General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsSo yesterday a restaraunt that I used to frequent lost me as a customer. Probably forever.
So I went to a downtown area to go bar hopping last night, and one of the places I usually go to, I was originally planning on eating at - until I saw this extremely horrible sign taped to the glass.
The sign read: "Due to government handouts, nobody wants to work here anymore. Please be patient with the staff that did choose to come here to work tonight.". The place I go to is known for large portions of food, and even larger beers. But the sign on the window just left such a bad taste in my mouth that I chose not to eat there.
Excuse me???? It's not government handouts as to why there's a labor shortage. It's because the pandemic made people realize that working really long hours for really low pay and almost no benefits is completely pointless. Not only that, that sign gives away your political affiliation, and you chose to support the Trump / Fox News side, because that's a pretty common Trump / Fox News talking point.
But if you have that sign on the door, you might as well have a sign that reads: "Hi, we treat our employees like shit and pay them next to nothing, and give them terrible working conditions with no benefits!".
So that said, I went to two other bars - neither of which had that sign on the window, the food was great, and the beer was even better (one of the places I went had some amazing Belgian beers on tap)! And I felt better about my choices!
sir pball
(4,726 posts)There's been a bit of pushback I've seen lately; when a business posts the "Government Handout" bullshit, folks will go online and see if the place got any PPP money. If they have, the receipt/report gets printed out and taped up next to the sign, usually with a snarky comment about handouts.
Initech
(99,915 posts)sir pball
(4,726 posts)Do tell if you find anything!
Laffy Kat
(16,356 posts)The bar proprietors need to know why you won't return. You could make it anonymous. The sign is off-putting and I'm certain you weren't the only former customer to walk away.
fescuerescue
(4,448 posts)There's alot of businsess that I would like to search on
sir pball
(4,726 posts)I'm sure the SBA has the database publicly available somewhere, but as usual it's easier to just find an outside group. This one is free: https://www.federalpay.org/paycheck-protection-program
FreeState
(10,553 posts)There is a business down the road that got nearly 400k for 4 employees- they completely remodeled and rebranded while they were closed for COVID. The company has over 10 businesses - all successful.
sir pball
(4,726 posts)I do know you can't really "misuse" PPP funds in that way; yes you have to prove that 66/75% or whatever went to payroll, but that's only to get the loans forgiven - if you use the money outside of those requirements, for rent, equipment, improvements, &c, it's not forbidden as such, you just then have to pay it back, at a very reasonable rate. I think forgiveness/must repay status shows up in the PPP records; if they're claiming forgiveness it may be an issue.
Demobrat
(8,916 posts)Piasladic
(1,160 posts)and left a typed up sign saying exactly what you posted in your fourth paragraph. The first sign would have been enough to deter me, the second would have made me laugh and cry out..."Hey managers, you're assholes!"
Initech
(99,915 posts)Walleye
(30,723 posts)gratuitous
(82,849 posts)Craig T. Nelson famously complained that when he was out of work, all he had was unemployment benefits and food stamps to get by with. Nobody helped him out!
TigressDem
(5,121 posts)IT THEM, not US scenario.
Wicked Blue
(5,767 posts)Sherman A1
(38,958 posts)Could be interesting.
stillcool
(32,626 posts)'Republican spoken here'
Towlie
(5,308 posts)
←
They're just another example of different labels for the same thing that one chooses from depending upon whether you want it to sound good or bad.
Crunchy Frog
(26,548 posts)634-5789
(4,175 posts)Of course, I would not eat there anyways...they had a giant tRump flag on the premises. They get ZERO of our dollars.
TexasBushwhacker
(20,044 posts)are female. How many of them were using a daycare that went out of business? How many had other jobs and were just waiting tables as a side gig and figured out it just wasn't worth it?
How many lost their jobs, were 62 or older and decide to just take early Social Security?
Rabrrrrrr
(58,347 posts)center just to be able to hold that job isn't actually worth it?
I think we have a fair amount of those, too.
Lots of folks saying, "You know what? The extra $200 a week was nice (after spending $500 on day care), but given the hassle of driving the kids to day care, working all day, picking them up at day care, and making arrangements when I can't do that; and having to take the occasional day off when a kid is sick anyway... it's just not fucking worth it. I'm staying home with the kids. We'll live on one income."
Millennials and gen z especially have given up the multiple job B.S.
TexasBushwhacker
(20,044 posts)and it will eventually, as will regular unemployment payments, they still aren't going back to work for shitty wages and no benefits.
Even the IRS, which pays well, is having a hard time getting people that they laid off to come back to work. Working conditions matter too. It isn't all about $$$.
Runningdawg
(4,494 posts)and that we were considering dining IN again recently until we saw the rant on the businesses FB page.... He said he didn't want vaccine-shedding liberals in his establishment and how glad he would be when they were all dead or at least sterile and would stop killing their babies. God Bless 'Merica.
Your move Karma.
smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)How about virus shedding MAGAts? I know who I would rather take my chances with.
Runningdawg
(4,494 posts)And the place where pet stores and feed stores had to move the Ivermectin (livestock med hillbillies take to prevent covid) to behind the counter to avoid it being stolen.
Initech
(99,915 posts)That got shut down during the pandemic for violating health code protocols. 1 of 3 in the entire fucking county. Needless to say that's one place I will *NEVER* go back to!
SammyWinstonJack
(44,129 posts)Runningdawg
(4,494 posts)A four year old in CO just killed himself. Daddy left the kid WITH THE MOTHER in a car and the kid found the gun. The news didn't mention what mom was doing - my bet is passed out. Both were arrested at the scene. https://whdh.com/news/parents-arrested-after-4-year-old-discovers-gun-fatally-shoots-himself-in-back-seat-of-car/
A 3 year old just shot himself in OKC, the father was IN THE ROOM but said he didn't notice the child had found the gun.
Comments on the stories which both appeared on OK social media? They went something like this...OMG those poor parents. How dare they charge them, they have suffered enough!! or Liberals will use this to take our guns. No mention they were the least bit concerned someone might take the remaining kids. SMH
Mysterian
(4,524 posts)I would not patronize that restaurant again, unless it changed ownership.
FakeNoose
(32,351 posts)And this is a perfect example - people vote with their feet. Or in your case, you voted with your wallet and your time, which amounts to the same thing.
The restaurant/bars that you DID patronize last night are better off and hopefully so are their employees. You and other customers feel better about choosing them, and that's important too.
ret5hd
(20,433 posts)on the type of society you want.
Yeah, sometimes there arent good choices, but there may still be less bad choices.
Warpy
(110,909 posts);copy that post and stick it into an envelope and mail it to that restaurant with the insulting sign.
One letter might not make a difference but a bunch of them might. Tell like minded friends what you did and hope they follow.
Sock it to them on their Facebook page, or yours if they don't have one and you do. And also on Yelp.
leftieNanner
(14,998 posts)is that FB isn't anonymous and these kinds of people might also be gun humpers.
I wouldn't put myself in a position to be attacked.
Just MHO.
wnylib
(21,146 posts)RW cult people.
Tiger8
(432 posts)This isn't about minimum wage jobs - but about economic justice for both wage earners and small business owners.
Reagan's Trickle Down policies have been a disaster for everybody except the moneyed investment class. The restaurant/bar owner has likely seen their income affected, as they pay taxes more taxes than Amazon, GM and other Wall Street corporations who pay nothing - in addition to chain restaurants getting lower cost access to capital, etc.
The restaurant owner's crime is blaming the Democrats and minimum wage workers. The real enemies are the Billionaire Capitalists invested in the restaurant chains, banks, and real estate investment trusts, etc. that affect his profit margins.
Response to Tiger8 (Reply #22)
Demobrat This message was self-deleted by its author.
Buckeye_Democrat
(14,847 posts)I'm glad that you'll never go back there!
Anyone stupid enough to post that on their door doesn't deserve anyone's business! It's bad enough to think that way, but to publicly post it is moronic!
"Wah! I'm not easily living the 'American dream' of the owner-class, exploiting others!"
AverageOldGuy
(1,462 posts)We went to our favorite brunch place two Sundays ago -- the front page of the menu was EXACTLY the same wording (East Virginia on the Chesapeake Bay).
I'm torn: If I don't go back and the place goes under, the people who will be hurt are the cooks and the wait staff . . . the owner is wealthy. If I do go back, I have to put up with the asshole owner. I'm inclined to go back and tip heavily, in cash, and hand my tip to the server and the busboy/girl so it doesn't go through the owneer.
PoindexterOglethorpe
(25,746 posts)I've heard far too many stories of servers not getting the tips put on a credit or debit card.
And if that place closes, the servers and other staff will probably easily find such jobs elsewhere.
I never shop at Hobby Lobby or WalMart. Yes, those employed there are going to be local people who deserve to make a living, but I'm not willing to give my own money to the corporations. As with that restaurant. You really don't want your money going to an idiot like that owner, do you?
Piasladic
(1,160 posts)I ordered a meal at a place for pickup- sort of annoyed that Pickup means I had to tip until I thought about it for a second. So I gave a good tip- thinking I was an ass for thinking it was optional. It was on the debit card used to pay for the meal. Guy who brought it to the parking lot seemed mad, almost didn't let me shut my door (asked a bunch of times if that was all). I wonder if he thought I stiffed him.
70sEraVet
(3,430 posts)then they won't have to worry about not having enough employees. Problem solved!
Dukkha
(7,341 posts)quit being a whiny self-entitled snowflake and get to work yourself! Learn personal responsibility and maybe just accept the fact that you suck at running a business instead of blaming everyone else!
brewens
(13,397 posts)or COVID deniers that own the place or are running it. If they didn't take COVID precautions seriously, I doubt they take health regulations seriously. That had washing sign in the bathroom. Just something foisted on them. They would probably rather their employees ignore it and save them money on soap. Nope. I can't trust the food in a joint like that.
Beartracks
(12,761 posts)The reason: the cost of the soap could reduce profitability which would impact his bonus.
===========
brewens
(13,397 posts)a one second hand rinse after using the bathroom. Actually, I was in the stall and not watching, but saw he was the only other one in there and heard him. He was a great guy and never usually touched anything in any of the donor or lab areas, but still. He's in charge of a lot of the training and SOP's written up on stuff like that.
Pacifist Patriot
(24,647 posts)They loathe Trump and the GOP, but have bought into the notion that people would rather live on unemployment than work. It has gotten to be a very contentious subject with us so now we just avoid it. I cannot figure it out for the life of me!!!
homegirl
(1,419 posts)are involved. A recent visit to local Goodwill was surprising. Learned a lot:
1. Goodwill is a non profit corporation
2. Goodwill has a Board of Directors
3. Board decided to not increase wages for employees
4. Result-the location was sparsely stocked and gravely understaffed.
The only employee at the checkout informed anyone who asked of the particulars of the situation. Speculation on how long before they close.
Jilly_in_VA
(9,854 posts)They treated my ASD son terribly. I don't go to Salvation Army (called "Sally Ann" in the UK, BTW) either. We are fortunate to have three great local thrift stores here in Harrisonburg VA: Gift and Thrift, run by the Mennonites; Tried & True, an outreach of Church of the Brethren whose profits go to AIDS charities; and Mercy House, which is an interdenominational outreach that does a bunch of other things (a shelter, etc. as well as the store). Gift and Thrift is my favorite. It's huge and very well run and has an amazing book department. I got a table for my studio that had originally been some kind of school desk. At $15, it was an incredible bargain. Very sturdy and holds a lot of stuff.
homegirl
(1,419 posts)here is Forgotten Felines. The challenge of finding just that special object and helping others is very satisfying. I too, have found some outstanding objects at thrift stores.
On 50% off for seniors day I buy jackets and warm clothing to donate to local homeless organizations.
grantcart
(53,061 posts)I had a friend who married into a AAA "owner" and decades later I bumped into him and asked why he didn't go to graduate school with the rest of the gang. He said he hit the lottery EVERY YEAR.
He answered my questions and I learned that many non profits,like AAA, pass the restricted voting shares on to family members.
They have no profits but they have exorbitant exec salaries. AAA execs in S California get more than 1 million a year.
Red Cross chief execs also get million dollar salaries.
I did check Goodwill salaries a while back and found that they had one of the most modest salary structures in the non profit industry.
Delmette2.0
(4,143 posts)I could not wait for them to reopen. My sister and i went in for lunch.. We had the artichoke dip and both ordered shrimp salads
The artichoke dip was thin, not thick to be scooped up on the pita bread.the salads were a good size but just 4 shrimp on each. Then they charge $17 for each salad. I had a cup of coffee, sister had water. Total bill for lunch $50+.
Meanwhile there were just two people waiting on tables inside and outside. They both covered the front desk to seat people. The man who waited on us made a comment about getting staffed up again. I don't think I believe him. I think they have not raised their starting wage.
I am not going back.
Question. Is it rude to ask what their starting wage is before I am seated?
bringthePaine
(1,726 posts)mdbl
(4,972 posts)I refuse to give them any business.
Dopers_Greed
(2,640 posts)Businesses airing internal issues in front of customers is a bad practice.
It's extremely unconformable to the customer.
Just apologize in advance for wait times and leave it at that.
ToxMarz
(2,154 posts)She went off on a restaurant she likes that is only serving take out because they are short staffed. She said THOSE people need to go back to work now. THEY made enough money now not working. I was like who are THEY and THOSE PEOPLE that you feel so entitled that they need to serve you. Who do you think you are. Nobody is required to do anything, let alone serve your entitled BUTT and not earn enough doing it to make ends meet. She and my brother have a good business (that they took over from my father, not exactly self made) that was largely unaffected by the Pandemic, and I know they got PPP money they didn't need or have to pay back. UGGGHHH!
SweepPicker
(266 posts)I see lots and LOTS of Trump supporters took advantage of PPP in my area, 21613.
Response to SweepPicker (Reply #43)
ExTex This message was self-deleted by its author.
Demobrat
(8,916 posts)They didnt lay anybody off. They stayed open throughout the pandemic and kept us going with coffee and homemade muffins to go. Protocols in place and strictly adhered to. Employees worked fewer hours but nobody lost their jobs. Instead of three people working there would be one. Nobody got Covid. Nobody quit.
Now were back and the place is packed again. Service is great as always.
SayItLoud
(1,696 posts)One of my fav places started setting the TV's set to Fox. I've never gone back nor will I. F' em.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)And religion, for which Faux's Kool-Aid is something of a substitute.
I rejected a new PCP friends strongly recommended when I found nothing but religious tracts, from just one sect of course, in the waiting room. Besides feeling it was rude, even if that wasn't meant, I want profound commitment to both knowledge and informed patients in my doctor. And zero dependence on faith medically.
Initech
(99,915 posts)I've only got a couple of dirty looks, most places usually comply. I usually ask to change it to something less toxic.
skydive forever
(443 posts)that I work for got PPP money (I looked it up, he got 130,000) and strangely enough showed up at work with a brand new Corvette around last July. Coincidence?
SweepPicker
(266 posts)quite a bit of the same in my area...
lonely bird
(1,642 posts)2 days before my 64th birthday in June. My territory, the Northeast, wasnt showing growth. They gave my severance pay until the end of September. I remembered that the company had taken PPP money. My guess is that they were afraid of some repercussions. They phrased it as severance.
appleannie1
(5,044 posts)You could call it dessert.
Joinfortmill
(14,247 posts)whoever runs that place is dumber than a rock.
Alpeduez21
(1,739 posts)But I forget who did it:
If unemployment benefits are keeping people from working for you youre not a job creator youre a poverty exploiter
Fla Dem
(23,351 posts)relayerbob
(6,509 posts)Would they care? Probably not.
CanonRay
(14,037 posts)Completely alienated about half their customer base. Dumb asses.
Response to Initech (Original post)
ExTex This message was self-deleted by its author.
Evolve Dammit
(16,632 posts)UGADawg
(501 posts)?
Shermann
(7,358 posts)I've heard this talking point echoed by relatives who aren't all that political. It seems to be a go-to excuse as to why times are still difficult in the restaurant business. While there is actually a kernel of truth to it, it is stretched way out of proportion. There was a poll on CNN of people who hadn't re-entered the workforce, and the percentage who were lingering in that group voluntarily due to the stimulus checks was only 10% or so as I recall.
BumRushDaShow
(127,312 posts)the Inquirer newspaper did a similar informal survey of almost 200 people and found similar data -
by Jenn Ladd
Published Jul 10, 2021
(snip)
Many point to extended unemployment benefits as the root cause of the nations abiding labor shortage, which has been felt in all sectors. That narrative has prompted 26 states to end federal unemployment payments before their September expiration date, while others, including Pennsylvania, have resumed work-search requirements for eligibility.
But restaurant employees assert more factors are at play, from low wages to routine customer harassment. That rare time to think, they say, led many colleagues to leave the industry altogether, while others are pressing for changes that seemed improbable only a few years ago.
(snip)
How Workers Rated Possible Causes of Restaurant Labor Shortage
The 190 respondents were asked to categorize the importance of eight possible causes of the labor shortage. The workers tended to identify longstanding labor conditions as primary factors for the shortage.
Possible causes-------------------------------------Very Important-------Important--------Not important
Low wages--------------------------------------------------------66%-----------------28%----------------6%
Lack of benefits (health insurance, paid time off, 401(k))-----74%-----------------18%----------------8%
Long hours/inflexible schedules---------------------------------62%-----------------30%----------------8%
Pandemic working conditions------------------------------------54%-----------------33%---------------12%
Continued unemployment benefits------------------------------20%-----------------34%---------------46%
Veteran workers have left the industry-------------------------32%------------------33%---------------35%
Poor workplace culture-------------------------------------------52%-----------------33%---------------15%
Lack of child care (including in-person schooling)--------------42%-----------------30%---------------28%
https://www.inquirer.com/news/labor-shortage-pandemic-workers-restaurants-philadelphia-hiring-20210710.html
Treefrog
(4,170 posts)malaise
(267,823 posts)Rec
zentrum
(9,865 posts)....why you'll never come back.
murielm99
(30,656 posts)It did not go over well. It made the local news, and the servers were allowed to tell their side of the story.
I loved that place. Now I will not be able to go back.
Ways
(20 posts)Totally correct! People dont deserve a business who will not treat their employees with respect. Little dictators.
Demobrat
(8,916 posts)made up primarily of women that kept the hospitality business running cant afford to work there anymore.
When you make $7.25/hr and childcare costs $1200 per week per child the math doesnt work.
JI7
(89,177 posts)so I have seen the attitude so many of these fools have.
GopherGal
(1,999 posts)I always said that one explanation for stereotypically professorial behavior traits is that many professors are professors because they could never work for anyone else. Maybe the same goes for small business owners -- many are in that classification because they're too "difficult" of a personality to work for anyone else.
Shermann
(7,358 posts)They've been talking about the upcoming wave of retiring baby boomers for a while now. This supposedly will blow a hole in the workforce as well as the Social Security trust fund.
For some, the pandemic may have delayed retirement. For others, they may have been prodded to move up the timeline. I suspect the latter is true more than the former. Anecdotally I know of a few. Boomers tend to have better jobs than your average younger worker, and now those opportunistic younger workers are moving up to fill that vacuum of higher-paying jobs.
This is just a hypothesis with zero data to support it.