General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsCDC to urge vaccinated people to resume wearing masks indoors in some circumstances
Last edited Tue Jul 27, 2021, 04:13 PM - Edit history (1)
Several sources have been putting out heads-up articles. Putting this here since it hasn't happened yet so not yet eligible for LBN. Expected this afternoon.
By Yasmeen Abutaleb, Joel Achenbach and Adam Taylor
Today at 10:44 a.m. EDT
The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention is expected to recommend on Tuesday that vaccinated Americans wear masks indoors in certain circumstances, citing the highly transmissible delta variant. The recommendation, to be unveiled at a 3 p.m. news briefing, would alter the agencys May 13 guidance saying that vaccinated individuals did not have to wear masks indoors or out because of the protection afforded by vaccines. At the time, cases were dropping sharply and the delta variant, which is 1,000 times more transmissible than earlier versions of the virus, had not gained significant traction in the United States. President Biden and CDC director Rochelle Walensky have repeatedly said there is a pandemic of the unvaccinated because unvaccinated people make up the vast majority of patients hospitalized with the disease.
But the delta variant has been a game-changer for the United States, sending cases surging throughout the country, and there is concern that although vaccinated people are unlikely to become severely ill, they may still be able to become infected and spread the virus. Nobody wants to go backward but you have to deal with the facts on the ground, and the facts on the ground are that its a pretty scary time and there are a lot of vulnerable people, said Robert Wachter, chairman of the department of medicine at the University of California, San Francisco. I think the biggest thing we got wrong was not anticipating that 30 percent of the country would choose not to be vaccinated.
Wachter said the earlier CDC guidance on masks was reasonable given the state of the pandemic at that time. In June we were in this virtuous cycle, where cases were going down, people were getting vaccinated, everyone said happy days are here again, and let their guard down. But then came the delta variant. When things change, they dont change in a linear fashion, they change in an exponential fashion, he said. Senior officials were debating the masking guidance on Monday afternoon, according to a person familiar with the deliberations.
The officials discussed new data the CDC has showing that vaccinated individuals infected with delta have viral loads similar to those who are unvaccinated, raising questions about how much vaccinated individuals can transmit the disease. Experts and some senior Biden health officials had grown frustrated that the CDC has not moved more quickly to change its guidance. One senior administration official said the agency was wary of being viewed as flip flopping, but senior health officials came to the conclusion that the picture on the ground had changed substantially with the delta variant.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2021/07/27/cdc-masks-guidance-indoors/
ETA - the guidance has dropped (summary portion posted below) - https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/fully-vaccinated-guidance.html
Updated July 27, 2021
Summary of Recent Changes
Updated information for fully vaccinated people given new evidence on the B.1.617.2 (Delta) variant currently circulating in the United States. Added a recommendation for fully vaccinated people to wear a mask in public indoor settings in areas of substantial or high transmission. Added information that fully vaccinated people might choose to wear a mask regardless of the level of transmission, particularly if they are immunocompromised or at increased risk for severe disease from COVID-19, or if they have someone in their household who is immunocompromised, at increased risk of severe disease or not fully vaccinated. Added a recommendation for fully vaccinated people who have a known exposure to someone with suspected or confirmed COVID-19 to be tested 3-5 days after exposure, and to wear a mask in public indoor settings for 14 days or until they receive a negative test result. CDC recommends universal indoor masking for all teachers, staff, students, and visitors to schools, regardless of vaccination status
Scrivener7
(50,932 posts)BumRushDaShow
(128,699 posts)Arkansas Granny
(31,512 posts)BumRushDaShow
(128,699 posts)It's a PITA and I have kept my errands trips down to a minimum - supermarket, post office, gas station, pharmacy and any one-off places that I need to go to drop stuff off or pick something up, or get something serviced.
SoonerPride
(12,286 posts)What circumstances?
Underlying health conditions? If you are around people whose vaccination status is unknown (ie anywhere other than with family and close friends)? If you live in a red state?
What a crap article.
This article also says Delta is 1,000 times more transmissible than Alpha? That seems new.
I have always said I will follow CDC guidance. If they suggest I wear a mask indoors in public spaces then I will resume doing so.
I will await the press conference where they hopefully reveal what these circumstances are since the article failed to list any.
BumRushDaShow
(128,699 posts)I expect that they might suggest masking in some of the same "high risk" types of situations that required masking in the past - e.g., crowded indoor venues that have little ventilation.
The transmissibility of Delta has been reported and posted about before. Some articles -
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-01986-w
https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/21/health/delta-variant-covid-19-explainer/index.html
https://virological.org/t/viral-infection-and-transmission-in-a-large-well-traced-outbreak-caused-by-the-delta-sars-cov-2-variant/724
Tomconroy
(7,611 posts)Is 1000 times greater. I don't actually know what viral load means. I've read that the delta is more infectious, meaning it makes you sicker, faster, but not 1000 times more infectious
BumRushDaShow
(128,699 posts)Delta is able to replicate itself much faster than Alpha. So in the same time frame, it actually makes many more copies of itself than previous variants. And that means if someone sneezes or coughs on you, there can be many more viral particles in a droplet from that variant.
One of the issues that is being seen is that although the body is "trained" to send out antibodies to attack the incoming viruses, it still takes a bit of time for them to get into gear and tackle them. So at least initially, the immune system can get briefly overwhelmed if you inhale that larger amount of viral invaders. Otherwise, your antibodies can usually keep up with them to neutralize them as long as there are less of them to have to deal with.
BumRushDaShow
(128,699 posts)I posted a the summary portion in the LBN OP - https://www.democraticunderground.com/10142776000
Updated July 27, 2021
Summary of Recent Changes
Updated information for fully vaccinated people given new evidence on the B.1.617.2 (Delta) variant currently circulating in the United States. Added a recommendation for fully vaccinated people to wear a mask in public indoor settings in areas of substantial or high transmission. Added information that fully vaccinated people might choose to wear a mask regardless of the level of transmission, particularly if they are immunocompromised or at increased risk for severe disease from COVID-19, or if they have someone in their household who is immunocompromised, at increased risk of severe disease or not fully vaccinated. Added a recommendation for fully vaccinated people who have a known exposure to someone with suspected or confirmed COVID-19 to be tested 3-5 days after exposure, and to wear a mask in public indoor settings for 14 days or until they receive a negative test result. CDC recommends universal indoor masking for all teachers, staff, students, and visitors to schools, regardless of vaccination status
SoonerPride
(12,286 posts)So I will be going back to wearing a mask indoors unless around known vaccinated friends and family.
All along I have said I will follow CDC guidance.
I will follow this guidance.
USALiberal
(10,877 posts)SoonerPride
(12,286 posts)I have always said I will follow CDC guidance.
As that changes based upon updated data or facts on the ground then I will follow their advice.
It really isn't hard to figure out.
People on this board also said deaths would skyrocket. Even amongst the vaccinated. That is patently false and just an example of why I don't take my health advice from anyone on DU, no offense.
USALiberal
(10,877 posts)Elessar Zappa
(13,941 posts)Ill continue to listen to the CDC.
SoonerPride
(12,286 posts)BumRushDaShow
(128,699 posts)(image from a post down further in the thread - https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=15669263)
It may look "clear" in the "vaccinated" NE and Upper MW states, but I think it's more a factor of the higher vaccination rates literally "bending the curve" and slowing the transmission. But the transmission is STILL happening and it may just take longer to get to a peak in those states as Delta moves through the unvaccinated populations in those states.
SoonerPride
(12,286 posts)Don't tell them that though! They've not been blue since since 1968.
BumRushDaShow
(128,699 posts)I mean I was just looking at the populations of the towns near some of those "blue" spots (Buffalo - a county seat, and Laverne) and both have less than 1500 people each living there.
KS Toronado
(17,178 posts)didn't need to wear masks. Everybody needs to wear them until we get rid of the virus.
And keep politics out of health issues, it is politics saying masks are unnecessary.
BumRushDaShow
(128,699 posts)and despite their calling this virus "novel", they still keep defaulting back to the comfortable assumption from their past training and experience, that it is just a "bad flu", and will behave just like other respiratory infections, which is a mistake.
They really need to internalize that this thing is "novel" ("new"/"unique" ) and is not following the old "rule book".
KS Toronado
(17,178 posts)didn't need to wear masks. Everybody needs to wear them until we get rid of the virus.
And keep politics out of health issues, it is politics saying masks are unnecessary.
3catwoman3
(23,965 posts)...in the first place.
IMO (recently retired peds NP) it would have been much better to say something like, "Numbers have been showing a favorable trend, largely due to vaccination. Should this trend hold steady over the next 6 weeks, and vaccination rates continue to go up, easing of masking requirements/recommendation may be possible."
Instead, they went from zero to 60, so to speak, overnight, and with the typical American inability to delay gratification, a whole bunch of folks basically said, "Yay- it's all over!" and threw all caution to the wind.
BumRushDaShow
(128,699 posts)There should have been a "transition" type messaging, giving leeway to allow for recommending a slow phase out of masking as we got closer to higher percentages of vaccinations.
But instead, it became a light switch with the insistence to take the masks off while proclaiming "You're home free!!!111!!! Go for it!!!111!! The vaccine will make you completely impervious to any infection, so make sure you get vaccinated!!11!!!!!"
It's not like the 18 month history of this virus in the U.S. isn't front and center, along with all the things that went on that created the waves and ebbs.
(above from CDC itself - https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/covid-data/covidview/index.html)
Wounded Bear
(58,618 posts)never really stopped.
Treefrog
(4,170 posts)I really pay no attention to the CDC. They lost me over a year ago when they, and Fauci, said masks were of dubious value.
Wounded Bear
(58,618 posts)Tomconroy
(7,611 posts)Will be confined to areas with high transmission rates.
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/07/27/cdc-to-reverse-indoor-mask-policy-to-recommend-them-for-fully-vaccinated-people-in-covid-hot-spots.html
SoonerPride
(12,286 posts)Tomconroy
(7,611 posts)BumRushDaShow
(128,699 posts)"everywhere" may end up with "high transmission rates".
I think traditionally, they have sounded the alarm if the positivity rate in a locale was above 5%. I know here in Philly as of yesterday, we were up to 3% (from 1% just 2 weeks ago), and the city has already reinstated a "mask-up indoors" recommendation.
Just today with PA's case report, we are almost back up to 1000 cases per day for the state, which is where we had finally gotten down to after the spring wave and just before Memorial Day. And believe it or not, just before July 4th, the level had gotten down to ~150 - 200 cases/per day.
Ms. Toad
(34,055 posts)BumRushDaShow
(128,699 posts)because I know here in PA, we have gone up some 250% in the number of cases since the beginning of the month.
Elessar Zappa
(13,941 posts)areas with low vaccination rates will be hit worse than high vax areas. Of course all areas will have increased virus rates but it will vary greatly.
BumRushDaShow
(128,699 posts)but then you can't assume that those who are unvaccinated are going to hole up in their locations and not move around to the other areas and potentially spread it (particularly if they start out asymptomatic or get the initial Delta "cold-like" symptoms and think they just have a cold or allergies... And then you might have someone who is vaccinated but needs to go to those lower vaccinated areas for work or to run errands, etc.
This is why the extra layers of mitigation are important - the same things we heard over and over a year ago - masks, social distancing, and hand-washing/hand-sanitizing.
Runningdawg
(4,514 posts)OK crossed my 1000 new patient line in the sand a week ago. Now I am waiting for our OK governor to make masks illegal.
Talitha
(6,579 posts)liberal_mama
(1,495 posts)Immune compromised people and kids should not have to risk getting Covid19 while purchasing groceries.
dalton99a
(81,426 posts)BumRushDaShow
(128,699 posts)Here in PA, as of today, we are almost up to 1000 cases/day, which is where we had come down to just before Memorial Day after the big Easter surge. Right before July 4, we were running in the 150 - 250/day range.
Meowmee
(5,164 posts)We never stopped. I hope masks will be required in more places and vaccines will be mandated soon..
Kinda too little too late, the damage is done.
Ms. Toad
(34,055 posts)But still so pissed they were asleep at the wheel in the first place. This was completely avoidable. Nothing that was not completely foreseeable has changed.
The fact that the CDC was too focused on rewarding the vaccinated is no excuse for:
1. Not being aware that Delta was a game changer
2. Not realizing that tacitly approving ditching the masks would discourage, rather than encourage mask wearing
3. Pretending that vaccinated individuals with COVID can't transmit it to others
4. Not acting more responsibly as to the 0-11 year olds who cannot be vaccinated.
The words "I told you so," come to mind. I have been talking about everything they are now citing as a change since the day they made the announcement (and royally trounced as being anti-science, hoping for the pandemic to continue, etc.)
Orrex
(63,185 posts)Then just wait 24 hours, and theyll issue brand new ones.
Ms. Toad
(34,055 posts)had they backed off right after their new masking Guidance when medical professionals, pediatric physicians, etc. complained. Or better yet, consulting them before they issued the guidance.
IMO they should have been more decisive and rigid from day one (or at least from day one of the Biden administration). Instead, theyve issued so many half-measures and provisional guidelines and contingent recommendations that its impossible to keep track of the current right thing to do.
Anti-maskers and anti-vaxers will always be assholes, but one can hardly fault them for expressing confusion or frustration at the CDCs oscillations.