Ed Norton 🧵: I'm no political pundit but I grew up w a dad who was a federal prosecutor & he taught

[soothsayer]

Link to tweet

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Edward Norton
@EdwardNorton
I’m no political pundit but I grew up w a dad who was a federal prosecutor & he taught me a lot & I’ve also sat a fair amount of poker w serious players & l’ll say this: I do not think Trump is trying to ‘make his base happy’ or ‘laying the groundwork for his own network’...

..or that ‘chaos is what he loves’. The core of it is that he knows he’s in deep, multi-dimensional legal jeopardy & this defines his every action. We’re seeing 1) a tactical delay of the transition to buy time for coverup & evidence suppression 2) above all, a desperate endgame

Edward Norton
@EdwardNorton
...which is to create enough chaos & anxiety about peaceful transfer of power, & fear of irreparable damage to the system, that he can cut a Nixon-style deal in exchange for finally conceding. But he doesn’t have the cards. His bluff after ‘the flop’ has been called in court...

His ‘turn card’ bluff will be an escalation & his ‘River card’ bluff could be really ugly. But they have to be called. We cannot let this mobster bully the USA into a deal to save his ass by threatening our democracy. THAT is his play. But he’s got junk in his hand. So call him.

Edward Norton
@EdwardNorton
I will allow that he’s also a whiny, sulky, petulant, Grinchy, vindictive little 10-ply-super-soft bitch who no doubt is just throwing a wicked pout fest & trying to give a tiny-hand middle finger to the whole country for pure spite, without a single thought for the dead & dying

But his contemptible, treasonous, seditious assault on the stability of our political compact isn’t about 2024, personal enrichment or anything else other than trying to use chaos & threat to the foundation of the system as leverage to trade for a safe exit. Call. His. Bluff.

Edward Norton
@EdwardNorton
Faith in the strength of our sacred institutions & founding principles is severely stretched...but they will hold. They will. He’s leaving, gracelessly & in infamy. But if we trade for it, give him some brokered settlement, we’ll be vulnerable to his return. We can’t flinch.

[underpants]

1. One of my favorite actors

[obamanut2012]

2. Same

And, even though he isn't underrated, he is underutilized imo.

[KPN]

20. That may be his own choice?

It would be good to see him more though.

[Cha]

84. Here's Ed Norton's IMDB BIO.. says he's an Activist, too..

https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001570/

[Lucky Luciano]

94. He's made a lot of money as an angel investor/VC type of guy.

For example, he was an initial investor in Kensho Technologies which was bought by S&P, so he’s doing very well.

[PunkinPi]

54. His mom taught at my rival high school and lots of my friends that had her, knew him.

He's definitely good dude and a talented actor.

[TheBlackAdder]

55. +1. I wonder if Trump will threaten to start a war, that Biden has to handle, for such consessions.

.

Trump doesn't give a shit if thousands of people die, just as long as he gets what he wants.

What's starting a war with him. He's already telegraphing something with Iran.

.

[Skittles]

90. he is fantastic

VERY underrated in my opinion

[LaMouffette]

3. Thank you for posting this! Norton's theory makes perfect sense in light of the recent news story

that Trump had over $280 million in loans forgiven for a Chicago construction project, just by throwing a big enough hissy fit and by threatening to sue them for "predatory lending" until the banks were finally, like, "Fine! You don't have to repay us all the money. Just GO AWAY!"

[link:https://www.forbes.com/sites/nicholasreimann/2020/10/27/report-trump-had-over-280-million-in-debt-forgiven-and-avoided-paying-taxes-on-most-of-it/?sh=3b41bc887ac4|

Now he's trying this ploy again. We all want Trump to just go away. But not by cutting him a deal. We need to remember the US policy of no negotiation with terrorists. Especially domestic terrorists like Traitor Trump.

[PatSeg]

19. Yes

Trump has been using the same cheesy intimidating tactics his entire career, but what worked in the real estate business isn't necessarily going to work on a bigger stage. Though I'm surprised it has worked as well as it did with republican politicians across the board. I guess they are weaker and more vulnerable than I could have possibly imagined.

Trump likes to brag about what a brilliant deal-maker and businessman he is, but the truth is he is just incredibly outrageous and disruptive, as well as threatening. Imagine being so obnoxious and chaotic, that people will pay to make you go away.

[malaise]

40. THIS

He is a truly evil human being

[PatSeg]

57. I never used to use that word "evil"

very much. To me, it applied primarily to fictional characters and a small handful of historic tyrants or maybe serial killers, but the past four years, I find myself using it more and more frequently. Somehow the usual psychological terms just don't quite cut it. Anyone who would repeatedly cause great harm to benefit himself or just to be spiteful is definitely "evil". And anyone who willingly enables him has to be considered evil as well.

[malaise]

58. Same here

It's now appropriate

[calimary]

61. Yes. It IS. And it's well-deserved and definitely well-earned.

[PatSeg]

66. Yeah, Trump is such an overachiever

When he does "evil", he does it really big.

[Grasswire2]

73. The late psychologist M. Scott Peck, an expert on narcissism...

.....felt that the concept EVIL should be a measurable tool in the DSM -- the diagnostic "encyclopedia".

He thought it could be described in psych terms.

[PatSeg]

77. That helps somewhat

as my logical mind has a hard time thinking in terms of good or evil. Its a heaven or hell, angel or devil mentality that just doesn't work for me for the most part. It brings to mind Saturday morning cartoon super villains. Sadly, I have encountered too many people, often high functioning, who appear to have absolutely no redeeming qualities whatsoever, which I find very disturbing.

Ah, the older I get, the more I realize how much I don't know.

[Grasswire2]

78. His book on Narcissistic Personality Disorder: PEOPLE OF THE LIE

I read it years ago when my ex husband's business partner (a psychologist) told me my husband was NPD. As I learned about the disorder, things made sense to me, finally.

[PatSeg]

80. I think a very close association

with a narcissist, such as a spouse can be a real eye-opener for many of us. I could find some redeeming qualities in my ex in spite of his narcissistic behavior. He had many clarifying moments of compassion and understanding, but would quickly revert back to cruel and often violent behavior. As he got older, he became more introspective and realized he really couldn't be with other people for long. He takes in stray dogs instead. At least he does no harm and has sporadic bursts of generosity, but from a distance.

However, I've known too many men who never were introspective. They just kept repeating the same patterns over and over again, always resulting in great pain and destruction. At least my ex knew that he could not sustain an actual relationship and pretty much withdrew from society. He was perceptive enough to know his weaknesses.

I've known so many. They were accomplished liars and convincing actors. It always blew my mind that a person could pretend so well for so long. I can't fake love or affection and can't fathom how anyone else can. Its like they are a different species.

[IsItJustMe]

92. Funny you should say that.

But before trump came along, I use to have the philosophy that everyone is basically good in nature and when people screwed up, it was just a person who was making a bad decision in that moment. I no longer hold that philosophy. Without a doubt, there are people out there that are rotten to the very core of their being. We live and learn.

[PatSeg]

98. Oh, same here

I held a Mr. Rogers attitude of "good people sometimes do bad things", making allowances for people who are insane and can't help themselves. Now I see that there are relatively ordinary, sane people who like you say, really are "rotten to the very core of their being". What is even more disturbing is there are so many of them. We work with them, live next door to them, are even related to them. It is like we are sharing our world with another species, creatures who can act like us, but on close examination really lack any humanity.

Looking back on history, I can see they've always been with us, purveyors of cruelty and destruction in the name of progress, but lacking any compassion or basic humanity. It is because of people like this that civilized people had to make laws, but when they end up in charge, it all goes to hell.

[IsItJustMe]

99. I have experienced such people in my life.

But in the past I have always found a way to rationalize it and keep my basic premise that people are naturally good. After four years of seeing what has been done to our country and seeing what can happen when unscrupulous people get in power, I can no longer keep that belief. You can call it growing up or you can call it jaded, I don't know. I do know I no longer see the world through the same prism.

[PatSeg]

100. I did as well

I never wanted to paint certain people with a broad brush, knowing that life is more complex than that and people are more complicated. I often used psychology, philosophy, and metaphysics to explain divergent behavior of other people, though not always successfully.

I've never considered myself naïve, but now I have to wonder if at my age I'm coming to a new and unsettling awareness of the world around me. Years ago, I read a book about relatively normal, intelligent people in Germany in the 1930s and the horror they experienced watching their friends and neighbors transform into unrecognizable monsters. That is how I've felt the past few years. We no longer have to question how on earth that could have happened, as we are witnessing it in real time. It isn't because we as Americans are inherently better people, we just had better institutions and laws to keep such insanity in check for the most part.

[IsItJustMe]

101. Sound like perhaps you are coming to the realization that I have come to in these past few years

When I was a young man, I thought I knew everything and nothing could change my mind about that. In my mid years, doubt began to creep in and I questioned some of my unyielding beliefs. Now that I have grown older, it seems that the older I get, the less I know. I believe that life's experiences brings most of us to that place where we start seeing things for the way they are; rather than, the way that we think it should be.

[PatSeg]

102. Yes, so many of those tired old clichs

the "old folks" used to tell us turned out to be true. Apparently a part of being young is to know everything and then as you grow, learn how much you don't know. In some ways I suppose I am comfortable with the "not knowing", as it leaves me so open to endless possibilities.

From a philosophical point of view, as you empty your mind of preconceived ideas and beliefs, you are making room for the new, becoming more receptive to the truth, whatever that may be. Someone once said that as soon as you try to define something, you deny it. That was undoubtedly in regard to god or supreme beings.

So we start out knowing nothing, spend a lifetime learning so we can reach a point where we can acknowledge that we know nothing. Seems rather like a cruel joke, I suppose, except I don't think we really start out knowing nothing. There is a certain wisdom in the very young that gets lost in the "learning" process. I think that is why so often people yearn for their youth.

[IsItJustMe]

103. We are living in a world of programming, this is for sure and it is extremely hard to be truly open

minded because of that. I am constantly catching myself believing something simply because I read it. But the old critical thinking always creeps in and says, "Hey now, Wait a minute".

You would probably appreciate this song. It's about being comfortable with those things we do not know. I believe that is a very good place to be for the peace of mind that it brings us. WARNING: Heavy twang but the words are most superb, for me anyway.

[PatSeg]

104. Oh yeah, that works for our discussion

It rather has a heavy blue grass sound to it.

I will say that the programming is always around me, but I do have a critical side that can't stop questioning most things. The things I rarely question are those that truly come from within during times of silence and contemplation, that tends to be very real, but not definable.

[Texin]

65. The rethugs are neither weak nor vulnerable. They are crooks.

They've been a white glove mob family within the chambers of the Senate as long as McConnell has been the majority leader.

[PatSeg]

68. They may be crooks

but they are weak and easily intimidated. I suppose most crooks probably are.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

24. Small loan: your problem. Big loan: bank's problem. How many mortgages foreclosed to pay tRump?

How many ordinary people are forced to subsidize the big cheaters?

[GoneOffShore]

33. 'Traitor Trump' - I like it.

Remember, Remember
The 3rd of November
We voted out Traitorous Trump
I know of no reason
The Donald Trump Treason
Should ever be Forgot!

[Whatthe_Firetruck]

46. Rhyme scheme...

A A B, C C B. IMO, to match the original scheme better, it should be "Traitorous Trump we voted out".

[GoneOffShore]

71. Hey, it's the best I could do at the time.

And one of many versions

Please to Remember
The 5th of November
Gunpowder Treason and plot
I know of no reason
That Gunpowder Treason
Should ever be Forgot!

[Blue_playwright]

52. Can we have our own bonfire night?

Remember, remember the fifth of November,
Gunpowder treason and plot.
We see no reason
Why gunpowder treason
Should ever be forgot!

[nebby70]

4. nicely said ....

... I'm reminded of an old movie (Operation Petticoat) where the fitting line "...in chaos there is profit..." is uttered by Tony Curtis' character: an opportunist '.

Perhaps Trumps entire philosophy is exactly that -- make money while others are distraught by chaos....

[kirkuchiyo]

13. Absolutely

LOVED that movie

[Phoenix61]

5. I couldn't agree more. He's toast and he knows it. nt

[vlyons]

6. Excellent observation & insight

nt

[Hortensis]

7. No doubt much is true, but not that he's not desperately trying

to hold onto "his base." They're both key to his continuing power in and out of office and a nationwide dairy of cash cows to be milked. Notably, the angrier more of his voters are at his legal "persecution" -- and resentful and disrespected they feel, the better the deals he may be able to strike will be.

[groundloop]

14. True. Without his base he'd be out of cards.

[Hortensis]

17. Beautifully succinct. :)

[Baitball Blogger]

8. Very bright observations.

I'm glad he shared them with us.

A Nixon type pardon? I don't think so. Biden would have trouble winning a second term if he capitulates to the Republicans. Democrats have to be more aggressive in sending a signal to Republicans that their behavior crossed the line and they should face consequences for it.

[North Shore Chicago]

9. Well said, Mr. Norton!

My favorite line:

"....vindictive little 10-ply-super-soft bitch...."

[leighbythesea2]

89. Also

My favorite part

[IsItJustMe]

93. I wish I could kick a thread.

to you.

[Iliyah]

10. Yep . .

that is the bottom line, self preservation and knowing what is to come after screwing up The United States of America.

Also, shithole can care less regarding the cult, it's all about me, me, me, me, me, me.

[NCDem47]

11. Absolutely no deals with Trump.

He lost. And it can proven again, and again and again. There's no ambiguity here. Fuck your "perception is reality" bullshit.

You did the crime so you do the time after you leave the safety cocoon that is the Presidency.

He thinks he has bargaining power with holding back/releasing his posse of loosers.

Biden will stay above the fray about prosecution...but NOT others.

America is busting out of its hostage situation.

[wnylib]

44. No deals, absolutely none.

History says never let a tyrant off the hook easily.

Bavaria was lenient with Adolf after his conviction for the beer hall putsch. He served a short, nominal sentence being catered to by guards and came back to the people as a hero. He did not win a majority in national elections, but "negotiated" for a coalition government position, reneged on the negotiations, and made himself dictator.

No negotiations or leniency for Herr Drumpf.

[Ferrets are Cool]

12. This

[James48]

15. The only deal I'm ok with

Is offering him life in prison instead of the death penalty for his guilty plea for crimes against humanity.

[KPN]

26. Yes. Call his bluff.

[wnylib]

45. Works for me.

[BSdetect]

16. Spot on analysis

[greenjar_01]

18. Just watched The Score again the other day

Nice heist flick, Norton masterful.

[UCmeNdc]

21. Interesting

[ananda]

22. Absofuckinglutely! Call. His. Bluff.

Give him no quarter. Hang his ass
on the graveyard of infamy!

[Mme. Defarge]

23. Exactement!

[Roc2020]

25. Yes he is hoping for a deal

Too late. Before the elections he had a great hand. Now he has snake eyes. And his bluff will be called.

[LuvNewcastle]

27. Well said,.Ed!

We've got to finish this right or we'll deal with it again, no doubt. This is our punishment for letting Nixon go, I guess. And the next person will be worse than Trumpy!

[KPN]

28. Based on Biden's words yesterday, I think he

will be okay with DOJ calling tRump’s bluff.

[Shermann]

29. Is Trump really playing a masterful game of poker here?

CNN seems to think he's just butthurt over that whole impeachment thing.

Hard to say really.

That Woodward book really showed what an enigma the guy is. His public statements on CV-19 were consistent with him being an incompetent, simplistic charlatan on the science. But the recordings revealed he hid a nuanced, enlightened view of the risks.

Is the same thing playing out in this hand?

[PatrickforO]

30. He never had the money to even see the flop, let alone win the hand.

He isn't smart enough. He is a tyrant used to getting his own way.

Like the author of these tweets, I say call his bluff. I just had a colleague come down with COVID, but is Trump doing his job? NO, he is doing everything he can to cast doubt on the election, and reverse the will of the American people, all between rounds of golf.

Trump is a TRAITOR.

[KewlKat]

31. I feel this is spot on and what many of us here have felt

Since Election Day.

[usaf-vet]

32. Dead center shot. He called it tRump is stalling to get a deal and at least destroy the evidence.

I want him gone tomorrow BUT I want him held accountable for all his insults to our Democracy.

So I am willing to wait for his ass to be dragged out on January 20th with NO DEAL and facing justice.

[stuffmatters]

91. 100% Trump's buying time to destroy the evidence

That stood out to me too. I think we've all thought it, but Norton's the first one I've seen/read to actually point out this.

[Sprite]

34. Right on!

Everything is caving in for the whole Trump family. No negotiating with criminals and traitors. No one is above the law!

[Lonestarblue]

35. Who would have the authority to make such a deal with Trump?

I don’t think the AG can. Biden can’t because he hasn’t been sworn in. All Trump has to do for his federal crimes is resign and have Pence become president for a few days so he can pardon him. I don’t think Trump is stupid enough to risk a self pardon that might not stand up in court.

That leaves New York. Is this a deal that Cuomo can make? The NY AG? Vance?

There are lots of holes in this theory, though I agree that no deals should be made with Trump. Am I just missing something here? I really think that Trump genuinely believes that he can pull off a coup and is going after it, which is his usual pattern of refusing to accept something he wants being denied to him.

[wnylib]

82. I think your post sounds very plausible

and well thought out.

I never believed the fears of some people that Trump might use a war to stay in power. After all, elections continued through the Civil War and WWII. Plus, Trump has always been anti war.

But his recent changes in DOD and the Pentagon make me wonder if he has plans to attack Iran. I don't see that as an excuse to overturn an election, though. Especially not when the President-elect is as experienced as Biden. But he might try to use it to hold onto power by declaring a national emergency. Don't think it would work, but he might try.

I agree that he does believe he can pull off a coup somehow. If he can delay official certification of the states in the Senate, or get a state to challenge the outcome, with the required formal letter from a Senator, then it would go to the House. I believe that is what he will do. The military changes might be for the purpose of having agreeable and pliable people on hand to quell the rebellion and street riots that would happen if he succeeds in overturning the election through the House.

[blueinredohio]

36. Wow what a statement.

I agree don't give him anything and DONT FLINCH!

[llashram]

37. this

[Javaman]

38. as i have been saying and posting for years, the orange asshole is a psychopath out to save his own

skin.

I can't post this enough.

the dark triad

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_triad

In psychology, the dark triad comprises the personality traits of narcissism, Machiavellianism, and psychopathy.[1][2][3][4] They are called "dark" because of their malevolent qualities.[5][1][6][7]

Research on the dark triad is used in applied psychology, especially within the fields of law enforcement, clinical psychology, and business management. People scoring high on these traits are more likely to commit crimes, cause social distress and create severe problems for an organization, especially if they are in leadership positions (for more information, see psychopathy, narcissism, and Machiavellianism in the workplace). They also tend to be less compassionate, agreeable, empathetic, satisfied with their lives, and less likely to believe they and others are good.[8]

All three dark triad traits are conceptually distinct although empirical evidence shows them to be overlapping. They are associated with a callous-manipulative interpersonal style.[9]

Narcissism is characterized by grandiosity, pride, egotism, and a lack of empathy.[10]
Machiavellianism is characterized by manipulation and exploitation of others, an absence of morality, unemotional callousness, and a higher level of self interest.[11]
Psychopathy is characterized by continuous antisocial behavior, impulsivity, selfishness, callous and unemotional traits (CU),[12] and remorselessness.[13]
A factor analysis found that among the big five personality traits, low agreeableness is the strongest correlate of the dark triad, while neuroticism and a lack of conscientiousness were associated with some of the dark triad members.[11] Agreeableness and the dark triad show correlated change over development.[14]

[mtnsnake]

39. OUCH!! Fantastic!

[democrank]

41. Indeed..."We can't flinch"

My guess is that Trump and his fellow-fascists are buying time so they can set up a few private burn pits and shredders.

[Merlot]

59. "a tactical delay of transition to buy time for coverup & evidence suppression"

[nuxvomica]

42. I agree. He's trying to force a deal

We need to restore the rule of law, make him an example, humiliate him and awaken his base to reality, but Biden's job will be to leave it to the DOJ and the states while focusing his energies and visibility on fixing America's problems. These are the pincers that will turn most of his base around. That is how you deal with fascists.

[SidDithers]

43. Ed Norton watches Letterkenny...

Sid

[smirkymonkey]

47. Hear, hear!

[keithbvadu2]

48. Pretty good analogy

[KewlKat]

49. Kick

[MontanaMama]

50. John Fugelsang said exactly this

on the Stephanie Miller show this morning. We need to stay the course...let him flail and lash out. We’re almost there.

[liberalla]

51. WOW! Great analogy. Appreciate your 'take' on the situation.

[dsharp88]

53. Brilliant! nt

[Duppers]

56. + 1,000,000

He's been treating the whole U.S. as marks. Time we stopped falling for it.

[pandr32]

60. Nailed it!

[Texin]

62. I know it's not popular here, but I wish somebody could broker an exit for him

even it is means not prosecuting his corrupt ass. I just want him gone. I say, do it now. Have him go now. It's only a matter of time before he does something else that breaks the law(s), and he and his mob family will continue to operate as mobsters do until a rival family has them executed. The damage he and his minions are doing to this country is just about irreparable at this point. He needs to go and I can live with him not facing immediate prosecution however much he richly deserves it. Again, it's just a matter of time before another law is broken and a prosecutor can swing into quick action. And time and tide wait for no man, and tRump isn't a young person, nor a well person. FFS. A 74 year old guy who's been wearing Depends for ten years or longer (according to Neil Casler) and crapping in them routinely while television cameras were rolling isn't likely long for the Earth. For our own mental health, I say cut him a deal and make him walk.

[soothsayer]

64. For the sake of democracy, he must be punished

It’s the only way to stop this nonsense in the future.

[grantcart]

69. Yes it worked so well when we gave a similar guy Austria

And then Czech and finally gave him Poland. Peace in our time.

Certain personality types, I.e. those that lie all of the time, are not suitable to negotiate a deal , but even if he could be trusted (he can't) and even if he were to promise a quiet and peaceful removal from the public square (he won't) it would be the wrong move.

The reason that serious multi billion white crimes are still committed is that we simply don't put rich white guys in jail. There is a direct line between the fraud that were committed with energy and banking scandals around 2008 and Trump. When guys like Trump see people shooting people on 5th Ave and walking away he thinks "I can do that".

Send a couple of dozen high profile white guys (and Ivanka) serve time and You will see tax compliance go up and mega fraud and perjury before Congress go down.

Our system (especially our tax system) relies on self regulation and compliance. Put a few rich white guys in jail for tax fraud and you will see dramatic increases in self reported revenue the following year.

[crickets]

81. +1000000

The country has reached a point where we have to draw a line in the sand. We have to do it, or there will be no functioning country left.

[calimary]

63. A TOTAL keeper!

Here’s hoping other prosecutors in the Donald’s future feel the same as Norton’s prosecutor father indicated.

[aquamarina]

67. America doesn't negotiate with terrorists

and Trumps actions are the actions of a terrorist.

F him.

[grantcart]

70. Which is exactly how he successfully negotiated his bankruptcies

He is about to find out that you can only double down so many times.

[Enoki33]

72. Excellent analysis that dovetails with the traitor's allegiance

to Putin in that by creating as much chaos and distrust of the democratic process he is also trying to ensure a future Russian financial bailout of his failing investments. The fact that he is truly an evil person who casually uses his power to destroy anything decent is undeniable.

[birdographer]

74. Yep.

Call his bluff. He is out of moves. He is meeting with state officials, but his problem is that there has not been enough time to get kompromat on them--from his guys or help from his BFF Putin. He can't pull his favorite quid pro quo shit, or threaten them with exposure. Which he would certainly do if he could. He's got nothing. And of course the whole world is on to him, we have watched him at work (so to speak) for 4 years. We know this guy. He's not going to get anywhere. And the loser fails again.

[Marcuse]

75. No Deal!

[BobTheSubgenius]

76. When he starts with "I'm no political pundit..."

I had to agree, in that I've never read anything else he's written about politics, if anything. Turns out, he actually is a political pundit, in my estimation. His writing is good, and engaging, and he certainly has some strong points.

[LudwigPastorius]

79. I've got a deal for Trump:

...and take that freakshow you call your family with you, so we can start deep cleaning the People's House.

[Cha]

83. Wow Ed Norton! TY! Rt!

[HotRod Deluxe]

85. HRB

Haaayyy Ralphie Boy!!

[Laura PourMeADrink]

86. So bottom line is -dont give him any deals to give up WH?

[soothsayer]

87. Yep

[pansypoo53219]

88. BUTBUTBUT the moron WON on TUESDAY! he saw it on teevee.

[BusyBeingBest]

95. I'm with Ed Norton. No deals.

No mercy.

[Dark n Stormy Knight]

96. Absolutely fantastic!

[LittleGirl]

97. Happy to be the 301st rec! eom