When discussing what Trump may or may not do to stay in power, could we just scrape one

[Atticus]

popular scoop of pure BS off the table?

Let us, please, not waste time debating whether there is ANYTHING that is so "extreme", "over the top" or "lunatic fringe" that Trump would not at least attempt it. The Constitution; statutes; long-established customs and traditions; notions of morality---religious and secular------none of these have ever stopped Trump from doing whatever he deemed necessary to get what he wanted.

And, now, he has the added motivation that, if he loses power, he will likely face indictment and prosecution for innumerable crmes.

So, could we please dispense with the "But, he has no authority!" line of "reasoning"? Let's move past the false premise inherent in that.

[ProfessorGAC]

1. Um, No?

Just because he skated on the impeachment trial doesn't mean the whole Constitution is null & void, and that there aren't people who will enforce the !was.

[DonaldsRump]

2. Not so sure about that anymore

And I'm a lawyer.

Right now, the Senate, the Supreme Court, and the US Attorney General, as a well as Fox News and around 43% of the electorate, will let Trump get away with pretty much anything.

There has NEVER been a time like this in our country where the checks and balances are no longer there.

A year ago, I might have agreed with you. I don't now.

I frankly have no idea what these monsters will do next. Several people will likely go to prison if Joe Biden becomes President and appoints the Attorney General etc. The stakes for Trump and the Rus-publicans to do everything they can to win this election are astronomical.

[ProfessorGAC]

7. Lawyer or Not, I Still Disagree

Not taking shot at you personally. Despite all that has happened, I don't believe he'll do it.
If I'm wrong, I'll admit it, but assuming nothing can stop him seems defeatist to me.

[DonaldsRump]

8. Do what?

What exactly do you know that he is going to do? You don't and neither do I.

Anything is possible now.

[DonaldsRump]

9. Great, so now we are going to suspend the writ of habeas corpus?

and allow detentions without legal process?

https://www.democraticunderground.com/10142453060

This is exactly the point. We need to be prepared to have everything thrown at us until and after November 2020.

[Mr.Bill]

16. And that is the major difference

in Trump, and, say, Nixon.

There are many others who are enabling and are complicit with Trump. Enough people drew the line with Nixon to stop him. As I've said here many times, though, we are where we are at now because Nixon did not die in prison.

[TwilightZone]

3. There are plenty of things that are impossible that will always remain impossible.

It's not a false premise. It's an understanding of how the process works, what the Constitution says, and what precedents exist and how they were determined.

You may not care about facts or the details, but others shouldn't have to give lip service to things that simply aren't going to happen, such as Trump unilaterally cancelling the 2020 elections. It's just a pipe dream and monumental waste of time.

We should not waste time and effort on it when there are bigger fish to fry, like winning in November.

[DonaldsRump]

4. Nobody is saying that we shouldn't do everything we can to win in November

The point is we will have to fight like hell to win, far more than "normal", as there is no "normal" anymore. That's the fundamental point.

[TwilightZone]

5. The premise of Trump's ultimate authority is false.

He quite certainly does not have the authority to cancel the 2020 elections. Stating that is not a false premise. It is a fact.

[DonaldsRump]

6. The OP does not say that Trump will "cancel" elections.

Perhaps it's implied, but everything is implied in the OP, as there is no normalcy left. I fundamentally agree that. Anything is now possible where there are no checks and balances. Which is precisely there were supposed to be checks and balances.

The point is nobody knows what these folks will do. The stakes are much, much higher as people are going to prison if Biden wins.

[Atticus]

10. As long as there are those willing to characterize an insistence that we deal with reality

as "not caring about facts", we will have wedges driven into what should be united opposition.

No one of which I am aware is advocating doing anything less than all we can do to defeat Trump on the November election. But, to ignore the possibility of there not BEING a November election or of selected populations or polling places being "quarantined" is to stick our heads in the sand and simply hope that all goes well.

[meadowlander]

18. Whether or not something is possible is separate from the question of whether or not someone

will try to do it.

Is it possible to go up in a balloon and prove that the world is flat because there is no curve? No. But someone still tried to do it.

I think the OP's point is that regardless of whether or not it is possible to cancel a US election, Trump may still make the effort.

[onenote]

11. No.

If he has the power you say he has and believes he can do anything, here are some things he would have done: "fired" Ginsburg, Sotomayor, Kagan, and Breyer. Announced that the 2018 elections were invalid and that the House was still under Republican control. Forcibly shut down CNN, the New York Times and the Washington Post and arrested dozens of journalists.

Since you think the Constitution isn't an impediment and that he intends to stay in office indefinitely, what has stopped him from doing these things?

[c_junk]

20. You've just described...

A possible (probable) series of tRump moves beginning Nov 4, 2020...

If the election isn't delayed by President, for the good of the country of course.

[onenote]

21. why hasn't he done so already if he can.

His won/loss record at the Supreme Court in cases in which the administration was a party was 12 wins and 10 losses in 2018-19 and 12 wins and 11 losses in 2017-18. He let the House impeach him (sure he was going to be acquitted, but why would he allow it to even get to that point if he had the power to do so?

And I don't think you know the meaning of the word "probable."

[rampartc]

12. trump is the type who will do whatever, wether he has authority or not

and will then drag it out in courts (to which he has appointed the judges) for as long as necessary.

if he decides to cancel the election and appoint himself de facto president for life, there is nothing that congress can do to stop him.

[kentuck]

13. He will do whatever he can get away with.

It doesn't matter what the laws or traditions are.

[Tennessee Hillbilly]

14. Trump is a big coward

He may try to do various vile evil things, but he's already backed down a number of times when he saw opposition building, and he'll do so again. He's proven that he's a big coward.

[mercuryblues]

15. You are right

There is nothing, absofuckinglutey nothing trump won't stop at to maintain in power. There is no one in government willing to rid us of that meddlesome president. I suspect we will have to win the election by 20%, to squeak out a win. There will be hackers for trump. Straight D down the ticket, get rid of as many R's in office as possible.

[zaj]

17. True, but... without an election

Pelosi likely becomes President. So I'm sure we'll get an election.

[alwaysinasnit]

19. At one point I, too, thought there were limits but I think we have reached the point where there

are few if any limits left to what this monster might try. But it is not so much the monster in the WH, rather it is Moscow Mitch and Barr who are the true sources of evil. Like the medieval aristocracy, they prop up the puppet in the seat of power because they can use him to retain power and influence. Without his enablers, tRump is just another nasty con man.

Moscow Mitch has been busy packing the courts with like-minded judges so I don't think we can count on the judiciary, in any real sense, to uphold the Constitution.

[0rganism]

22. people seem to think he'd have to cancel the election to stay in power

ignoring 3 possibilities where he doesn't cancel the election yet stays in office:

1. (likelier than we'd prefer to think) he WINS the election outright. never underestimate the effect of the appearance of strong leadership during a crisis. long term, his support will become stronger as a result of our current situation. the longer it lasts, the more it will grow, as long as he behaves like an authoritarian strongman.

2. he prevents congress from certifying the results of the election through use of strict quarantine emergency declarations (long shot, to be used if the results are a landslide against him)

3. he contests the results (viable if the election is close), after shutting down the courts. so we'll just have to wait it out. meanwhile, he'll just stay in the job as a favor to us all.

[Stuart G]

23. There is one powerful force we have not seen, that could stop Trump. Republicans who believe in

the Constitution and the U.S.A.

...I know it sounds ridiculous, but some Republicans in power and some who are highly respected that are not in power, could stop him. I didn't say they will, but they could. If Trump tries something so "extreme" and clearly.. "illegal", that power could join us to totally stop Trump.

...Let's say 20 to 25 percent would join in the fight to save this nation, then Trump would not succeed. It is hard to imagine that 20% would join us in any kind of unity coalition to stop the "extreme" behavior, but if Trump goes "over the top", he will lose a lot of support. It may not seem so now, but I believe that many Republicans are upset with Trump. He is just too much.

...The impeachment was not enough to shake them loose. But an illegal take over of power, or a cancelling November's election will enrage those who have a sense of patriotism over Republicanism. They are there, and will join us.... Yes, that will shake them loose to save this country. It doesn't seem like they are there, but they are. And Trump's behavior has alienated more than we can imagine. He will not succeed, if he tries to stay in power illegally. Yes, they will help us fight to save the Constitution and this country. I sure hope we do not have to fight that fight, but we will see, and time will tell.