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xchrom

(108,903 posts)
Fri May 17, 2013, 07:06 AM May 2013

Jeremy Scahill and Noam Chomsky: The Truth About America's Secret, Dirty Wars

http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/jeremy-scahill-and-noam-chomsky-truth-about-americas-secret-dirty-wars?page=0%2C0

Jeremy Scahill: I’m really honored to be here with both Amy Goodman and Noam Chomsky. On my own Facebook page, I list Democracy Now! as my university, because I learned journalism not from the classroom. I wouldn’t have been able to be—you know, I was saying to Professor Chomsky, when we were walking, I’ve never been on Harvard and didn’t actually spend much time in an actual classroom when I was technically enrolled in college anyway. So it’s a little bit odd to be here [at the Harvard Kennedy School]. But I bring that up because I think that journalism is a trade and should be accessible to people. And I learned journalism as an apprentice under the person that I think is a great journalist of our time, and that is Amy. And I had to stalk Amy before she would agree to let me come in and volunteer at Democracy Now! I think she had—I was calling her and writing her letters, and I was saying—this was in the mid-'90s—"If you have a cat, I'll feed your cat. I’ll wash your windows." And she had to decide whether, I think, to get a restraining order against me or to let me come in and volunteer for her. And, you know, she has just been such a dear friend and teacher for so long.

And I like to think of the footnotes in my book as a tribute to Professor Chomsky, because one of the first things I do when I look at a book is to check out the notes in the index to see how serious the book is, how serious the author was about citing every fact that he states in the book. And it was something that I very much learned reading Professor Chomsky’s books. And it’s a real honor to be here with you, Noam.

We’re here at a time when a popular Democratic president, who is a constitutional lawyer by trade, has expanded, intensified, continued and, most importantly, legitimized, in the eyes of many liberals, some of the most egregious aspects of what the Bush administration called its counterterrorism policy and the Obama administration continues to call its counterterrorism and national security policy. And despite the fact that this very popular Democratic president campaigned on a pledge to radically change the way that the U.S. conducted its business around the world and, upon taking power, issued a number of executive orders that were purportedly aimed at shutting down secret prisons, ending torture and closing Guantánamo, what has actually happened is that the Obama administration has made cosmetic changes, tweaked the language, made a few adjustments to the detention program, to the—what’s called the targeted killing program, but it’s anything but targeted, as we’ve seen so often—it’s an assassination program. And this administration has sold the idea to many liberals in this country that this is a clean war, that it’s a smarter war than the ones that were being waged by his predecessor.

If you look at the administration’s claims of bringing the Iraq War to an end, you have to examine what was on President Bush’s desk the day he left office. It was the very plan that President Obama implemented. It was already in motion. So this administration did not bring an end to the Iraq War; the Bush administration’s plan was implemented. But also we’ve seen an expansion of CIA paramilitary activity in Iraq over the past several months. The largest embassy in the world is the U.S. embassy in Baghdad, and strike teams continue to operate out of it alongside thousands of mercenary forces.
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Jeremy Scahill and Noam Chomsky: The Truth About America's Secret, Dirty Wars (Original Post) xchrom May 2013 OP
Scahill and Chomsky are obama hating alt-media type with no credibility who owe me an apology! KG May 2013 #1
! xchrom May 2013 #3
Umm....Satire? Help me out. truth2power May 2013 #5
.... redgreenandblue May 2013 #8
Hee ,Hee bahrbearian May 2013 #9
But didn't the repugs vote against closing Guantanamo? brush May 2013 #27
... redgreenandblue May 2013 #7
Well Played bahrbearian May 2013 #10
You just know it's coming Autumn May 2013 #14
LOL!! Liberal_Dog May 2013 #15
+80 20!!! QC May 2013 #16
An attempt at Poe's Law Ichingcarpenter May 2013 #20
It really has crossed over from merely annoying to comedic parody. n/t Egalitarian Thug May 2013 #25
Nailed It........ but you made more sense. bvar22 May 2013 #28
LOL too funny. nt limpyhobbler May 2013 #44
k/r marmar May 2013 #2
Scahill and Chomsky are American Heroes RoccoR5955 May 2013 #4
Scahill: "So this administration did not bring an end to the Iraq War" ucrdem May 2013 #6
That was funny to read usGovOwesUs3Trillion May 2013 #13
Well, assuming this is not more sarcasm, you should be able to show us where the truth is being sabrina 1 May 2013 #21
Sure. Watch carefully: ucrdem May 2013 #23
Irony abounds ...huh. L0oniX May 2013 #41
The Obama Administration executed the SOFA Agreement.... bvar22 May 2013 #29
Actually, reading Chomsky is essential in cutting through propaganda and getting to the truth. marmar May 2013 #34
Scahill is simply an excellent, G_j May 2013 #35
He's an excellent catapulter of RW fables, I'll give you that. ucrdem May 2013 #36
I like how when leftists critizice POTUS it's 'right wing' TransitJohn May 2013 #37
The SOFA meme was floating around in the MSM ucrdem May 2013 #38
-1 L0oniX May 2013 #39
yea God forbid someone should expose Blackwater! G_j May 2013 #40
...and Eric Prince. L0oniX May 2013 #42
Thanks for posting joelz May 2013 #11
K&R woo me with science May 2013 #12
Scahill and Chomsky are leftist troublemakers. We need more of them. Tierra_y_Libertad May 2013 #17
I don't think of them as leftists. they just tell the truth, and it looks leftist! KG May 2013 #24
K&R Solly Mack May 2013 #18
We know where this is headed... Egalitarian Thug May 2013 #19
I had the privelege of hearing Scahill speek recently in San Francisco and I am reading "Dirty Wars" Luminous Animal May 2013 #22
Recommend! End the drone wars! morningfog May 2013 #26
America is now involved in 74 wars and conflicts TakeALeftTurn May 2013 #30
Washington gets explicit: It's "War on Terror" is permanent Glenn Greenwald TakeALeftTurn May 2013 #31
kr HiPointDem May 2013 #32
In America support for war is a religious belief socialsecurityisAAA May 2013 #33
kicksies .nt limpyhobbler May 2013 #43

KG

(28,751 posts)
1. Scahill and Chomsky are obama hating alt-media type with no credibility who owe me an apology!
Fri May 17, 2013, 07:31 AM
May 2013

word salad, goobledy-gook, nader, eighty-twenty, word salad, goobledy-gook, nader, eighty-twenty, word salad, goobledy-gook, nader, eighty-twenty, word salad, goobledy-gook, nader, eighty-twenty,

word salad, goobledy-gook, nader, eighty-twenty, word salad, goobledy-gook, nader, eighty-twenty, word salad, goobledy-gook, nader, eighty-twenty, word salad, goobledy-gook, nader, eighty-twenty,

word salad, goobledy-gook, nader, eighty-twenty, word salad, goobledy-gook, nader, eighty-twenty, word salad, goobledy-gook, nader, eighty-twenty, word salad, goobledy-gook, nader, eighty-twenty,





















ucrdem

(15,512 posts)
6. Scahill: "So this administration did not bring an end to the Iraq War"
Fri May 17, 2013, 08:35 AM
May 2013

That's a bald faced lie, and all three are chronic truth-twisters. Nothing against anyone's admiration of them, though I think it's misplaced, or against xchrom for posting this, and I'm glad he did, but let's not pretend this crew is anything but a pack of propagandists.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
21. Well, assuming this is not more sarcasm, you should be able to show us where the truth is being
Fri May 17, 2013, 02:26 PM
May 2013

twisted ....

ucrdem

(15,512 posts)
23. Sure. Watch carefully:
Fri May 17, 2013, 02:52 PM
May 2013

The man speaking at the podium is named Barack Obama, not George Bush:



Amy, Noam and Jeremy seem to think we don't know the difference, and oddly enough, some of us don't. Imagine that.

bvar22

(39,909 posts)
29. The Obama Administration executed the SOFA Agreement....
Fri May 17, 2013, 06:25 PM
May 2013

negotiated by the Bush Administration in 2008 To The Letter.
The Obama Administration actually requested an extension to the Withdrawal of American Forces Deadline,
and were told by the Iraqis,
"Not just NO, but F**k NO" to the requested extension.

You may not like it, but those ARE The Facts.

Status of Forces Agreement with Iraq

The U.S.–Iraq Status of Forces Agreement (official name: "Agreement Between the United States of America and the Republic of Iraq On the Withdrawal of United States Forces from Iraq and the Organization of Their Activities during Their Temporary Presence in Iraq&quot was a status of forces agreement (SOFA) between Iraq and the United States, signed by President George W. Bush in 2008.

It established that U.S. combat forces would withdraw from Iraqi cities by June 30, 2009, and all U.S. forces will be completely out of Iraq by December 31, 2011.[1] The pact required criminal charges for holding prisoners over 24 hours, and required a warrant for searches of homes and buildings that were not related to combat.[1]

U.S. contractors working for U.S. forces would have been subject to Iraqi criminal law, while contractors working for the State Department and other U.S. agencies would retain their immunity. If U.S. forces committed still undecided "major premeditated felonies" while off-duty and off-base, they would have been subjected to an undecided procedures laid out by a joint U.S.-Iraq committee if the U.S. certified the forces were off-duty.



Iraq’s Government, Not Obama, Called Time on the U.S. Troop Presence

http://world.time.com/2011/10/21/iraq-not-obama-called-time-on-the-u-s-troop-presence/#ixzz2TajMCZIa




You will know them by their WORKS,
not by their promises or excuses.
[font size=5 color=green]Solidarity99![/font][font size=2 color=green]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------[/center]


marmar

(77,052 posts)
34. Actually, reading Chomsky is essential in cutting through propaganda and getting to the truth.
Sat May 18, 2013, 11:02 AM
May 2013

ucrdem

(15,512 posts)
36. He's an excellent catapulter of RW fables, I'll give you that.
Sat May 18, 2013, 11:19 AM
May 2013

When the first order of business is to push a ridiculous RW and -- in my humble O -- racist canard giving W credit for one of Obama's signature accomplishments, I'd say we're dealing with a distinctly untrustworthy truth-teller.

TransitJohn

(6,932 posts)
37. I like how when leftists critizice POTUS it's 'right wing'
Sat May 18, 2013, 11:25 AM
May 2013

Here's a hint: If leftists are criticizing POTUS, it's because POTUS is behaving right wing.

ucrdem

(15,512 posts)
38. The SOFA meme was floating around in the MSM
Sat May 18, 2013, 11:29 AM
May 2013

long before Jacko every latched onto it. It's their way of saying "this isn't really happening."

joelz

(185 posts)
11. Thanks for posting
Fri May 17, 2013, 10:26 AM
May 2013

long but well worth the time to read,you guy have a great national treasure in Jeremy Scahill real journalism is so rare now days.

Luminous Animal

(27,310 posts)
22. I had the privelege of hearing Scahill speek recently in San Francisco and I am reading "Dirty Wars"
Fri May 17, 2013, 02:31 PM
May 2013

It is an important and sobering book.

 

TakeALeftTurn

(316 posts)
30. America is now involved in 74 wars and conflicts
Sat May 18, 2013, 02:52 AM
May 2013
http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2013/05/u-s-currently-fighting-74-different-wars-that-it-publicly-admits.html

Extracts :-

Citing a page at US Central Command’s (CENTCOM) website, they highlight the “areas of responsibility” publicly listed:

The US Central Command (CENTCOM) is active in 20 countries across the Middle Eastern region, and is actively ramping-up military training, counterterrorism programs, logistical support, and funding to the military in various nations. At this point, the US has some kind of military presence in Afghanistan, Bahrain, Egypt, Iran, Iraq, Jordan, Kazakhstan, Kuwait, Kyrgyzstan, Lebanon, Oman, Pakistan, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Syria, Tajikistan, Turkmenistan, U.A.E., Uzbekistan, and Yemen.

US Africa Command (AFRICOM), according to the paper, “supports military-to-military relationships with 54 African nations.”

[Gosztola points out that the U.S. military is also conducting operations of one kind or another in Syrian, Jordan, South Sudan, Kosovo, Libya, Yemen, the Congo, Uganda, Mali, Niger and other countries.]

Altogether, that makes 74 nations where the US is fighting or “helping” some force in some proxy struggle that has been deemed beneficial by the nation’s masters of war.

.....

There are legal restrictions on what the CIA can do in terms of covert operations. There has to be a finding, the president has to notify at least the “Gang of Eight” [leaders of the intelligence oversight committees] in Congress. JSOC doesn’t have to do any of that. There is very little accountability for their actions. What’s weird is that many in congress who’d be very sensitive to CIA operations almost treat JSOC as an entity that doesn’t have to submit to oversight.
 

TakeALeftTurn

(316 posts)
31. Washington gets explicit: It's "War on Terror" is permanent Glenn Greenwald
Sat May 18, 2013, 04:23 AM
May 2013

Last October, senior Obama officials anonymously unveiled to the Washington Post their newly minted "disposition matrix", a complex computer system that will be used to determine how a terrorist suspect will be "disposed of": indefinite detention, prosecution in a real court, assassination-by-CIA-drones, etc. Their rationale for why this was needed now, a full 12 years after the 9/11 attack:

Among senior Obama administration officials, there is a broad consensus that such operations are likely to be extended at least another decade. Given the way al-Qaida continues to metastasize, some officials said no clear end is in sight. . . . That timeline suggests that the United States has reached only the midpoint of what was once known as the global war on terrorism."

On Thursday, the Senate Armed Services Committee held a hearing on whether the statutory basis for this "war" - the 2001 Authorization to Use Military Force (AUMF) - should be revised (meaning: expanded). This is how Wired's Spencer Ackerman (soon to be the Guardian US's national security editor) described the most significant exchange:

"Asked at a Senate hearing today how long the war on terrorism will last, Michael Sheehan, the assistant secretary of defense for special operations and low-intensity conflict, answered, 'At least 10 to 20 years.' . . . A spokeswoman, Army Col. Anne Edgecomb, clarified that Sheehan meant the conflict is likely to last 10 to 20 more years from today - atop the 12 years that the conflict has already lasted. Welcome to America's Thirty Years War."

Continued at:-
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/may/17/endless-war-on-terror-obama

33. In America support for war is a religious belief
Sat May 18, 2013, 10:48 AM
May 2013

If you are pro-war or pro-invasion you are part of the war religion. It's not built on reasoning, historical facts or an honest motivation. People support it because they feel more comfortable living in a comfortable lie than they would if they were forced to take responsibility for the MILLIONS murdered so that America can maintain global dominance. People ignorantly say and most likely believe we are spreading democracy(which is rarely true, and when it is, is of little practical consequence considering human rights abuses continue or worsen) It is no different whatsoever than believing nations should be invaded simply to convert them, not different one bit. Our dollars are used to kill, torture and deprive under both Republican and Democratic candidates.
Meanwhile few see the facts as they stand, and are often chastised for voicing their views.. Few understand war is a result of a HUGE arms/energy lobby and the power they wield combined with an ignorant, arrogant greedy legislature(with few exceptions Bernie Sanders, Alan Greyson and on the war issue Ron Paul)
I find it baffling that the same people who rightly want to restrict the ownership and use of dangerous deadly weapons also avidly support war, as long as a democrat is at the helm. ABSOLUTELY BAFFLING. It's no different than a conservative pro-lifer supporting the death penalty, 100% hypocritical!

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