I Agree With Joe

[NanceGreggs]

The Republicans will have an epiphany after Trump is gone. It won’t be a realization that they’ve been dishonest, have acted contrary to the Constitution and the rule of law, have sold out their constituents and their country in order to protect a traitor – they already know all of that.

What it will be is a realization that their party brand has been tarnished beyond all recognition, and that the only way to rid themselves of Trump-stink will be to demonstrate that they are reasonable people who have the best interests of their fellow citizens at heart.

Needless to say, that’s going to be a monumental task. Trying to return to the talking points they once touted as defining the GOP is going to take a tremendous effort – if it can be done at all. How do you promote yourself as the party of fiscal responsibility after you allowed Trump to balloon the deficit? How do you call yourselves the party of Christian values after you supported imprisoning migrant children?

How do you get back to being the party of law and order when you’ve supported a “pResident” who has consistently defied the law? How do you convince the citizenry that you’re the party that protects national security when you’ve enabled a “pResident” who has put that security at risk for personal political gain?

Once Trump is out of office, the only way the GOP can try to resurrect its image as the Grand Old Party will be to pretend that the Trump “pResidency” was an aberration, a time when they temporarily lost their collective minds and who have suddenly come back to their senses with his departure.

Yes, the Republicans will have an epiphany – not based on an honest refutation of Trump’s disastrous policies, nor prompted by an acknowledgement that they enabled and supported those disastrous policies. It will be the epiphany that their party’s survival will depend on acting in a bipartisan manner with Democrats on issues their own constituents
want resolved through cooperation and compromise – issues like immigration reform, affordable healthcare and education, along with re-establishing our standing in the global community by strengthening our ties with our allies.

The Republicans really have no choice. Continuing to adhere to Trumpism after the lard-ass is out of office is a lose-lose proposition, and paying lip-service to the Trump-humpers would only continue to tarnish the GOP brand. The only road to survival for Republicans will be to demonstrate their willingness to reach across the aisle and further an agenda that serves the citizenry AND their own constituents, rather than serving a lying idiot who has demonstrably attempted to destroy the underpinnings of our democracy.

With the demise of Trump and the election of a Democratic president, the GOP will be doing back-flips in order to show that they are the honest brokers they once pretended to be. How many people believe them will be interesting to watch.

[guillaumeb]

1. The GOP worships power.

There will be no epiphany, only a conversation about how to better steal elections and disenfranchise voters who do not back the GOP.

[NanceGreggs]

3. Both parties have to play ...

... on the national stage, not the Trump-humpers-only stage.

Exactly what is the upside in Republicans continuing to promote the agenda of a "pResident" who has been rejected by the voters?

Will the GOP continue to be dishonest brokers? Of course they will. But the only way they can survive as a party will be to advance the issues important to their own voters - and that means compromise with the Democrats under a Democratic president.

[guillaumeb]

18. As we both know, turnout is key.

If only 52% of eligible voters actually voted in 2016, those who did vote are the only voters who mattered.

And the GOP, while a failure at governance, is good at motivating and turning out their base.

So it is still possible for the GOP as it currently exists to "win" elections as long as they can disenfranchise and demotivate sufficient likely Democratic voters.

[Hestia]

25. Yes they will continue to be dishonest brokers. Voters elected PBO twice, and the GOP was getting

started, stating that their election was a mandate, screw the rest of us out here to didn't vote for one of them. We really come out to vote in 2016 yet GOP keeps pointing out the mandate. Now we are past 2018 election but that was a once off; same with 2019 election and the only one who's mentioned all the states who turned over their State Houses was Rachel.

They most certainly have the MSM in the their back pocket and the only thing they have going for them is that they look good in HD makeup, weren't around to even know political history and tsk tsk about how Baby Boomers thought 30 years ago.

The only way to "promote their agenda" is for each and every member of the GOP in DC is to quit, walk away, and start building houses with Jimmy Carter or the like. That will be the ONLY way.

[Scarsdale]

47. Surely you jest?

No gop member will ever "build houses with Jimmy Carter". They do not have a single member with any empathy for the poor or working class citizens. Backing the total disaster that is tRump shows just what they are made of. Selfish and ignorant just like their orange mistake. Look at how many of them are "retiring to spend more time with family". Scared of being whipped into siding with Moscow Mitch in defending the indefensible. They KNOW what a disaster he is, yet they do not have the courage to represent their constituents, so they will walk away. Cowards of the first order, the entire group. If tRump is removed, along with Panty-ass Pence, will Gym Jordan or Gaetz be their next mistake as president? The gop OWNS this disaster, and all the destruction he has brought to the USA and worldwide. I have nothing but contempt for any republican.

[lastlib]

12. And how better to "enslave" the working class...

...so that next time they don't arise and put up roadblocks on the superhighway to serfdom.....The corporate masters will demand this of them, and they must do their bidding.

[guillaumeb]

19. True. As Frank Luntz once said,

the GOP does not want to see people vote. They need only their base to vote.

[Scarsdale]

48. "base" being

the operative word.

[guillaumeb]

55. Indeed.

Their base is indeed base.

[DinahMoeHum]

2. Pardon my Latin, but. . ."GOPus Delendus Est"

The GOP Must. Be. Destroyed.

[NanceGreggs]

4. I agree.

But watching them destroy themselves is absolutely delicious.

[bdamomma]

9. And that day

will come when they deny all the acts that this POS has committed. I want to see them all go down. They need to pay for their sins and they what have done to the country.

[Hoyt]

5. I'm fine giving them a chance once trump is gone and we hold Prez, House and maybe Senate.

If they don't make an effort, fine. We'll still be in a better position to make them listen.

[NanceGreggs]

6. Oh, they'll 'make an effort'.

Not because it's the right thing to do, but because it's the only way to salvage what's left of the GOP's reputation.

[Garrett78]

7. Except that the GOP has been rotten to the core for 50+ years. Trump didn't happen in a vacuum.

Trumpism made Trump possible, and not the other way around.

Republicans will survive, aided by a tyranny of the minority system. They'll just move on to Trump 2.0, a smarter and more charismatic asshole.

[Ilsa]

8. What frustrates me is that MF45 will stay in the news, via tweets, etc,

Unless his ass is in prison. He's going to keep his maggats worked up.

[bdamomma]

10. if this

POS goes down his cult will go down too. Just like Charlottesville social media will splash their faces everywhere.

I keep Congressman Cummings in my thoughts.

[NanceGreggs]

11. He'll be too busy ...

... spending his days in court, fighting the charges against him in the SDNY.

In the meantime, the MAGATs will be on to the next shiny object their party dangles in front of them.

[LiberalLovinLug]

38. I tend to agree with Ilsa

He's always busy with this or that suit (either against him or spurned by him)

I think Trump is a special case. He is not like W Bush, whom, after worshipping him for eight years, they conveniently didn't even invite him to the GOP convention following Obama's win. They manage to be able to selectively erase not only facts, but ex-Presidents as well, if they are starting to have a stink on them. We even have the present day President badmouthing the Bush family openly.

But I think Trump is a different kind of animal. He is a cult leader. He will not give up his followers without a fight, and they him. He is the shiniest biggest great white hope they have ever had, and that now that they've had a taste of such extremism, they will never be satisfied with a stand in. At the very least, some new shinier, younger, smarter, racist, sexist, fascist will need Trump's endorsement. Trump will continue to hold great sway I fear with a large chunk of the populace. He will tweet even more. He will maybe start his own Trump network with help of sympathetic billionaires like the Koch brothers. I think even if he is in prison it will only help raise his image as some kind of American cult hero.

[Tarheel_Dem]

13. K&R

[Hermit-The-Prog]

14. the cult and the mechanisms behind it will not end with Trump

[Garrett78]

20. Trumpism made Trump possible, not the other way around. And it will outlive Trump.

As I wrote in post #7.

[brettdale]

15. When Trump is gone

The GOP will say "Trump an independent/Democrat" ran for the republican party and won in 2016.

Faux News will then say the experiment of the Republican party to allow a democrat to run for it, will
never happen again.

[Mr.Bill]

16. They just learned in Kentucky

that being a total asshole is not the way to get elected any more. The asshole era is over.

[Gothmog]

17. I also agree with Joe

[Stuart G]

21. I like this paragraph especially...

....Yes, the Republicans will have an epiphany – not based on an honest refutation of Trump’s disastrous policies, nor prompted by an acknowledgement that they enabled and supported those disastrous policies. It will be the epiphany that their party’s survival will depend on acting in a bipartisan manner with Democrats on issues their own constituents........

___________________________________________________________________________

In addition, I do think that the Republicans are going to.........yes this is the word........apologize.... for protecting and supporting Trump. Over and over again, we will hear the cumulative apologies of the liars and enablers of Trump. The apologies will be disgusting, since now they are not doing anything to stop the tyrant/asshole. You are correct about the GOP doing "back-flips" in order to show that they the "honest brokers"..instead of total assholes and enablers. It will be a sickening show as they try to save their party.

........I think that .."new blood" and "new faces" will come along and disavow those that supported Donald Trump. They will look different, and they will talk different, but they will be exactly the same awful scum that the previous scum was and is. And after a while, there will be no difference between the old and new Republicans. A classic reference is due to honor an author of different age and time..

George Orwell wrote a book called "Animal Farm." At the end of that book, (easy read) I recall that you couldn't tell the pigs from the humans. They were really the same. When this is all said and done, we will not be able to tell the "old Trump Republicans" from the.."New Republicans" They will all look and sound the same, because they are the same.

[LiberalLovinLug]

39. Dont' forget the "If I had only known at the time!" (the extent of Trump's crimes)

[Karadeniz]

22. I'm not sure they can be redeemed as they now are.

[Raftergirl]

23. The GOP

is the Trump Party now. It will never get rid of the stench.

[SterlingPound]

28. Nor should America let them

[tirebiter]

24. I heard what Joe said as something of threat

They can surf the blue wave or get slammed on the reef

[Alpeduez21]

26. The lazy lying steaming pile Hump

Is a symptom of the disease called republican. This mythical reformed decent republican is merely a white whale. An obsession which chasing it will only lead to our destruction. Vote blue like your life depends on it in every election until Roy Moore doesn’t win a primary. Until Gym Jordan is not considered a leader of the party. Until sexual predators are not considered lifetime judges. Until gerrymandering is a thing of the past. Until taxing the rich makes sense. Until corporations are not dependent on gov’t handouts to support their employees

I seem to remember repukes saying they needed to reform after Obama won. Look what happened. That are lying racist scum. That will never change. Believing anything less is dangerous

[drray23]

27. I have the same analysis.

I completely agree. As soon as Trump is gone they will be falling all over themselves to try to appear reasonable again. Of course, they will attempt to hinder the democratic agenda by suddenly becoming the party of fiscal conservatism again. I am pretty sure however that if Biden gets elected we would end up with a bipartisan immigration bill. This was already agreed upon before Trump gummed it up with his stupid wall and xenophobic policies.

[flying_wahini]

29. I hope that the majority of Republicans are THAT smart.

Somehow, I don’t think so.

[BlueTsunami2018]

30. No they won't.

They were supposed to have one after W but they just got worse. I see them continuing to double and triple down on this tendency. Their base has gotten so extreme and insane that they have no choice. I don’t see Limbaugh, Hannity and their ilk ever having an epiphany and coming back to reason and they are who the base follows. Remember, Palin was Тяцмр first and some other “charismatic” (to them) person will come along and pick up the mantle. This is who the rank and file of the party is and anyone trying to temper this sort of behavior will be shunned. The Republicans are scared to death of their base. That’s why none of them will stand up in the face of obvious corruption and even flat out treason coming from the “leadership”. The base loves this shit.

[NanceGreggs]

40. I'm not talking about ...

... Hannity or Limbaugh. I'm talking about elected Republicans. They can't continue to sit on their asses and do nothing for the sole purpose of opposing Democrats.

Think of the obnoxious, lazy guy at the office who never gets anything done. When he realizes upper management is watching him, he suddenly starts working hard, meeting deadlines, getting along with coworkers. He doesn't start being a good employee because he thinks it's the right thing to do - he does it to keep his job.

Republicans lost heavily in the 2018 mid-terms, and will continue to lose in upcoming elections. Even dumb-ass Republican voters want action on their behalf - and will vote out those they see doing nothing for them.

Republican office-holders don't have to be decent employees - but they DO have to act like they are if they want to survive.

[jalan48]

31. Joe's mistaking the symptom for the problem IMHO.

[Garrett78]

41. I agree, and that puts us all at risk.

Anyone who thinks there are "many really good Republicans" is living in an alternate reality. It's vital that we recognize just how rotten that whole party is, and has been for decades.

We didn't call it Trumpism before Trump, but that ideology or way of being is what made Trump possible. Not the other way around.

Trump is merely the inevitable result of 50+ years of increasingly cruel and unhinged rhetoric and policy. A monster was created. That monster is the Republican Party and the Republican Party base. Not Trump.

The next version will be smarter and more charismatic. We best be ready.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

54. That's exactly what Joe is doing and it's very dangerous.

Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[Dem4Life1102]

32. Not sure about that

This is not just about Trump. He is not the cause but the symptom of 30 years of Rush, RW talk radio and FAUX News.

[CentralMass]

33. The republican party is corrupt down to its core. Their rabid right wing media and the billionaires

that fund them won't allow any decency.
If they lose they will just double down and block anything the democrats attempt pass. Compromising with that pack of jackals is nothing that I support.

[Nitram]

34. I disagree with Joe. Republicans have proved they have no principles, no values, no balls,

no intellect, no understanding of history, no understanding of the constitution and our system of government, and no shame. At all. They always think they are right and everybody else is wrong. They will NOT have an epiphany, unless you think deciding that they lost because they weren't conservative and loony enough is an epiphany. The same one they've had every time they've lost an election.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

51. THIS!! Joe is flat-out wrong on this, which is another reason he won't be the Democratic nominee.

Voters will not buy what Joe is selling.


Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[uponit7771]

35. K&R, They did such with George Bush ... they act like he never existed. The M$M takes the bate

[ck4829]

36. January 21, 2021 will be the day that dissent will become patriotic again, it turns out the POTUS

ISN'T selected by God, that it will be OK to question the government, that the deficit will matter again, job numbers are all fake, etc.

[Perseus]

37. Wishful thinking Nance, they can't do any of the things they should to try to clean their reputation

I want many of them to disappear from public view for ever, Graham, Jordan, Nunez, King, etc...too many.

They are evil inside, they will continue their vitriol, it is the only thing they can do. Even without trump, I believe they owe Putin a lot, they have been compromised and they cannot get rid of that invisible jail ever, so I don't have any expectations they will behave better than they have, I actually expect them to continue their evil ways.

[spooky3]

42. Nothing will change until the GOP voters stop approving of

And voting for them. Then, all of a sudden, they will reconsider some plans.

[Scarsdale]

43. I just read that

many repubs. plan to tune out the hearings, say they do not keep up with reports. Isn't it their JOB to keep tabs on their leader? What WILL they be doing then, plotting to defend the indefensible? I bet all of these clowns watched every second of the Clinton bj fiasco. Now that their dear leader is accused of extortion, everything is brushed off. The gop never fails to "live down" to their reputation of attracting the least intelligent representatives.

[Nasruddin]

44. I used to believe in the tooth fairy

Also 1 Corinthians 13:11

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

52. Wait, you sayin' there's no tooth fairy?! What's next, no Santa Claus too?!

Last edited Mon Nov 11, 2019, 05:16 PM - Edit history (1)

Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[kentuck]

45. If they were smart....

they would join with the Democrats and impeach his sorry butt. That would be the best bet for them.

[RobertDevereaux]

46. The GOP, that walking stinking corpse, is already dead..

... and they don't know it.

Bury them in eternal solitary confinement, never to rise again.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

53. Yup, nothing wrong with "beating a dead party"...why recessitate it?!

Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[dsc]

49. delusional flat out delusional

The GOP got massacred in both 2006 and 2008. Close to 2/3 of the House was Democratic, 59 Senators were Democratic, and Barack Obama won the largest percent of the vote and the largest margin of victory for a Democrat since LBJ's reelection. And just what did the GOP do? Literally on the night he was Inagurated they met to plot how to best not cooperate. If we win, it won't be with anything like the margins we had then.

[Hortensis]

50. Sure hope that's the case. We know a lot of nice cons who want that,

and at one time I was sure they would never let it get this bad. Oh, I always knew it could happen here, but believed it never would. On the plus side are those nearly CEOs of nearly major corporations, many conservative, who lead a business-world rejection of the Republican leadership's extremist goals.

But then there are the others, the kind of conservatives we're careful not to discuss politics within hearing of AT ALL these days, not unless we want to spoil everyone's fun by causing eyes to sharpen and glitter with malice and barely contained hostility.

But it's their intensely ruthless leaders we have to watch, the really bad actors: what they manage to hold together and get away with. They're much too close to success to just give up. If they think they have no choice, their first actions will be to do whatever they have to to create some. If enough conservatives block them in that, they will appear to die but plot and spread underground like poisoned kudzu waiting to spring up and take over again.

“Maybe you do not care much about the future of the Republican Party. You should. Conservatives will always be with us. If conservatives become convinced that they can not win democratically, they will not abandon conservatism. They will reject democracy.”

“Democracy is a work in progress. So is democracy's undoing.”

― David Frum, Trumpocracy: The Corruption of the American Republic