Again I have watched a press conference held in Uvalde, Texas by law enforcement and

[Atticus]

again I find it infuriating. This guy, Victor Escalon, just spent several minutes telling us how horrible the shooting was and then more minutes during which he DIRECTLY CONTRADICTED what his uniformed counterpart told us this morning.

THIS MORNING the story was that there was an armed school security officer plus two cops who "engaged" the shooter outside the school and FOLLOWED HIM INSIDE, where he "barricaded himself inside a classroom" and began killing kids. NOW, ---are you sitting down?---there was NO school security officer present, cops did not "engage" the shooter inside until he'd been there for four minutes and after 12 MINUTES passed between the shooter wrecking his pickup and when he entered the school!

What happened during those 12 minutes? They don't know. They're "investigating".

Was the door locked? They don't know: they're "investigating".

THIS MORNING, the shooter was inside for "40 minutes, maybe as much as an hour" before he was shot and killed. NOW, the border patrol officers, who killed the shooter, did not ARRIVE for an hour.

And, some seriously wounded kids who were lying inside BLEEDING during this hour LATER DIED! That hour was what trauma medics call the "Golden Hour"---during which seriously wounded victims must be treated if they are to survive.

This morning I said that "something" was being concealed. It now appears that that "something" is gross incompetence and cowardice.

[Wingus Dingus]

1. They were mostly hanging back, hoping the shooter ran out of ammo or shot himself.

Guarantee it.

[halfulglas]

4. They don't realize that most of the mass shooters who kill themselves don't do it until

Confronted with enough force to know they aren't going to make it out alive and they do themselves in rather than left the cops do it. This is an entirely different situation than suicide by cop. That's why after Columbine its standard practice to go in as soon as a few cops are on the scene. Every minute delay is a chance for more casualties.

[BadgerMom]

18. Why weren't cops trained as well as kids & staff?

I’ve read this—that since Columbine LEOs are trained to enter the school in order to distract the shooter from students and, perhaps to trigger the shooter’s surrender or suicide—in several places in the past few days. Clearly, the Uvalde police, Sheriff’s deputies and other law enforcement in Uvalde didn’t follow this protocol—a protocol that makes sense to this former teacher. Why? Are these LEOs more poorly trained than the students and teachers? Or are they cowards who should never have become cops? Do fire fighters not know how to respond while kids and teachers regularly practice fire drills? Republicans need to see that the women and children in that elementary school were asked to be heroes while the armed cowards pushed around parents.

[lapfog_1]

2. yesterday, when rumors started circulating

I posted in a couple of threads that this wasn't going to look good for the cops or the SRO (who, apparently, was not even present).

and I was told that I needed to wait for the facts.

Well, the facts maybe will come out... but there seems to be a concerted effort now by Texas DPS to coverup what happened.

[elleng]

3. Sounds like INCOMPETENCE being 'concealed.'

[hamsterjill]

5. You have to understand Uvalde.

I grew up there. I don’t live there but I can promise you that some things never change.

First, the majority of the people there are big time Trumpers. The ones in power, at least.

Second, there are and always have been definite racial tensions.

Third, these people are not used to having to answer for their actions. They would normally put out a story and that would be the end of it. In this case, we have the national media with real resources verifying and checking the information that is being fed. The powers that be in Uvalde are in new territory.

It’s going to be interesting…

Those families deserve answers!

[BadgerMom]

19. That's why what Beto did was so important.

The mayor who shouted at him and the politicians who were up there trying to conceal the truth, but labeling Beto’s actions as political kill me. That whole charade was political. They weren’t in church. They were at a news conference held by politicians in order to cover their butts. Beto had the gall (in their eyes) to speak truth to power. May others continue to do so.

[hamsterjill]

21. Oh absolutely.

Beto surprised the hell out of them.

Just in case anyone is interested, the negative comments are slowing down on the Uvalde mayor’s personal Facebook page. The mayor is the one who called Beto a “sick son of a bitch”.

The mayor’s name is “Don McLaughlin” in case anyone might want to comment.

[BadgerMom]

22. Thanks!

[BrightKnight]

53. He should propose a comprehensive plan.

Mandatory training and drills.
School hardening with things like magnetic locks for instant remote lockdown.
Gun control measures to keep guns away from nuts.

A lot of people in Texas are really angry about this.

[LeftInTX]

23. I don't know much about Uvalde, but sounds like "good ole boy"

Pretty sure Hondo, Bandera, Del Rio etc are the same way.

I've heard Del Rio is conservative.

[hamsterjill]

31. All are "good ole boy".

You know how that works! Wink! Wink!

[IronLionZion]

40. It sounds like the police are mainly to keep the Latinos in their place

rather than actually provide any security. That is often the case in some places where MAGAts "fear for their lives" when there are too many brown people around.

[hamsterjill]

41. Except the majority of the police are Latino themselves.

There are many Latinos, especially in law enforcement, who are Trumpers.

[IronLionZion]

44. That's disappointing

Many of the police here in DC are black and there is still a lot of shootings

[TreasonousBastard]

6. The cops outside very likely had no training in what to do under the...

circumstances, and were waiting for orders. Some of them were stupid, some assholes, some being careful, just as any group of people facing a new situation would be.

Granted that it appears they were doing nothing, but we have not heard from actual cops uninvolved with this scenario telling us what was happening.

That, of course, means nothing to the chorus of armchair heroes who all seem to know exactly how the cops should have acted. I have yet to find an armchair hero with all the answers who had any worthwhile answers at all. Often they don't even have the right questions.

The point overlooked here is that we don't know, and our opinions should be ignored until we do. And not taken too seriously even then.

[Atticus]

8. I agree there is much we do not know. Whose fault is that? And, what we "knew" this

morning (when they told us ), has now been directly contradicted by what the just told us.

The story this morning about the armed school security officer "engaging" the shooter before he entered the school sounds much more like a lie than a mistake. And, how much "investigation" does it take to find out just HOW th he shooter "barricaded" the door.

These cops have shot themselves in both feet. They sound to me like people who are not used to having their story of "what happened" questioned.

[BadgerMom]

20. +1

[ret5hd]

12. We DO know this much for ABSOLUTE fact:

1) there was a VERY active shooter
2) inside a SCHOOL
3) the cops stayed outside

So, do we need to give them more money?

[70sEraVet]

27. I never cared for the 'defund the police' slogan, but I'm sure that teachers would like some pay

redirected to them. Especially if they're the ones going into the line of fire to protect kids.
You probably saw what these teachers did last week in East Nashville.
https://www.tennessean.com/story/news/education/2022/05/23/inglewood-elementary-school-intruder-meet-teacher-who-tackled-him/9887901002/

[llashram]

38. we need the police true

but the last 10 years have shown me just how racist the Americans hiding under the authority of badges and guns are. White privilege and the threat to that? Responded to immediately. POC, usually black and brown Americans responded too much slower.

[IronLionZion]

45. I highly doubt they defunded the police in that area

so maybe not a funding issue

[ret5hd]

47. Of course they didn't "defund" them...

i JUST NOW saw a spokesman on the news praising the cops BRAVERY and COURAGE…like they are expecting us to fall to our knees in thanks and praise.

I’m fuckin’ ill.

[JanMichael]

17. Sorry they are not just any other group of people facing a new situation

They are sworn police officers and even Texas has standards.

Even the podunk rural areas around here practice for this sort of thing because they get free weapons to play with from the military.

So I don't think it's reasonable to assume that there's just the same dynamic as any other group of people witnessing the same thing or something different. They had a bunch of chicken s****. People that probably should have never been cops. God forbid they were firemen waiting for the fire to go out before everybody burned up.

[llashram]

39. +++

[llashram]

33. no you are wrong

too much video evidence and contradictory statements from TPTB. You are wrong in your assessment because too many have been trained out here and know exactly what should have been done by these cowards. One hour for children to bleed out due to inaction by stupid law enforcement. 1 hour!!! And I have talked with uninvolved safety officers and they are aghast at what happened there to the children. Due to cowardly inaction by adults, before and after. Beto has my vote and money...

[thucythucy]

51. "The cops outside very likely had no training in what to do..."

Really? That seems like a reasonable proposition to you?

A very substantial part of that town's budget, from what I've read, is devoted to law enforcement.

School shootings have been in the headlines now for decades.

If cops aren't trained in how to respond to a school shooting, what the fuck is it they train for instead?

I've seen photos of what is described as the department's "SWAT team." SWAT="Special Weapons and Tactics." So, the local cops evidently have a SWAT team that isn't trained in how to respond to a mass shooting? If so, someone needs to seriously look at how this department spends its budget.

And yeah, by all means, let's wait a few days or weeks so the cops involved can get their stories together. Because we've all had so much experience with the police coming clean on their own malfeasance and incompetence.

I'll also be waiting for the inevitable body cam "malfunctions."

I apologize in advance for my snarky skepticism. Under the current circumstances this is about as civil as I can be.

[Ocelot II]

7. It's become increasingly evident that they screwed up big time -

whether that was from confusion, inexperience, incompetence, bad information, bad training, chickenshittedness, or some combination thereof remains to be seen - but they can't get their stories straight, they can't figure out how to spin their conflicting versions, and the fact that it was all a terrible, tragic clusterfuck can't be covered up for much longer.

[Nevilledog]

9. More on Escalon

Link to tweet

Tweet text:

Liliana Segura
@LilianaSegura
This is literally the same man who, as a Texas Ranger, brutally interrogated Melissa Lucio on the night her daughter died to send her to death row.

Jeremy Stahl
@JeremyStahl
Victor Escalon, Regional Director, South Texas, Department of Public Safety literally just said of cops involved: "I'm a father. I can't go home tonight and hug my kids. That hurts. The members behind me--our family members. Their kids. It's tough. It's hard." What the holy fuck.
12:44 PM · May 26, 2022

[Lars39]

10. And that's when I started yelling at the tv.

[Novara]

11. Heads need to fucking roll

These motherfuckers keep digging themselves in deeper and deeper.

[Probatim]

15. Heads won't roll - these motherfuckers will be receiving awards and getting promotions.

[inthewind21]

13. NOW

The "tactical" team that was being waited on, well the BP officer who shot and killed the shooter worked at a detention center near by and was OFF DUTY. He lived in the area. Some of that "tactical team" were local police who live in the area. That was just reported. Sounds to me like it was not a "team" it was local officers, some off duty, who had the guts to go in.

[kimbutgar]

14. Sounds like that local police F'ed up badly

[Torchlight]

16. After all is said and done, my guess is that

we'll find out the entire department in Uvalde is staffed by a gaggle of Barney Fifes. Odd press conference, his rationalizing incompetence as something else seemed to be the trigger that got his dander up.



I've worked with the incompetent before, but at least they were never responsible for public safety or carried a firearm.

[llashram]

35. barney fifes

makes this tragedy lighthearted. Barney Fifes under sheets and pointy hats is more like it. After all, this was a majority Hispanic elementary school and LEOs not wanting to protect them points me in one direction.

[spanone]

24. FBI needs to take over.

[3825-87867]

26. Under Wray?

The FBI is still out about Jan 6!

Check back in 2025. Oh wait, I would think it will be dropped by then.

[Chuuku Davis]

48. Justice Department Won't Charge FBI Agents in Nassar Case Failures

From the Wall Street Journal

The Justice Department said Thursday it is standing by an earlier decision not to charge the FBI agents who disregarded Olympic gymnasts’ allegations that former national team doctor Larry Nassar sexually assaulted them and later made false statements to cover their mistakes

Officials said in October that they would review their decision not to prosecute the agents. The monthslong inquiry analyzed evidence and the outcome “reflects the recommendation of experienced prosecutors,” the department said in a written statement.

[3825-87867]

25. Change their views on guns?

You have to wonder if the parents or relatives and friends of the dead and injured children would have a change of heart about Amendment 2.

Nah!

I'm betting rationalization and excuses win out.

Mores the pity.

[PurgedVoter]

28. School Security is for the most part, Security Theatre

My career has been working inside Texas schools. I have been included on the police walk throughs multiple times. I have seen schools that were designed with security in mind.

The security in mind was all show. Any child in the school with a mind to, can bring things in using back doors. Any child that can exit a door, can open the door for entry. If a school has identification cards, they are more vulnerable than schools where people who work and go there can recognize each other. Technicians, contractors doing repair, maintenance, janitors and air conditioning repairmen all have keys and access. By nature they come and go and they are not trained in security. You cannot have a school stay in shape and not have serious security issues.

Anyone who has ever been on a military base when the security protocols have been raised, knows what real security is. Real security is such a pain that all the teachers would leave in the first year. What you see when you look at a school is a place where the teachers and staff still put passwords on the bottom of keyboards. You see a place where the councilors and cheerleaders open doors for each other and let whatever come back in and out.

I have met brilliant officers that made a school a safer place. I have seen officers in schools that made a difference, made the school safer and contributed to the security of the school and the community. That is the only security that works. A detective who is tough and fit, ready to do the right thing and has a personality that people will talk to, is the best extra security you can have. I cannot give enough praise to the truly fine officers I have met that were more observant, more fit and more vigilant than I could ever be. The best are always listening and always learning. The best officers are practically superhuman in my eyes and I am not exaggerating. Sadly, the police are made up of a mix of people.

Some of them are weekend warriors who are waiting for the end so they can profit by being the only ones ready for it. Some officers take to the training that teaches them to lie like fish to water. Some officers are bullies that love to swagger with a gun on their hip. Some are damaged ex military who still see it all as them and us. Some didn't make it as the sports star they wanted to be. And some went to authority as the fastest road to opportunity.

When you have a mix like this and the ranks are tight and will not turn on each other, security goes away entirely. If an officer is not the active, intelligent, listening individual you need for a community or school to be safe, then you have problems.

[Liberal In Texas]

29. I think we might ought to have an investigation that doesn't

include Texas law enforcement. Maybe FBI or ATF.

Some agency needs to go over all the evidence (body cams? radio chatter? cell phone video?) and piece together a timeline. If there were cowards that could have stopped this, we need to know.

[Stuart G]

30. Lies are still lies......and they don't want to tell the truth, so they lie...Just like Trump!!

He lied so often that one couldn't tell the truth from a lie, His most famous lie, "It's all a hoax"

[TeamProg]

32. Holy f******** f**** f****!!!

Guys with guns are COWARDS! Good guys with guns are the very same COWARDS !!

[Ziggysmom]

34. But we must, must send US Marshals to protect our wimpy SC judges homes from peaceful

protesters! WTF?

[Emile]

36. They know here in a day or two there will be another mass slaughterhouse shooting

and this will all be forgotten.

[lastlib]

37. It's a grand pity that donald tRump wasn't there...........

*Brave* man that he is (war hero an' all....), he would've rushed right in and taken that shooter down!

We all know that!


.


.


.


(for anyone who needs it)

[IronLionZion]

42. Reform the police, record the police, ask uncomfortable questions

It's time to hold police accountable when they fail to protect and serve.

At a minimum, they should have helped some kids escape.

[BComplex]

46. Amen.

[Jilly_in_VA]

43. Sounds to me

like the local cops were/are STUPID, INCOMPETENT, and COWARDLY. Not necessarily in that exact order.

[BrightKnight]

49. The standard response to an active shooter is get anything

you have to it as soon as possible. Any law enforcement agency should know this.

There really should be mandatory drills for this kind of event.

I’m sure the State doesn’t provide funding and poor small towns would struggle to afford it.

Magnetic locks are not that expensive and would allowed a school to instantly total lock down.

[jcgoldie]

50. Right

How the fuck can they say they thought it wasnt an active shooter as kids are literally calling 911 repeatedly as he kills people?

[iemanja]

52. NPR says it was an hour.