When is it okay for the government to keep secrets from its citizens?

[cynatnite]

I have struggled with this question and I wondered how DU felt.

I know many of you feel that there is never enough transparency and I've read about the frustration you all feel. Oftentimes, I share it.

When do you believe it's okay for government secrecy? Or should there be government secrecy at all?

I'm curious to know what you think. Maybe it'll help me come to some firm conclusions of my own.

[jberryhill]

1. Obviously not when they are in Bill Clinton's pants

Because, it was so goddamned important to know what was going on in there.

They spent two years inside of Bill Clinton's pants because unlike the inside of George W Bush's head, there was at least a functioning organ in there.

[cynatnite]

2. Win!

[Mnemosyne]

5. Depends what the definition of pants is. nt

[jberryhill]

7. In American English or British English?

[dkf]

3. It should be very very rare. Only to protect operatives in imminent danger.

And never ever to prevent embarrassment.

[Herlong]

4. Don't get me going on this dog and pony show.

For me it's all about what we have lost as a nation in the years since Martin Luther King's march on Washington proclaimed, "Me Too"

Since then, they have been trying to prove, not you.

[Archaic]

6. The other side of that. If we'd stop doing things we needed to keep secret...

We wouldn't need the damn secrets.


Our government, and its branches and agencies work in our name and with our cash. So the information should be free.

We pay for what is done in public or in secret, but the secrets get expensive. So we should strive to be transparent.

I don't want the CIA destabilizing countryX while we talk about how we aren't doing it. I don't want us to send cash in relief to a country who we're causing to need that relief. If we'd stop propping up certain companies and markets at the expense of others, maybe we wouldn't be making poverty worse in many places. (Republicans love to say that the Government shouldn't be picking winners and losers. I wish they believed that)

I get why we have some military secrets, why we can't say that we know certain things are happening in CountryY because then they'd know we can see what they're doing before something extremely bad comes our way. But that isn't carte blanche either.

[Deep13]

8. Immediate battle plans. Prisoner transfers.

That's pretty much it.

[Warpy]

9. Only in time of war

when troop movements and the like have to be hidden from an enemy.

Otherwise, it's done mostly to protect bureaucrats. The spy vs. spy stuff is largely futile, focusing on minutiae while missing the big picture, the way the CIA completely missed the imminent collapse of the USSR in 1991.

[moondust]

11. Part of the difficulty

is that when the government reveals something to "its citizens," the same is also being revealed to real and potential enemies. In some cases that may place the government at a disadvantage when it comes to dealing with adversaries, i.e. self-defeating.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

12. In a democracy, the people are the government.

Get back to me when we actually have a democracy.

[railsback]

13. By all means, they shouldn't have ANY secrets

When we somehow manage to get a source into the top level government of North Korea, we should tell everyone about it, especially North Korea. If we're about to hack Iran's nuclear computer mainframe, we should tell them first. Pinpointing known terrorists in Yemen, hey, we gots to let them know that we're tracking them. All the thousands of operatives working undercover overseas, they need to be exposed. We're a nation of open borders and open secrets. All those other countries who protect their sovereignty are just a bunch of yokels.

[LeftInTX]

14. Obama should have told us (aka the world) the address of OBL's Pakistan hideout.

Then OBL could have found a new home before the raid.

FDR should have told us (aka the world) that the govt was building the A-bomb and shared the blueprints with us (aka the world).

Obviously, there are some things that the entire world should not know. Anytime you tell anything to the American public, the entire world will know.

As long as there is evil in the world there will be secrecy. As long as we have enemies there will be secrecy. This has been going on since the Greeks and Romans.

The question is how much secrecy and when does it become an abuse of power? Do we have checks and balances?

(It's 3:27 am. I probably don't make any sense)

[GeorgeGist]

15. I could tell you but ...

[GeorgeGist]

16. When its none of your business.

eg. my tax returns.

[lame54]

17. Ask Valerie Plame