okay i am not prone to panic but this has got me there

[yuiyoshida]

Trump wants to steal this election by using the SUPREME Court to over turn the election even if BIDEN wins by a landslide and Biden wins the Electoral College... how do Democrats deal with that... someone please talk me off the ledge!!

[BannonsLiver]

1. No.

[yuiyoshida]

3. NO what???

I ask a question that is scaring me to death and you give me a two letter one word answer? I will wait for a more educated answer than what you just said.

[BannonsLiver]

4. No. I'm not going to talk you off the ledge.

[yuiyoshida]

19. oh well fine than

HAVE A NICE DAY

[BannonsLiver]

20. Thanks.

[quickesst]

45. ********

[jorgevlorgan]

2. By winning

The laws in place are still the law of the land. He cannot change that. He has no power. Don't even consider otherwise.

[yuiyoshida]

6. His justices will be in his back pocket,...

The GOP has wanted this for years... they will want this too... how do you defeat a guy who can over turn the election by calling on
HIS SUPREME COURT justices.. talk about corruption!

[jorgevlorgan]

9. He cannot overturn the election. I promise.

The courts would be overruling 150 years of precedent if they even tried to overrule a landslide election. The laws and the constitution is clear about how this all works. They cannot change that.


Daijobu...

[triron]

30. They said until it happened.

[jorgevlorgan]

33. Well if the election is overturned

It isn't because of legal norm and precedent or the constitution. Or judges. It is because we became convinced he had the power to do it and let him. We need to be firm in pushing back against the idea he has any strength. He is a weak, sad, miserable little man. We cannot let him be anything other than that.

[LovingA2andMI]

5. There is NOTHING in the Constitution....

Which REQUIRES the Electors be seated. That is how he will steal it. Period. Votes will not matter. Only a revolution will remove the dictator.

[BannonsLiver]

10. Let us know when the fife and drum corps is assembled.

[not_the_one]

12. Go ahead. Scoff.

You better wake up.

[BannonsLiver]

13. Bless your heart.

[BannonsLiver]

25. Thanks.

I believe Biden will win this election handily. I believe we will take the senate. I don’t crap my pants when Republicans say boo. Just not my deal.

[jorgevlorgan]

14. Ya realize the constitution isn't the only thing that tells us how to run our elections, right?

We also have like, laws. And laws do require the process to be followed. 150 years of legal precedent will likely withstand Trump's mad ravings.

[LovingA2andMI]

18. The Constitution....

Is the process how Electors are seated however, it does NOT MANDATE it occur. Laws won't help that.

[jorgevlorgan]

27. Laws are what norm and precedent are based on.it is also how courts base their ruling.

The constitution does give full authority for states to conduct their elections -not individual state legislatures. And 150 years of legal precedent far exceeds any obscure interpretation of a 200 year old excerpt from the document. States follow the law regardless of what accusations there are.


This needs to stop here. The only way this rhetoric by Trump will be successful is if we believe it can be. The truth is legally nd constitutionally it has no basis. But if we can't believe that, then we are letting Trump get the upper hand in an obviously uphill battle for him

[LovingA2andMI]

29. The ELECTORAL COLLEGE...

Is in the Constitution and that is how a President is done. These are the facts. If the Electors are not seated or Legislative Bodies appoint their own (i.e. Republican Legislative Bodies deny the WILL of the VOTE and APPOINT GOP Electors in spite of the VOTE) --- there is no LAW to STOP IT.

Unless the U.S. Supreme Court, steps in...which we just lost another seat there.

#FACTS

[jorgevlorgan]

32. Missing the part where legislative bodies cannot just unilaterally appoint their own

The laws where we elect electors in states are guided by 150 years of state law. States would have to change their state laws for them to appoint electors directly. That would require the governor to also be on board. PA, MI, WI all have democratic governors. And most states even with Republican governors aren't likely stupid enough to do that.

Also we are a handful of seats away from flipping the Florida state legislature. The new term starts the day after they are elected. If we take the state legislature, there is even less of a path to victory even if the Republicans try it.


It just isn't possible on a legal or constitutional or logistical basis. Only on a psychological basis.

[LovingA2andMI]

34. Okay....

But, you are wrong. At the best case scenario everything is solved on January 6, 2021- if the Democrats retain the House and Vote in the new President. That is it.

[jorgevlorgan]

35. You said there is no law preventing state legislatures from appointing their own

Electors. Every state actually has laws that prevent that right now. That is why in every election, the popular vote of the state has decided the winner of the presidency. Or at least which party's electors are sent to cast their vote.

[LovingA2andMI]

37. Nope....

It's Not.

The Democrats appoint Electors and So Do The Republicans. The State Legislative bodies appoints the Electors aligning with the results of a Vote. This is in the CONSTITUTION --- not ANY STATE LAW.

Next, the Electors normally and historically voted the way their State Voters do. Again, THERE IS NOTHING in the CONSTITUTION that MANDATES this.

So...what if the Republican LEGISLATIVE BODIES REFUSES to sit the Democratic Electors in the States th Biden won? The CONSTITUTION does not DIRECTLY address this -- Blank Area. This could end up in a 5/4 or 6/3 U.S. Supreme Court to determine.

Oh and the Governor is an EXECUTIVE and not a LEGISLATIVE BODY that VOTES on State Law. In other words, the Governor has no power play in what happens.

Denial is a strong emotion however, reality is harder to accept.

[BannonsLiver]

38. When is the big reveal when you say what you really mean?

I feel like the plot is in a bit of a lull.

[jorgevlorgan]

39. All of which are guided by the law of the state. None of which is universal.

Sometimes the legislature appoints them. Sometimes the board of canvassers. Either way the electors are the ones being voted for and appointment is done based on the certification of the election which the board of canvassers does in every state -not the state legislature! Arbitrarily appointing electors would be violating the state law in those processes. Again. Laws matter. And if there weren't laws that guided this we would have had a far bigger clustered*ck 2than 2000 long long ago. Why do you choose to give Trump so much power?

[LovingA2andMI]

40. Wrong AGAIN....

The State Board of Canvassers certify VOTES ONLY. NOT THE LEGISLATIVE BODY Actions. Period! That is the U.S. Constitution as it relates to seating State Political Parties Electors in a PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION for PRESIDENT and VICE-PRESIDENT -- i.e. the Electoral College - again - which is in the U.S. Constitution and NOT a part of any State Election Law.

Re-Read the information we have wrote above over and over again.

Denial is a Strong Emotion, Reality is HARDER to ACCEPT.

[jorgevlorgan]

41. That's what I said

"the board of canvassers certifies the votes not the legislature"


Again, where is your argument that there aren't laws about this when you are also citing procedure that the laws derive? You can't have it both ways.

[LovingA2andMI]

42. What you said WAS.....

Sometimes the legislature appoints them. Sometimes the board of canvassers.

There is no "Sometimes". The STATE LEGISLATIVE BODIES ALWAYS APPOINTS the ELECTORS. It is in the U.S. Constitution. Try reading it and Learn.

[jorgevlorgan]

43. Electors. There is a sometimes

In most States, the political parties nominate slates of electors at State conventions or central committee meetings. Then the citizens of each State appoint the electors by popular vote in the state-wide general election. However, State laws on the appointment of electors may vary.

Again there are established state laws on this that do not involve legislatures erroneously appointing electors.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.archives.gov/files/electoral-college/state-officials-instructions.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwiS0pLY8oDsAhUvHzQIHULNCMoQFjABegQIDhAG&usg=AOvVaw2Vz3kUgUu16GLWvjOa-zYB

[mzmolly]

7. By winning

big.

[PSPS]

8. Change the channel. You've been sucked into the outrage porn industry of the media.

[ChoppinBroccoli]

11. This Is Kind Of My Fear As Well. The Supreme Court HAS Installed A President Before.

Just 20 years ago, the Supreme Court installed the loser of the election as President. I'm worried that it will happen again. In fact, it's beginning to look like that's the PLAN. Why else would the Republicans be rushing to ram through a Trump stooge? What's the rush? Because the plan is for Trump to challenge the election results all the way up to the Supreme Court, where his installed stooges will steal it for him.

The original poster voiced some very legitimate concerns that this is exactly what's going to happen. I think a lot of us are having this very same worry. I was hoping somebody with more knowledge than myself could assure me it wouldn't happen and give the reasons why it couldn't happen. What's to stop him from challenging the results even in a landslide?

[LovingA2andMI]

22. Nothing....

The question is legitimate. The Constitution does NOT MANDATE the Electors be seated. That's is the Coup d'etat. Next, it is the Legislators that APPOINTS the Electors. Michigan, Wisconsin and Pennsylvania ALL HAVE GOP Legislative Bodies.

It is easier to Deny, Harder to accept. The System can be Rigged. Vote or Not.

[bamagal62]

15. I am also on the ledge. Plotting my move

To Canada

[fishwax]

16. Democrats deal with it by turning out at the polls in droves

By winning a clear margin in the electoral college and in the popular vote, and by making our righteous anger felt in close races against his corrupt allies like Joni Ernst in Iowa and Lindsey Graham in South Carolina, by righteous drubbings of an enabler like Susan Collins in Maine and never-should-have-beens like Martha McSally in Arizona.

He wants to steal the election, sure. And we've seen in the past that, in close elections like 2000, clarity and legitimacy can be quite precarious indeed. But the supreme court can't steal a blowout. Just because he wants to doesn't mean he can.

If the prospect frightens you, that's understandable. Do what you can to control the situation. Two things come quickly to mind: vote, of course ... but also consider donating to the Biden campaign. Or perhaps the DNC. Or perhaps both! You'll feel better

[yuiyoshida]

26. I have. I have sent as much as I can afford..

and I am sure that will still not be enough.

[Frasier Balzov]

17. Rachel explained it tonight. The state legislatures pick the electors.

Swing states with Republican controlled legislatures simply ignore the popular vote in their states if it goes Joe's way. The Constitution gives the state legislatures the sole power to pick Presidential electors for the electoral college. Apparently, lawyers for the Trump campaign are counseling them to do this.

[LovingA2andMI]

24. Bingo....

Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania ALL HAVE REPUBLICAN LEGISLATIVE BODIES Folks. #BePrepared

[qazplm135]

31. so it's a middle thing...

yes, this plan COULD happen, in theory. And if they could do it, we know the Trump campaign and some republicans would.

But it's not easy, and there's a lot of ways to kill it.

1. Win Florida. Or Texas. Or Georgia. Or North Carolina. Win more places and the electoral college win is so high that even if he convinces one or two state legislatures to pull this off, it won't be remotely enough. This is the easiest way to stop this. Just get out and vote. Get a friend or two out to vote. Phone bank. Donate if you can. Vote.

2. Win the Senate. If we win the Senate, this plan dies there. Heck, just push Kelly and Ossoff over 50 percent in their special elections and it's already a 51-49 R Senate, and we only need two more, and we know that Colorado is ours too. That's 50-50 and we only need one more.

3. Win a couple more House delegations to get to 25/25. Again, plan dies in the House. And we are not very far off from this.

4. Vote in such large numbers in places like PA, WI, and MI that we are closer to a 10 percent win. If it's that wide, this plan just is not going to work. It requires a close election.

The alternatives if we don't do any of these things is relying on republicans to follow the law and 6-3 Supreme Court to enforce it. And is that possible, yes? Would I rather rely on 1-4? You betcha.

So is it crazy conspiracy theory? No. Is it locked in or easy to do? Also no. Is it easy to kill if we just turn out? Most definitely.

[Frasier Balzov]

36. Re solutions 2 and 3, won't those chambers remain as currently constituted

until the next Congress is convened in January 2021?

The President will be certified by December 2020.

[qazplm135]

44. nope

they vote on January 6th in both Houses.

[Frasier Balzov]

46. Thank you!

https://www.house.gov/feature-stories/2017-1-18-electoral-college-vote-count

[Crunchy Frog]

23. We don't ever give in. If Biden has clearly won, then he must refuse to concede.

We must never call him president, or even 45, or acknowledge his legitimacy in any way, including all pro-democracy elected officials.

If the Dems win the House and the Senate then they must give him NOTHING. That includes stopping all government funding and shutting down the government. Nothing until the legitimate president is sworn in and seated.

We cannot ever acknowledge this as anything more than a coupe. A Supreme Court that enables this must also be recognized as illegitimate. The ultimate aim must be to dissolve it and reconsitute it as something functional for our modern society.

We follow our Democratic governors and mayors, and not an illegitimate federal coupe government.

[yuiyoshida]

28. Yes but shutting down the government....

may work, that makes me feel a little bit better... having THE MARINES STORM THE WHITE house would be better.