This Afghanistan situation was a setup,

[duforsure]

The former guy intentionally undermined the results by reducing troop levels too low, which some in his administration told him and he ignored them. Then he got the terrorist Taliban leader with his 5,000 terrorist fighters released to aide them in retaking of the Afghan government, and now wants to claim others failed. The former guy claims they couldn't stop the process, which is odd because they wanted out years ago. The media should show the former guy aided terrorist, again, and caused this situation, and stop attacking those that were handed this mess. I turn the channel when they do that. The former guy doesn't know a terrorist he doesn't like, or aides if he can.

[Voltaire2]

1. Shitler thought he was going to win.

So the setup theory is nonsense.

[GPV]

2. Maybe there was a backup plan?

[Orrex]

24. When has Trump ever had a backup plan?

Or any plan at all, for that matter, beyond “do whatever the fuck I want and then blame everyone else.”

[rampartc]

3. if he had won he could have reneged on the deal

or al least would have faced a friendly press and complacent dems.

[David__77]

38. Maybe his party would have supported him.

…

[rampartc]

52. is there any doubt of that?

[certainot]

9. he was working for putin so it makes perfect sense

and if he won he could say the taliban lied and sent more troops back in

and his plan for winning the election was to make covid worse so he could call a state of emergency and cancel the election - while making money off covid

having his guy limbaugh call covid a hoax for the early months should be considered evidence they wanted to use it like they did ebola as an oct surprise in 2014 - to get 9 senate seats. if former guy wanted to stop or slow covid limbaugh would not have called it a hoax, and then politicized masks and vaccinations

[duforsure]

11. I suspect Putin wanted this to use,

To destabilize the Middle East more to create conflicts to manipulate higher oil prices , which the former guy failed getting oil sanctions lifted. Also to use against Biden if he won.

[PatSeg]

28. Yes, I was thinking he was doing what Putin wanted him to do

Though it's not always easy to assign motives to the erratic, impulsive things that man did.

[certainot]

42. imo like other authoritarians he's motivated by fear of uncertainty - he wants finality, certainty

i think it's sex on the wrong brain and a very bad case of the Certainty Deficit Disorder. he wants something and it's all or nothing.

like all authoritarians, but at an insane level, he's so addicted to finality/certainty that uncertainty, complications, unpredictability scare him so much he has to deny they exist. he reduces the world to absolutes - black white, right wrong, good bad and that ability is what his sex on the wrong brain followers love in him - he creates the certainty they're addicted to. when he says "like no one has seen before" he's creating certainty. he grew up like a prince with $1/2BIIL he was insulated from the lessons that usually beat that level of royal certitude out of people.

life is a game of golf to him, one hole after another. he wants something, pulls out his favorite clubs, and whacks away until he gets there and finishes the hole - certainty. then he goes onto the next hole. nothing valid exists outside his realm. he has no imagination to imagine complications or failure. capable of complete denial of reality - i didn't lose!

putins people recognize he has the royal certitude and played him with pee tapes

[PatSeg]

44. That certainly (no pun intended) describes Trump

"Certainty Deficit Disorder" - I'd never heard of it before, but it is like it was written for him personally.

[certainot]

46. sowb basically explains the trumpers, proud boys, taliban, isis as masturbation cults

[rainin]

25. It's a win win for Putin-rump. If he's elected, he can profit off the chaos

If he's not elected, he can campaign on the chaos.

[janterry]

30. agree

n/t

[GoodRaisin]

37. Why would Shitler care if he won?

If he won he still wouldn’t give two shits about Afghanistan. He’d just head back out to the golf course on our tax money.

[Voltaire2]

39. the theory was that the deal with the taliban was a booby-trap for biden

that theory has a huge problem as shitler obviously not only thought he was going to win, he is still convinced that the Democrats must have done even more cheating than the republicans did in order to defeat him.

So no, the deal was not an intentional timebomb for biden.

[GoodRaisin]

43. You are forgetting something.

Shitler is never accountable for anything. How many times have we seen this before we accept it as fact? That is what is wrong with your argument.

There is no debate that he cut the troops to bare bones and released the prisoners. If he loses, that’s bad for Biden when he tries to withdraw. That part isn’t debatable, nor can it’s significance be dismissed. It happened, for a reason.

But, if he wins, he’s a second term president that knows he won’t be held accountable for anything, much less what he decides to do about Afghanistan, if anything at all (he’s also very lazy). What he “thought” about his chances of winning isn’t even relevant when we are speaking about Shitler. We don’t know what he thought. The point though, is that he doesn’t care. To Shitler, this is a two sided coin flip. If he wins he can handle it any way he likes without consequences to himself. So yes, this looks very much like an attempt to box Biden in in case he loses, and the idea that he wouldn’t do it because he thought he would win doesn’t make any kind of sense.

[Voltaire2]

47. or more likely he didn't give a shit

I'm fine with the theory that the deal was encouraged by putin. But a complicated scheme to use this as a timebomb for biden, again, requires shitler to have a concern that he might lose the election, and also has to have shitler concocting complicated schemes as contingencies for the 'lost the election' scenario. Neither of those seem remotely possible for the narcissistic asshole. Not remotely possible. In fact it is ludicrous.

[GoodRaisin]

54. It's not near as complex or ludicrous as, say, a scheme to run a shadow foreign policy in

Ukraine to discredit Biden; or, a scheme to hijack an election to deny Biden his electoral victory.

But we can agree to disagree on this point.

[JI7]

4. In the end the Afghans failed to defend their country. This after 2 decades

they had more numbers in their armed forces plus an air force. But they did not think it was worth defending against the Taliban.

[littlemissmartypants]

5. Sometimes quantity is no substitute for quality.

Watch this video and you'll see what I mean.

The Hashish Army report by The Guardian
Video is twelve years ago but it still gives an eye opening look at the Afghanistan National Army.

[Haggard Celine]

10. Good God, no wonder our people were so fed up

with the situation over there. It was hopeless. They never would have made disciplined troops out of those guys, like a bunch of hash-smoking Gomer Pyles.

[littlemissmartypants]

22. Yep. They were doomed from the get go. nt

[cab67]

7. the numbers might not mean that much.

Evidently, it wasn't uncommon to keep deserters on the rolls so others could collect their pay.

[lookyhereyou]

20. they didn't seem to want to defend a corrupt government

with their lives.

[JI7]

23. How about defending the women of the country against the fucking Taliban . It wasn't just about the

Govt. They could try to change the govt also .

That's a bs excuse .

More likely they agreed with the Taliban or at least did not disagree when it comes to things like treatment of women.

[gulliver]

26. Trump excluded the Afghan government from his withdrawal (surrender) talks

The Afghan troops might have fought to preserve their government if Trump hadn't basically announced to the world that the Afghan government had no friend in the United States. Trump screwed up any possibility of the Afghans defending their country.

[Joinfortmill]

6. Agree

[bucolic_frolic]

8. Found, and posted, without comment

https://www.facebook.com/cyrad5099/videos/2852556471718514

[Haggard Celine]

12. Looks like a lot of veterans are backing Biden.

The veterans wanted this shit to be over a long fucking time ago, but the MIC had to keep taking in profits. Biden probably wanted to end it long before this, but he didn't have the power to do it before. Now that he's able to do it, he's standing by our troops, and he'll get a lot of credit for that. Fuck these pundits! Their opinions won't count for shit in the end.

[bluedevil4]

13. It was Obama

who killed OBL but he didn’t take the troops out. Now I understand why he didn’t take the troops out. It was easier to pass it on. President Obama new it was a mess.
Biden had a difficult task on hand and no one can argue that. I don’t know how he’s going to get around this. The British and France are sending their paratroopers in to get their people out. I don’t understand why we don’t do that but maybe they’ll save some Americans. Now I’m reading that US citizens should not go to the airport. This is going from bad to worse

[jaxexpat]

14. TFG was not a president of anything.

He had no plan for anything. The closest he has ever been to a plan is whatever little scheme he playing to get attention at any given time. Look, the guy allowed sub-human creatures like Steven Miller around him, for Christ's sake. He has no concept of society or community except for whatever half-baked, lower class, prejudices he inherited or which he's steeped himself in his whole life. Yeah, re: Afghanistan, he did set up whomever was to proceed him but the concepts and means and methods, the nuts and bolts of it, came from the Kremlin. If he'd been re-elected(which I don't think he ever anticipated)he would have simply ignored and denied, with media assistance, his way out of any Afghanistan connection and that persistent problem would have stumbled along with the unmoored and outdated directives the military had been given in 2001. I mean what's up with our military that they can't tie their own shoes without a cadre of civilian contractors in tow? Hell, the whole world's watching the colossal embarrassment of it's inability to get itself out of it's own way while having had TFG's withdrawal schedule to work with for over a year. Maybe we need to take a critical look at the readiness our "heroes" stand to.
The whole "big lie" thing is a short term scheme to perpetuate relevance which got picked up by the RW media who still run with it via GQP candidates cementing their support with the looney base. TFG was playing America when he directed his mob or morons to attack the capitol bldg. and his line to denial of culpability, again with help from the RW media, is so sewn into his second nature scheming that he knew, to a pretty great extent, he'd NEVER be held to account for it.

We might get lucky and the pestilential fool could simply die soon but we'll still be stuck with certainly the most expensive and possibly the least capably lead military in the solar system.

[Ford_Prefect]

15. The whole thing reads like Putin set it up for Trump to create a disaster for the following

Administration. It really does read like it was intended cross-circuit the western allies and Biden administration while creating as much chaos and human woe as possible.

A better withdrawal would have involved staged releases of prisoners and more coordinated actions between the allies. It could not have stopped Taliban being and Taliban since they were waiting for us to leave and would have waited another 10 years if needs be.

[duforsure]

17. I've always suspected Putin, Russian think tanks, and the gru,

We're behind this peace deal, and the former guy had to go along aiding the enemies, probably getting money funneled into his pockets using a PAC.

[usaf-vet]

19. You Think !!!

[ananda]

16. Excellent.

Exactly right!

[They_Live]

18. Who's minding the poppy fields?

I haven’t heard anything about that, and it’s important to someone since it’s such a huge money maker.

[luvtheGWN]

32. Yes, poppies are a big money maker,

but apparently Afghanistan is full of rare earth minerals, which the Chinese covet. Those minerals are necessary for the booming electronic industry (which we actually shouldn't call "electronic" since electric is passe!).

[NurseJackie]

21. You're talking about Trump?

If so, why not go ahead and use his actual name and have it clearly and plainly associated with this analysis? All this "former guy" stuff is ridiculous.

[rainin]

27. Some of us are tired of seeing his name. Calling him TFG is a creative

and effective way to communicate how worthless he is. I vote for its continued use

[NurseJackie]

31. Then why talk about him at all if it's so tiresome?

It's such a bizarre thing for adults to do.

[rainin]

33. How can you talk about current events without talking about him?

Plus, some of us don't believe he was legitimately elected, so calling him President is, and always was, offensive. Yet, we had to live with it. I'm happy that so many are actively taking his name out of the conversation.

[NurseJackie]

36. Just saying his legitimate name "Trump" will go a long way toward clarity in messaging...

Plus, some of us don't believe he was legitimately elected, so calling him President is, and always was, offensive.

Offensive as he may personally be, there are plenty of others who can deal with the reality that he was indeed elected, inaugurated, and served one full term. Ignoring facts and playing these games doesn't change history.

Besides, in order to have an intelligent conversation about him (or "current events" that involve him, or that are the result of him) you don't need to use the word "president". Just saying his legitimate name "Trump" will go a long way toward clarity in messaging and being able to exchange ideas and observations and analysis in a less confusing, less cryptic and ... frankly... an adult manner.

I'm happy that so many are actively taking his name out of the conversation.

All I'm trying to say is that this type of behavior truly serves no good purpose. It's a fad (and one that I hope ends soon) and is no better than other juvenile name-calling. Being able to discuss issues, current-events, history without needing a cheat-sheet of the latest fad nickname/insult is much better than pretending that such antics actually make a difference, or that Trump even cares what this small community thinks or says. (Hint: he doesn't.)

[AllaN01Bear]

29. my take on it that the tb have always been in place . with us gone and the ag prres gone

, just change hats .

[IthinkThereforeIAM]

34. Exactly like when Poppy Bush sent U.S.A. troops into Mogadishu/Somalia...

... after he lost the election to Bill Clinton in 1992. Among other, "things", that were left to blow up for the Democratic Party to be blamed for and clean up.

[Voltaire2]

48. "after he lost the election to Bill Clinton in 1992"

the deal was made long before the election was lost.

[IthinkThereforeIAM]

49. And then there is this...

... glad my memory is still intact!

" President Bush ordered a large U.S. military force to the area on December 4, 1992. Five days later, the first U.S. Marines landed in the first phase of “Operation Restore Hope.” "


[link:https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/bush-orders-u-s-troops-to-somalia|

[Snackshack]

35. Agreed

[fescuerescue]

40. This disaster is all Trumps deal 100%

Biden had no way to know that Trump had laid a trap for him.


I'm really afraid for what other traps that Trump has lying in wait.

[duforsure]

41. I agree,

And maybe why the DOJ is taking longer on indictments and prosecutions, to uncover their spies, and find any traps, or illegal wiretaps being done.

[Cuthbert Allgood]

50. Biden's been in office for over a year.

Certainly he had some time to assess the situation in Afghanistan. Seems like he needs to replace some of his cabinet level people if they couldn't tell in over a year that "trap had been laid."

[Strelnikov_]

51. More like a little over six months. Allowing for transition time . . .

remember, the previous admin did not provide for a standard transition, I would say four plus months.

[fescuerescue]

53. Biden had no one to know this was going to happen

Frankly, everyone was taken by surprise.

Trump needs to be prosecuted for this disaster.

Biden's cabinet didn't know either because Trump refused to brief them.

[uponit7771]

55. Over a year ?!??!! You forget the sarc tag?

[Cuthbert Allgood]

56. I meant almost a year.

The point being is that he has people that are supposed to figure this out, and if they didn't know that it was going to be a shitshow, then they should have waited. We can't act like this couldn't have been handled better. I agree we should be out of there, but it shouldn't have gone this badly.

[uponit7771]

57. So the shit show of a war was going to have a butter smooth exit?! When people ask how ...

... were we supposed to vamoose without others knowing I ask the same question.

We were going to get an exit mob no matter what is what I see

[Cuthbert Allgood]

58. Never implied it would be "butter smooth." But it could have been better.

We should have known that we needed more in place to protect those that helped us.

[uponit7771]

59. How were we going to get them all out with an exit mob? I'm thinking 10 a day for for whoever long

... but even then we'd eventually have an exit mob

Ser Spiegel is reporting the Taliban has been in control since July

[Cuthbert Allgood]

61. So Der Spiegel found out something that our foreign policy experts didn't?

That isn't helping your argument. We should have known that and planned accordingly. An "exit mob" is one thing but not having procedures in place to get our assets out of there when the Taliban is apparently in charge is not a good plan.

[uponit7771]

62. The article confirms my point, there wasn't going to be a butter smooth exit and we've

... been evacuating since July so that's more proof that there wasn't much that could be done to make this smoother and a non media issue.


Nothing anyone has presented looks like a butter smooth exit of assets **STARTED** with Putin's Whore.

There was no plan then and only could be covered after the fact

[moondust]

45. If it was a setup,

it probably wasn't TFG's idea. He has an attention span of approximately 2 minutes.

That would suggest it had to be somebody else's plan. Maybe somebody experienced at long-term planning. Like 5-year plans in communist Russia or China?

So if TFG didn't win reelection the mess would be there for the next administration. And if Pooty managed to get TFG reelected? Maybe they had a backroom deal with the Taliban.

Perhaps those rare earth minerals could help save somebody's "gas station economy."

[former9thward]

60. Let's see.

Trump is dumb and an idiot but he was able to lay a trap for Biden who has almost a half century of government experience. And that is not even counting Biden's advisors. They were all trapped by the dumb Trump. Doesn't speak too well for Biden. But the trap is found out by anonymous posters on a discussion board. Wow....

There was no trap. The exit from Afghanistan was always going to be ugly no matter who did it and when they did it. When Trump made his agreement with the Taliban in Doha it was all in the open and reported by the media. Nobody criticized it including then candidate for President, Joe Biden. Biden began receiving intelligence briefings in early December. He knew about the plan. If he did not approve it then he would have ended it. He merely extended it for a few months. He was not well served by his State Dept., Defense Dept. or his intelligence agencies. That was the failure, not a "trap".