The Shocking Paper Predicting the End of Democracy

[JoeOtterbein]

[link:https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2019/09/08/shawn-rosenberg-democracy-228045|

Human brains aren’t built for self-rule, says Shawn Rosenberg. That’s more evident than ever.

By RICK SHENKMAN September 08, 2019

Everything was unfolding as it usually does. The academics who gathered in Lisbon this summer for the International Society of Political Psychologists’ annual meeting had been politely listening for four days, nodding along as their peers took to the podium and delivered papers on everything from the explosion in conspiracy theories to the rise of authoritarianism.

Then, the mood changed. As one of the lions of the profession, 68-year-old Shawn Rosenberg, began delivering his paper, people in the crowd of about a hundred started shifting in their seats. They loudly whispered objections to their friends. Three women seated next to me near the back row grew so loud and heated I had difficulty hearing for a moment what Rosenberg was saying.

What caused the stir? Rosenberg, a professor at UC Irvine, was challenging a core assumption about America and the West. His theory? Democracy is devouring itself—his phrase — and it won’t last.

As much as President Donald Trump’s liberal critics might want to lay America’s ills at his door, Rosenberg says the president is not the cause of democracy’s fall—even if Trump’s successful anti-immigrant populist campaign may have been a symptom of democracy’s decline.

We’re to blame, said Rosenberg. As in “we the people.”

snip

more at link

[Cryptoad]

1. They will be forced to end it,,,,

since there will soon be more POC than WASP....... Can't have POC rule.!

[Oregon1947]

30. True..once it appears imminent, goodbye democracy.

[OMGWTF]

2. I blame Republicans.

We've managed self-rule for over two centuries. Republicans had to ruin it all with their greed.

[yuiyoshida]

10. Exactly

The fact that Moscow Mitch won't let anything pass to the Senate... this country has been taken hostage, and the Republicans wants a PUTIN like government. Trump thinks he is a leader like Kim Jong Un..his cruelty will be his undoing in the end,

[DallasNE]

12. It Got Its Toe-hold Under Nixon

He started the purity test for SC Justices with Warren Burger as Chief Justice. He also ushered in his southern strategy based on dividing the races. Ford then pardoned Nixon and it has been off to the races with Republicans. You dismantle it to the point it doesn't function as it should then convince the uneducated that government can't work.

[JudyM]

36. Anyone who profits from giving donors preferential treatment in government decisions.

Self-dealing and corruption apparently rule stronger than the Constitution.

[real Cannabis calm]

3. K&R spooky stuff

[appalachiablue]

4. K & R. 'Blame the people,' I couldn't disagree more strenuously.

[Hortensis]

41. Oh, we'll clean up our act belatedly -- because we have to.

Just as our grandparents' did back in the 1930s when they'd gotten themselves into such a mess that fascist and socialist extremists openly competed for who'd overthrow and take over our government.

Biden is hardly the only leader rallying people to save the soul of America, to remember who we are and who we want to be.

I'm pretty sure we agree on most. But we have to admit that our current generations, through the negligence and foolishness of many, have collectively trashed what those who came before created and left to our care. It is our fault.

40% of all eligible voters didn't in 2016 alone. Only 1 in 6 had a disability that would have excused him or her. And then there are those who've been voting for corrupt and/or extremist candidates for their entire voting lives.

And following bad leaders is not just a RW thing either.

Populism, today's biggest danger to democracy, is anti- pluralism: it appeals to people who are angry at being outvoted and look for ways to overset popular votes and seize power. In democratic societies it is by definition extremist.

BOTH Trump and Sanders lead populist movements in the U.S., Sanders' LW universalist, Trump's RW nationalist. Both promised to try to smash the democratic electoral process if needed in order to win, a political version of shooting democracy in the middle of Fifth Avenue, and shockingly not just got away with it but were cheered for it.

And our flaws are the material people like the Kochs et al and Putin work with.

As for this article, old stuff surely? The rise of populism and other manifestations of anti-democracy movements that are threatening, and taking down, western liberal democracies like ours have been worried about around the planet for a long time now.

[Initech]

5. End of democracy? We're at the end of humanity!

When the Nazi party makes a return, and people prefer conspiracy theories to taking care of the planet, you know we're truly fucked. Just end it already.

[struggle4progress]

6. I'd still rather hear Tom Paine

THESE are the times that try men's souls. The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of their country; but he that stands by it now, deserves the love and thanks of man and woman. Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly: it is dearness only that gives every thing its value. Heaven knows how to put a proper price upon its goods; and it would be strange indeed if so celestial an article as FREEDOM should not be highly rated ...

[cilla4progress]

14. Beautiful

quote. Studied him in college a loooong time ago, but only broad sweeps of memory.

Thanks.

[Roy Rolling]

7. Really?

Nothing lasts forever in its original form. Democracy must evolve, like every living thing or institution.

But, for example, humans have billions of cells in the body die every day. Does that mean we die.

I understand the essay, but hope democracy evolves and people become more enlightened. Not turn back the hands of time.

[rpannier]

8. As a friend of mine said, "There are no more Bill Buckley's any longer"

Bill helped toss the John Birch Society from the Republican temple 60 years ago. Now, his publication, other conservative publications and their representatives cater to these people.
Their alliance with the religious reich was the camel nose under the tent

[PoliticAverse]

17. National Review (magazine which Buckley founded) opposed Trump...

(See: https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/01/standing-athwart-history-yelling-stop-donald-trump/426504/ ) but eventually jumped on board after Trump won.

[cilla4progress]

26. Is that when Bill Kristol, et al.

Jumped ship and formed The Bulwark with other never-drumpf Republicans?

[Pepsidog]

9. Powerful, astute, and grave Predictions. Read it.

[Perseus]

11. I think he is using "we the people" as a scapegoat to what right wingers have been working on

for so many years.

Yes, people have become lazy thinkers, they don't want to learn, but all of it has been slowly but surely been put into people's minds by those who have been working on getting rid of Democracy to perpetuate their place of power.

I remember when comedians used to tell the joke of "who needs to learn another language, let them learn English", it drove me nuts because I knew at the time that all they were doing was promoting ignorance. The right-wingers have always worked hard at weakening education because they understand that an ignorant people are easy to manipulate, so little by little they have weakened education, they have done things that keep kids from reading, at one time republicans wanted to get rid of libraries (was that during GW Bush?), they have pushed for easy life non-thinking programs to keep people from watching what they do to an extent that "Monday Night Football" and a six-pack have become a very important part of USA citizens life. All is done to keep people from becoming uninterested in politics, in knowing the truth of what their elected leaders do when they are watching football and comedies on TV, they have helped create a society of "lazy thinking people", they have brought a sports mentality into politics where now people belong to a political party which must win the race, regardless of the agenda they bring to the competition, its win or nothing..."Rather be Russian than a Democrat"...this is all by design.

I disagree with the article, the problem now IS "we the people", but "we the people" have been conditioned to be the problem, and it can be reversed with good politics, with campaigns to get kids to read more books, for adults to stay informed, to understand that the crooks are pulling the rag from under our feet and we are not paying attention.

Democracy CAN BE SAVED, all we need is a change in attitude to make sure people become more educated, and less knowledge lazy. We need to encourage people to learn, to feel hunger for knowledge, to reward intelligence/knowledge, to start elevating our literates to a higher celebrity status than football players, than athletes and actors, all the so called "celebrities".

It is not "we the people", it is that we have allowed our government and industry to change us for the worst. Remember when everyone was a "workaholic" and were proud of it? This was conditioning, corporations burning people by over working them, the CEOs ripping the fruits, elevating their salaries and bonuses to pornographic levels.

NO, IT IS NOT "WE THE PEOPLE", that is bullshit. Lets educate our kids well, lets promote reading books, lets promote the beauty of knowledge, then we and they, will not accept being manipulated, being told that it is great to be ignorant, we will know better. Lets promote the arts, music, etc. IT IS NOT "WE THE PEOPLE", we just allowed crooks to manipulate us, we must reverse that and Democracy will live for ever.

[SpankMe]

13. I've said this many times here on DU

The American experiment has run its course. For better or worse, allowing "elites" to run our high institutions worked right up until about the time Reagan took office.

So-called "populist" leadership is no more democratic than "elitist" leadership. The difference is that elites can actually think. Populists can only follow.

[PoliticAverse]

15. Shouldn't the title be "The Shocking Paper Calling for the End of Democracy".....

if it claims "Human brains aren’t built for self-rule".

[struggle4progress]

37. +

[EveHammond13]

16. "citizens have proved ill equipped cognitively and emotionally

to run a well-functioning democracy"

[Farmer-Rick]

18. Bull sh*t, bull sh*t, bull sh*t

It's not democracy devouring itself. It's capitalism devouring democracy. Allowing unlimited bribes in the form of campaign contributions. Allowing never ending monopolies. Allowing the Supremes to rule like kings with no restraints. No we need more democracy not rule by a bunch of stupid, over pampered, racist, trust fund baby, wannabe mobsters.

Elites are elites because of their stolen wealth and wealth in capitalism is control and power. These sad elites who can't keep their hands off our children or their guns from killing off the last of the endangered animals are not in control because of some magical mystery ability. Their Inheritance is just another word for royalty. An economic system based on capital, merely encourages criminal activity to obtain that capital.

Read some Marx he predicted all this. This writer never mentions the impact of capitalism.

We can have democracy we just have to extend democracy into the workplace, Not extend capitalism into our governance...as we have done. Dump capitalism and increase democracy, not the other way around.

[yaesu]

19. yep, democracy cannot survive under a capitalist state, fascism is the end product. nt

[jmbar2]

20. 1000%!

I think this academic is reading from the Putin playbook.

For a better alternative, please read Terry Kanefield's twitter feed, blogs and books. Also Timothy Snyder's "The Road to Unfreedom.

Snyder traces the long battle for and against the western democratic block in the modern era. Basically, Russia and China want to break up the democratic nations' block because they cannot compete against it. But they offer no better alternative, so it has to be done by turning us against ourselves.

The fight for democracy is erupting globally as young people see that it's the best alternative for the future - see Russia, Hong Kong, Sudan.

Democracy will certainly morph into variants, but I have faith that the young who want to live under democratic rule will ultimately prevail. The wild card will be technology - it can become a prison if we don't fight undemocratic applications of it as well.

[WA-03 Democrat]

29. Absolutely!

[rbe]

27. Bull sh*t

Bravo!

[defacto7]

32. You take the words right out of my mouth.

You're right on the mark.

[KT2000]

39. Was just about to say that

but you said it much better. Your last sentence is a classic!

[ismnotwasm]

21. Meh. Reading Cyberpunk showed me this.

Future is wide open

[Land Shark]

22. Democracy did NOT elect Trump; "federalism" did

And that assumes Trump was fairly elected under the electoral colege. No election contest recounts were allowed to finish, you may recall.

It is absurd to blame We the People for a decompensating President who wasn't even the choice of a majority of voters in the first place.

Don't let despair over Trump cause you to throw in the towel on democracy and allow Trump's authoritarianism complete victory. Please?!

There are many in a minority who prefer strongman rule to democracy. They have their friends in academia because anyone who thinks their ideas are better is tempted to not want to be second guessed by unwashed majorities.

[scarytomcat]

23. Thanks for posting this

[elocs]

24. As the saying goes, all it takes for evil to succeed is for good people to do nothing,

or for good people to become complacent and not remain vigilant. Too often Democrats and those on the Left have not remained vigilant, voting only when they are excited or motivated.
Meanwhile, Republicans have a long game to support their beliefs like control of the courts and they often will vote like it's their duty even when they personally don't like the candidate.

I read questions of why aren't people taking to the streets in thousands to protest but the reality is that most Americans are still simply too comfortable with the status quo to do that or to rock the boat.
Perhaps we should not be so quick to always blame others when things don't work out as we like--the Russians, those dirty Republicans--and take a look at ourselves.

Democracy may indeed end but it will not end in a vacuum.

[rbe]

25. The End of Democracy. Confirmation Bias.

Without the actual paper to review, there seems little reason to think Rosenberg took the fickleness of the public into consideration, always complaining and searching for greener grass. Is there a control group measuring stability of nondemocratic governments, where populations agitate for democracy (China, Russia, South America countries)?

Rosenberg seems to suffer from confirmation bias since today’s democracies face challenges and are noisy about it. He seems to think xenophobia and racism are signs of collapsing democracy. They are more likely symptoms of the flawed human condition and are present with all forms of government.

History can’t point to many benevolent dictatorships. Dictatorships are full of people fighting for democracy, while democracies don’t seem to be fighting to become dictatorships. It’s difficult to imagine a population that would actually prefer more restrictions on freedom.

I do agree, however, that should the US find itself an autocracy, it is our fault for permitting it.

[Farmer-Rick]

28. So insightful

"History can’t point to many benevolent dictatorships. Dictatorships are full of people fighting for democracy, while democracies don’t seem to be fighting to become dictatorships. "

[WA-03 Democrat]

31. +1000!

[defacto7]

33. It's BS. Completely twisted logic on so many levels.

[UTUSN]

40. I agree with you/defacto7 - here's the core of the contradictions:

********QUOTE********

.... Thanks to social media and new technologies, anyone with access to the Internet can publish a blog and garner attention for their cause—even if it’s rooted in conspiracy and is based on a false claim... ....

... Now that people get their news from social media rather than from established newspapers or the old three TV news networks (ABC, CBS and NBC), fake news proliferates. ... ....

The irony is that more democracy—ushered in by social media and the Internet, where information flows more freely than ever before—is what has unmoored our politics, and is leading us towards authoritarianism.

**********UNQUOTE*******

So which is it, our brain not suited for democracy or the internet/social media? Given that it's a byword that we still have reptilian roots in our brain, the artificial little old internet will disappear in a nano second as an influence if the mechanics are gone. And as for the heightened venue of conspiracy theories/lies/and ignorance fueled by the social media, it works the other way, too, that those things can be *exposed* just as easily. I'm willing to entertain the "brain" theory.

[The Wizard]

34. Marx and Melville

predicted the decline of capitalism in their 1850 writings. Marx posited the idea that capitalism left unfettered would devour itself. In "Moby Dick" Melville used the metaphor of sharks on a feeding frenzy eventually devouring each other until the spices became extinct.
Nietzsche predicted Democracy's failure because the general public is too stupid to govern itself.

DEMOCRACY FOSTERS TYRANNY
"The same new conditions under which ... a leveling and mediocritizing of man will take place [i.e. democratization] -- a useful, industrious, variously serviceable, and clever gregarious man -- are in the highest degree suitable to give rise to exceptional men of the most dangerous and attractive qualities.

The collective impression of such future Europeans will probably be that of numerous, talkative, weak-willed, and very handy workmen who require a master, a commander, as they require their daily bread; while, therefore, the democratizing of Europe will tend to the production of a type prepared for slavery in the most subtle sense of the term: the strong man will necessarily in individual and exceptional cases, become stronger and richer than he has perhaps ever been before -- owing to his unprejudiced schooling, owing to the immense variety of practice, art, and disguise. I meant to say that the democratizing of Europe is at the same time an involuntary arrangement for the rearing of tyrants."

Source: Friedrich Nietzsche, Beyond Good and Evil, Paragraph 242

[qazplm135]

35. there's always a small coterie of misanthropes

sometimes liberal, sometimes conservative, but always ready to both predict the doom of man and how much man oh so much deserves it.

[Falcata]

38. +1