I have long held the view that the power brokers in Russia

[malaise]

have only one aim - to break up the United States (they will never forget that the US broke up the Soviet Union). What is surprising is that the white supremacists in the poorest states financed by the billionaires at home and abroad are doing their best to facilitate the plan. Murdoch is also in on the plan.

[lindysalsagal]

1. because chaos works for the rapture cultists. It's nihilism on an enormous scale.

So depressing. I'm drinking rye whiskey.

[malaise]

3. In my much younger days my brother called me

Last edited Sat Oct 23, 2021, 05:19 AM - Edit history (2)

and water - for he knew I loved Scotch and chased it with either plain water or coconut water. It's been decades since I had any - white wine and beer. Cheers!

[panader0]

38. I'm not much on wine, but what beer do you enjoy? Red Stripe?

[Blaukraut]

2. If it weren't unconstitutional, sure. But we're all stuck with each other.

So how is this breakup supposed to happen?

[malaise]

5. They're working on tearing that up as well

I'm an optimist so let's hope the institutions hold and that's up to ordinary citizens.

[Blaukraut]

16. I'm actually pro-breakup, but can't see a peaceful, equitable way to do it

Being in a blue state, I'd rather not bow to our MAGA overlords if I can help it.

[Crunchy Frog]

6. It's not like countries breaking up is unheard of.

History happens. Even when it's not "supposed" to.

[roamer65]

8. Like Yugoslavia.

A multiethnic country that broke up along ethnic lines.

The United States would break up along political AND ethnic lines if it happens.

[roamer65]

39. ...

[roamer65]

4. Russia is fascist now.

So now the white supremacists love the Russians, just like they loved the Nazis in the 1930’s.

Charles Lindbergh.
Henry Ford.

Etc.
Etc.

[malaise]

7. Yep

[roamer65]

10. ...

Boy, am I aching tonite, malaise.

The third dose is packing more punch.

[malaise]

12. My doctor told me to take

Panadol for 48 hours after my two doses - worked like a dream.
Hope you feel better in the morning.

[roamer65]

14. Thx.

I hafta watch acetaminophen, so I took a couple of ibuprofen.

I had to whine to someone.

[malaise]

15. Versions of the same thing

should work

[blm]

9. Chaos agenda.

Putin knew Trump was into creating chaos and discord for fun AND profit.

[Walleye]

11. Yes, I think with Putin a personal vindictive hatred. The Russians in power hate the United States

It’s the same kind of persecution complex cultivated by the right wing. So much better when you can blame the other for all your problems

[cbabe]

17. Gorbachev said Chernobyl was the real reason ussr dissolved. Ukraine was their breadbasket until

they nuked it.

[relayerbob]

18. 100% agreed

[Woodswalker]

19. Not long ago my thread about America dividing

Was removed for being "Kooky". And everyday with what is starting to transpire it seems more and more realistic. Why are so many in a state of denial when they can see the walls crumbling right around them. Shit you only have to look at a short period of time in history to see it's happened before.

[malaise]

33. The institutions are still holding despite the noise

and violence. I am still optimistic but my eyes are wide open

[Woodswalker]

36. Not sure about the institutions

The biggest of which is the military.

[Roy Rolling]

20. +1,000,000

They lost their own Soviet Union of states, they hope to Balkanize the U.S.

[cate94]

21. You are right

I think it has been happening for some time. When it happens, I hope it can be peaceful but I doubt it.

[cate94]

32. No

I am not advocating for this to happen. I agree with the OP and see this happening before our eyes, for the reasons stated in the OP. My only hope was that when it does happen that it is peaceful. I don’t want a civil war.

[zaj]

22. Sort of... (and good thinking)

They want to restore the Soviet empire, but they are broke as a joke. So they have to destroy t he west and bring us down to their level.

So they are trying to breakup the EU. And, yes, likely trying to do the same here.

[DENVERPOPS]

23. If these 70 million Trumphumpers

ever figure out they were played, Katie Bar the Door.

They will retaliate against those that conned them big time. Only problem is that they are so full of denial to that that is going on, they probably won't ever wise up.

I don't feel any optimism for the future of us, or for mankind for that matter.......These assholes could not possibly have any compassion or empathy for what they are doing. They certainly don't have kids or grandkids for that matter.

Psychopaths have zero ability to show compassion. Maybe that's what is causing all this shit......Is there something they could put in the water that can cause psychosis??????????? Maybe that is why they don't care if there is lead (Pb) in the potable water lines throughout the U.S.?????????

[scarytomcat]

37. It will be too late when they figure out they have been conned

because it will be the collapse that might wake them up.

[DFW]

24. Not just the USA

There were numerous behind-the-scenes documentings of Russian involvement in Brexit. They would love to break up the rest of the EU as well. The reason that Putin-admiring right-wing regimes in Poland and Hungary haven’t already left is because they have excel spreadsheets like the rest of us, and know the level of financial support they would get from Moscow as opposed to what they get from Brussels.

I have been in Warsaw and Budapest both under socialist rule and after they got rid of it, and I’m sure the rulers of neither country want to go back to where they were when Moscow called the shots.

[malaise]

34. THIS

[dalton99a]

26. Putin wants to destroy Western democracies from within

[moondust]

40. New Christopher Steele interview

with Sky News. He believes there are "serious people at the top of Russia who regard themselves at war..."

[malaise]

42. Yep

Thanks for adding this

[pecosbob]

41. Putin pretty thoroughly consolidated power...I think he's the only power center in Russia today

The oligarchs are for the most part simply empowered thugs. There's no question that Putin has it in for us. The real question is where we go from there. My thoughts tend toward thinking the problems that face Russia will take him down eventually.

https://carnegieendowment.org/2001/10/01/simulations-of-power-in-putin-s-russia-pub-836

Hope, Fear, and Doubt

Surveying the field, we can identify three rival schools of thought about Putin's presumed consolidation of power. These are the school of hope, the school of fear, and the school of doubt. Adherents of the school of hope allege that Putin is a liberal in authoritarian clothing. They see him as a "reformer" and "pragmatist" struggling to establish new rules of the game, stanch capital flight, knock some sense into the predatory elite, introduce political stability and legal certainty, shield ordinary citizens from racketeers and bribe-taking officials, and encourage investments. Fair-minded observers must admit that some evidence supports this optimistic view.

Exponents of the school of fear draw a diametrically opposite conclusion from nearly the same set of facts. They argue that Putin is an authoritarian in liberal clothing. They see him as a KGB strongman and master of disguises. He may have rented a few liberal advisers as trompe l'oeil cabinet dressing, but he is obsessed with secrecy and bristles at the slightest criticism, however justified or constructive. He has restricted the independent monitoring of government agencies and chilled most critical voices in the media. He has even attempted to fill the space vacated by genuine civil-society organizations with cardboard replicas that do the state's bidding. Fair-minded observers must admit that there is some evidence for this view as well...

...Alongside the schools of hope and fear, we find the school of doubt. Advocates of this warier approach allege that changing the man at the top does not really change that much, because the underlying situation remains forbiddingly difficult. Fear and hope engender pessimistic and optimistic points of view; but if we look past the panic and the public relations, we will discover neither authoritarianism nor liberalism but an intermittently confused and often paralyzed Kremlin that continues to respond haphazardly to events outside its control, including centrifugal pressures that have not noticeably slackened over the past few years.

[malaise]

43. Great post

My biggest fear is that the Russians understand American GREED. Too many are willing to do anything for money and a good life.