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applegrove

(118,614 posts)
Tue Mar 19, 2013, 08:11 PM Mar 2013

There is a "high probability" that Syria used chemical weapons against opposition forces

CNN Breaking News Email

"There is a "high probability" that Syria used chemical weapons against opposition forces, though verification is needed, U.S. Rep. Mike Rogers, chairman of the House Intelligence Committee, said Tuesday.

The claims come amid pressure in the West to arm the rebels, long overmatched by the Syrian military and its allies.

The embattled government of President Bashar al-Assad on Tuesday accused rebels of a deadly chemical weapon missile attack on the town of Khan al-Asal in Aleppo province. The opposition has accused al-Assad's forces of using such weapons.

The civil war -- which began two years ago after a government crackdown on Syrian protesters -- has left around 70,000 people dead, the United Nations says, and uprooted more than 1 million people."

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There is a "high probability" that Syria used chemical weapons against opposition forces (Original Post) applegrove Mar 2013 OP
I thought they hadn't determined who did it. Maybe Rogers ought to stand down until TwilightGardener Mar 2013 #1
Anderson Cooper says they don't think the splintered resistance forces in Syria had the means applegrove Mar 2013 #4
I have to be skeptical. I just don't think we have very good intelligence, and many members of TwilightGardener Mar 2013 #7
Except that.... Xithras Mar 2013 #15
Can we just stay OUT OF IT? magellan Mar 2013 #2
Unauthorized use. If this was a concerted attack, thousands would have died. leveymg Mar 2013 #3
That's what I'm thinking. IF it happened, the Syrian army would have made it count. TwilightGardener Mar 2013 #6
If this were an actual military use, the targeting and deployment would be very different. leveymg Mar 2013 #9
There will always be reason for Empire to intervene. It is the manifest hand of God. Poll_Blind Mar 2013 #5
"Chemical weapons" could mean tear gas. WilliamPitt Mar 2013 #8
If we want to liberate the Middle East we don't need guns and bombs Demo_Chris Mar 2013 #10
Yup. And come up with some really cheap hardware/phones even poor kids can get access to. applegrove Mar 2013 #11
Exactly. INFORMATION is the enemy of the oppressor Demo_Chris Mar 2013 #12
Yep. And, evidence that US ships were attacked in the Gulf of Tonkin and that Saddam had WMD. Tierra_y_Libertad Mar 2013 #13
Doctors at the hospital in Aleppo said it was pesticides, and among the victims... Comrade Grumpy Mar 2013 #14
It looks like US Rep. Mike Rogers is full of shit. Comrade Grumpy Mar 2013 #16

TwilightGardener

(46,416 posts)
1. I thought they hadn't determined who did it. Maybe Rogers ought to stand down until
Tue Mar 19, 2013, 08:13 PM
Mar 2013

we get better intel. Reports of chemical weapon use have been unsubstantiated in the past.

applegrove

(118,614 posts)
4. Anderson Cooper says they don't think the splintered resistance forces in Syria had the means
Tue Mar 19, 2013, 08:20 PM
Mar 2013

to do it. The worry is the Syrians put chemical warhead and send it to Obama who is on his way to Israel. Looks like Obama is planning on continuing his visit. Very brave. Apparently they have chemical weapon kits on Air Force One.

Reminds me of Pierre Trudeau and the times he stood up to bullies - very iconic moments in his leadership. People loved him for refusing to vacate the stands at a St Jean Baptiste Day riot when people were throwing stuff at him. Every other dignitary left the stands. Trudeau refused to leave and sat there. Defying his handlers. I hope Obama gets all the credit for continuing on with the trip... more important than ever because the Syrian government is using gas against its own people. Obama on the ground in Israel will have much gravitas with the Israeli people and hopefully then the Israeli government. Maybe the hardest decisions of his presidency will happen in the days and nights to come.

TwilightGardener

(46,416 posts)
7. I have to be skeptical. I just don't think we have very good intelligence, and many members of
Tue Mar 19, 2013, 08:30 PM
Mar 2013

Congress have been DOGGED in their quest to get Obama to arm or otherwise get involved. Note that there is ZERO pressure on our response to North Korea. Our clear interests are at stake in the Pacific. Not so, Syria.

Xithras

(16,191 posts)
15. Except that....
Tue Mar 19, 2013, 09:02 PM
Mar 2013

...the Russian media released some intercepted messages two months ago that revealed a Qatari plot to smuggle some of the stolen Libyan rockets to the jihadist elements of the SAA in order to carry out a false flag operation. 60 days later, we have a rocket strike followed by the exact script outlined in the memo.

magellan

(13,257 posts)
2. Can we just stay OUT OF IT?
Tue Mar 19, 2013, 08:15 PM
Mar 2013

How much money have we spent on this so far? And why? To what end? Other countries are in conflict and we don't go sticking our noses in.

Sick of this.

leveymg

(36,418 posts)
3. Unauthorized use. If this was a concerted attack, thousands would have died.
Tue Mar 19, 2013, 08:19 PM
Mar 2013

The timing of this, with Obama in Jerusalem, is also highly suspicious. Seems like another political provocation.

TwilightGardener

(46,416 posts)
6. That's what I'm thinking. IF it happened, the Syrian army would have made it count.
Tue Mar 19, 2013, 08:25 PM
Mar 2013

Why would they make a piddly little show like this, enough to trigger us jumping in, in fact--if they really wanted to defeat the opposition and keep NATO out of it?

leveymg

(36,418 posts)
9. If this were an actual military use, the targeting and deployment would be very different.
Tue Mar 19, 2013, 08:39 PM
Mar 2013

The obvious military targets are key staging areas and weapons distribution centers. If the regime wants to commit suicide, but in a symbolically meaningful way, they would fire most of their missiles at targets in Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Turkey, and other states that have been most actively directing, arming and financing the invasion.

This was neither a military nor emotional strike by the regime.

Poll_Blind

(23,864 posts)
5. There will always be reason for Empire to intervene. It is the manifest hand of God.
Tue Mar 19, 2013, 08:23 PM
Mar 2013

It is our burdensome anointment to bring civilization to the noisy Savage™



PB

 

Demo_Chris

(6,234 posts)
10. If we want to liberate the Middle East we don't need guns and bombs
Tue Mar 19, 2013, 08:51 PM
Mar 2013

We just need to figure out a way to blanket the region with wireless broadband

 

Tierra_y_Libertad

(50,414 posts)
13. Yep. And, evidence that US ships were attacked in the Gulf of Tonkin and that Saddam had WMD.
Tue Mar 19, 2013, 08:56 PM
Mar 2013

Not to mention that the Spanish blew up the Maine.

 

Comrade Grumpy

(13,184 posts)
14. Doctors at the hospital in Aleppo said it was pesticides, and among the victims...
Tue Mar 19, 2013, 08:57 PM
Mar 2013

...were Syrian soldiers and pro-Assad militants.

That was on the Al Jazeera Syria Live Blog earlier today.

 

Comrade Grumpy

(13,184 posts)
16. It looks like US Rep. Mike Rogers is full of shit.
Tue Mar 19, 2013, 09:04 PM
Mar 2013

From the Al Jazeera Syria Live Blog (the posts go from newest to oldest, all today)
http://blogs.aljazeera.com/liveblog/topic/syria-153

Syria about 3 hours ago

UN Secretary-General Ban Ki-Moon spoke on Tuesday with Ahmet Üzümcü, director general of the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW), and shared deep concern about the alleged use of chemical weapons in Syria.

According to a readout of the phone conversation between the two officials, Ban Ki-Moon "remains convinced that the use of chemical weapons by any party under any circumstances would constitute an outrageous crime".

The statement said: "The Secretary-General reaffirmed his strong support for the work of the OPCW which is closely monitoring the situation on the ground. The Secretary-General and the Director General of the OPCW will continue to maintain close contact as developments unfold."

Source: Agencies

Tags syria, OPCW, Ban Ki-moon, chemical weapons, Organisation for the Prohibition of Chemical WeaponsSyria about 4 hours ago
Colonel Malik al-Kurdi, deputy commander for the Free Syrian Army, told Al Jazeera that the Syrian regime’s claim that rebels a chemical weapon at Khan al-Assal is baseless:

This kind of weapons is not available with the Free Syrian Army, as they do not have the (technical) capabilities for using chemical weapons that need laboratories and other means for operating them which the FSA cannot possess at this stage.

In principle, we fully reject in absolute terms, the use of this kind of weapons because they are not defensive weapons, but are designed for mass murder, which is contrary to the principles of the FSA and the Syrian revolution."

[AFP]
Syria about 9 hours ago

Ziad Haddad, a medic in Aleppo, told Al Jazeera several patients arrived in the emergency room earlier this morning with cases of suffocation and constricted pupils.

"Several of them died of respiratory inhibition," he said.

Haddad said the victims seemed to have been exposed to organic pesticides and not chemical weapons, like Sarin and VX nerve agents.

"Victims spoke of pungent smell. Chemical weapons are usually odourless."

“Moreover , the number of deaths is small compared to those who would have died had chemical weapons been used." He estimates that 25 people have been killed in the attack in Khan al-Assal.

Haddad said the casualties included Syrian regime soldiers and pro- Assad armed men.

Earlier, Sana state news agency on Tuesday accused rebels of launching "a rocket [that] contains chemical materials" on Khan al-Assal.

Syria about 9 hours ago

The United States said Tuesday it had seen "no evidence" that Syrian rebels have used chemical weapons and warned it would be "totally unacceptable" for the regime in Damascus to use such arms.

Responding to claims by the Syrian government and its ally Russia, White House spokesman Jay Carney said the United States has "no evidence to substantiate the charge that the opposition has used chemical weapons."

[AFP]
Syria about 11 hours ago

Russian Foreign Ministry says Syrian rebels have used chemical weapons, killing 16 people and injuring 100 others.

The ministry said the attack represented an "extremely dangerous" development in the two-year Syrian crisis. It said the rebels detonated a munition containing an unidentified chemical agent early Tuesday in the province of Aleppo. It didn't give further details.

Syria's state-run news agency has also accused the rebels of the attack, saying 25 people died, but the rebels say government forces fired the weapon.

Russia said that the evidence of rebels getting hold of weapons of mass destruction had taken the confrontation to a new stage.

Russia has been the main ally of President Bashar Assad's regime since the start of the uprising, in which more than 70,000 have died.

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