Has the definition of socialism changed in recent years?

[Poiuyt]

I understood the basic definition of socialism to mean that the means of production and distribution of products is owned by the government. The Republicans have long used it as a pejorative for any liberal as it has connotations with the old Soviet Union (at least to an old timer like me). This has really taken hold since Bernie Sanders described himself as a Democratic Socialist.

Lately, I've been hearing Democrats also referring to the left wing of our party as socialist. I like to think of the progressives as those who want to see government as being the vehicle to provide for a better society—the strong help the weak, the healthy help the sick, the rich help the poor. A society is best when all are strong. But I don't consider myself to be a socialist. I don't think any Democrat wants to see the government take over all businesses, though I think some industries are more effective when they are run by a central government.

Of course, we shouldn't be concerned about labels, but as long as words are able to elicit an emotional response, then we should pay attention to how they are used.

So, has the definition of a socialist changed recently to be anyone who wants government to help the little guy?

[secondwind]

1. I think the GOP sprinkle the word "socialism " and "socialist "

liberally in their speeches, yet deep in their hearts they know that Democrats are just as capitalist as they are — but there are many ignorant people out there who are afraid of any type of “socialism”, even though we have plenty of it already.

[rampartc]

2. no, socialism is still anything government does to help the "little people."

just as it has been for my lifetime.

[lastlib]

3. As they do with everything, GOPhers have twisted it and....

deformed it to try to fit their view of the world. It has become just any policy right-wingers don't like---pure and simple. They Do. Not. Want a better society where the strong help the weak, the healthy help the sick, the rich help the poor. For them it's survival of the fittest--Spencerian Darwinism. That is all.

[pnwmom]

4. No, the definition hasn't changed. Some progressives confuse Democratic socialism with the

Social Democracies of the Nordic countries, but they are well-regulated capitalist countries with strong safety nets -- not socialist countries.

What is Democratic Socialism? (From the website of the Democratic Socialists of America)

https://www.dsausa.org/about-us/what-is-democratic-socialism/

Today, corporate executives who answer only to themselves and a few wealthy stockholders make basic economic decisions affecting millions of people. Resources are used to make money for capitalists rather than to meet human needs. We believe that the workers and consumers who are affected by economic institutions should own and control them.

Social ownership could take many forms, such as worker-owned cooperatives or publicly owned enterprises managed by workers and consumer representatives. Democratic socialists favor as much decentralization as possible. While the large concentrations of capital in industries such as energy and steel may necessitate some form of state ownership, many consumer-goods industries might be best run as cooperatives.

[DBoon]

6. either we own them or they own us

That is how I would describe it

[Bavorskoami]

7. Why describe Social Democracies by using a definition of Democratic Socialsim?

The Nordic countries that you reference are, as you say, "well-regulated capitalist countries with strong safety nets -- not socialist countries." So I would not use a definition of Democratic Socialism to describe them. It is, IMHO, a widespread mistake to confuse Democratic Socialism with Social Democracy. You call the Nordic countries Social Democracies and point out that they capitalist so let's use a definition of Social Democracy such a found in Wikipedia: "Social democracy is a political, social and economic philosophy that supports economic and social interventions to promote social justice within the framework of a liberal democratic polity and a capitalist mixed economy." Many Americans would love to have a political and economic framework like some of the European social democracies, so let's not misidentify them as socialist, because that falls into the Republic framing.

[pnwmom]

9. I am not. I am CONTRASTING them. I gave the definition from the Democratic Socialists

to show that they still have a conventional view of what socialism is -- and that is NOT what the Nordic countries practice.

[safeinOhio]

5. Socialism is the new

Communism. It got wore out.

[EarnestPutz]

8. Years ago I read that socialism, in it's broadest sense, was defined as any time...

.... that society undertook to be responsible for some need that all or part of its members had at that time. This would include veterans health care, the highway system, bailing out banks and paying death benefits to those killed on Sept 11th.

[pnwmom]

11. Maybe so, but that's not the dictionary definition.

From dictionary.com

Socialism
noun

a theory or system of social organization that advocates the vesting of the ownership and control of the means of production and distribution, of capital, land, etc., in the community as a whole.

procedure or practice in accordance with this theory.

(in Marxist theory) the stage following capitalism in the transition of a society to communism, characterized by the imperfect implementation of collectivist principles.

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/socialism?s=t

[EarnestPutz]

17. Like I said, this was years ago. The word "socialism" has evolved....

....but the word itself suggests something done by society, not the government. My comment was meant to be a contrast to today's dictionary definition and to suggest that those who equate it with Communism's ownership of everything by the state are overstating even your dictionary definition.

[Xolodno]

10. Well..the definition of Capitalism hasn't changed either, yet....

...we still call ourselves capitalist and don't fit the definition. And every time we try to move towards it, things get worse.

[Humanist_Activist]

12. As an actual Socialist, posts like this make me want to slam my face into my keyboard...

please actually read up on what Socialism actually is and not rely on Boomer-era cold war propaganda?

[Lucid Dreamer]

13. It doesn't matter what YOU think the definition is.

And it doesn't matter what the dictionary says it is.

What matters is what actual voters think socialism is. There are many voters that are in the range that could be converted from trump voters to the Blue side... IF they understood the policies without labeling them socialxxx. That is a turnoff for many, especially older voters that anything socialxxx means USSR/China/Cuba of the '60s.

If the Dem candidates can't communicate policy attractively to them, kiss them goodbye.

[pnwmom]

18. I agree with you that it's a wrong label to use. And the dictionary agrees with us.

Socialism is still socialism, according to the dictionary.

[Lock him up.]

14. Republicans are for 'Socialism' to benefit their richest donors only.

Tax breaks, fiscal loopholes (their biggest contributors not only pay zero taxes, they also get gazilions in returns).

Minimum-wage workers can eat their socks...

It's been that way since Reagan.

[elocs]

15. Socialist/socialism are the Communist/communism of today, they are scare words because that works.

Rightly or wrongly, words do have meanings for people but we come across as condescending when we lecture people about how they are wrong in what they believe words to mean rather than explaining what we think is right.
It's easy to be dismissive, but that's not helpful.

[malaise]

16. Some folks deliberately distort the meaning

There are fundamental differences between Democratic Socialism and Marxist socialism.

[pnwmom]

20. There are fundamental differences between the capitalist Social Democracies,

the Nordic countries Bernie's always pointing to, and Democratic Socialism.

According to the Democratic Socialists of America, this is what Democratic Socialism is:


https://www.dsausa.org/about-us/what-is-democratic-socialism/

Today, corporate executives who answer only to themselves and a few wealthy stockholders make basic economic decisions affecting millions of people. Resources are used to make money for capitalists rather than to meet human needs. We believe that the workers and consumers who are affected by economic institutions should own and control them.

Social ownership could take many forms, such as worker-owned cooperatives or publicly owned enterprises managed by workers and consumer representatives. Democratic socialists favor as much decentralization as possible. While the large concentrations of capital in industries such as energy and steel may necessitate some form of state ownership, many consumer-goods industries might be best run as cooperatives.

[malaise]

21. I disagree - there are differences between Social Democracies and

Democratic Socialist societies but the differences aren't as stark as those between Marxist socialism and Democratic Socialism

[pnwmom]

22. Those social Democracies are well-regulated capitalist countries with strong safety nets.

They aren't socialist countries and they don't purport to be.

[Proud Liberal Dem]

19. Socialism seems to have become a casual "smear word"

the same way "liberal" became a pejorative term. Seems that when the GOP want to make progressive policies look extreme or "out of step" or "tyrannical" with the Public, they just call them "socialist". I think that it has some racial undertones as well.