It is not okay for cats to kill all the neighborhood birds.

[XemaSab]

I’m living next to a killer named Frankie. He’s black-and-white and sweet as cats go; he’s also a menace that nobody talks much about, though feral and free-roaming housecats like Frankie have become a tragic problem all over the world.

Every year in America, cats, many of them well-fed pets, kill about 12.3 billion mammals and 2.4 billion birds. When you open the door, your friendly furry feline transforms into a miniature terrorist. It’s as if outdoor domestic cats are an invasive species, predators that are pampered and subsidized by doting owners.

Feral cats are an even bigger problem. In the United States, there are some 60 million unwanted cats. No wonder: With a survival rate of 2.8 kittens per litter with continued breeding, two cats can become 3,822 cats in just four years.

Frankie belongs to my neighbors. We live in a small southern Idaho community, surrounded by sagebrush foothills and lots of wildlife. A marsh hosts red-winged blackbirds and assorted ducks. Deer wander past my window daily, as well as the occasional red fox, and quail and pheasant calls fill the air. Red-tailed, Swainson’s, sharp-shinned, and Cooper’s hawks all share the sky with a golden eagle, though not at the same time. The Cooper’s is a particular fixture; I occasionally see him dining on a finch but don’t begrudge him his meal. After all, he’s a native.

That’s where Frankie comes in. His owner opens the door for this well-fed, neutered cat and the carnage begins. First, he digs up my flowerbed to relieve himself, then he hunts.

https://www.hcn.org/wotr/frankie-and-the-cat-problem

[Glorfindel]

1. Thank you for posting this. It needs to be said, loudly and often.

The little town in south Mississippi where I reside was a bird paradise prior to the ravages of Hurricane Katrina. Feral cats, left homeless by the storm, are now everywhere, living in drainpipes and abandoned buildings, and the only birds one sees are big, tough birds like bluejays and mockingbirds that can raise a ruckus and defend themselves. If there were packs of feral dogs roaming the streets and killing randomly, something would be done about the problem.

[ileus]

2. Forget the birds...

Think about the rabbits...

Between cats and coyotes there are no neighborhood rabbits.

Still have plenty of birds however...

[one_voice]

20. My neigborhood is..

run with rabbits.

I have mamas and babies everywhere. I have to look before I let my dogs out to make sure they aren't in the yard.

They live under my sheds and deck. Cutest little things. I sit and watch them.

One of my dogs lays by the shed like she's trying to cuddle them, weirdest thing.

I have squirrels everywhere too. And the birds are around cuz they're crapping all over my car.

Maybe we don't have as many cats around.

[Warpy]

137. They're not as cute when all those bunnies eat your garden

down to little stubs growing out of your carefully tended raised beds.

My own back yard is the local cat flophouse since I don't own a dog or six. It also doesn't attract songbirds because I don't have any mature trees and I don't put a feeder out for anything but hummingbirds. The hummingbirds are safe. In fact, they tease the cats unmercifully.

I don't honestly mind all the cats but some I know are feral, they get into fights at night when Fluffy and Bootsie are home with their owners. I do have a mouse problem from time to time, something the cats are taking care of most years, killing and inhaling them. Since mice around here carry hantavirus, I'm delighted the cats nail them before they get into my house.

My own cat is almost 20 and has been indoors only since I got her 19 years ago.

[CreekDog]

24. yes, but coyotes are often indigenous species, feral housecats are not

there's a difference, do you see it?

[panzerfaust]

78. No, and neither is the primate Homo sapiens sapiens - except in sub-Saharan Africa

Humans and cats (both from Africa) have lived in a mutually beneficial symbiotic relationship for approximately 10,000 years. Not being great travelers on their own, cats are only where they are today because humans brought them along as they expanded their range causing environmental devastation not only because of their accompanying dogs and cats - but because of disruption of entire continental wide ecosystems by planting crops, felling forests, building cities, introducing herd animals and deliberately - for food, for sport, and by accident - exterminating entire species.

It seems ludicrous to complain about cats in general when we look at the direct devastation our own species has caused: Indeed, we are currently poised on the brink of another massive global extinction event caused by our pollution of the planet's very atmosphere.



If one has a recurring problem with a particular cat owned by a particular neighbor then one should deal with it directly - as, indeed, the author of the article is doing: By taking the cat to the county animal shelter.

[CreekDog]

79. ah, humans have disrupted the environment, therefore we do nothing about feral or outdoor cats

we just throw up our hands and say "oh well" and limit our efforts to one or two individual "bad kitties" that we'll take to a shelter.

why, your idea is so helpful it might just get nothing accomplished at all.

[pnwmom]

167. Songbirds are at great risk. Bunnies aren't, except in your neighborhood,

apparently.

[Mojorabbit]

192. I do wildlife rehab and I cannot tell you how many bunnies and squirrels I get in

where people tell me. Oh the cat was only trying to save the bunny or ...... and He brought him right to me. I bite my tongue so I can respond as nicely as possible with a that is bullshit reply only in nice words.

[Myrina]

3. Hate if ya' want, but I let my dogs chase 'em.

My guys are too old/slow to catch a cat & would probably get their ass kicked by the cat if they ever actually did, but just chasing the cat away from whatever it's stalking at least gives that potential victim a chance to flee.

I f*ing HATE cats.

[NuclearDem]

6. The itty bitty kitty committee just added you

To the extra mewdicial kill list.

[clarice]

27. lol. nt

[freedom fighter jh]

77. What Clarice said nt

[City Lights]

36. My cat (now deceased) once chased the neighbor's dog off our lawn.

Sack of shit owners kept letting their dog crap in our yard, so one day we opened the door while the dog was doing his business on our lawn and the cat took care of it.

I don't "f*ing HATE dogs," but I do consider myself a cat person.

[Volaris]

48. From a young age, I learned the "proper" way to keep cats as "pets"

if they live inside, they have thier claws removed, no questions asked.
If you want them to keep their natural weapons, then they spend most of their time (like 95%) outside, and you don't subsidize their food intake unless there's 6 feet of snow on the ground because those weapons you want them to keep? Yeah, those are for feeding themselves with the farm mice they can kill, otherwise, they can go hungry. The farm country I grew up in, cats were working animals, and if the rabbits were eating your garden, then they sure as fuck were fair game for kitty. The roomate has indoor cats, and I'm ok with this, as they have no REASON to be let outside to harass, maim and eat the local wildlife.

[leftynyc]

50. My vet will not declaw cats

He says it's like cutting off their fingers. It also leaves cats defenseless if they manage to get outside. That said, my two are indoor kitties who get tortured every year by the birds who decide to park themselves on the outside window sill while the cats are on the inside sill.

[Volaris]

57. I wonder what kitty thinks about that when it happens lol..

pissed at the birds?
or pissed at the window...

And yeah, more and more vets are refusing to declaw, which almost means deciding IN ADVANCE that you're going to be buying new furniture pieces every 5 years or so. It's why I won't own a cat of my own volition until I have a garden for it to babysit=).
I'm not NOT a cat person, I think they just have a different natural purpose than most other people do.

[lapislzi]

88. There are many ways to prevent cats from scratching up furniture.

I think de-clawing is inhumane and I would never subject an animal to the procedure. Nor would I give my money to a veterinarian who would do it.

Squirt guns and canned air are effective deterrents, but they startle the cat. Placing tin foil over surfaces also works. Eventually the cat loses interest in that piece of furniture. If he forgets, just "remind" him with your can of air.

The best thing is to provide the cat with an acceptable scratching substitute. Layered corrugated cardboard, carpet remnants, even logs, are good for this. Spray it with some catnip juice and praise the cat lavishly when he scratches in the "right" place. If you have space and money, cats love those kitty-cat Habitrail things with spaces to snooze and climb.

If the cats are happy and occupied, they're much less likely to get into indoor or outdoor mischief. Mine still go for rodents occasionally, but birds--almost never.

[leftynyc]

101. I've always had cats

Grew up with a Siberian Husky and 4 cats. It's not that I have anything against dogs but cats are much easier. They don't need to be walked in wretched weather and you can leave them overnight with enough food and water. I've had extremely loving kitties and those who weren't. I hear you on the furniture but mine don't really go for the furniture - they have scratching pads and sometimes will claw at the area rugs but they really aren't very destructive (got them at Pet Rescue - two long haired tuxedos - they're brothers -both extremely friendly).

[cui bono]

164. Just get a scratching "post" or whatever and teach your cat to use it.

And teach them not to scratch on the furniture. They do learn. And catnip on the scratcher is a great incentive. The vets are right to refuse to declaw. Because doing so is amputation, it's not just pulling the nail out.

I'm really glad you don't have a cat. :p

[MerryBlooms]

171. Our cats are indoor only and we trained our cats with catnip on those cardboard loungers,

tinfoil taped to the legs and backs of the sofa and chairs, and spraying our wicker furniture with bitter apple. We purchased our furniture in April and it still looks new. The proper methods and spending the time training is what it takes for happy non-destructive kitties.

I'm in complete agreement regarding declawing/amputation, it is very cruel and totally unnecessary. Our vet also refuses to declaw. I'm glad to see it's becoming a more common stance.

[City Lights]

67. Many cats that have their claws removed turn into biters.

It's their only line of defense.

[City Lights]

66. I am against removing their claws.

The cat that chased the neighbor's dog off our lawn was declawed, but all of the cats we have now have their claws. We have a variety of materials from which our cats choose to scratch. We play with them, allowing them to "hunt" mice on wires, rotating feathers on string, or red dots, and our clawed cats are fine living indoors. We do take a couple of them outside on a leash, and rarely have they shown any interest in chasing birds. They are more interested in chasing bugs or eating grass.

[Jenoch]

86. When i was a kid we had a cat that was declawed, front and back.

He must have been one smart cat because he lived to be 20 years and 6 months old. He was an indoor/outdoor cat. He caught mostly striped gophers and a few young rabbits. He once brought home a muskrat as well. We got that cat when I was 7. I had to bring him to the vet to have him put down. It was the hardest thing I've had to do in my entire life.

[City Lights]

94. It hurts like hell.

One of our (now deceased) declawed ones ran out once when I opened the back door to go out and within seconds she had a chipmunk in her mouth. I grabbed her and gently squeezed the back of her head until she dropped the chipmunk. Chipmunk ran off and Tabitha came back in the house. She was one hell of a jumper, too.

[Jenoch]

100. My parents had a cat that was strictly an indoor cat.

There was a chipmunk in their garage so my dad put the cat in there to catch the chipmunk. Less than a minute later, he opened the door to turn the light on so the cat would have an easier time catching the chipmunk. That cat bolted into the house with the chipmunk in his mouth. He ran down the stairs to the family room with my dad chasing him. My dad picked up the cat and put him outside so he would not drop the chipmunk inside. The cat dropped the chipmunk on the patio, it ran across the pavement and into a hole in the ground. The cat had him in his mouth for approximately 30 seconds before he got away.

[Marrah_G]

97. Declawing is very bad

[bunnies]

132. Not to mention, cruel.

Poor kitty.

[nomorenomore08]

158. +1

It's actually banned, probably rightly so, in a lot of places. What we call "de-clawing" is actually equivalent to having one's fingers cut off, not just the nails.

[cui bono]

163. No! It is cruel to declaw a cat. They chop off part of their toes!

Declawing traditionally involves the amputation of the last bone of each toe. If performed on a human being, it would be like cutting off each finger at the last knuckle.

http://www.humanesociety.org/animals/cats/tips/declawing.html

I don't know why taught you that is the "proper" way to keep a cat as a pet! Yikes.

If you want to keep a cat indoors only make sure you teach them to use the scratching post/item you bought for them. If you're gong to declaw a cat, don't bother to get a cat.

Also, my cat was living in my yard for a few months then I took her in. She is not outside 95% of the time, far from it. She does like to hunt, but it has slowed down. She eats at home now, always has food in her bowl.

The reason I let her outside is because she wants to go out there. She likes it.

[Myrina]

70. I would have done the same thing.

I also dislike irresponsible humans, be they dog or cat people. Or parents who let their kids run wild.

[Ash_F]

93. Odds are they trained it to poop on your lawn. /nt

[Hissyspit]

180. So ask yourself what is wrong with you

That you "fucking hate cats."

[Arugula Latte]

182. I can't stand cat haters.

Some dogs attack and kill people, yet I would never say I hate dogs, even though I'm no dog person.

[NuclearDem]

4. My little terrorists have the mighty red dot to kill.

I never let them outside.

[KittyWampus]

5. which is the greater threat: cats or deforestation, over development & pesticides?

[daleanime]

10. I afraid we're well pass the point....

where we can worry about one problem at a time on this issue(the health of our planet). We need to work on as many fronts as possible.

[mockmonkey]

21. Add to that

Global Climate Change, the drought has brought many more birds to where I live in the Midwest. It's getting a bit crowded I don't think it can sustain too many more.

Windows also kill somewhere between 100 million and billion birds a year also.

[Revanchist]

75. I always knew Bill Gates hated birds N/T

[mockmonkey]

114. Windows 8...my bird n/t

[CreekDog]

25. so there's a bigger problem, so we'll ignore this one?

people should keep their cats inside, if they have cats that they just can't be to keep inside, their *next* cats should be inside.

if cats are allowed to roam outside, the least they could do is make sure they are spayed and neutered.

cats are not native to your environments. if you don't like your native songbirds and other critters, go ahead, let cats roam free as much as possible --you'll help reduce the population of annoyingly loud songbirds.

[OnlinePoker]

152. Very few songbirds near where I live

But the culprits are the European Starlings, another invasive species that have devastated songbird habitat throughout North America.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

45. Which is the bigger problem: largescale mass murder in Syria, or someone stabbing you to death?

"Look over there!" is a contemptible debating tactic, I'm afraid.

[otohara]

105. Guns In America

talk about large scale mass murder....we went to war over 3000, yet since 911 over 300,000 dead American's by guns.

Syria has a civil war, we have a sick twisted slower war of killing each other. We vow to never forget 911, yet are encouraged
to sweep the gun deaths under the rug in the name of some amendment written long long ago.

But since this thread is about cats/birds - I came up with a solution so our darlin isn't successful when it comes to bird killing.

[Scootaloo]

51. Choose one; walking, or chewing gum

The point is, they're all threats, and while as individuals we can't suck carbon out of the atmosphere, we CAN keep our cat from diminishing hte local wildlife.

[NickB79]

58. Which is the easiest to address (ie low-hanging fruit)?

Ultimately, you would probably save more wildlife by cutting deforestation and development, but short-term it's easier to save at least SOME wildlife by keeping cats indoors while we work on the larger issues at hand.

An analogy: Long-term, I'd save more money on gas by buying a Prius than driving my old beater car, but in the short-term I can still save SOME gas by keeping my engine tuned and tires inflated while I save to buy said Prius.

[cthulu2016]

7. A worm or bug would say it is okay with him

[snooper2]

8. SWEET! we haven't had this thread in a while

maybe birds wouldn't get eaten if they weren't so fucking annoying

[LWolf]

9. My black and white cat

is currently sitting in a bay window that has large, roof-high lilacs growing next to it. Her tail is twitching back and forth as she watches the finches flitting from branch to branch.

She doesn't go outside; not without what she considers a "prison break," that is. Recapturing is an entertaining process for all but myself.

She's not an indoor cat because of the birds, at least, not because of those birds. She's an indoor cat because I'm keeping her safe from the birds and coyotes. We have owls, hawks, and falcons who take cats. I know, because I've seen it.

My last cat was allowed outside, and she hunted, and killed, regularly. Primarily rodents, which are also way too numerous here. Mice, voles, ground squirrels, pack rats, and bunnies. She got an occasional sparrow; by "occasional," I mean, maybe one every 5 years or so. Maybe those who live in developed areas have fewer rodents, so the cats focus more on birds. Around here, they are interested, but, like an efficient predator, concentrate on what's easy: the prey without wings. I believe all the people who tell me, though, that cats take too many birds. There are a hell of a lot more cats in more heavily populated areas than there are in my little patch of the world.

Around here, the local rescues take in any feral cats that can be captured; they spay, neuter, and offer them up as "barn cats" to help keep the rodent population down. And they do a great job of that. I know, because when I moved here there was a large feral cat colony in the barn. I trapped, neutered, and released them, and within a year, they were gone. Why? Because the hawks, falcons, owls, and coyotes were taking them regularly. Once they were gone, the rodent population exploded, and has stayed at frustratingly high levels. I've considered taking in more neutered "barn cats," but I just can't bring myself to give them that inevitable death sentence.

So, for the most part, I am in agreement with keeping cats indoors. I'm not sure, though, what to do about adult feral cats. They don't socialize well, and aren't going to make great indoor pets. What do we do with them after we trap and neuter/spay?

[Lizzie Poppet]

23. There are programs that capture feral cats and provide them to folks who need barn cats.

So long as people understand that true ferals can never be pets and are willing to provide shelter and some food, in exchange they get rodent-free barns. It should go with out saying that these cats are spayed/neutered before being placed, too.

The Feral Cat Coalition here in Oregon also traps, neuters, marks, and releases feral cats. The cats are marked by one slightly clipped ear.

My cat? Strictly indoor. I live downtown, so it's just not feasible or safe for her to be an indoor/outdoor cat. Probably best for the birds, as she's an amazing hunter (I used to live out in the country, had a mouse problem, but after I got her, the mice only lasted another six weeks...mouse genocide!).

[LWolf]

31. I know about the programs for feral cats.

It's a catch-22. First of all, re-releasing them puts all those birds at risk, doesn't it? And, in places rural enough to have barns and barn cats, they are also going to be short-lived because of the creatures that prey on them. It's better than rounding them up and euthanizing them, but not by much. Of course, a small percentage of cats survive and learn to avoid predators; I guess if we keep getting barn cats, eventually we'd end up with a survivor or two.

I'm in Oregon. My local program provided me with all the traps, and spayed and neutered everything I brought to them at very low rates when I first moved into my current place.

[Gormy Cuss]

33. It's extremely unlikely that birds are taking out adult cats.

A kitten, yes. A small adult cat, possibly. Average size adult cats weigh too much for hawks or falcons to carry off. Even the biggest of owls would have a hard time doing so. That's not to say that some haven't tried, just that they aren't successful at it.
Cats are injured by larger predator birds and smaller birds who are protecting their nests.

Coyotes on the other hand are quite expert at stalking and killing cats.

[LWolf]

39. It's not unlikely. I've seen it.

I've seen it happen 3 feet away, when the local great-horned owl dove and snatched a cat a few feet away from me while I was on my way out to the barn at 4:30 AM. Of course, the feral cats aren't heavyweights. I've seen falcons and hawks perch on one of my 4 ft fences and watch the cats, and was there to see one dive on a cat once. It didn't get the cat into the air, but it did kill the cat.

And the coyotes...my place is fenced to keep coyotes out, but that doesn't keep the feral cats from breaching the fence. I'm sure they took most.

I don't have any more feral cats out there. I trapped, neutered/spayed, and released the dozen living in the barn when I moved here. They were gone in a year, once they weren't reproducing any more.

[Gormy Cuss]

54. Again, extremely unlikely.

I didn't state impossible. I also differentiate between able to carry off and able/willing to attack. A great horned owl has the power to carry off a cat but is unlikely to do that with an average size or larger adult cat. Why? Too much work when there are so many other meals around. A kitten or small injured or old cat is more attractive. The other birds can not carry off an adult cat. As I noted they can and will attack them on occasion.
Coyotes on the other hand kill cats easily and readily. Coyotes probably stalk your yard because they can see/sense the cats.

[LWolf]

63. Coyotes still stalk the perimeter

even though the cat colony has been extinct for 7 years. There are chickens. The chickens free range, and the hawks and falcons take them on occasion, too. The owls, not so much, since they're roosting when the owls are out and about.

A young hawk once got trapped in the coop yard, which has a wire roof, following a hen through the open gate. I found it in a panic, and used my manure picker to encourage it in the right direction from a safe distance.

As far as the cats go, it's true that most are victims of the coyotes. There are exceptions, though.

[NickB79]

60. A raptor doesn't have to carry away a cat

To "take it out".

An owl or hawk sinking those razor-sharp talons into a cat's back is often a death sentence, even if the owner finds their pet before it bleeds out or dies of infection.

But yes, I'd agree with you that coyotes are the true killers of outdoor cats.

[raccoon]

11. But not all cats kill birds. I don't think mine ever did. Mice, yeah, but not birds.

And she sure doesn't now; she's 15 years old.

[bahrbearian]

12. Put a Bell on them.

[Peregrine Took]

35. Amen!!!!!! You can do it as a neighbor - a breakaway collar with bell.

Lure Frankie over with some cheese or cream or something and slip it on him.

[Ohio Joe]

193. Thats fine if there are no predators around...

Here in Aurora CO, it is very much a dinner bell you place around them.

[Dreamer Tatum]

13. Reminds me of the silly people who try to turn their dogs into vegans

Guess what - animals have instincts. Those instincts aren't to brew chamomile tea and listen to All Things Considered
while the lentils stew.

[progressoid]

44. ...

[wild bird]

14. All 3 of our cats are indoor cats.

Rodents don't stand a chance in our house. Haven't seen a mouse in over a year now.
Gopher snake got in one time, our Himalayan pounced on it and took care of business.

[mockmonkey]

22. 13 indoor cats

and they still managed to kill a bird inside somehow.

[RebelOne]

49. I don't like cats, but last year I had a rat problem

and wished I had a cat. But a pest exterminator took care of the problem in short order.

[Bonobo]

15. My cat protects us from big cockroaches and poison centipedes.

I fucking LOVE my cat.

[laundry_queen]

153. You know

if I could find a spider-killing cat I would keep it despite my horrid kitteh allergies. Thankfully I live where there are no large cockroaches or poison centipedes! ick!

[EC]

16. put a bell on that cat. n/t

[otohara]

123. Mine Has 4 Bells & A Walking Jacket

with a leash and extra rope. She's perfectly happy to be outside nestled under a bush for hours - I check on her constantly.
We have cat eating coyotes in our hood.

[joeybee12]

17. Unreccing for crap science...

Yes, cats kill birds, yes cats should be indoor pets, no, they are not the biggest problem for songbirds, etc. Let's talk development, pesticides, instead of this fucking shit yet again.

[hamsterjill]

34. Exactly.

It's all been debunked already as to cats being the biggest threat to birds. But some stories simply never die...

[grahampuba]

42. 'biggest threat to birds'

not sure where the hyperbole came in, OP says nothing of biggest threat to birds,
but as far as bird deaths and cats, debunked you say? as of when?

http://www.sibleyguides.com/conservation/causes-of-bird-mortality/

[hamsterjill]

47. Yes, debunked I say!!!!

Am I only allowed to use the same words that appear in the OP? Can I not extrapolate in my own thoughts and text?

Well, this for starters:

http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=945

[XemaSab]

172. Alley Cat Allies is not a reliable source

It's like going to the NRA for gun statistics.

[hamsterjill]

191. It is as reliable a source as I need.

That, plus 35 years in cat rescue myself.

I'm sorry that you obviously have decided to hate on cats, buy I simply don't buy what you're trying to promote.

[joeybee12]

116. Kill ALL the neighborhood birds?

Yup, not one fucking bird is left because cats have killed them ALL. Yehak re-reaad...the hyperbole is staring you in the face...and yeah, crap sceience...your link as well.

[City Lights]

37. Ditto! nt

[XemaSab]

38. So if car accidents kill 33,500 people a year

and guns kill 11,000 people a year, does that mean that we shouldn't take gun deaths seriously? Especially given that gun deaths are much more preventable?

[joeybee12]

113. ALL the birds in the neighborhood...ALL the birds...

Talk about overreaching hyperbole...ALL

Do you read what you write before you post? Fuck.

[XemaSab]

122. I didn't write the OP

[dbackjon]

40. It is not crap science

Cats kill billions of birds yearly.

Are there other threats? Yes. But should this very real threat be ignored?

No

[snooper2]

62. People can't even nail down the number of birds on the planet any closer than 200-400 billion

I think they will be okay LOL

[joeybee12]

112. BILLIONS?

How ridiculous.

[dbackjon]

117. Yes, BILLIONS

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/01/29/cats-wild-birds-mammals-study/1873871/


You are the one being ridiculous

[Ocelot]

73. No it's not crap science, except to the wilfully uninformed

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/21/science/21birds.html?_r=0

I see it every year in my own front yard, particularly when Chickadees and other newly fledged birds first venture around the feeders. The feeders are hung up well above the neighbors' cats' reach, yet the cats are always able to maul a few fledglings who land on the ground to retrieve sunflower seeds, or just out of curiosity. It's no fun picking up the mutilated carcasses of young birds who were killed not because the cat was hungry, but because it was just an attractive target to pounce on in response to the cats' instincts.

I do not fault the cats, which are by nature predatory, and I do nothing other than shoo the cats back to the neighbor's property. Now if my dog (who actually likes cats) were to venture into their yard I'd never hear the end of it. And if I owned another cat, it would be an indoor cat like my previous one.

[joeybee12]

110. You "see"

You proved my point...it's not science, it's seeing...yeah, I've seen cats kill birds...from seeing cats kill birds you're saying they kill ALL birds...right...give it a fucking rest,

[Ocelot]

150. You...sound....real....scientific... right...yeah...

I doubt you know anything other than what treats your kitty likes.

YOU give it a fucking rest.

[Logical]

156. Can we discuss both? WTF? n-t

[joshcryer]

166. The OP didn't say they were the biggest problem.

[Le Taz Hot]

18. Yep.

Been awhile since we had an "I hate outside cats" thread.

And to that, my 5 outside cats say, "Thhhhppppptttt!"

And just for the record, I have 3 bird feeders in the patio and, since they're busy all day long, I'm assuming they have no objections.

[Egalitarian Thug]

19. People are the problem, not the cats. i know you know this but your title

reads as if it is the cat's fault.

[CreekDog]

26. if she thinks it's the cat's fault, why is she posting to convince cat owners?

or am I missing something and her OP is actually designed for cats to read and subsequently modify their behavior?

[Douglas Carpenter]

29. yeah, you know .. like those deer crossing signs

[Ian David]

32. Are you suggesting we need to put up "No Bird Eating" signs for the cats?

[Douglas Carpenter]

46. absolutely - The cats need to take responsibility for their actions

[cui bono]

165. Well then we need to provide public education for cats to make sure they can all read

at at least a 5th grade level. And a city ordinance that no pet signs are too complex for animals to read.

[Douglas Carpenter]

173. too many cats are already ensnared by a culture of dependency

[reformist2]

28. two cats can become 14 million cats in just eight years, lol!

[bunnies]

53. lmao!

That totally explains how my neighbor got 35 million cats. I'd been wondering about that one.

[PADemD]

30. Keep Frankie away from your garden with Rue (Ruta graveolens)

Rue is also grown as an ornamental plant, both as a low hedge and so the leaves can be used in nosegays. Most cats dislike the smell of it, and it can therefore be used as a deterrent to them (see also Plectranthus caninus).

Caterpillars of some subspecies of the butterfly Papilio machaon feed on rue, as well as other plants.[8]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruta_graveolens

I've also read how Rue can be dried, made into a sachet, and pinned to furniture to discourage cats from scratching.

[MarianJack]

41. I agree.

Our 2 furry boys are indoor cats and that's it. Additionally, it keepss us from having every friggin' flea in Maine in our house!

PEACE!

[The Link]

43. Stray cats don't make it long in my neighborhood.

We have abundant wildlife. Lots of beautiful birds, rabbits on the lawn in the morning, chipmunks, squirrels.

[Ocelot]

80. Outdoor cats in my neighborhood have a tendency to vanish

At least those that are allowed to roam at night. It's saddening to see the "Missing" posters that go up on telephone poles.

Many people aren't aware that coyotes and other wild mammals can maintain a nearly-invisible nocturnal presence in or adjacent to suburban areas, where they will roam freely at night. There's more wildlife around at night than people seem to realize: last year I was astonished to see 5 large raccoons standing in our street while a sixth raccoon perused our garbage can. And if I was a cat I wouldn't want to run into 6 adult raccoons.

[bunnies]

52. If someone stole my cat and brought it to the shelter...

there would be HELL to pay. Thats was such a dick move on the authors part. What kind of horrible person steals someones PET? Disgusting.

[NickB79]

65. What the author did was perfectly acceptable (and wasn't stealing)

Unless the author walked ONTO the cat owners property, they stole nothing. The OWNER allowed their pet to leave their property; that makes it perfectly legal and acceptable for neighbors to bring the stray cat to an animal shelter.

Don't like it? Don't abdicate your responsibility to your pet and let your cat wander freely on other people's property.

[bunnies]

68. My cat is an indoor cat.

But Im sorry, what she did is completely disgusting. She took something she knew belonged to someone else. A PET ffs. Have you ever had a pet go missing? Its a horrible thing to do to someone. Cats are everywhere. She doesnt have the right to steal everyones pet that touches her yard. Thats absurd.

[NickB79]

82. She stated she notified the owners multiple times previously

And they did nothing about the issue. She gave them more than enough warning and chances to rectify the situation.

She also stated that the owners would have to come pick up the cat and pay the $40 shelter fee, so that tells me she either notified the owners of what she did, or gave the shelter the relevant information so that the shelter could contact the owner.

Spin it all you want, but the fact is that the owners are ultimately responsible, and have no expectation of having their "property" remain in their possession when they allow it to wander God-knows-how-far from their property.

Like I said, in no way can what she did be construed as "stealing". Realistically, she removed a pet from a potentially hazardous environment and brought it somewhere safe. IMO, pet owners who allow their pets outdoors unsupervised are putting their pets in harm's way, and should be viewed as irresponsible pet owners. If it were up to me, they'd have their pets removed from them for such infractions.

We have experienced our cats escaping, once. It was horrible, and I WISH someone would have caught our cats and brought them to a shelter. As it was, it took them 4 DAYS to find their way home. The reason it was so horrible is that we KNEW how dangerous it was for them to roam free, and actually CARED about our pets enough to recognize the danger. The owner in the OP apparently did not care enough to be concerned.

We are horrified when people "dispose" of unwanted pets by dumping them on the side of the road and driving away, but turn a blind eye when owners let their pets roam miles from home on their own.

[bunnies]

129. Yeah. She left generic notices on everyone doors.

Couldnt she at least have gone to the neighbor personally and had a conversation about their cat? And since she didnt even do that I really doubt she had the gall to admit she took their pet to the shelter. Also, do you really think the shelter would have accepted the cat if she admitted she knew who he belonged to and where he lived? Not to mention, it was incredibly selfish of her to take up space in an animal shelter with an animal that doesnt need to be there. An animal in need could very well be turned away because of what she did. Its despicable.

But no... this woman was too wrapped up in her garden to give any of that a thought. Or if she did think about it, she didnt care. Thats just sad. The neighbor should definitely keep his cat inside. To protect him from that woman. Who knows what she is capable of if she doesnt get her way. The only reason her yard is "potentially hazardous" is because of her hatred toward this cat.

Like I said, I dont let my cat out. But its not my place to impose my behaviors on other people. Growing up, we had two indoor/outdoor cats who lived to be 18 and 22 years old. Our cats were not abused and certainly none of our neighbors would even consider just grabbing one of them and driving it an hour away.

It must have been horrible for you when your cats escaped. If my cat got outside, I would lose my mind. The concept of roads and cars are foreign to her and she would be terrified. Cats that are used to going out have a much better handle on such things. To say someone doesnt care about their cat because they let them go out is unfair. Some people believe its the natural thing to do and in fact, it probably is.

[Hissyspit]

74. Bullshit.

[NickB79]

89. How thoughtful

I'll have to re-evaluate my entire stance on outdoor cats based on all the thought-provoking points you made

[Hissyspit]

95. There's plenty of information throughout this thread

for you to re-evaluate the nonsensical OP.

[NickB79]

103. Nah, I have better things to do

Than waste my time tracking down information that says it IS stealing to bring a wandering pet far from home to an animal shelter when their irresponsible owners allow it to wander a potentially dangerous environment despite repeated warnings from concerned individuals.

But hey, clearly it's better for a cat to be eaten by a coyote or run over by a car than be brought to an evil, cruel animal shelter.

What a monster I am!

[bluestate10]

108. Even if you were a horrible pet owner that didn't control your pet?

The cat's owners were irresponsible, that problem was not something their neighbor could solve. The neighbor could solve the problem with the cat. The cat's owners are lucky, when I was growing up in a poor rural area, stray pets that became a problem were shot. I never shot a pet, but watched with horror as one person did, even as I yelled from a distance not to shoot the pet. The pet was a nuisance, my family tolerated it, but the person that had the gun didn't.

[bunnies]

130. So anyone that lets their cat outside is a horrible pet owner?

She didnt even bother to go to the neighbor and talk to him about it. And this cat isnt a stray. Its someones pet for crying out loud. Do you round up every cat you see and taking it to the shelter? They must have horrible owners, after all.

[Le Taz Hot]

128. Someone did that to one of my cats?

Hell to pay would be only the beginning. I'd stay up nights thinking up devious retributions and I'm not a vengeful kind of person but mess with my animals? Dead. Meat.

[bunnies]

131. Thank you!

Cats have been outside FOREVER and suddenly if one is caught catting in your yard its a horror beyond horrors! Geezus. Im with you.

[DevonRex]

138. +1. nt

[XemaSab]

174. Being taken to the shelter is one of the better outcomes

if you let your cats roam around outside.

[Le Taz Hot]

187. In that they were spayed/neutered as kittens

and in that they have pretty luxurious accommodations at home (covered patio, food, water, clean litter boxes), they don't do too much roaming. With only one exception, when my cats pass they pass of old age. My cats do bring home the occasional tree rat but rarely do they bring home birds. If one were to believe the OP, there should be birdie carnage everywhere with 5 outdoor cats but that's not the case.

As mentioned above, I have 3 bird feeders on the edge of my patio, out of reach for the cats, and those bird feeders are busy every day, all day. So, tell me again how me and my cats are wreaking havoc with the wildlife?

[Spitfire of ATJ]

55. We have a birdbath to help feed the cats.

[Coyotl]

56. Be sure to read the article to the end!

[XemaSab]

175. I should have known this thread would be of interest to you

[darkangel218]

59. Nice to see all the cat haters on here.

[NickB79]

69. Riiiiigggghhhhttttt.

Because not wanting your beloved pet to wander outside, kill wildlife, and possibly get killed/sick/eaten itself, automatically translates into "cat haters".

So, do you consider cat owners who let their cats frolic outdoors with the coyotes and diseases the true cat lovers among us?

BTW, I have 2 indoor only cats, and I think what the author did was entirely appropriate.

[darkangel218]

125. lololol!!

Buh bye.

[laundry_queen]

154. I think so too

My town has a cat bylaw. Every so often they go on a 'blitz' and trap problem cats and the owners have to pay a fee to get them back. It doesn't seem to make a difference to these owners. They still let their cats roam around. Where I have a problem with it is they crap in my kids' sandbox. We had to get a lid to keep the cats out. I'm not a cat hater for being disgusted with these irresponsible owners who think their kitties are entitled to run around at will - it's purely the owner's fault. It reminds me of those people who think their child can do no wrong. I don't hate the kid, it's not their fault.

[Myrina]

72. .... awww, and there are just so FEW cat LOVERS on the internets, right?

Poor, unloved little kitties.

[HangOnKids]

135. You have already stated upthread that you hate fucking hate cats

There are plenty of dog lovers on the internet too. Do you want me to make a list of the ways that dogs are disgusting? Here I will start with the dog that licks his ass and then wants to kiss you on the face. Oh and howz about the dogs that bite children, or worse yet maul them to death. And do dogs not kill birds?

[nomorenomore08]

160. Yeah. Why *is* it so much more acceptable to "hate" cats?

Shit, you say you hate dogs - which I don't, by any means - and people will probably think you're some kind of sociopathic monster. But despising cats, even to the point of "joking" about killing them, seems just fine and dandy to a lot of folks.

[XemaSab]

176. I love my dogs

Loving them for me means keeping them vaccinated, feeding them healthy food, taking them to the vet when they feel sick, making sure they get appropriate amounts of exercise, and making sure they don't run around in the street.

I have two dogs who were picked up as strays, and it's not a life that I would intentionally subject an animal to.

If it's cruel to let a dog run around, then why isn't it cruel to let a cat run around?

[alp227]

61. "Cats=invasive species" is a misconception.

Because of American native feline species like bobcats, cougars, and jaguars. Bobcats have about 3 babies per litter too and eat birds too. Furthermore, feral cats and wildcats have the same health issues if living in the same area. Why not let nature decide which species win?

[NickB79]

64. That's a poor argument

Just because there are felines in North America doesn't make domestic cats in any way comparable to native species. They inhabit entirely different niches. A 10-lb cat in no way occupies the same niche as a 30-lb bobcat, or a 100-lb cougar.

It would be like saying that, since there are 10-lb catfish in the Mississippi River, it's no problem that there are ALSO 50-lb invasive carp there as well. After all, they're all fish, right?

[caseymoz]

71. Actually, it seems cats are being selected against hunting.

That same famous survey that put mini-cameras on cats and discovered all the carnage domestic outdoor cats were wreaking also found that only 44 percent showed any hunting behavior whatsoever, and only 30 percent were successful. Hard to believe that this much destruction is done by only a third of outdoor cats, but it seems so.

Nevertheless, another better reason to keep them in is the fact that it isn't safe. Outdoor cats have shorter lifespans, and the leading causes of death for outdoor cats were diseases and other cats. Yes, cats will kill other cats. They're sweet to humans but they despise one another.

Surprisingly, cars aren't the leading cause. Felines seem to negotiate streets just fine.

[GalaxyHunter]

76. isn't a cat killing birds its natural instinct?

some birds survive, some birds die.

that's life.

[alp227]

81. True, but a bird in every cat's dish = EXTINCTION. Can't have that. nt

[GalaxyHunter]

85. I don't believe that for a second.

there is NO POSSIBLE WAY cats could make birds extinct.

[XemaSab]

178. Birds have gone extinct due to cat predation

and I don't know why you think this is funny.

[NickB79]

98. In their native habitat as wild animals, yes

However:

1) Small species of cats aren't native to North America. The smallest native feline is the bobcat, which usually weights twice what a domestic cat weighs, and feeds on different species (or grown individuals of said species) than what most housecats hunt.

2) Cats that are fed by owners, but allowed to roam free, are killing out of instinct rather than out of hunger. As such, they are getting a free pass of sorts from Nature; instead of seeing the population of cats stabilize to the available food resources (birds and rodents) through starvation like we'd see in a wild predator/prey scenario, the cat population never falls no matter how low the number of wild animals goes. That is VERY unnatural compared to how species have evolved over the eons.

[GalaxyHunter]

104. mother nature will straighten it all out.

[NickB79]

107. Not so long as humans actively intervene

But then again, Mother Nature is getting close to straightening US out after decades of abusing the global environment, so you might be right.......

[GalaxyHunter]

111. mother nature doesn't take shit from anyone. She will do what she pleases.

[bluestate10]

118. I once witnessed a flock of birds dive bombing a cat in my neighborhood.

The cat was being hit so much that it ran and hid under a parked car. I didn't see what had happened, but I did see that those birds were pissed.

[GalaxyHunter]

120. that cat must have done something to piss those birds off!

[mitchtv]

115. yeah, like the flu virus

some live, some people die. That's life.

[GalaxyHunter]

119. so flu killing humans = cats killing birds in your eyes?

[mitchtv]

126. your point "it's nature" why worry?

is the operative theory. When do you intervene in a fractured ecosystem?

[GalaxyHunter]

140. question is, do you?

[ZombieHorde]

127. Yes, but cats are an introduced species.

People who care about preserving ecosystems are often against introducing new species into environments.

[GalaxyHunter]

141. mother nature will overcome.

[ZombieHorde]

148. All life on Earth will eventually be snuffed out.

Stars don't last forever.

[GalaxyHunter]

149. BOOM! Truth Bomb!

[XemaSab]

181. Do you know how many species went extinct when humans came to the Americas?

[wryter2000]

83. What cats actually do

http://www.npr.org/2012/08/10/158589981/kitty-cam-reveals-the-secret-life-of-roaming-cats

BLOCK: Wildlife ecologist Kerrie Anne Loyd led the research. She was surprised that only 44 percent of the cats exhibited hunting behavior and even fewer, 30 percent, successfully captured animals. Another surprise, Loyd says, is what those cats were hunting.

KERRIE ANNE LOYD: Well, in Athens, Georgia, we found that they were capturing quite a few reptiles, so small lizards, small snakes, and that may be due just to the availability of these animals there. The prey may be very different in different geographic areas.

BLOCK: And apart from the reptiles, what else?

LOYD: Small mammals, woodland voles - that's a small mammal that runs around in the leaf litter in suburban areas - chipmunks, we had a squirrel, then invertebrates, so earthworms, moths, dragonflies even, and then birds were the minority of the prey.

From an NPR show of what cats actually do. Cats were fitted with kitty cams and followed around their neighborhoods. There was far less hunting than previously thought, and birds weren't the most common prey.

As far as I can tell, in the 8.5 years I've had my cat, she's killed exactly one bird. There might have been a few more I've missed, by I've had more birds kill themselves by flying into windows.

[Vinnie From Indy]

84. I told her "Your obsession with cats has gone too far and I want you to go!"

She looked at me and said, "So, you are kicking meowt?"

[valerief]

91. Bwahaha! nt

[eilen]

87. I have an indoor/outdoor cat

she is small. She is formidable. Occasionally she gets a bird but it has to be a small/young one--usually a baby crow because the adults go nuts and my cat is crazy and think its fun to tease big crows and mostly she gets mice. Our backyard is lined in trees and we have many many many birds: bluejays, robins (lots of robbins), crows, smaller birds--I don't know what they are, hummingbirds, woodpeckers, cardinals etc. My dog obligingly sheds her coat a few times in Spring and Summer to cushion and insulate their nests. We also have many voles, mice, rabbits and more rabbits and I have been hearing a creature at night that sounds very much like a raccoon. We also have possum. There is a river not far from us which teems with wildlife. Our neighbors have a wire fence and behind it, they keep a rott. Our cat does not visit them. She mostly just hangs out in our yard/deck.

It is their nature to hunt. If cats are feral, they cannot be kept indoors anyway. Mine is not feral but is doing just fine and she is living her purpose--she only hunts at night when most birds are asleep in their nests although we have given her a bird toy stuffed with catnip that cheeps every time she moves it. We do not have bands of feral cats nor wild dogs in our suburb. Luckily the Canadian Geese spurn us for the local wildlife lake refuge or we would be replacing our rooftops every 5 years. The wildlife in my 45 year old subdivision/neighborhood lacks natural predators to keep it in check.

[bunnies]

134. Aha! Youre one of those horrible cat owners I read about upthread.

You let her out because you dont love her. Did you know that?

[eilen]

145. Yeah, guilty. She yowls to go out. It's not like I throw her out.

Cats are bossy. Any concern trolls out there can come over and see if they can convince her to leave with them. She might be generous with her affections but she knows who butters her bread.

[bunnies]

146. lol. I know what you mean.

I'd like to see one of them try to make a cat used to going outside stay in. A few hours of wailing and any of them would be opening that door. Ive no doubt your kitteh is very happy and very much loved.

[MFM008]

151. all owned cats should be indoor

there is no reason for a cat to go outdoors at all.
They can get air and exercise in the house.
I have a 1 bedroom apt and my cat looks out the sliding door at chipmunks,squirrels, birds of all types and unfortunatly other cats I have to chase off.
You dont know what a cat catchs and kills when out of direct view.
At least put a bell on them if you insist on letting them out.
Dont assume your doing nature a favor by letting a cat run

.

[eilen]

195. You are not the boss of me LOL

go find someone else to be a control freak over.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

90. i love my cat therefore i would never let her outside. its better for her and the environment

for her to be indoor only.

[NickB79]

106. Why do you hate cats so much?!?!

Based on some of the posts on this thread, people like you and I are horrible, horrible cat haters for keeping our cats indoors.

The only way we can be redeemed as true "cat lovers" is to personally deliver our cats to the jaws of a waiting coyote, or throw them under the wheels of an oncoming semi-trailer.

You know, for love and whatnot.

[heaven05]

92. i have

taken care of a feral cat colony for three years now. I get them spayed and neutered as I can trap them. I try to catch them to get rabies shots as we do have skunks in the neighborhood. I have a colony that has ranged from nine to nineteen cats. A couple of them don't get along with each other but water bottle breaks them up quickly, but no real killing of birds happens with this colony. How do I know? I have had one dropped off on front porch in the three years and one in the garage. No squirrels or rabbits. Wheezy, the opportunist cat from three houses down has killed couple of birds, they don't feed her much, leave out in the winter and I had her spayed after she had a litter in my garage. I have heating boxes constructed with heating pad for winter time in the garage and around the house under bushes and the like. I find if they are well fed, they DO NOT kill that gratuitously. My experience. My local humane society TNR program helps and I have a local vet that helps me also. All in all I have had a pretty good experience with my colony. Yes I have inside cats also.

[Ash_F]

96. Nice read.

I don't know if I agree with keeping cats indoors all their lives. Sounds boring. They are animals.

But then again I don't own any pets, mainly because I can't give them the time/necessities that I think they deserve.

[Rex]

99. Can't blame them for millions of years of evolution.

Cats are carnivorous animals. No bird, lizard or cockroach is safe.

[Stainless]

102. My cat hunts lizards!

He is mostly an indoors cat, but he spends a little time outdoors in the yard. The desert environment I live in is full of lizards and very few escape my cat when he is outside. I've never seen him successfully stalk a bird although he continues to try.

[bluestate10]

121. Watch you cat. It may hunt lizards, but one day it may try to hunt the pit vipers that

are surely plentiful in your desert environment. Even if your cat wins that fight, it is likely to end up dead.

[Bake]

109. Umm, it's what they do. They hunt. It's in their DNA.

bake

[bluestate10]

124. So, by your logic it is ok if larger predators hunt cats while they are outside? nt

[Bake]

136. Animals are going to do what they do. It's nature, not logic.

If I had a cat (used to), I'd keep it inside. For its own protection and for the birds as well.

Bake

[eilen]

147. I'm reasonably sure that my cat is cognizant of other creatures

and knows which ones to avoid. For instance, while I am sure she can figure out how to get over the fence next door, she never does this when the rottweiler is out.

Once she went over there when the idiot woman had her caged tropical birds outside. To my cat that looked like a Happy Meal. The idiot woman moved out. These are the same people who use a ride on tractor mower to cut the grass in their little yard.

My cat also knows not to go in the street. She usually catches mice under our deck. We have no Owls or Hawks nesting here. There are some Eagles nesting in a park south of us and I have seen the occasional hawk fly however, I think the voluminous squirrel population keeps them fed. Rabbits are probably too fast though they do linger in the clover patches in my yard.

It's been 11 years. Cats live almost forever.

[dogknob]

133. Substitute "people" for cats and you might be on to something...

...because there are some 6 billion unwanted humans on the planet.

All we need is to hand over control of everything to a group of men who can make decisions with no regard for the lives or feelings of those who need to be culled from the herd...

[Tom Ripley]

142. Fuck Crista Worthy; I would prefer Frankie as a neighbor

[JCMach1]

144. +1000

[JCMach1]

143. Cats are a part of the 'human' ecosystem... take them away and the rodent population

and nuisance bird population will SPIKE!!!

Lay off the kittehs,,,


Article author must be a dog lover!!!

[LisaL]

155. Mine are kept inside.

No danger to any birds.

[NaturalHigh]

157. BS.

Cats are doing what their DNA tells them to do. The larger animals that hunt them are doing the same. If you don't like that, talk to Mother Nature.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

168. Nonsense. Domestic cats do not have larger animals that hunt them. And ...

Further, domestic cats are artificially maintained and propagated by humans. They are fed, housed, attended to, and given veterinary care.

It is ridiculous to invoke "Mother Nature" in such a context.

[XemaSab]

183. Do you think cats should be taken care of by humans?

[ohheckyeah]

159. It is the responsibility

of the pet owner to see that the pet stays out of other's yards.

I live in the country and we went to great lengths to provide everything needed for a wildlife habitat. I don't appreciate a neighbor allowing their cats or dogs to roam the neighborhood killing the wildlife.

I recently had an issue with the neighbor's dog....it is stealing stuff and breaking stuff all over the neighborhood. That dog has cost me about $200 already. It stole pillows off my front porch for God's sake and the neighbor knew it was doing so and did nothing except collect the stuff in a mudroom. When we realized what was happening because we caught the dog on the porch, my husband confronted the neighbor who still doesn't seem to give a crap.

[alarimer]

161. All pet cats belong indoors. Period.

It's better for them, it's better for the birds.

For the feral ones, I am in favor of euthanasia. Sorry, they are an invasive species that wreaks havoc on the ecosystems. As a biologist, I want all invasives eradicated.

[Hissyspit]

179. As a biologist it's amazing how ignorant you are.

[XemaSab]

186. Are you a biologist?

[Arugula Latte]

185. So how about euthanizing the invasive species known as homo sapien when they venture into non-native

territory and wreak havoc on ecosystems?

[liberal_at_heart]

162. We have lots of wildlife where I live including birds and bunnies. I cringe whever I see cats and

dogs roaming the outdoors out here because I know they are hunting our wildlife.

[cherish44]

169. Oh well do like my asshole neighbor did and put out some water with antifreeze in it

That cut down the cat population and also killed my beloved cat (she died a horrible painful death from the poisoning). My personal cats only kill bugs and the occasional mouse, not quite ambitious enough for birds.

[madville]

170. Animal control in my county loans out traps

My neighbor went and picked up a couple. In the last year he has trapped 27 cats and an occasional possum or raccoon that he usually releases.

Animal control will then come pick up the cats or he drops the trap at their office and I assume they put the cats down since they are wild.

[gulliver]

177. Arm the birds.

Berton Roueché wrote a novel called Feral back in the 1970's. We were warned about the cats but foolishly have not listened.

[Arugula Latte]

184. I'm so fucking sick of these anti-cat threads on DU.

Give it a rest.

Also, what about all the rats and mice cats kill to humans' benefit?

[XemaSab]

188. How is asking people to keep their cats inside

anti-cat?

[Arugula Latte]

189. That's a different thread topic.

These "cats are mass murderers!" threads bring out all the cat-hating creeps on DU ... This subject has been covered and covered and covered.

Yes, keep cats indoors if possible for their own safety. I keep mine inside. (Some cats simply won't put up with it, though -- I get that.)

[The Second Stone]

190. How about the invasive and ubiquitous African Rock Pigeon

aka, the feathered and flying rat? Can we hope that the non-native cats kill the pigeons?

[Ohio Joe]

194. A shame the article never even tries to address the claim of it's title

Is there so much as a single neighborhood where cats have killed all the birds? Most of them? Complete non-sense with no basis in reality.