Coons Says Manchin and Sinema Back Biden's Plan

[applegrove]

Coons Says Manchin and Sinema Back Biden’s Plan

October 28, 2021 at 3:12 pm EDT By Taegan Goddard 41 Comments

https://politicalwire.com/2021/10/28/coons-says-manchin-and-sinema-back-bidens-plan/

"SNIP.....

Sen. Chris Coons (D-DE) spoke to Frank Thorp of NBC News about whether Sens. Joe Manchin (D-WV) and Kyrsten Sinema (D-AZ) support President Biden’s new budget reconciliation framework:

COONS: It’s quite clear that they back this framework, it would not have been announced without their support.

THORP: It’s not really totally clear.

COONS: It’s clear that they back this plan.

THORP: That Manchin and Sinema back this plan?

COONS: I just spoke to both of them.

......SNIP"

[Johnny2X2X]

1. No surprise

This is what we've known for a few days. People have just been following the media's negative spin on everything.

"Just in, Manchin doesn't agree with the weight of the paper the bill is written on, Biden's presidency in jeopardy?" MSN

[FalloutShelter]

3. Exactly this.

[themaguffin]

9. To be fair, Manchin and Denim Vest have gone out of their way to flip us off.

[Irish_Dem]

10. Exactly. We don't have any confidence in them for good reason.

[AZSkiffyGeek]

16. To be fair, Sinema hasn't said a word until today

People have taken anonymous reports and her silence to mean she was a seekrit Republican who was going to nuke the whole thing.

[honest.abe]

35. +1

[Fiendish Thingy]

2. Then pass the BBB first, then the house will pass the BIF. Nt

[Johnny2X2X]

5. That's been the plan for months

Am I missing something? Of course that's what they're going to do, that's what they said they were going to do for months.

[lagomorph777]

6. It sounded like Pelosi was caving on that today.

But I could be mistaken.

[Fiendish Thingy]

15. Biden backed down today and urged house to pass BIF first

[Autumn]

4. With eventual changes?

[hamsterjill]

26. With Manchin and Sinema still in charge?

I’m laughing at all of the posts indicating there will be more and better down the line. This took way longer than originally expected and has been whittled to less than one-third of what was originally sought.

I won’t hold my breath.

[Autumn]

27. This is a movie I have seen before. Manchin and Senima seem to be the understudy for each other

[hamsterjill]

33. Very good example.

Almost like they are receiving instructions from someone, right?

[Autumn]

36. Right as rain.

[hamsterjill]

38. And...

Has Steve Bannon been locked up yet? Guess I missed that, right?

[Autumn]

39. Priorities ya know. Maybe we can get Sinema and Manchin on board talk about it.

[hamsterjill]

43. That would be exciting!!!

Of course we would start out wanting him in jail, then Manch would balk and offer house arrest. We’d agree but then Sinema would decide that she wants him to be able to leave the country, so we would have to give in because we can’t buck the two who are really in charge, so we’d just agree to forget the whole thing.

And some on here would be telling us to be happy because it could have been worse.

Bad analogy??? LOL

[mcar]

7. Biden wouldn't have announced it otherwise

[Irish_Dem]

11. Unless they have lied to Biden.

[mcar]

13. Why would they do that?

[Irish_Dem]

14. Because they can.

Both are narcissistic personality disorders.

[FoxNewsSucks]

47. THey haven't been dealing honestly anyway, why not lie also?

[berni_mccoy]

8. So pass it in the Senate so the House can vote on both together then

And why aren’t they saying this themselves?

[wellst0nev0ter]

12. Nothing's decided until everything's decided

That's the same thing Manchinema said with Biden announced the two-track plan.

I trust them as far as I can throw them.

[AZSkiffyGeek]

17. It's interesting how all these positive threads are getting swarmed by people calling bullshit

It's almost like they don't actually want good news.

[Silent3]

19. Oh, I want good news, badly...

...I just have absolutely no trust in Manchin and Sinema until whatever is left of BBB gets voted in by both houses FIRST. Anything short of that, and those two WILL fuck us over.

[Demsrule86]

20. some don't. They are spoiling for a fight and want to deep six both bills...just as the wanted to do

with the ACA which has undoubtedly saved millions of lives...there is much good stuff in this bill...it is almost like the Great Society bills really.

[FoxNewsSucks]

48. No, we don't want a fight, and don't want to kill the BBB

We want corporate conservadems to live up to the deal they made - progressives vote for the BIF which contained things we don't like in exchange for "moderates" voting for the BBB which contained things they don't like. It was compromised to $3.5T and agreed upon. That was the deal, and progressives lived up to it.

Why can't they other side keep their word? We did.

[Bettie]

53. It's almost as if we've seen this before

and know what is likely to come next.

It is like the scene in the Disney Cinderella movie when she comes down the stairs in the dress she made to go the ball and her stepsisters tear each and every piece off until she's dressed in rags, then they go off to the ball smug and happy that they ruined her night.

Except there is no fairy godmother coming to help out. Just an evil turtle giggling in the shadows.

[Silent3]

18. I still don't trust Manchin and Sinema until BBB gets voted by both houses FIRST.

Even if these two publicly, boldly swear their support, on their knees in front of Pelosi, Schumer, and Biden on live TV. If the bi-partisan bill gets signed first, they WILL fuck us over.

[Demsrule86]

22. Seriously? They are not the boogie man...I have not know Manchin to lie and go back on a deal...

I doubt Sinema would either. I suggest you remember that these are Democrats of which you speak.

[AZSkiffyGeek]

23. That doesn't matter - the mob decided a long time ago...

That "Don't Bash Democrats" doesn't actually apply to Sinema or Manchin.

[Demsrule86]

34. I don't understand that ...yet when AOC (whom I like) announced she would not vote for the

compromise...she was a hero. How is it different exactly? This is Democratic Underground and trashing Sinema and Manchin should not happen here.

[Celerity]

46. AOC's supported Biden's agenda for months, whilst Manchin & Sinema have been playing slash 'n shred

Machin and Sinema have ripped out vast parts, entire programmes, headline programmes, that were major Biden (and most Dems') campaign promises

As it stands, in terms of total 'compromise' dollars between the 2 bills, in terms of new spend

Manchin and Sinema have 'compromised' $250 billion total upward from their original offers in terms of new spend between the two bills

Biden and many of the Dems, Progs included (who initially, months and months ago came WAY down from their original 10 trillion total for the 2 bills number and agreed to get behind Biden's $6.1 trillion topline new spend number (2.6 trillion for the BIF, 3.5 trillion for BBB) 100%), have come down $3.8 TRILLION in new spend.

So the 'compromise' scorecard for the two bills is

Manchin/Sinema: a plus $250 billion total, all of it on the BBB

Biden and most Dems: a minus $3.8 trillion total between the 2 bills, with the BIF new spend reduced by almost 80%

That is 15.2 TIMES MORE than Manchin and Sinema have given in on, in terms of dollar movement. Also, that includes Manchin & Sinema's tag team vast removal of entire key, crucial programmes, not just reduction in terms of duration or funding, or amount of funding.

That is not actual 'compromise'. That is a Manchin and Sinema damn near unilaterally-dictated gutting of what is closing in on nearly 2/3rds of Biden's agenda, his proposals for the two bills, proposals that all the Progs compromised on and accepted 100%, and are fighting like hell for.

And even after all that, neither Manchin nor Sinema will, even at of this late (figuratively speaking) hour, still even say they are 100% on board with the BBB framework as it stands (it was released to all the Dem Congressional caucus hours and hours ago). That is why Pelosi recently cancelled the BIF vote for tonight.

[FoxNewsSucks]

52. Good post!

I wish some here would read it, take the time to read it again, then think about it and read it one more time before continuing the sickening tongue-bathing of a certain two Senators.

[Silent3]

25. The fact they've already caused so damage to what BBB could have been makes me not trust them

They've clearly put special interests and their own power ahead of the good of the American people.

Even in Manchin's Trump-loving West Virginia, much of what Manchin made us cut from the bill is popular and would have helped his constituents.

The totally flaky way Sinema has been acting makes me not trust her one bit. She's already had staff resign in protest, criticizing her for her contemptuous attitude toward the people she's supposed to be helping, while she parties with donors and amiably chats with Republicans.

And since I don't think either of them are stupid or naive, they should know these bills aren't just about these bills, but they're about whether we keep our democracy or not. If Republicans gain control of either or both Houses in 2022, the slippery slope into Trumpian autocracy gets very, very slippery indeed.

Nevertheless, these two fuckers act like they don't care. Manchin worries more that billionaires will feel we're being too divisive, and Sinema worries more about Big Pharma profits. Both so far refuse to budge even a little on the filibuster. Without that, Republican voter suppression will procede unchecked.

And you wonder why I lack trust here?

[Demsrule86]

32. It is called compromise...did you really believe that BBB would sail through in a 50-50

Senate...it is nothing short of a miracle that we got such good bills...these bill are a game-changer...a BFD.

[Silent3]

37. The bills will be better than nothing, yes, even pretty big and important... if they both pass.

AND if they don't get watered down even more between now and hypothetical passage. AND if Sinema doesn't decide at the last minute that all federal highway lane lines have to be painted pink, otherwise she can't support any of this.

Yes, I do expect compromise. But this is very lopsided compromise that isn't about different visions of what's best for America. It's a lot of good Democrats trying to do good for America, forced to compromise with two DINOs with their own selfish, narrow agendas.

[FoxNewsSucks]

50. It was supposed to. Yes. THAT WAS THE DEAL

Do you really not remember?

3.5T WAS the compromise. Now those two conservadems went back on their word and demanded further changes to what they don't like, even though those things will benefit the public greatly.

[FoxNewsSucks]

49. It might be easier to remember if they would ACT like Democrats.

Since when do Democrats work to sabotage the agenda of a popular Democratic president?

[TheBlackAdder]

21. Yeah, they stand behind it. Two miles behind it.

[Dopers_Greed]

24. They probably do support the plan

Just trying to milk this for as much attention as possible while they still can.

[JHB]

28. The show ain't over 'til the fat lady sings

Maybe they do, maybe they don't, but they can't be trusted until they actually put down "yes" votes.

[blueinredohio]

29. We shall see.

[IronLionZion]

30. Dems in array

I hope

[Patton French]

31. Is there going to be a vote tonight?

Haven't heard the latest.

[gab13by13]

42. No vote tonight

[johnthewoodworker]

40. Manchin and Sinema will do exactly what the wealthy tell them to do.

[MadMike47]

41. That was five minutes ago.

What about now?
Or five minutes from now?

[gab13by13]

44. You know what gets me?

People complaining about the 1.75 trillion BBB Bill. I'm 74 but my memory is still OK, doesn't last as long but OK. I remember president Obama getting a 787 billion dollar stimulus bill that jump started the economy. The BBB Bill is more than double that of president Obama's. Is my memory close?

[FoxNewsSucks]

51. Numbers are correct, but different timing.

Obama's stimulus was a one-time thing. The BBB is 10 years of spending, so it's 175B/ year.

[MoonlitKnight]

45. I will wait for them to say they back it

Let’s give everyone time to read it and agree.

[Wounded Bear]

54. Nice to hear, but I'll believe it when the votes are counted...

I'm kind of with the House Progressive Caucus.