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Liberal In Texas

(13,548 posts)
Fri Aug 13, 2021, 12:29 PM Aug 2021

Florida woman on a business Zoom call shot and killed by her toddler.

Toddler shoots, kills mom during video call after finding gun, Florida police say
The 21-year-old woman was shot in the head during a Zoom call, and Altamonte Springs police believe a toddler found an unsecured gun.

A toddler in Florida fatally shot a woman during a video call after finding an unsecured handgun, police said Thursday.

Someone on the work-related Zoom conference called 911 and reported that they had seen a toddler and heard a noise before the woman, Shamaya Lynn, fell backward, police said in a statement.

Lynn, 21, was killed Wednesday in Altamonte Springs, near Orlando.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/toddler-shoots-kills-mom-during-video-call-after-finding-gun-n1276722

Holy crap.
🥵🔫


20 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Florida woman on a business Zoom call shot and killed by her toddler. (Original Post) Liberal In Texas Aug 2021 OP
thoughts and prayers HAB911 Aug 2021 #1
"Florida toddler . . . " hatrack Aug 2021 #2
gruesome RussBLib Aug 2021 #3
We're right on this! gratuitous Aug 2021 #4
You Need To Realize That We're In A Country That Couldn't Give 2 Shits About Human Lives SoCalDavidS Aug 2021 #13
Damn! malaise Aug 2021 #5
Damn! malaise Aug 2021 #6
Oh well ..... moving on Fullduplexxx Aug 2021 #7
It must have been loaded with a round chambered for pwb Aug 2021 #8
Something positive can still come out of this gratuitous Aug 2021 #15
Not her handgun Klaralven Aug 2021 #9
Oh....But The Child WAS Injured SoCalDavidS Aug 2021 #12
Are They Going To Charge The Child? SoCalDavidS Aug 2021 #10
No. mahatmakanejeeves Aug 2021 #14
Stupidity on display to an audience Bayard Aug 2021 #11
An irresponsible parent embraces the 2A and loses her life. The NRA must be thrilled. LonePirate Aug 2021 #16
what a country... stillcool Aug 2021 #17
Where's a "good toddler" with a gun when you need one? nt Xavier Breath Aug 2021 #18
Unfortunately, there was no good toddler with a gun on the scene. lagomorph777 Aug 2021 #19
People Control, Not Gun Control Sancho Aug 2021 #20

gratuitous

(82,849 posts)
4. We're right on this!
Fri Aug 13, 2021, 12:35 PM
Aug 2021

From the NBC link:

"If you own a firearm, please keep it locked and secured," Police Officer Roberto Ruiz Jr. said. "Incidents like this could be avoided."


Because really, what else can be done in such a tragic situation? Officer Ruiz went so far as to say "please," and that's really above and beyond, isn't it? So sad, but damn if we're going to do fuck-all about reducing the chances of it happening again.

SoCalDavidS

(9,998 posts)
13. You Need To Realize That We're In A Country That Couldn't Give 2 Shits About Human Lives
Fri Aug 13, 2021, 12:48 PM
Aug 2021

I want my fucking Guns, and I don't want to wear a mask.

But I'm a good person.

Bullshit!

pwb

(11,261 posts)
8. It must have been loaded with a round chambered for
Fri Aug 13, 2021, 12:39 PM
Aug 2021

a toddler to fire it. This was preventable. That kid has to live with this now. FM.

gratuitous

(82,849 posts)
15. Something positive can still come out of this
Fri Aug 13, 2021, 12:53 PM
Aug 2021

The gun manufacturer can now truthfully advertise that its product is so easy to operate, a child could do it! Or a toddler. Just don't ask any nosy questions about how the manufacturer knows this to be true.

 

Klaralven

(7,510 posts)
9. Not her handgun
Fri Aug 13, 2021, 12:44 PM
Aug 2021

Investigators said the handgun belonged to the father of the victim's two young children, the station reported. Neither child was injured.

SoCalDavidS

(9,998 posts)
12. Oh....But The Child WAS Injured
Fri Aug 13, 2021, 12:46 PM
Aug 2021

That child is going to grow up and eventually learn, that they were the one who killed their mother. The psychological damage done will last forever.

SoCalDavidS

(9,998 posts)
10. Are They Going To Charge The Child?
Fri Aug 13, 2021, 12:45 PM
Aug 2021

'Cause since it's FL, I know they're not gonna charge the father, and the mother's dead.

mahatmakanejeeves

(57,417 posts)
14. No.
Fri Aug 13, 2021, 12:52 PM
Aug 2021
Mens rea

{snip}

Mens rea ( /ˈmɛnz ˈreɪə/; Law Latin for "guilty mind" ) is the mental element of a person's intention to commit a crime; or knowledge that one's action or lack of action would cause a crime to be committed. It is a necessary element of many crimes.

The standard common law test of criminal liability is expressed in the Latin phrase actus reus non facit reum nisi mens sit rea, i.e. "the act is not culpable unless the mind is guilty". As a general rule, someone who acted without mental fault is not liable in criminal law. Exceptions are known as strict liability crimes. Moreover, when a person intends a harm, but because of bad aim or other cause, the intent is transferred from an intended victim to an unintended victim, the case is considered to be a matter of transferred intent.

In civil law, it is usually not necessary to prove a subjective mental element to establish liability for breach of contract or tort, for example. But if a tort is intentionally committed or a contract is intentionally breached, such intent may increase the scope of liability and the damages payable to the plaintiff.

In some jurisdictions, the terms mens rea and actus reus have been replaced by alternative terminology.

{snip}

stillcool

(32,626 posts)
17. what a country...
Fri Aug 13, 2021, 02:27 PM
Aug 2021
There were at least 369 unintentional shootings by children younger than 18 last year, with 142 deaths, according to the gun control advocacy group Everytown for Gun Safety, which tracks reports.

In North Carolina in February, a 25-year-old mother of five was inadvertently shot and killed after her children found a gun in her purse, police in the town of Cornelius said.

In April, a 3-year-old boy in Houston found an unsecured firearm and fatally shot his 8-month-old brother, police said.

lagomorph777

(30,613 posts)
19. Unfortunately, there was no good toddler with a gun on the scene.
Fri Aug 13, 2021, 02:36 PM
Aug 2021

This could have been avoided if she'd had more toddlers and more guns.

Sancho

(9,067 posts)
20. People Control, Not Gun Control
Fri Aug 13, 2021, 02:39 PM
Aug 2021

This is my generic response to gun threads where people are shot and killed by the dumb or criminal possession of guns. For the record, I grew up in the South and on military bases. I was taught about firearms as a child, and I grew up hunting, was a member of the NRA, and I still own guns. In the 70’s, I dropped out of the NRA because they become more radical and less interested in safety and training. Some personal experiences where people I know were involved in shootings caused me to realize that anyone could obtain and posses a gun no matter how illogical it was for them to have a gun. Also, easy access to more powerful guns, guns in the hands of children, and guns that weren’t secured are out of control in our society. As such, here’s what I now think ought to be the requirements to possess a gun. I’m not debating the legal language, I just think it’s the reasonable way to stop the shootings. Notice, none of this restricts the type of guns sold. This is aimed at the people who shoot others, because it’s clear that they should never have had a gun.

1.) Anyone in possession of a gun (whether they own it or not) should have a regularly renewed license. If you want to call it a permit, certificate, or something else that's fine.
2.) To get a license, you should have a background check, and be examined by a professional for emotional and mental stability appropriate for gun possession. It might be appropriate to require that examination to be accompanied by references from family, friends, employers, etc. This check is not to subject you to a mental health diagnosis, just check on your superficial and apparent gun-worthyness.
3.) To get the license, you should be required to take a safety course and pass a test appropriate to the type of gun you want to use.
4.) To get a license, you should be over 21. Under 21, you could only use a gun under direct supervision of a licensed person and after obtaining a learner’s license. Your license might be restricted if you have children or criminals or other unsafe people living in your home. (If you want to argue 18 or 25 or some other age, fine. 21 makes sense to me.)
5.) If you possess a gun, you would have to carry a liability insurance policy specifically for gun ownership - and likely you would have to provide proof of appropriate storage, security, and whatever statistical reasons that emerge that would drive the costs and ability to get insurance.
6.) You could not purchase a gun or ammunition without a license, and purchases would have a waiting period.
7.) If you possess a gun without a license, you go to jail, the gun is impounded, and a judge will have to let you go (just like a DUI).
8.) No one should carry an unsecured gun (except in a locked case, unloaded) when outside of home. Guns should be secure when transporting to a shooting event without demonstrating a special need. Their license should indicate training and special carry circumstances beyond recreational shooting (security guard, etc.). If you are carrying your gun while under the influence of drugs or alcohol, you lose your gun and license.
9.) If you buy, sell, give away, or inherit a gun, your license information should be recorded.
10.) If you accidentally discharge your gun, commit a crime, get referred by a mental health professional, are served a restraining order, etc., you should lose your license and guns until reinstated by a serious relicensing process.

Most of you know that a license is no big deal. Besides a driver’s license you need a license to fish, operate a boat, or many other activities. I realize these differ by state, but that is not a reason to let anyone without a bit of sense pack a semiautomatic weapon in public, on the roads, and in schools. I think we need to make it much harder for some people to have guns.
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