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Atticus

(15,124 posts)
Mon Aug 23, 2021, 11:46 AM Aug 2021

I have read that some of the unvaccinated died because there were "conflicting" views online

about the vaccines' safety and efficacy and, therefore, they were "uncertain".

Is that all it takes to override thousands of trained educated experts? Someone you don't know anything about---except they are MAGAfolk---posting totally ignorant and silly nonsense which contradicts them?

If several thousand strangers wearing those stupid red caps post an announcement that they have "absolute proof" that the sun actually orbits the earth, are you now "uncertain" about that stuff you were taught in science class about earth orbitting the sun?

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orwell

(7,771 posts)
2. Tomorrow, and tomorrow, and tomorrow...
Mon Aug 23, 2021, 11:53 AM
Aug 2021

Creeps in this petty pace from day to day,
To the last syllable of recorded time;
And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
The way to dusty death. Out, out, brief candle!
Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player,
That struts and frets his hour upon the stage,
And then is heard no more. It is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.

Wingus Dingus

(8,052 posts)
4. I wish Dr. Fauci would come out strongly in favor of:
Mon Aug 23, 2021, 11:55 AM
Aug 2021

vegetables, seatbelts, helmets, quitting smoking, 8 hours of sleep, clean water and oxygen. How many of these numbnuts can we get rid of?

Haggard Celine

(16,844 posts)
5. These people are consumed with the idea that
Mon Aug 23, 2021, 12:00 PM
Aug 2021

the government always lies, so the opinion of a scientist who is employed by the government has no more worth than Alex Jones's opinion. In fact, the government scientist is probably trying to trick you, so you probably should do the opposite of what he says. Bullshit rules the day!

Johnny2X2X

(19,058 posts)
7. Research
Mon Aug 23, 2021, 12:06 PM
Aug 2021

On a bipartisan board someone told me that I am free to research vaccines before deciding for myself. My response was, "No research necessary, I trust my doctor to research things like this for me."

This whole idea that everyone needs to do research to become informed is sometimes counterproductive. As adults, we trust the experts on a number of things without "researching" their area of expertise. We might research whether or home builder has satisfied customers, but we aren't going to research foundation pouring, or the statics of frame houses. We might research what other customers think of our dentist, but I doubt anyone is researching new composites to use for fillings.

I say trust your doctor, trust the other experts. The problem is people "researching" Covid issues are really just looking for things to confirm their suspicions. And they end up giving equal weight to dubious sources. Let's face it, on some things, the average person isn't capable of doing real research that will help them make any more informed a decision than just listening to the experts. In fact often times the "research" people do makes them less informed on important decisions.

Response to Atticus (Original post)

 

Tomconroy

(7,611 posts)
10. Goofball scientific theories must have existed
Mon Aug 23, 2021, 12:15 PM
Aug 2021

Before the internet, but they were a lot harder to access. Rather like child pornography.

Iggo

(47,551 posts)
15. I haven't checked, but my feeling is they don't teach it anymore.
Mon Aug 23, 2021, 02:37 PM
Aug 2021

If it ain’t on the test…

Caliman73

(11,735 posts)
12. Why do you think we have the term "Snake Oil Salesman"? Why is the supplement industry booming?
Mon Aug 23, 2021, 12:59 PM
Aug 2021

We have always, in this country, had a portion of the population, who do not trust science and medical professionals.

While I DO NOT in any way, support anti-vaccination, anti-science, anti-medicine viewpoints; we also need to understand that on some very tiny level, mistrust of the pharmaceutical industry and of public health are valid. There have been sufficient stories about the pharmaceutical industry pushing government to approve medications that ended up causing harm, and of pushing medications on doctors knowing that they were addictive or caused harm in other ways. While, again, I will say, that this should not create such vehemence in the anti-vaccination movement, it does give them fuel. Likewise, there are historical issues within the medical and public health fields that do not promote 100% trust. The Tuskegee experiments for one, the sterilization and testing of birth control on Puerto Rican women, and other situations.

When people feel lied to or powerless, they will become vulnerable to unethical people who will prey on them with wrong, but "certain" information. Our brains are hardwired to accept authoritative information, even if it is wrong. That is why crooks are often called Con men or Confidence men. They exude confidence and gain your confidence/trust and then they steal from you. The internet just allowed the practice to move from local street corners or seedy magazines, to the tips of our fingers. I am sure if I wanted to, I could find a dozen websites that are certain that vaccinations are part of a sinister plot between big pharmaceutical companies and the government, which they have captured, to inject us with some sort of tracking devices so that... (whatever people fear whether dominance, control, stealing, etc...).

On this very forum, we often rail against the wealthy (I know I do) because we believe (with fairly good evidence) that they would like to be dominant in society with most of the benefits of said society, going to them. Well, the wealthy own the pharmaceutical industry. The wealthy also have an outsized voice in government. It isn't a far leap to think that there is some kind of cynical collusion between the two.

The problem is that the attribution and solution to said problems becomes: Install Trump, or some other right wing government. Or, don't get vaccinated to protect yourself and others, just take a horse de-worming pill that has no science backing its use for COVID-19. One of the solutions is to demand accountability and transparency from pharmaceutical companies and the government, especially in situations where there is not really a "States Secrets" or national defense situation, but there is a public health concern. Remove the profit motive from medicine. Medicine should be a societal good. That doesn't mean that doctors, researchers, etc... should not be well compensated. It means that profit should not be a prime driver of the development of medications and treatments for disease.

Also, we need to get WAY better at teaching the scientific method, how to interpret evidence, logic, and how to find and evaluate trustworthy sources. Those things are sorely lacking in our schools.

Iggo

(47,551 posts)
14. They find what they're looking for.
Mon Aug 23, 2021, 02:35 PM
Aug 2021

If all they’re looking for is an excuse to not wear a mask, they’re going to find it.

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