"now do u still think it was just a flu?"

[babylonsister]

Borrowed from a friend: if you know of anyone who compares covid to the flu, this might be helpful.

This is a very clear, understandable explanation of why we cannot “open back up” right now.
Let me introduce myself: I am a practicing ER doctor with a Bachelors degree in cell and molecular biology/genetics and a Masters degree in public health in addition to my doctorate.

COVID is not a flu. Not even a little. Here are reasons why:

1. It is a separate species. It is no more like influenza than you are like a hippo. DIFFERENT SPECIES.

2. It is an airborne virus. This means the tiny droplets can stay in the air for a full 2 hours. So if a person coughed in aisle 4 of Target 1.5 hours ago, they may be home now but their covid cloud is still hanging there just waiting for you to walk by and take a breath.Kind of like when someone in the bean aisle farts and walks away, the smell stays in the Mexican and tomatoes aisle when the guy is all the way over in frozen foods. But you go to pick up a can of kidney beans for tonight's chili, it hits you in the face like a fastball. Influenza is not an airborne virus. It is droplet spread- meaning someone has to directly crop dust you with their sneeze to get you sick. Covid is much more contagious.

3. Covid is more virulent. Virulence factor is a measure of how catchy something is. For example, the flu is like beer. It takes a bunch to get you drunk. Covid is more like tequila - A little goes a long way. You need to suck up a lot of flu particles to actually catch the flu; with covid, even a few particles is enough to infect you.

4. Covid has a longer incubation than the flu. When you catch the flu, you typically get sick in the next 1-2 days. This is awesome because it means you stay at home while contagious because you feel like a heap of fried garbage. Covid has a blissful 5-9 days of symptom free time during which you are well enough to head to the movies, gym or mar-a-lago while also being contagious enough to infect everyone you encounter.

5. Covid has a longer duration of illness than flu. With covid, you have a 5-9 days of blissful asymptomatic contagiousness. This then turns into about 1 week of cough and overall feeling like hell but still surviving. Week 2 is when things hit the fan and people end up unable to breathe and on a ventilator. Many stay on the vent for up to 15 days. 5 days incubating+7 kinda sick days + 15 days on a ventilator makes for 27 days of virus spreading illness, (assuming your don’t just die of massive asphyxiation and body-wide collapse from overwhelming infection somewhere in that last week). The flu has an average incubation of 1-2 days and sick time of 7 days for a total of 9 infectious days. In the world of deadly viruses, that 18 extra days might as well be a millennia.

6. Covid is more deadly. A LOT more deadly. The flu has about a 0.2% mortality rate, meaning 2 of every thousand people who get sick with flu will die. On the contrary, the death rate from covid is reportedly 2%, so 10 times more deadly than flu. Ten times more death seems like a lot more death to me. Whats more worrisome is that 2% is actually incorrect because it doesn’t usually kill kids so that skews the average. With covid, age is a major factor in survival. If we don’t include people under 30, the death rate for adults is on average 4.5%. 9 out of every 200 adults that get this will die from it. Do you know 200 adults? Do you think losing 9 of them is no big deal? Since mortality increases with age in covid, the risk gets worse as you get older so if we put 100 grannies in a room with covid, only 85 would make it out alive to make pies and tell great stories of the old days... and that just sucks.

I hope that helps to clarify why covid is in no way a flu, why you are in no way a hippo, and why staying home is the only way for non-essential people to do their part while I spend my days at work covered in a plastic poncho, sucking air through a stuffy respirator mask, leaving my scrubs in my driveway, showering the covid off at 4am when I get in, and thinking to myself “now do u still think it was just a flu?” as I risk my own life with my face 2 inches from their highly contagious, gasping mouth while I slide the plastic tube down their throat and start up the ventilator.

- Dr. Peter Tippett

[blitzen]

1. and, Did 31 NYC cops die of the flu in the past month? n/t

[SheltieLover]

2. If at this point, people still believe this is "the flu," and I know maggots do,

they are as willfully ignorant as their dear leader. And they appear unable to realize that by encouraging them to gather in groups, dump is encouraging them to jump right up there on that sacrificial alter to protect his reelection chances. 😳

While I am sure many are proud to identify with the pos, Karma has and will continue to prove them wrong.

It's infuriating that these morons are terrorizing & endangering sane people while disrespecting health care workers & everyone's right to isolate to remain healthy. 🤬

Even more infuriating is that these asshats are not being locked up & charged with domestic terrorism!

[CaptYossarian]

6. Since he was short by 3 million votes last time,

how can he pull off another second-place victory by killing off his supporters this time? You'll notice the 8 governors who didn't declare Safer at Home were all Republican. And so are the ones who closed their states and want to reopen them too soon.

His mind must always be on golf--where the low score wins.

[SheltieLover]

7. Who needs voters when Parscale is managing hackers?

Lol dump liking a game where the liw score wins. And he has to cheat at that, too. 🤮

[CaptYossarian]

11. He didn't have to cheat while playing with Lindsay Graham.

Lindsay made sure the woods were full of his balls.

[SheltieLover]

13. LOL

📣Karma if you are listening...

[Bernardo de La Paz]

3. 7. Covid-19 leaves many survivors with long term organ damage. . . . nt

[SheltieLover]

17. This!👆

Absolutely!

When I read that ICU cases often need kidney dialysis "for months" after discharge, I had to wonder whether that means for life? This has only been happening here for a few months.

So they will, most assuredly, in all their arrogant denial, reopen schools in the fall. I fear for our future generation(s) that they will suffer severe, permanent health damage from such concentrated exposure.

And without bothering to test, test, test, not to mention validating the Chinese contention that there have been at least 30 mutations, as that would not find favor with shitstain.

[Haggis for Breakfast]

37. Additionally, many people who do recover

will live with respiratory illness for the rest of their lives. The scarring of the lungs will leave massive damage to the alveoli - which are the breathing sacs at the end of the bronchioles.

[malaise]

4. And

you are not separated from your family leaving them to die on their own when you have the flu

[LuvNewcastle]

35. I think that is the worst part about this disease.

You go to the hospital and die without any visits from family and friends. All you might have is a nurse with you, and that is no replacement for loved ones in your last hours. I hope effective treatments and vaccines are found soon.

[bucolic_frolic]

5. People are not obeying masks

Saw 2 at the post office this week, no masks. Just want to run from them.

[CaptYossarian]

8. Did they lick their finger to count their money?

Ask them if they have a next of kin.

A well-timed fake cough works too. Even if all they have is one working neuron, they can still think.

[bucolic_frolic]

12. I had one of those a month ago

Then handed me my change. I barely touched it, and put it in the corner of my wallet, haven't touched it since. Never go back there.

[CaptYossarian]

15. I've seen clerks sticking a finger between where their teeth used to be.

So I've kept little bottles of hand sanitizer in both cars ever since (about 15 years now).

[bucolic_frolic]

16. Good advice, CaptY, thanks /nt

[MoonchildCA]

9. I'm in California.

I had to go into our tiny little post office a couple days ago. There is not even room for social distancing, and the employees, whom you stand 3 feet from at the counter, were not wearing masks.
Crazy!
I also had to go into Target and Trader Joe’s yesterday, and only half of the employees, at the most, wore masks. It’s so frustrating. They are endangering the public.
All people working in jobs that serve the public should be required by law to wear a mask.

[SheltieLover]

19. grocery workers here in TN

wearing masks like necklaces. and no soc distancing. 🤬

[not fooled]

29. Yesterday I went out

had to go to the dentist for an emergency + necessary shopping. Went to dentist + Costco in a California city ~60 miles from the CA-AZ border, then AZ stores just across the border.

CA dentist + Costco: everyone wearing masks, generally maintaining social distancing, store personnel doing the same + cleaning carts before usage.

AZ (SW AZ, deep red maggot territory) 3 stores, 1 restaurant for takeout: only ~1/3 of shoppers wearing masks, almost no store personnel wearing masks in 2 of the 3 stores, many not wearing masks in the 3rd; no longer cleaning carts in any of these stores (they were the last time I shopped, ~2 weeks ago); NO restaurant personnel (saw ~5 people so a pretty good sample) wearing masks when I went in to pick up my order (after seeing that, I won't go there again until there is a vaccine).

Bottom line: CA still taking this seriously but the particular corner of AZ I visited is throwing caution to the winds and embracing death-dealing donnie's recommendation to just ignore the situation. Clearly, his urging is seeping in to the maggot consciousness.

[mwooldri]

10. Regarding #2 - I thought it was a droplet spread virus.

Like flu, but obviously not the flu.

So I looked... https://www.who.int/news-room/commentaries/detail/modes-of-transmission-of-virus-causing-covid-19-implications-for-ipc-precaution-recommendations

From this WHO document, I interpreted it to say "both". Seems in medical close contact settings it's airborne - and why medical staff interacting with patients directly need the N95 masks. But in more distant applications it's more droplet spread. Hence if one sneezes in that Target store, droplets may end up on that can of kidney beans. Thus infection transfers from can to hand - and if hand touches face - into the body. Hence no face contact and wash hands.

Otherwise everything is accurate as far as I can tell.

[bucolic_frolic]

14. Early March I had a sneezer in Walmart

As I always do, I stopped breathing, turned on my heel, and went in the opposite direction. I think i've avoided many a cold that way. I did get a sore throat from this one, and thought omg this is it, but it went away in 36 hours.

[gibraltar72]

18. It has a longer incubation and intubation.

[Javaman]

20. do you have the link? thanks nt

[WePurrsevere]

21. So far the only article by Dr Peter Tippett that...

I've found about COVID 'so far' is this one and while it bares some similarities, and is worth a read BTW, it's not the same.
https://caremesh.com/blog/2020/4/8/saving-your-health-one-mask-at-a-time

While it may just be that I'm not finding the original by him yet, this may very well be just your basic internet meme that uses bits from a real article and a real name to lend credence but has extras added by an unknown author or ten.

[Moostache]

22. K&R for truth!

The madness surrounding this thing is infuriating...and 2-3 weeks from now, when we are all worse off because of the actions of dipshits with no scientific knowledge or understanding and only $$$ flashing in their dead, soulless eyes, I won't take any comfort in saying "WE TOLD YA SO...", I'll just be further saddened that MORE innocent lives will be ended that did not be so.

This is literally fucking madness...

[IronLionZion]

23. There are vaccines for flu strains and people have built up immunity over the years

so with H1N1, it was kids who got it hard while adults fared better. Quite the opposite with COVID-19, which has also mutated several times already.

[AtheistCrusader]

25. Specifically people over the age of 60.

H1N1 got around in the late 1950's, so the elderly actually had pretty strong residual antibodies.

We got lucky there.

Edit: My mistake, H2N2 was the 1950's pandemic, but may have resulted in later immunity or partial immunity to H1N1 in the 2009 outbreak among 60+ year old victims.

[denem]

28. H1N1 got around in 1918.

The 'Spanish Flu' was a H1N1 swine flu.

[AtheistCrusader]

31. And in 2009.

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/pandemic-resources/pandemic-timeline-1930-and-beyond.htm

April 17, 2009: A new H1N1 virus is detected in the U.S.
CDC begins working to develop a virus (called a candidate vaccine virus) that could be used to make vaccine to protect against this new virus.
April 25, 2009: The World Health Organization (WHO) declares a public health emergency of international concern.
June 11, 2009: WHO officially declares the new 2009 H1N1 outbreak a pandemic.
2009: CDC begins a complex and multi-faceted response to the H1N1 pandemic which lasts more than a year.
2009: Physicians use point of care rapid immunoassay tests to provide influenza results within 15 minutes during the H1N1 pandemic
October 5, 2009: The first doses of monovalent H1N1 pandemic vaccine are administered.

There are commonalities in some subtypes that appear to confer immunity.

In 1957, we lost about 100,000 people to H2N2.

1957: A new H2N2 flu virus emerges to trigger a pandemic. There are about 1.1 million deaths globally, with about 116,000 in the U.S.

If it works in one direction, it's fair to assume it works the other way as well.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4871858/
"The phenomenon of heterosubtypic immunity was elegantly demonstrated by Schulman and Kilbourne in a murine model of influenza infection. In mice infected with a H1N1 strain and subsequently challenged with a lethal H2N2 virus, they observed a reduction in viral titers in the lung, lung pathology, and mortality (21). They remarked on the early reduction in viral titers despite an absence of antibodies, suggesting that protection may not have been mediated by neutralizing antibodies. Since then, studies in multiple animal models including NHPs have reproduced this observation (22–25) noting reduction in viral load, lung pathology, weight loss, and mortality, but not infection. Investigation of the immunological mechanisms in animal models revealed the role of CD8+ T-cells and CD4+ T-cells in mediating this cross-protective immunity (26, 27)."

It is not known for certain why people over the age of 60 fared well in the 2009 H1N1 outbreak, but this is the most-suspected reason.

Edit: My mistake, I DID say H1N1 got around in the 1950's, and that was not correct. It was H2N2, but H2N2 exposure is suspected to have resulted in antibodies that also worked against H1N1 in 2009.

[wnylib]

43. H2N2 pandemic was not limited to 1957.

A second wave came in 1958, which is when I caught it (8 years old) and nearly died from it.

When H1N1 came around in 2009, I read that those of us who had H2N2 in the 1950s had some degree of immunity to prevent us from having the cytokine storm reaction that younger people experienced. I worked with the public at the time and often handled money. Did not get so much as a sneeze during that period.

[Mariana]

24. Your number 3 is wrong.

The virulence of a microorganism is a measure of the severity of the disease it causes. So, Covid-19 is more virulent, but not because it's easier to catch, but because when you do catch it, it's more likely to make you very sick or kill you.

[AtheistCrusader]

27. Good catch, terms have meaning. It is ALSO more contagious.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/tarahaelle/2020/04/07/the-covid19-coronavirus-disease-may-be-twice-as-contagious-as-we-thought/#736e588b29a6

It already had an R value higher than most flu's, before this likely revision.

[StClone]

33. As is (in the OP) speaking of virus as having "species."

I do not know of any experts using the word species to define virus variants, mutations, strains or types. There are four basic types of viruses called, for convenience, families and different individual types are often just labeled virus.

Species is a term specific to living organisms of somewhat definable units of high genetic similarity. Virus may be a third form of being (living, non-living and virus) and are non-living biologically dependent, and life affectable, and more akin to nano-machines than life and not divided into species (even though Linnaeus system used the the term species to denote even mineral types).

[KY_EnviroGuy]

26. Thanks for posting. Here's another very good article by the same doctor....

Saving Your Health, One Mask at a Time
Published on April 7, 2020
Peter Tippett MD PhD

Read it here: https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/saving-your-health-one-mask-time-peter-tippett-md-phd/

There, he does a great overall review of personal safety techniques and risks with lots of credible references.

I found his Twitter page and ran across that article here:

Link to tweet

Will be sending the text of your post to friends. Thank you!


KY.........

[cab67]

30. On point 1:

We're more closely related to hippos than coronaviruses are related to influenza viruses.

A better analogy would be "coronavirus is no more like the flu than humans are to starfish."

[TreadSoftly]

32. Thanks for the bolding. Is this all still correct?

I went looking for the original (have only found one FB post like it) & found one from March 28.

Has anyone seen anything that contradicts this, since it's nearly a month old?

(I saw posts here correctly for "severity" (good catch) and also the very important comment about organism landing on can thus creating risk of "can to hand" -- thank you, DU authors!)

[Pepsidog]

34. Great post Babylonsjster. I almost always love and agree with your posts which are some of the most

informative and best written on DU. Thanks.

[orangecrush]

36. Kick

[flying_wahini]

38. Check out this graphic I found on Weather.com. EWWWWW!!!!!

[link:https://weather.com/health/coronavirus/video/3d-model-shows-cough-spreading-germs-inside-a-store|

[C Moon]

39. I was hearing that A LOT in March, but not so much anymore.

[Demovictory9]

40. k&r

[Blue Owl]

41. K&R

[jimmyzvoice]

42. Where did you get this list? I would love for my local newspaper to print this.

Newspapers often print editorials from other newspapers. I would love to be able to direct my local newspaper where to "borrow" this editorial and print it in our local paper. This list needs wider circulation than just DU.