I find it interesting that Germany has only 2 serious / critical cases out of over 7,000 infected

[Quixote1818]

They have had 17 deaths but these mortality / critical numbers are extremely low. Germany is not a young country: https://www.statista.com/statistics/454349/population-by-age-group-germany/

The US number of critical cases is very low too at just 12 out of just under 5,000 though there have been 93 deaths. I believe a lot of the deaths were in Washington State when it swept through a nursing home.

Italy's numbers of those in critical condition and dying is very high but I know their population has a very high number of elderly. Almost 4,000 deaths / in critical condition out of 27,000 cases. Yikes! That is 15% critical / death combined with a death rate of around 7%

So Germany's serious / death rate is .28%. US is 2% in serious condition of having died (combined) Italy 15%

If the German / US numbers hold up (I know a lot of the US cases may not have had time to become critical) That would put the death rate close to a regular flu type death rate. Unless the numbers just are not accurate.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

Editing to include this article:

How come fewer people are dying from COVID-19 in Germany than elsewhere?
At a press conference last Wednesday, Prof. Dr. Lothar H. Wieler, President of the Robert Koch Institute in Berlin said, "From the beginning, we have very systematically called upon our doctors to test people."

He added that the German system can provide "testing to a high degree so that we can easily look into the beginnings of the epidemic."

Wieler also explained that this is just the beginning for Germany. "If you imagine an epidemic like a curve [...] then there are countries that are simply further" into the progression of this epidemic.

He expects the case numbers and the numbers of deaths to rise, just like they have in other affected countries.

The professor noted that Germany is exchanging information with other countries to learn about the development of the disease and is collaborating on concepts to contain the pandemic.

"As long as this epidemic continues to affect our country, it will take months, certainly, perhaps years.


More: https://www.euronews.com/2020/03/13/coronavirus-why-does-germany-have-so-few-covid-19-deaths

[Igel]

1. The numbers may not be accurate.

That's a cop out, of course, the easy way to say, "Nothing to learn here."

There's another take. Germany's cases have only really taken off in terms of numbers in the last 12 days or so. Death often takes 20 days. So the low death toll may just mean that the majority of the cases haven't been active for long enough to end in death.

This would produce the prediction that in the next 5-6 days Germany should see a steady and fairly rapid increase in the numbers of dead. (Not a happy prediction, but one that would falsify the hypothesis that the time course is responsible for the current low death rate and not anything specific to Germans, Germany's health care system, or the strain of virus that's spread in Germany).

[Quixote1818]

2. However, France, the UK and Spain have much higher mortality rates

and I believe the virus was kicking into those countries about the same time as Germany. Actually, Germany has more cases than those countries so more time to grow probably.

[Aquaria]

3. Some of it may be because Germans are more likely to practice

A form of social distancing. They are not as touchy-feely as, say, the Mediterranean populations.

Furthermore, if they're anything in the old country like their descendants are here, they're fanatical about cleanliness. My mother was constantly impressed with how clean so much of Germany was when she stayed there for a couple of months.

In our predominantly Texas German town of Fredericksburg, my son and I were leaving a party and saw the local city employees washing out the public trash cans at 3 a.m. And I'm not talking some hoses and dumping out the water, but scrub brushes and massive amounts of soap at work. My son and I went back to see if they would be doing the same thing around a similar time the next month, and there they were, washing the trash cans again.

We're lucky if they empty trash cans here in San Antonio, and Fredericksburg routinely washes theirs.

So this clean mania + less touchy-feely may help in keeping their numbers lower.

[uponit7771]

5. +1, We lived in Germany for 6yrs, my mother was constantly floored at old women sweeping the allies

[Spider Jerusalem]

4. Your math is way off

US death rate is 1.96%.

Germany's is 0.2%.

https://percentagecalculator.net/

[DFW]

6. One other thing to consider with Germany

Because of the traditionally crappy climate here, hospitals and clinics are used to treating lung ailments. Maybe the widespread experience with this has helped nationwide.

There are several severe cases where the norm just hasn't held. A co-worker of my younger daughter is 31, contracted the virus, and is now in a coma on life support.

Another DUer turned me on to a syndrome I wasn't aware of, which might explain why a small number of healthy younger people can be in acute danger from the virus BECAUSE of their otherwise perfect health. https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=13100840

I will be going into the center of my small town outside Düsseldorf in a few minutes to see if our usual three-times-a-week farmers market is manned. After every market session, the town sends in a cleaning crew to wash down the town square (where the market is held). An hour later, you wouldn't even know it had been there. The cleaning is that thorough.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

7. The Farmers' Market in my town doesn't have to hire a cleanup crew.

We have squirrels, raccoons, pigeons, and seagulls.

If only they ate the plastic bottles and cups.

(it's still too early in the year for our farmers market. I hope it opens as scheduled, hope the "peak" is in the past by then.)

Best of luck to your daughter's colleague.

[DFW]

8. In our town, the city pays for the cleanup

I'm sure the cost is covered by the fees the market stalls pay to the town to set up. They are open year round, and people still show up there no matter what the weather. Traditions that are 800 years old don't die out quickly.

Thanks for my daughter's colleague. No further news on that end. He was one of the unlucky ones. Maybe he was affected by the syndrome detailed in Laelth's thread on the Cytokine Storm. We just don't know anything for sure.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

10. 800-year-old market tradition? So, this corona-virus is nothing, ...

... compared to that 14th-century bubonic plague.

[DFW]

11. No "throw out your dead" calls from the town crier, if that's what you mean. Not yet, anyway.

Last edited Tue Mar 17, 2020, 12:52 PM - Edit history (1)

The town I live in used to be what was considered a substantial metropolis in the 13th and 14th century. Over 1000 people living here, 1500 at the height. It was exactly half-way between Paris and the southernmost cities of the Hanseatic League, so geography played a major role. We have a castle in back of the house with a small moat and a cornerstone (added later) with the year 973 (no "1" missing) listed as the first citing of it.

There is a small stream near here called the "Düssel." Where it flows into the Rhein, a small village was founded there, also about 800 years ago. As the Rhein Rivier traffic grew in importance, and the land traffic to the Hanseatic league grew less tedious, the village on the Düssel ("village" in German = "Dorf" ) became a settlement of major importance, even though its name never changed from Düssel Village (in German: Düsseldorf).

[crickets]

13. Thank you for sharing stuff like this; it's fascinating. nt

[DFW]

14. After all this time here and being married to one of the friendlier natives

It is easy to forget that it is not common knowledge.

To someone from San Antonio, the history of the Alamo is something he or she has known from the third grade onward. To someone from Düsseldorf, it's spellbinding history from a faraway land.

[Amishman]

9. germany is not reporting severe cases and deaths the same way as everyone else

they split out deaths directly from corona from deaths that occur while infected with corona.

They are also very aggressive with testing (similar to S Korea) and identifying more of the mild cases.

They also have a lot of recently infected, and this takes a while to kill.

[Maru Kitteh]

16. That makes more sense, not their reporting method, but the discrepancy. nt

[DFW]

12. We just had two more deaths here overnight

Both were men, one born in 1936, and the other in 1940, and both were already suffering from serious ailments.

If you can read German, here is an update from this morning:
https://www.merkur.de/welt/coronavirus-deutschland-nrw-berlin-bayern-tote-infizierte-news-merkel-spahn-grenzen-covid-19-sars-cov-2-zr-13600553.html

[Captain Zero]

15. Let him BLABBER; HE IS LOSING THE Soap Opera vote

Right now. People social isolating and many want their soap operas. He is fucking with that RIGHT NOW.
HAHA.