrible person who hurts people, but that he WILL be mad if that terrible person also suggests god damns people (other than all the people he totally damns to hell--for all eternity).

[VOX]

46. Here's a dose of ambivalence for evangelicals: "Merry goddamn Christmas!"

“What, I said Merry Christmas!”

[backscatter712]

51. Don't you think that God would be bigger than to get offended by someone saying "God dammit"?

The Trumpvangelicals are getting butthurt over a few swears. Isn't the great creator of the universe more mature than to get upset over a few swears uttered by a bunch of shaved apes on a pale blue dot?

If I were a believer, I'd be more upset about, well, all the other ways that Trump violates Jesus's great commandments, the Ten Commandments, and how he personifies all seven of the deadly sins.

Or if we're talking about taking the Lord's name in vain, how about Trump pretending to be religious to sucker right-wing evangelicals into playing along with him throwing children in concentration camps and ripping babies from the arms of their mothers.

THAT's taking the Lord's name in vain!

[Lady Freedom Returns]

52. If that is what it takes to get them to stay home election day....

How do we get him to say it more?

[Buckeye_Democrat]

53. Jesus f***ing Christ!

It's just an expression, evangelicals!

Taking the Lord's name in vain means the person uses their belief in God for personal vanity. Saying something like, "I declare that you are damned to Hell by my God!" would be an example.

My evangelical sister who randomly sent me a video (by text) recently about how non-believers -- like me, although she didn't explicitly mention me in the text -- will be sent to Hell? That struck me as vanity too, to some extent. (I simply replied, "Thanks for the video" because it's not worth debating her about it.)

"Goddamn" is mostly an expression of exasperation, at least nowadays.

I'm not upset that some evangelicals don't support Trump now, however!

[KPN]

54. Depressing, isn't it?

[Rabrrrrrr]

56. RevTony Campolo made a great comment (and has many times) about the hypocrisy of the religious right

(and even of some on the religious left).

I first heard him say this in 1984, but he's said it many times in sermons/public speeches -

he gives some statistics about poverty and hunger in the U.S. and works himself into a preacherly high volume and ends it with "AND NO ONE GIVES A SHIT!"

Then he takes a long pause.

"And the sad part is, most of you here tonight are more offended that I said 'shit' in church than are offended that our neighbors are dying of hunger."

That's always stuck with me, and as the GOP and the religious right have become one increasingly evil shibboleth, I see the truth of it more and more and more.

Putting kids in cages - fine. Grabbing pussy - fine. Adultery - fine. Lying, cheating, stealing, not paying contractors - fine. Being a bully, an asshole, an oathbreaker, and a bearer of false witness - fine. Breaking the sabbath, coveting, being prideful, greedy, boastful, lustful, envious - all fine.

Say "goddamn"? That crossed the line.

Asshole hypocritical fucks.

As a Christian, this is the shit that drives me up the wall.

[lame54]

57. Run an ad...

Of all the times he has said it

[milestogo]

60. For the evangelicals I know, saying "fuck" is heinous sin, but calling someone a "nigger"

is no big deal.