Was talking to someone in business who explained to me why you can't get a phone number

[applegrove]

Last edited Mon Jan 16, 2012, 12:19 AM - Edit history (1)

when you got to a company's website. They want people to figure out their own problems, even if it takes more time. If they lose 10% of customers who cannot figure out the faq s or the online directives, they don't care. If they put a phone number up, the number of customers who use the phone lines would be 80% and the company would then have to man a phone bank.

All part of saving money and garnering a big bonus for the ceo who came up with the idea I would guess. Makes me so mad.

[BlueToTheBone]

1. Well, we put our number on our website

we need/want those 10% who are having problems. In fact, one called me today and I answered and he was so happy to place his $50.00 order. We were delighted to have it and it let me know of a problem that others wouldn't call about, I'd just lose money.

[applegrove]

2. Good for you. You are a rare bird these days.

[laundry_queen]

5. And that is the smart thing to do

Too many of these 'bean counters' often don't take hidden costs into account. For instance, yes, not having to man phones might save you more than that 10% is worth in straight, everyday sales. However, as your example shows, with good customer service, those people are often very thankful and you receive a certain amount of brand loyalty thereafter which is goodwill any company would love to have.

I will also say that I'm the type of customer that if I'm unhappy, I tell people. Lots of people. Put it online, twitter it, whatever. In this day and age, bad customer service will bring you the wrong kind of publicity FAST. And that costs sales. Too many CFO's and controllers don't take that stuff into account.

[NBachers]

26. I tell people to buy Moen faucets based on their excellent customer service

I used to be lukewarm on Moen. But their customer phone service is literally the best customer service of any corporation I've ever seen. You get a live person who knows what they're talking about and is happy to help out. Their number's on every box.

I used to primarily be a Delta advocate, but Delta's done some real bone-headed moves lately that seem to be made by upline people who never check with the customers, professionals, or sales people. So Delta's gone down in my book. Their resource material leaves me boggled, confused, and frustrated. Our Delta reps are sick of hearing me complain about it. So I'm moving away from Delta.

I spoke with a Netflix rep yesterday who was quick, cheerful, and solved my problem right away over the phone.

So endorsements for good customer service.

[matt819]

17. I'm the same way

We have our phone number all over our site, and even on our FB info.

I've noticed that many websites make it hard to find phone numbers, and some even make e-mail contact difficult.

[BlueToTheBone]

36. and I don't know why, unless they are not

proud of what they do. If we have a problem, I certainly want to know. If I don't, then the customer's unhappy, will never refer and won't come back. Even if I do some stupid thing to their order, if they are treated with respect and fairly, they not only refer but make repeat orders. Repeats are where all the money is.

[laundry_queen]

3. Every decision they make is cost vs benefit

There is no thinking involved, just numbers.

If they would spend more money manning the phones for that 10% of customers than they would lose if those 10% just decided to walk away, they will take the chance those people walk away.

Or, say, the brand of t-shirts you LOVE are made by a maker of Jeans. Even though the t-shirts are popular and make a profit, suddenly the jeans company stops making them. It's usually because of some kind of numbers analysis that shows the t-shirts have a smaller margin and the sales of t-shirts are taking away from the sales of the jeans, which have a higher margin. They calculate and compare how much they would lose on the loss of t-shirt sales to how much they would gain on the increase sales on the higher margin jeans.

My mom worked for a company that was very successful and had been around for 50 years. It then got bought out by a bigger company. Even though they were making millions in profit, it didn't fit in the larger company's business model of a profit of at least a certain %, and so they just up and shut down the smaller company. Luckily it worked out for my mom, but she did lose her job (got a large severance and then found a job that paid 3 times as much).

This is how business works. No thought behind the numbers. No 'big picture' thinking. And it's not for lack of teaching it in business schools. Every text I have pushes the importance of 'big picture' thinking, of thinking outside the box, not always just going with the numbers, the importance of social benefit etc. But I"m thinking if you are in a large company with thousands of employees, and you're being told profits need to go UP and you have a psychopathic CEO and/or bosses, then you are going to try to keep your job by giving them the numbers they want. Whatever they lose (in order to gain) is collateral damage, nothing more.

Corporations are heartless, souless entities, which is why they must be regulated.

[applegrove]

4. +1

[unblock]

14. it's not just a question of cost vs. benefit, or optimization under constraints.

"cost" and "benefit" are not uniquely-defined, objective criteria.

over what time frame?
under what assumptions?
what is the cost of each percentage of failure?
what is the cost of lower customer satisfaction (as distinguished from lower demand)?

for example, many decisions have short-term profit advantage but long-term customer resentment disadvantages. a ceo with a long-term vision will reject such plans, but many of today's ceos love that crap, in part because they're so heavily compensated on quarterly and annual performance, not five- or ten-year performance.

[applegrove]

21. +1

[laundry_queen]

22. exactly.

It's not just the CEO - managers are often compensated in short term periods and there is very little incentive at the lower managerial levels for long-term strategizing.

There are many other things that are not often considered during these decisions - especially if it is something that is hard for the accounting department to quantify - like customer goodwill.

The good ones know this. Unfortunately, the whole business promotion model is set up to weed out the good ones and promote the greedy ones.

[dmallind]

6. I almost never see a corporate website without a phone #

In fact the opposite drives me nuts. I get frustrated when large companies with significant online presences force me to call them to get anything done.

[physioex]

10. I have a friend with Magicjack....

And they have taken no customer service to the extreme. There is practically no way to reach competent customer service. But hey you get what you pay for....

[boston bean]

7. I was hoping this thread was about

trying to track down a listed phone number on the web.

I find it nearly impossible now a day.

Anyone got any good links for that.

[demosincebirth]

8. Try getting Amazon's #. Not too easy.

[Igel]

16. Took me 45 seconds.

And I'd probably have preferred filling out the info and have them call me after some nice customer service munchkin had pulled up my information on their screen.

1-866-216-1072 for their "automated customer service system."

Now, if you'd wanted the number that was guaranteed to have a sentient being pick up the phone at the other end ... okay, a carbon-based sentient being ... that would take longer.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

35. You don't need their number.

You get on their website, and THEY CALL YOU! It's freaking sweet, and they are helpful and sweet. I had some trouble with my Kindle when I first got it because the cover was causing some issues. They refunded me my money, gave me enough credit to get a new one with a light, and didn't make me send back the other cover. It was all so easy. Amazon is amazing at customer service.
Duckie

[southernyankeebelle]

9. I learned that they hard way. I ordered something and it came from overseas. The item

didn't come in and I tried to call them and could find a number anywhere. I finally called my credit card company and stopped payment. Never heard from the company but they didn't get my money. The 2 things I learned was no order out of the country and if there isn't a phone number on the website I won't order.

[applegrove]

11. That is good advice.

[southernyankeebelle]

12. I think so. Sometimes you learn the hard way.

[Nye Bevan]

13. Yes, I HATE that practice

On a more serious note, http://gethuman.com/ is a good site for finding out company's phone numbers.

[applegrove]

15. Yeah but the questions here always get answered. They never need to walk you through

several steps at the DU. I am trying to get a downloaded firewall/virus scan and the download didn't work. So now I have to figure out how to get their cleaning software, download that and then download what I have paid for again. Neither of which has obvious instructions on their website. And to boot my computer is old so their website is really messed up for me. I really need somebody to be there and walk me through it. But no way.

[customerserviceguy]

18. From my perspective in customer service

You are so very correct.

[Mopar151]

19. The internet hot rod business figured this out long ago

Kraze Korlacki ; "We have no telephone operators - you only have to tell your story once!"

Speedway Motors: "Racers answer our phones!" "Here to Help You - To speak with a knowledgeable rep, Call Toll Free: 800.979.0122"
"Stop in while your'e in the neighborhood" and across the street “If you love life, you will love the Smith Collection Museum of American Speed. Here, there are thousands of physical examples from persons who lived, loved, and had the passion for speed.”

JEGS:

I have personally dealt with alll 3 - I can't say enough about what REAL customer service is like! About 15 years ago, I called JEGS on a Sunday night, drunk and disgusted from working on my truck all weekend. The rep was very knowledgeable, friendly, and hooked me up with the distributor I needed (vacum advance dual point - you don't see many of these), and a sparkplug wire set that was not listed in the catalog. Shipped overnight, Arrived Tuesday as promised, made 2 events the following weekend.

[SheilaT]

20. A lot of those in management have not real concept

of customer service. They do not understand how it really works (treating clients, customers, and even the employees well) nor do they understand why it's important. Management rarely has worked in the jobs they manage.

Oh, and they're the nastiest customers out there, if you're any kind of a service person.

[laundry_queen]

23. Schools of business

should have some sort of requirement that those in their programs work retail customer service for a term before they are allowed to graduate.

[applegrove]

25. There was an Economist article that talked about business schools and how after 1990

they started to teach MBA students that your competitors were not just your competitors. You should be competing with customers, government, stockholders and anybody else. I think this bad customer service is part of that thinking.

[laundry_queen]

29. That's bad.

I'm in business school right now (not MBA, but I get an accelerated MBA option when I'm finished b/c my undergrad is in business and the courses are so similar...) and I'll let you all know if I learn anything like that. I'm in Canada though and generally there's not as much fear and horror surrounding regulations as in the U.S.

[applegrove]

30. I'm in Canada too. Yes it is not as bad here. We are lucky.

[SheilaT]

33. Another problem with business

schools is that they teach that almost all jobs are fungible, interchangeable with each other. And that's just not true. Just because you have a business degree, even perhaps an MBA from Wharton or Harvard, does NOT make you qualified to run any business at all. Different business have different needs.

Often the best boss is one who has actually worked his or her way up the ladder. Back in the 60's and 70's Delta Airlines was possibly the best airline out there. It was certainly the best one to work for (I worked for a different airline at that time) in no small part because the then-president had started out on the ramp, loading and unloading airplanes. Can't recall the man's name any more, but he had a very strong sense that if he treated the lowest level employees well they'd do a good job and in turn treat the passengers well. That's a concept that hardly seems to exist in most companies anymore.

[Mopar151]

34. Proof in post 19, above

All 3 of those businesses were ground-up startups - Speedy Bill has 56 years in the trade, Jeg Sr. 50 this year. Kraze started out selling parts out of an old truck at his local track. He sold the business a while back - it's considerably diminished now.

PS - with rare exception, I don't deal with anybody who doesn't have a phone #, and a real address.

[boppers]

24. Well, that'll help drop their rankings in search engines....

Voila! Less customers to worry about making money from.

I currently work for a business that doesn't have a public phone number for an entirely different reason: We have customers using a product on 422,088 websites, all around the world, in all timezones. We have no customer service reps, technical support department, none of that. It's 4 programmers and one bizdev guy, and we do everything by email... we're not charging our customers enough to pay for luxuries like phone support for the people who refuse to read, or are too drunk to understand what the issue is, don't know html, etc. When it *is* a valid, emergency, kind of issue, it's still a total waste of time for customers to call, because before they've finished dialing, all of our alert systems have already triggered.

[bhikkhu]

28. On the other hand, I have a tracfone so I'd much rather use e-mail

I find it aggravating (and expensive) when I have to call places instead of being able to e-mail. Usually I'll go all the way to snail-mail if i have to, to save money on phone calls. The IRS is the worst - I had to talk to them last week, spent 30 minutes on hold before hanging up without ever getting a person, and just wrote them a letter instead.

[Uben]

31. What really pisses me off.....

....is when you do get someone on the phone, they keep telling you what they can't do. I tell them "Don't tell me what you can't do, I called to find out what you can do!" Then proceed to ask for someone who CAN DO something. If they say they can't do something, I ask again for someone who can. The sheer incompetence is apalling.

Sears is one of the worst. I think they train their employees to try to frustrate you.

[NNN0LHI]

32. I am a 10%er

No phone number means no order placed with that company from me.

That is a fact.

Don