Penn State doctors: 30-35% of athletes with Covid-19 have myocarditis, even asymptomatic ones

[Johnny2X2X]

https://www.centredaily.com/sports/college/penn-state-university/psu-football/article245448050.html

Even asymptomatic. Know this, athletes competing right now are in danger and they're only doing so for Trump's political needs.

1/3 have an inflamed heart. No idea what that means long term, but they should not be completing for months.

[at140]

1. I was infected on a Carnival cruise ending in March 2020

And my heart is working better than ever. I had dry cough for 2 weeks then went away by itself.
I do treadmill 6 days/week. Right now I just checked my heart rhythm with a stethoscope,
and it sounds steady and strong. BPM = 60. That is a good athletic heart for a 80 year old me.

[uponit7771]

5. So does thus mean the study is not true?

[localroger]

9. It means YMMV /nt

[at140]

13. Any study is never meant to cover 100%

There are always exceptions. I simply stated my personal experience. For what it's worth.

I have no reason to doubt that some people are affected in heart, some in lung damage, some in liver.

Keep in mind 2.5 Million Americans die EVERY YEAR from various diseases and accidents and suicides.
All fatal diseases are terrible. Hear disease, liver disease, cancer, Aids, TB, Yellow fever, Diabetes, Ebola, Sars, Plague, etc
are all killer diseases. Covid-19 death rate is lower than most of above horrible diseases.

https://www.drugs.com/slideshow/deadly-diseases-1248

[brush]

16. The report did say 35%. That figure will certainly cause some athletes to opt out of playing.

The conferences did the right thing to postpone fall football.

[JanMichael]

46. Problem is that it is a shit-ton more contagious.

So while the rate is lower - keep in mind - the number infected is astronomically higher.

Sounds like you are trying to play down the danger. Nice work.

[Pathwalker]

27. You're not a Penn State athlete.

[at140]

28. I am just another human and was positive for covid-19...2 things in common

with PS athletes.

[Nevilledog]

2. Why aren't we seeing info on how many non-athletes are having this damage?

[Johnny2X2X]

3. There have been studies

This one is going to generate buzz because it makes clear that athletics shouldn't be occurring right now.

[Blue_true]

36. Doctors in Germany saw heart disease in 70% of a group that was examined.

They had tested positive.

Long Haulers are reporting problems with racing heartbeats and some with inflammation of the heart muscles and in tissue around the heart.

[Nevilledog]

37. TY

[BannonsLiver]

4. Wasn't a similar study recently debunked? Seems like there's mixed signals.

[Johnny2X2X]

6. No, it wasn't debunked

Just taken with a grain of salt because the numbers were closer to 75%. And there have been several studies all showing a much higher incidence of this in Covid-19 patients than in a healthy population or what you'd see from other viruses like the flu.

These are highly trained college athletes, 1/3 who've had Covid-19 had inflammation in the heart, that's a big deal and enough to shut college sports down IMO. It's a matter of time before athletes start dropping dead in practice or on the field of play.

[BannonsLiver]

7. Ah this is what I was thinking of. Totally different deal, apparently.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.al.com/alabamafootball/2020/08/how-a-cardiologist-may-have-saved-the-college-football-season.html%3foutputType=amp


The Minnesota-based cardiologist leads the Windland Smith Rice Sudden Death Genomics Lab which studies, among other things, sudden death in young athletes. He explained to the Big 12′s leaders that a new myocarditis study in the Journal of American Medical Association that sparked panic across college sports didn’t have the “bandwidth” to be transferable in a useful way. The study, conducted in Germany and composed of middle-aged adults, found that 78 percent of the 100 participants had some cardiac abnormality. Ackerman said it’d be a “scientific foul” to infer that those findings are relevant for 18 to 24-year old athletes.

[brush]

18. They'll not measuring the same age demographic. Certainly not young athletes who depend on their...

bodies to perform much more physically than sedentary, middle-aged adults.

Those two studies are not comparable.

[BannonsLiver]

19. Yeah, two separate things

[greenjar_01]

8. It's one doctor saying this, and he seems to be referring to an unpublished report

"across the Big 10."

It would be interesting to to see a formal study on this.

[Johnny2X2X]

10. There have been several studies all showing elevated instance of myocarditis

Myocarditis is really rare and is not a chronic condition so there's no reason people should have it.

This is a real concern, that we don't know a ton about yet. Could end up being no big deal and athletes just need to rest for a few weeks, but it also could cause long term damage that ends their athletic careers or lives.

[empedocles]

11. This should create a ripple of concern through the football world - for openers

[greenjar_01]

12. I'm interested in seeing a study on what this doctor is claiming informally in the chat

with the State College Area School District Board. He clearly states that in MRI tests of COVID-19 + athletes across the Big Ten, 30% ended up with cardiac inflammation sufficient to be considered myocarditis. That's a jaw-dropping claim, but obviously, somebody is keeping track of and aggregating this data across institutions, and pushing it out to stakeholders (like the athletic medical director at a member school). These are mostly public institutions, so all that data, disindentified, should be as available as professor salaries.

Interesting, in any case.

[Kid Berwyn]

14. It is what it is.

Thanks, Putin.

[Stallion]

15. I Believe this is Why 100+ college players Have Opted Out

they get the Covid diagnosis-- talk to medical professionals-- and decide its not worth the risk. This number will continue to skyrocket as it has in recent days

I really believe most teams have had been 10-50 cases already and it will increase as the players are involved in more contact drills/games.

I also believe several schools may be well on their way to herd immunity including Clemson, Alabama, Texas Tech and OU and I'm not sure we can discount that it might not be intentional in at least some cases. Hell Clemson had almost 40 cases before they began hitting drills

[Mersky]

17. Athletes w/myocarditis will be able to safely return to sports after 3-6 months!

From the Aug 10 article linked in the OP’s story: https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/29633697/heart-condition-linked-covid-19-fuels-power-5-concern-season-viability

People can get myocardial inflammation, feel fine and never know it, Drezner said. He said most athletes who get myocarditis will be able to safely return to sports after a restriction of activity for three to six months. But he said that in some cases, the inflammation can turn to scar tissue and put the patient at risk for an irregular heartbeat that can lead to sudden cardiac arrest, which can be triggered by exercise.

- Dr. Drezner, director of the University of Washington Medicine Center for Sports Cardiology

___

Three to six months out for those with heart inflammation!

Despite a different doctor’s equivocation quoted at the end, I found this ESPN article rather informative. Even that doc said those diagnosed with myocarditis should sit out 3-6 months. With the potential of so many athletes experiencing myocarditis - including asymptomatic ones - how are colleges going to sufficiently control for this hazard? Will sports departments be motivated to fully identify those positive for COVID 19 if a high percentage of the roster has to sit out, with or without symptoms? Why put that decision on teams and universities? Ethically and logistically, it just doesn’t add up to a decent way to conduct college sports of any sort this fall.

Thanks to tRump’s stupid dictatorial ways, is another grim reality of living in a country without a proper national pandemic response in place. I can do without his bread and circuses for one season.

[crimycarny]

20. Myocarditis also caused by flu and rhinovirus

While I’m not dismissing this report, myocarditis can be a side effect of other respiratory viruses as well. It usually heals on its own in healthy people.

I’m not saying this is something to shrug off. It could be that Myocarditis is more common with COVID than other viruses, but it’s not something unique to COVID.

I’m just tired of all disaster porn our news media loves to feed us. Yes, this is concerning but I wish the news would report in a less “the sky is falling” fashion.

[Johnny2X2X]

21. It's a big deal when caused by other viruses too, just a lot more rare

http://dailyorange.com/2020/09/mayo-clinic-doctor-advises-myocarditis-risk/

Basically this doctor thought the risks of athletes getting myocarditis were low, but in patients that are shown to have it it's a huge deal and they should shut down for at least 3 months. Now that we know a significant portion of healthy athletes show myocarditis I wonder if he'd change a few of his answers in this.

[crimycarny]

25. Again--not dismissing it

I’m not dismissing or minimizing this at all. I have a D1 athlete so this obviously concerns me. But there is just so much we still don’t know.

In the meantime I’m glad fall sports were cancelled and I hope to h*ll we have a treatment soon.

[Johnny2X2X]

26. normal prevalence of this is 10-20 cases per 100,000 people

This is something with Covid-19 that makes it 2000-4000 times more likely to get this heart inflammation.

[crimycarny]

31. But have has there been this much scrutiny?

Since COVID is a novel virus there is a lot more scrutiny. Is is possible myocarditis happens more than we know but since it’s not necessarily super obvious, especially in athletes, it was never checked for in cases of flu, etc. I don’t know, but neither do scientists yet.

All I’m saying is I’m grateful that our scientists and doctors are on top of this, but I’m also going looking forward to more data.

[at140]

29. 15 X more people will die in US from something else in 2020 than covid-19

2.5 million people die every year in US from various diseases. Not just temporary inflammation of heart muscle,
but the ultimate result...death! So why is diabetes still allowed to grow? Why cigarettes are still legal? Why air pollution
allowed to exist? Why Americans are the most obese nation on earth? Where are government Ads educating Americans
on the very bad health problems due to obesity?

Here are 7 diseases which are much more lethal than covid-19.

https://www.drugs.com/slideshow/deadly-diseases-1248

[FakeNoose]

30. You've mentioned several things that have nothing to do with this

This is a discussion about a highly communicable, potentially fatal VIRUS. Therefore diabetes, air pollution, cigarettes, obesity, and a hundred other things are completely irrelevant.

[crimycarny]

33. at140 has a point

Many of those diseases at140 lists are the same pre-existing conditions that make someone more likely to die of COVID. In fact, that could be why our death rate is so much higher per capita than other countries.

COVID is a sign of things to come, IMO. The encroachment of humans on animal habitats means more cross over diseases. The healthier we can become in general, the better we’ll fare when the next “COVID” hits.

Global warming plays a part too. All of these things are connected. So dismissing them and laser focusing on COVID only is a mistake.

[at140]

39. Intelligent reply...thank you for deeper thoughts

instead of knee jerk reactions.

[LanternWaste]

45. Or instead of simplistic anecdotal evidence resting upon on a post hoc ergo propter hoc fallacy.

"instead of knee jerk reactions."

Or instead of simplistic anecdotal evidence resting upon on a post hoc ergo propter hoc fallacy.

[Dem2]

32. WTF?

I feel like I ventured onto Facebook.


We've had 200k-250k "excess" deaths over normal, why on Earth are you attempting to change the subject?

[crimycarny]

34. How many of those excess COVID deaths are due complications from some of those other diseases?

India has a much larger popular than the US. 1.19 billion versus 311 million. There are parts of India that are 10x as dense as NYC. Places where social distancing is impossible. Yet India’s COVID death rate per million is 49 whereas our death rate per million is 566. US ranks 5th worldwide in obesity, India is 185th.

To ignore the systemic problem of obesity and other underlying conditions in the US population means we’ll continue to have high death rates. Period.

[Dem2]

35. You're kidding right?

You're also trying to deflect from this crisis, discounting how rates are reduced in the US also as we've learned how to treat it?

I question your motives.

[crimycarny]

40. YOU'RE kidding, right?

Whose trying to deflect from the crisis? Where in ANYTHING I wrote am I trying to “deflect” from the COVID crisis? I’m saying we need to guard against tunnel vision. If we look solely at COVID and ignore those pre-existing conditions that are greatly increasing the risk of death from COVID the we aren’t doing our utmost to reduce those deaths.

My husband is a perfect example of the point I’m trying to make. About 5 years ago he was diagnosed with Type II diabetes. Typical American shitty diet, lack of exercise, overweight, the whole 9 yards. The doctors wanted to start him on insulin immediately. He refused and instead did a complete 180 in his lifestyle (something I had been trying to get him to do for years). He started eating much healthier and started walking. In 3 months his A1C went from 13 to 6. That’s a massive drop from severely diabetic to normal.

5 years later he’s maintained his healthy lifestyle and his normal A1C. ALSO 5 years later we’ve got COVID. If he had not changed his lifestyle and reversed his diabetes he’d be extremely vulnerable (he is 62).

So spare me the “deflection” crap.

[at140]

49. See #47

[at140]

47. crimycarny is simply trying to inject reality and facts,

is how I am seeing it. Instead of attacking her, will you calm down and try to explain why India has a much lower death rate in spite of 10x population density in Mumbai & Kolkatta than NY city?

Rational explanation could be obesity is rare in India because food costs lot more than earnings compared to United States. And most Indians don't own cars. Many must walk or peddle bikes.

So again, do you have any other plausible explanation for the difference in death rates?

[crimycarny]

50. Yes, thank you

And I don’t mean to be a total jerk, but it’s just exasperating at times. I’m simply trying to understand this virus like everyone else.

[Blue_true]

38. So a dangerous new pathogen should be put at lower priority because other

illnesses have killed people during the past? That sounds almost like what I would expect a Trump talker to say.

[crimycarny]

41. Just stop

Last edited Sat Sep 5, 2020, 07:12 PM - Edit history (1)

Where did anyone say COVID should be a lower priority??

Those top disease killers are also the MAIN pre-existing conditions that greatly increase your risk of death from COVID.

Can’t we multitask here? As I wrote in comment, my husband reversed his type II diabetes in 3 months by an immediate and drastic modification to his lifestyle. This was 5 years ago when there was no inkling of a pandemic. I am soooooo grateful he made those lifestyle changes because I’m far less worried about him DYING of COVID. That doesn’t mean we don’t take COVID seriously!

[Blue_true]

42. I stand corrected. Thanks. nt

[Mersky]

22. 30-35% with myocarditis regardless of symptoms is alarming

I am not sure that comes across well from reading the these articles, because they’re rather sedate. We’re not dealing in sniffles, or a flu season with insufficiently diagnosed young athletes with heart inflammation.

[beachbumbob]

23. No do overs with this stuff

[Mersky]

24. Yup, is a dangerous season

I really wish I could see how to feasibly take enough precautions, but I just can’t. I place college athletes apart from professionals who have more resources and agency in how they evaluate their risk during the pandemic.

[ffr]

43. Eww!

[roamer65]

44. The Cytokine Storm.