Illinois man died of rabies, after refusing the vaccine

[LeftInTX]

Woke up with a bat on his neck. He was 87. Happened in Sept. First case in 67 years.

https://www.npr.org/2021/09/29/1041457232/rabies-illinois-man-death-rare-public-health

The majority of human rabies cases in the US involve people who have traveled from another country. Some have come from Mexico/Central America etc, where vampire bats are common. However bats in the US do carry rabies. The Brazilian freetail bat migrates to Mexico in the winter and roosts in caves with vampire bats.

However, the man in the article was bitten by a little brown bat.

Rabies often are not fatal in bats, hence that is why they carry them more than other mammals.

[RockRaven]

1. If you wake up and find a bat in your house/room, you ought to get vaccinated...

even if you can't find any bites or whatever. The risks/benefits just aren't worth it.

Rabies is one of the few diseases that can be effectively vaccinated for after exposure... And it is virtually universally fatal apart from said vaccine.

[LeftInTX]

2. Yep...my friend had an encounter with a neighborhood dog. She got the vaccination.

Dog was not rabid, but she couldn't find the owner at the time or something like that, so she just get got the vaccine. It was not a big deal like it used to be.

I think her dog got out and got in a spat with another dog and she had to separate them. I can't remember if she was bitten, but if she was, she wasn't wounded etc.

[Crunchy Frog]

3. One of my sons had a close encounter with a bat when he was seven.

Startled it on the driveway while he was riding his bike around. I took him into pediatric urgent care and they advised that we do the shots. Hated putting him through it, but better off safe.

He got a big shot of antibodies in each thigh and a vaccination shot, and then had to go back two or three more times for more vaccine shots. It used to be much worse a few decades ago.

If you find a bat in your house, try to take it in to your health dept to get it tested. If it tests negative then you don't have to worry.

[Hekate]

5. You guys are scaring the shit out of me. We had a bat in the house several weeks ago...

We think it came in at twilight — in any case, it took us two days to make it go away. It was incredibly hard to see, the way it moved.

[LiberalLoner]

6. You still have time to go get the vaccination. Doesn't hurt these days, I'm told. Better safe than

Sorry.

[LiberalLoner]

7. Incubation period for rabies after bite. You can get the vaccine any time up until you show signs

Of rabies. If you are still in the incubation stage you will be okay if you get the shot.

https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Human-rabies-deaths-site-of-bite-and-incubation-period_tbl3_7103498

[LiberalLoner]

9. More info. If you find a bat in your house you should assume you have been bitten. ROP for why.

https://blog.uvahealth.com/2019/10/09/bats-and-rabies-what-to-do-if-you-find-a-bat-in-your-house/

[Hekate]

14. This may sound stupid, but where should we go?

Our doc is 40 miles away, where we used to live. We never think of the ER now there’s the pandemic. Just recently a branch of drop-in treatment center in our new town has been advertising on tv (what my brother calls a doc-in-box) and I took note because they are using the name of the hospital where we moved from.

It’s 3:30 am and I’m going to try to sleep now, but I am freaked.

[MissB]

15. Contact your county health department

They can advise you on where you should go. Call them tomorrow.

[LeftInTX]

37. Call your doc who is 40 miles away

I assume you will probably need to wait until Monday to get a response.

[Disaffected]

19. And, the incubation period

can be up to two years (tends to be longer the farther the bite from the brain).

Don't assume you are in the clear if no symptoms show up after a week or two.

I used to rescue/relocate bats in my wildlife rehab days and have received the immunoglobin treatment (as well as vaccination boosters) several times when ever exposure was possible. You can even contract rabies by getting bat saliva or urine in your eyes or mouth (which is what happened to me once).

Don't mess with bats.....

Skunks BTW are also quite prolific carriers in some areas. In fact, any mammal can be a rabies vector.

[BlackSkimmer]

28. Possums not so much.

Rarely carry it.

[SWMO_8541]

31. Thanks!

I never knew about the saliva/urine thing!
There have been some rabid raccoons around here as well.

[LeftInTX]

39. Raccoons are an emerging threat

Raccoons are so adaptable to our environment, that their populations are exploding and their range has expanded incredibly over the past 60 years.

Yes, they carry rabies and have killed two people in the last 10 years.

[womanofthehills]

45. A few yrs ago, a raccoon came in my doggie door

It was in the middle of the night - there was thumping on my stairs coming up to my bedroom - I thought it was an intruder - my dog started barking but stayed at top of stairs. I flicked on the light - actually releaved to see a raccoon - so the raccoon runs down the stairs and jumps on kitchen counter - I open back door & my cat is standing there - raccoon ploys down my cat (cat not injured) and takes off with my dog after him. Country living 😄

[LeftInTX]

46. One local women had a horde of raccoons in her backyard picking up pecans from her backyard

She wanted to know how to get rid of them.

Based on pictures and the way she described how the raccoons were not afraid of her and or her dogs (which were golden labs?), I assumed she had been feeding them in the past. I told her to call a pest person. She says she yells at them and they don't go away. (Something was really off)

When I have raccoons in my yard, I carry a pot and bang it when I go out at night. I have evidence of them now, so the banging begins again. They have NEVER approached me. Loud sounds send them scurrying. We do get a few that look inside our French doors Hubby takes pictures of them (grhh). If I spot one, I bang on the window to scare them away.

[Disaffected]

43. No prob.

I don't know offhand what the relative risk is for saliva & urine but rabies is a death sentence (with almost no exceptions except the rare child who survives AFAIK - I do recall the case of a 12 yo girl who survived but IIRC still suffered serious, permanent neurological damage) so don't take chances.

[GoCubsGo]

22. Yep. It's like getting the COVID or flu vaccine.

Some people have no effects. Others get a sore arm and feel a little bit crappy for a day. The shots go into the arm, rather than the stomach, as they were 40 years ago. I suspect that old man wasn't aware of all of this, and feared going through what people used to have to go through. It sounded horrible, granted, still better than contracting rabies.

[LeftInTX]

36. We had a bat conservation event a few weeks ago

Speaker showed up with "pet bats"....Speaker was handling bats.
This was a child friendly event...

[womanofthehills]

55. 1 to 3 cases a yr of human rabies in US - CDC

Cases of human rabies cases in the United States are rare, with only 1 to 3 cases reported annually. Twenty-five cases of human rabies have been reported in the United States in the past decade (2009-2018). Seven of these infections were acquired outside of the U.S. and its territories.

The number of human rabies deaths in the United States has been steadily declining since the 1970’s thanks to animal control and vaccination programs, successful outreach programs, public health capacity and laboratory diagnostics, and the availability of modern rabies biologics. Yet each year, hundreds of thousands of animals need to be placed under observation or be tested for rabies, and between 30,000 to 60,000 people need to receive rabies postexposure prophylaxis. https://www.cdc.gov/rabies/location/usa/surveillance/human_rabies.html

[LiberalLoner]

8. + a gazillion

[LiberalLoner]

10. So true. Bats have very small teeth, you may not find a bite mark at all but you can still die 😭

[LisaL]

12. They knew that bat who bit him was rabid.

"The man, who was in his 80s, woke up last month and found a bat on his neck in his Lake County, Illinois, home. After the bat tested positive for rabies, the man declined postexposure treatment, the Illinois Department of Public Health (IDPH) said in a news release."

https://www.cnn.com/2021/09/29/us/illinois-rabies-death/index.html

[LisaL]

11. From what was reported, bat was tested, and was found to be rabid, back when he got bit.

He still refused to be vaccinated. At his age, maybe he decided he had lived long enough, who knows.

[GoCubsGo]

23. He probably thought they still give the shots in the stomach.

The old rabies series sounded horrible, and I suspect that he feared that more than the rabies.

[LisaL]

25. Really?

He couldn't have asked how vaccines are given if that what he was concerned about?
Rabies are near 100% fatal once symptoms show up.

[GoCubsGo]

27. Well, yeah. He could have.

But, people aren't always rational, especially in situations like this.

[TexasBushwhacker]

35. That's a rough way to go though

"There may be also discomfort or a prickling or itching sensation at the site of the bite, progressing within days to acute symptoms of cerebral dysfunction, anxiety, confusion, and agitation. As the disease progresses, the person may experience delirium, abnormal behavior, hallucinations, hydrophobia (fear of water), and insomnia."

Probably kept him sedated.

[USALiberal]

17. They can analyze the back to see if I had rabies. So you might not need a shot.

[dem in texas]

4. When I as a kid, I was bitten by a rabid dog

Happened in Dallas in 1949 or 50, I was in 4th grade. Dallas had a rabies outbreak at the time and A rabid dog ran on the school grounds at W. W. Bushman School. The playground teacher realized the dog was rabid and was trying to corner it and was bit on her hands. Just then the bell rang and all the classes poured outside for a fire drill. The dog ran around the building, right into my class as we marched outside. Of course, all the kids including me tried to pet the dog. I was bit on my leg and other students were also bit.

The dog was cornered by the man who lived next door to the school and he shot the dog. They sent the dog's body to Austin where it tested positive for rabies. The playground teacher, janitor and about 8 children were bit. We had to go to the health dept every day for 14 days to get the shots.

The whole thing was hushed up, nothing in the papers about it.

[LisaL]

13. As a little child, I got bit by a dog too, most likely mine was not rabid.

But it died and wasn't tested. I still had to take rabies shots.

[Crunchy Frog]

42. How bad was it?

[dem in texas]

57. it was a good size bite

but the rabies shots were more painful. I got the shot in my stomach each morning before school. In an an hour or so i'd be doubled over in pain. The shots left knots in my stomach that lasted for years. But I am so thankful I was able to get the vaccine or I probably not be here.

[LeftInTX]

29. A few years ago, I discovered this fascinating document

https://dshs.texas.gov/idcu/disease/rabies/history/historyInTexas.pdf

Vaccinating domestic dogs was the key to human rabies reduction in Texas and I assume just about every other state.
I had always assumed that pet dogs were routinely vaccinated in the early 1900's, but nope, it didn't start until the 1940's and 1950's. By 1960, pet vaccines were routine.







Maybe we should include canine rabies in anti-vax memes.

[USALiberal]

16. Old story. Nt

[LisaL]

18. He died last month.

NT

[LeftInTX]

24. I just saw it last night. I haven't seen in before. This is the General Discussion Forum not break

breaking news.

It struck me that he refused the vaccine, then developed rabies and died.

Most rabies cases in humans in the US are in people who have recently arrived from other countries

Rabies in some countries is still a problem because dogs are not vaccinated

[LisaL]

26. He got bit by a rabid bat,

refused to be vaccinated. So of course he developed rabies and died. Rabies are nearly 100% fatal. The reason that most cases in US are not fatal is that people who get bit don't refuse the vaccine.
In this case, I have no clue why the old guy refused to vaccinate.
Obviously there was concern enough to collect the bat and to test it.
But yet her refused to vaccinate so of course he died. I suppose dementia is possible in his advanced age, and could be the reason for vaccine refusal.

[LeftInTX]

32. Or maybe it was the anti-vax influence from watching Fox?

It happened in his home, so he must have had his faculties.

[LisaL]

34. Well, we don't know if he was living with relatives and so on.

But who knows, maybe now anti-vaxxers are convinced all vaccines are bad.
Even if disease a 100 % deadly, like rabies, they won't get the vaccine.

[womanofthehills]

47. Many many years ago, for a summer program, we took a bunch of kids to the Sandia Mts for a week

The local church had a campsite in the Sandia Mts with quite a few cabins. Staff was sleeping in a small cabin right next to the girls cabin when all the girls started screaming histerically. We ran in with our flashlights and bats were in the corners of the wall and ceiling actually opening & closing their mouths. We then walked all the crying girls a half mile down to the boys cabin in the rain. I will never forget that night - the cabin was condemned but no one even thought or mentioned shots back then.

[LisaL]

20. Rabies are a good example of vaccines saving lives.

In case of rabies, vaccine can be given post-exposure (unlike covid). Once symptoms show up, rabies are nearly 100% fatal. A few young people have been saved by intensive treatments, but almost all die. Not sure why the guy who got bitten by a bat declined post-exposure vaccine.

"Human cases of rabies are rare, with one to three cases reported nationwide each year. But rabies exposures remain common, and an estimated 60,000 Americans receive post-exposure vaccines each year. The rabies virus attacks the central nervous system and causes disease and brain death, the department noted."


https://www.cbsnews.com/news/rabies-illinois-bat-bite-death/

[MustLoveBeagles]

21. Scary

We've had problems over the years with bats coming into our house. My husband thinks they're coming in through unsealed light soffits. Right now we have a device emitting sonic waves to drive them out. I hope it works. The bats haven't been anywhere near us or our dogs as far as I know. I'll ask my doctor and vet if they feel rabies shots are in order.

[Ron Obvious]

30. Any Tetanus deaths lately?

I suppose that's next.

[LeftInTX]

33. Really.....

And I'm due for a booster....
And they're harder to come by....

I tried to get one at my doctor's office during a routine visit and she said vaccines were not covered under routine office visits. Said I had to get my shingles vaccine at the drug store. Said she would only give tetanus if I had a wound. I used to be a nurse, so I always got vaccines as part of my work.

Where do I get my tetanus booster???

[Ron Obvious]

41. I had one at Safeway shortly before the pandemic

I don't suppose that's useful information to you, but I got it with my annual flu shot at the Safeway pharmacy. The prospect of lockjaw, even if that was far-fetched, was enough to make me get one when the pharmacist suggested it.

[womanofthehills]

50. Study finds childhood tetanus shots protect you for lifetime

Adults do not need tetanus or diphtheria booster shots if they’ve already completed their childhood vaccination series against these rare, but debilitating diseases, according to research published in the journal Clinical Infectious Diseases.

The conclusion aligns with the World Health Organization’s recent recommendations to only routinely give adults tetanus and diphtheria vaccines if they didn’t receive a full series of shots as children. In the U.S., the CDC’s Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices still recommends all adults receive booster shots every 10 years.

Mark Slifka, Ph.D.
Mark Slifka, Ph.D., and colleagues found no significant difference in disease rates between countries that require adults to receive tetanus and diphtheria booster shots and those that don’t. The finding is the result of comparing data from millions of people from 31 North American and European countries between 2001 and 2016. https://news.ohsu.edu/2020/02/25/adults-dont-need-tetanus-diphtheria-boosters-if-fully-vaccinated-as-children-study-finds

[Ron Obvious]

51. I just couldn't remember if I'd ever had one

I once had paperwork somewhere with all the childhood vaccinations I've had, but I've lost or misplaced it long ago. I'm a bit disorganised, I fear, when it comes to record keeping of all kinds.

[LeftInTX]

56. The study also says 30 years, which isn't lifetime. The CDC still says every 10 years.

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/hcp/vis/vis-statements/td.pdf

The CDC info is really hard to find because it's all mixed up with the childhood combo.

Australia's site is straightforward and also says 10 years.

[newdayneeded]

58. You just have to break your finger.

I just got a booster when I broke my finger a month ago. See, it's that easy! lol.

[womanofthehills]

49. If you go to the WHO website it lists tetanus cases around the world

No tetanus cases in U S for last 2 yrs according to WHO. https://apps.who.int/immunization_monitoring/globalsummary/timeseries/tsincidencettetanus.html

Many studies saying no need for tetanus booster shots - we are protected for life from childhood vaccines.

[FakeNoose]

38. Another danger is raccoons

We've got raccoons around here (outskirts of Pittsburgh) that seem to show up on "trash" night. My neighbors put their garbage cans out on Wednesday night for Thursday A.M. pickup. So the raccoons come around and sometimes raid the garbage cans. It's a nuisance but not dangerous. The danger is when a dog or cat happens to run into the 'coon, they can get bit rather easily. The chances of a raccoon carrying rabies is high, especially in warmer weather.

[LeftInTX]

40. Yep, it's an emerging problem cuz raccoons have expanded their range and habitat in the past 60 yrs

60 years ago, they were mostly a southern rural animal, now they're urban and all over the country.

[Celerity]

44. one less dumb fuck in the planet

[Meowmee]

48. That is very sad

Someone could not convince him to get the rabies pep / vaccine. I read a lot about this after my now indoor house kitty bit me outside- he had been vaccinated once but it had just expired so I had to quarantine him. He was ok so I did not need to get pep. I was still worried though because ideally it works best if you get it within 48 hours of exposure. The first thing you should do if you know where the wound is it to wash it out thoroughly with Saline and or water or an anti viral solution for at least 20 minutes. And then go directly to an emergency room or somewhere where they have the rabies post exposure prophylaxis. You will be given injections into the wound site of antibodies derived from people who have been vaccinated with the rabies vaccine. Then you get a series of between 2 to 3 shots of the vaccine depending on your exposure in your previous vaccination history.

Incubation for rabies can vary greatly, from a week or two to one to three months to even years in some cases, as someone mentioned it can depend on how close the wound site is to your brain.

If a bat gets into your house consider that an exposure for you and any pets and get the treatment as soon as possible. There is no way to know if you were exposed particularly if you were asleep when it happened- that is considered an automatic exposure. Their teeth are tiny so you could be bitten without even realizing it and you may not see a wound. In some areas they will require that the bat be tested for rabies first. But if you don’t have the bat or other animal who is exposed you there is no way to do that and you should get the treatment. Again it’s better to get it sooner rather than later 24 to 48 hours is recommended. Check with your insurance for coverage. Hospital ED charge more than other facilities. Call your county health board as well.

Bats and other animals can also expose you with saliva, blood and urine through direct non bite contact or aerosol. So really just the bat being in your house or you walking into a cave etc. with bats should be considered an exposure. People have contracted rabies simply from walking into a cave with bats without any bite wound.

Rabies was controlled here by vaccination of dogs, the main countries where it still causes high numbers of deaths don’t have high vaccination rates of mostly stray of dogs. There are now pellets for some wildlife to vaccinate for rabies, such as raccoons but that is not available to the public to pre treat wildlife such as raccoons.

For a cat bite, You can be exposed even if the cat is not symptomatic at the time. However if the cat is quarantined and does not show signs of illness and die soon after you will be OK. The reason being that in cats they can be passing the virus in their saliva 3 to 6 days before they become symptomatic.

Once you’re beginning to show signs of illness it is nearly 100% fatal for most. Only seven people in the world who started to show the neurological and other signs have survived. One of the doctors who developed a new treatment of paralyzing the patient and treating with antivirals however believes that about 25% of people exposed to rabies develop antibodies on their own and never reach the stage where death will result.

A study in Peru of people who lived in an area with bats revealed that some people who have not been exposed and had vaccinations or had pre-exposure vaccination had rabies antibodies- meaning they were most likely exposed without realizing it, fought the virus and developed antibodies. Even if you have had previous rabies exposure, vaccination or have otherwise developed antibodies it is still recommended to be vaccinated and receive treatment if you have another exposure.

[LisaL]

52. I can't find anything to indicate why the old dude declined the vaccine.

I would assume medical professionals at the very least tried to convince him to get treatment, given rabies near 100% fatality rate. After he got rabies, people exposed to his bodily fluids had to get rabies shots.

[Meowmee]

54. I guess we will never know

But had he gotten treatment he most likely would not have died from rabies. Yes exposure from a body etc. or caring for someone with rabies is a danger. Since I do cat rescue I have thought about getting the rpep in advance but I don’t do high volume rescue and I have only ever had this one potential exposure.

[Paladin]

53. Rabies vaccines have been administered for generations, without controversy.

Godawful, totally unnecessary way to die.