HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Main » General Discussion (Forum) » Moderna Creates Twice as ...

Mon Aug 30, 2021, 11:50 PM

Moderna Creates Twice as Many Antibodies as Pfizer, Study Shows

Let me start by saying, "America... fuck yeah. The boys and girls from Massa-fucken-chussetts have produced the world's finest vaccine... Red White and Blue, Made and Engineered in the USA. The true PATRIOT vaccine.

I've got it in my arm and it's in my portfolio, too...

SpikeVax.

How about some love for the Patriot Vaccine?


https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-08-31/moderna-jab-spurs-double-pfizer-covid-antibody-levels-in-study#:~:text=Moderna%20Creates%20Twice%20as%20Many%20Antibodies%20as%20Pfizer%2C%20Study%20Shows

A study of almost 2,500 workers at a major Belgium hospital system found antibody levels among individuals who hadnít been infected with the coronavirus before getting two doses of the Moderna vaccine averaged 2,881 units per milliliter, compared with 1,108 units/mL in an equivalent group who got two jabs of the Pfizer shot.

The results, published Monday in a letter to the Journal of the American Medical Association, suggested the differences might be explained by the:

higher amount of active ingredient in the Moderna vaccine -- 100 micrograms, versus 30 micrograms in Pfizer-BioNTech
longer interval between doses of the Moderna vaccine -- four weeks, versus three weeks for Pfizer-BioNTech
Modernaís vaccine was associated with a two-fold risk reduction against breakthrough SARS-CoV-2 infections compared to Pfizerís in a review of people in the Mayo Clinic Health System in the U.S. from January to July. The results were reported in a separate study released ahead of publication and peer review on Aug. 9.



Now we need to get the unpatriotic America-hating anti-vaxxers to roll up the sleeve.

44 replies, 3859 views

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 44 replies Author Time Post
Reply Moderna Creates Twice as Many Antibodies as Pfizer, Study Shows (Original post)
WarGamer Aug 2021 OP
herding cats Aug 2021 #1
WarGamer Aug 2021 #2
Hugh_Lebowski Aug 2021 #4
Rhiannon12866 Aug 2021 #13
dchill Aug 2021 #15
DoBotherMe Aug 2021 #19
ananda Aug 2021 #31
Wingus Dingus Aug 2021 #32
Moebym Aug 2021 #3
roamer65 Aug 2021 #5
moonscape Aug 2021 #16
roamer65 Aug 2021 #27
LisaL Aug 2021 #29
roamer65 Aug 2021 #34
dalton99a Aug 2021 #6
SergeStorms Aug 2021 #7
Jon King Aug 2021 #8
chowder66 Aug 2021 #38
ornotna Aug 2021 #9
Mr.Bill Aug 2021 #10
SleeplessinSoCal Aug 2021 #17
appalachiablue Aug 2021 #21
SleeplessinSoCal Aug 2021 #36
drmeow Aug 2021 #40
multigraincracker Aug 2021 #22
totodeinhere Aug 2021 #11
hlthe2b Aug 2021 #24
totodeinhere Aug 2021 #35
WarGamer Aug 2021 #39
totodeinhere Aug 2021 #41
WarGamer Sep 2021 #42
totodeinhere Sep 2021 #43
totodeinhere Sep 2021 #44
OMGWTF Aug 2021 #12
Rhiannon12866 Aug 2021 #14
helpisontheway Aug 2021 #18
SleeplessinSoCal Aug 2021 #20
Buckeye_Democrat Aug 2021 #23
LizBeth Aug 2021 #25
Shanti Shanti Shanti Aug 2021 #26
roamer65 Aug 2021 #28
LisaL Aug 2021 #30
roamer65 Aug 2021 #33
Mad_Machine76 Aug 2021 #37

Response to WarGamer (Original post)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 12:10 AM

1. The higher active ingredient meant fewer initial doses available

I'm thrilled they went the route of effectiveness instead of expedience. I realize this cut deep into their profits, but I hope it evens out in the end for them.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to herding cats (Reply #1)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 12:11 AM

2. I'm excited about the future of mRNA technology re: Cancer, etc...

I knew Moderna was potent...

Second shot straight up kicked my ass.

Sore arm within 5 minutes, shoulder into collarbone area sore within an hour... flu symptoms for 24 hours, flu, body aches... woke up at 3AM with tachycardia...

And then a WEEK of cold-like symptoms.

TO be honest I didn't feel "normal" again for 2-3 weeks.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Reply #2)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 12:34 AM

4. Got mine Friday afternoon, was 98% normal by Monday AM

But friggin' Saturday ... kicked me ass hard. I just sat on the couch all day, felt like I'd spent like 4 hours digging a trench the day before. Every muscle hurt, no energy, no motivation ... Sunday still felt bad in AM, but got a lot better as day went on.

Never had any 'cold like' symptoms, just terrible aching all over was the main thing.

Anyways, glad I got this one!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Hugh_Lebowski (Reply #4)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 12:58 AM

13. I got the Moderna, too, since that was the first one available to me, got an appointment at CVS

Though it wasn't local, the local appointments filled up fast. Most people I know got the Pfizer since that was more widely available soon after - and available early on for medical workers. I got the second shot on a Sunday evening and started feeling awful later that night and all the next day, really bad chills, nausea and I didn't want to get up since I felt so woozy. I stayed home on Tuesday, too, though I was much better by then and fine by Wednesday. I guess I should count my blessings, too, that this was the one I was able to get. BTW, I learned that Dr. Fauci also got the Moderna.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Hugh_Lebowski (Reply #4)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 01:20 AM

15. "Aching All Over" - that was the Guess Who, right?

(I was similarly affected by my second shot, as was my wife.)

Well worth it.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to dchill (Reply #15)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 02:08 AM

19. Johnny Kid and The Pirates

Kidd wrote and released it first. It's a great song, I do like the Guess Who version better.


Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Reply #2)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 09:43 AM

31. I also had a very sore arm, sluggishness, and a slight fever.

My arm hurt for a week. The other symptoms went away
after a day.

It was worth it.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Reply #2)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 09:53 AM

32. In a weird coincidence, my husband, both of my sons, and I all randomly received the Moderna.

It kicked all of our collective asses for two full days.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Original post)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 12:15 AM

3. Sweet.

That's the one I received.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Original post)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 12:36 AM

5. +1000000

The booster is gonna really kick us good.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to roamer65 (Reply #5)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 01:45 AM

16. Not necessarily. I was very symptomatic

after the 2nd one: 102 fever (declined over 3 days) and extreme fatigue over about a week. Could barely stay awake. Based on labs, had a good immunity response to vaccine even though Iím on chemo and compromised. Had my 3rd 2 weeks ago and apart from a sore arm, nothing.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to moonscape (Reply #16)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 09:18 AM

27. Good for you!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to moonscape (Reply #16)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 09:27 AM

29. I got more of a reaction after a booster than after a 2nd one.

I guess everybody reacts differently.
I am assuming that I made more antibodies after a booster, based on the reaction I had to it.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to LisaL (Reply #29)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 10:22 AM

34. Yup, they do and a bit of a reaction is good.

It tells you itís working.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Original post)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 12:38 AM

6. Kick

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Original post)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 12:43 AM

7. They all hate "Taxachusetts".

Because, you know, paying taxes is for fools and suckers. Everything should be free in MAGAatland.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Original post)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 12:48 AM

8. I read an article from a virologist that said this may not matter.

Trying to find the link to the article but the gist was that it does not really matter. The Moderna does prevent infection better than Pfizer, but severe illness prevention of both are around 90%.

The virologist made the point that even when a vaccine allowed infection, the body would produce natural antibodies, in addition to those produced by the vaccines. So after a break through infection, the person would have even more protection. And since in a vaccinated person most break through infections have no or mild symptoms, its not a big deal.

Sounds like either a mild break through infection or a Moderna booster likely gives about the same side effects anyway. So perhaps the mild break through infections are pretty much just like getting a booster shot.

The science is constantly evolving, we shall see.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Jon King (Reply #8)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 11:56 AM

38. I wonder if this might be more beneficial to immunocompromised people though since

they typically start off with less immunity. If so that would be really great.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Original post)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 12:49 AM

9. Good news

Everyone in the family is fully vaxed with the Moderna. Waiting on the booster.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Original post)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 12:53 AM

10. I got the Moderna shot back in January/Febuary.

No side effects whatsoever. It was exactly the same as if I got no shot at all. I will make an appointment for my booster shortly, as per my doctor's recomendation.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Mr.Bill (Reply #10)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 01:52 AM

17. Exactly the same for us.

I wonder if we actually are as protected as those who have reactions.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to SleeplessinSoCal (Reply #17)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 04:03 AM

21. Same, I had no reaction at all, just soreness

at the injection site for a couple days from Moderna.

I've been wondering, even after I found and posted an article in the 'health' section here by an MD who said, just don't worry about it if you had no reaction to the vaccine shots.

Twenty or thirty years ago, a flu shot would almost wipe me out for half a day or so with instant weakness, spaced out feeling and fatigue meaning it was working I think. Now, not so much.

- Few, No Vaccine Side Effects, Am I Still Protected? Don't Feel Bad, If You Don't Feel Bad: Experts, July 15, 2021. NPR, Scientific American articles,
https://www.democraticunderground.com/114225973

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to appalachiablue (Reply #21)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 11:39 AM

36. Thanks for the link!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to SleeplessinSoCal (Reply #17)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 08:08 PM

40. My theory is

a strong reaction means you were at risk for getting a worse/more damaging case of COVID if you'd been exposed, not that you have less protection.

Unless you have a defective immune system, your body is going to defend against the vaccine. The side effects are reactions to the defense, not the vaccine.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Mr.Bill (Reply #10)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 04:04 AM

22. Same here for the first shot.

But did take an extra hour nap after the second.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Original post)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 12:54 AM

11. We don't know if higher antibody levels help or not.

The fact recipients of the Moderna shot have higher antibody levels may or may not make any difference. So if I were you I would not toot your horn so loudly just yet.

It is yet undetermined what level of antibody to SARS-CoV-2 spike protection correlates to immunity against developing symptomatic SARS-CoV-2 disease.Ē And the U.S. Food and Drug Administration has issued a strong statement that ďantibody tests should not be used at this time to determine immunity or protection against COVID-19 at any time, and especially after a person has received a COVID-19 vaccination.Ē


https://multiplesclerosisnewstoday.com/columns/2021/06/15/my-covid-19-antibody-report/

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to totodeinhere (Reply #11)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 06:16 AM

24. EXACTLY. This is a VERY simplistic conclusion given how much we do not yet know about

the antibody (immune) response. In fact we group any antibodies that appear to be "neutralizing" and are miles away from establishing the level of the specific antibody that confers protection--from infection versus severe illness. Not knowing the "threshold" for protection, the specific antibody most at play makes an understanding of "durability" (longevity) of the immune response damned difficult to pinpoint. Some argue when the levels of circulating antibodies drops that immunity has dropped sufficiently to place an individual at risk And while such a decrease in CIRCULATING antibodies with a variant like delta can certainly suggest vulnerability to INFECTION, the b-cell memory (not to mention t-cell) means that in most people antibody production will immediately commence within hours of "seeing" the virus after exposure. That's why for most people severe illness is still prevented and THAT is the point of vaccination. (Thus the need for masks to prevent exposure to begin with for those MOST at risk and especially for those whose immune systems may not function properly).

Articles like this from non-immunologists/non-virologists and typically non-scientist press continue to mislead.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to hlthe2b (Reply #24)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 10:51 AM

35. Yet most of the posters in this thread do not realize that. I am grateful that at you at least did.

One poster after another is weighing in to agree what good news this OP is when actually they don't know what they're talking about. This goes back to an issue I have had with DU. Sometimes there is a herd mentality. I wish we had more independent thinkers here and less "me too-ism."

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to totodeinhere (Reply #35)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 06:37 PM

39. You're taking it a little seriously...

Moderna is a US Company and the vaccine was developed right here.

We can be proud of that.

The antibody thing, may or may not be scientifically valuable but how about the two-fold reduction in hospitalizations for Moderna recipients?

You conveniently ignored that.

So... how about just being proud of a Made in the USA product that "apparently" is the best in the world?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Reply #39)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 11:15 PM

41. I have trouble being proud of the country that has the highest infant mortality

rate in the developed world. We also have the highest incarceration rate and the highest amount of gun violence by far. Fix those things and them I might be more proud of this country. Oh, and fix the systemic racism too.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to totodeinhere (Reply #41)

Wed Sep 1, 2021, 04:11 PM

42. One more time. I'm proud of a great American company for developing what may be the world's best vax

Just can't do it, can ya?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Reply #42)

Thu Sep 2, 2021, 11:08 AM

43. I am proud of that company too and I am also proud of the people

who produced vaccines in Europe. But that doesn't change the many problems that this country has.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Reply #39)

Thu Sep 2, 2021, 11:14 AM

44. We don't know if this is the "best" vaccine or not. It may produce more antibodies but as I quoted

in my other post, "it is yet undetermined what level of antibody to SARS-CoV-2 spike protection correlates to immunity against developing symptomatic SARS-CoV-2 disease." So if that is undetermined how do you know it's the "best" vaccine?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Original post)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 12:56 AM

12. Charlie Pierce of Esquire Magazine calls it the "Dolly Vaccine"

because national treasure Dolly Parton donated $1M toward its development.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to OMGWTF (Reply #12)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 01:04 AM

14. She sure did and got her own vaccine shot live in front of cameras...



Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Original post)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 01:55 AM

18. I hope this is true

Two of my sons are vaccinated with Moderna. One is currently living on campus at a large university.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Original post)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 02:20 AM

20. Have to give Vanderbilt University props.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Original post)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 04:10 AM

23. Their headquarters are in Massachusetts, but my vaccines...

... were manufactured at nearby Bloomington IN.

When I later looked up the codes for my two Moderna shots, listed on the CDC card, it appeared that mine had left the Indiana facility only a couple days before they were injected into my arm. That's assuming a 6-month expiration date for the vaccines after manufacture each time, anyway.

American-made... and fresh!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Original post)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 08:16 AM

25. I got Moderna. Walking back into work force with lots of people, a little comforting.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Original post)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 09:17 AM

26. Cool, squeeze me another booster cocktail on Sept 20 and I be like Capt America, hell ya

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Original post)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 09:21 AM

28. Gonna find out how good Moderna is now.

An unvaccinated covidiot exposed my Dad and I this last weekend.

I hate these scumbags.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to roamer65 (Reply #28)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 09:32 AM

30. Oh no.

How did it happen?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to LisaL (Reply #30)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 10:15 AM

33. Home health person for my dad.

Iím ok. No emergency for dad yet.

Power of Moderna.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WarGamer (Original post)

Tue Aug 31, 2021, 11:54 AM

37. Kinda sucks

that we know that now and didn't really have a choice as to which vaccine we got. If we get boosters, can we mix and match or should we stick to the same one we already got?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Reply to this thread