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Kerry: Congress faces 'Munich moment' (Original Post) MyNameGoesHere Sep 2013 OP
Wow! Assad is going to invade Czechoslovakia!! Oh, wait, it doesn't exist anymore. Tierra_y_Libertad Sep 2013 #1
Well, to be fair, Republicans aren't too clear on that either... JHB Sep 2013 #33
Its still there - hasn't gone anywhere. dipsydoodle Sep 2013 #37
Kerry is an embarrassment at this point cthulu2016 Sep 2013 #2
That's absolutely ridiculous. n/t ProSense Sep 2013 #10
Oh, I stand corrected then. cthulu2016 Sep 2013 #12
Read my post at #9 and follow the link to Der Spiegel's article from today. KittyWampus Sep 2013 #13
Not only that, ProSense Sep 2013 #14
Its not that people are / were desperate to prove that this wasn't done by Assad. dipsydoodle Sep 2013 #39
Puts his Iraq war vote in perspective, doesn't it? The Link Sep 2013 #3
I am new, so I am really trying to not be banned Crimson76 Sep 2013 #4
Welcome to the DU Omaha Steve Sep 2013 #22
Low Point malletgirl02 Sep 2013 #5
He is really taking to his new role as Condoleezza. QC Sep 2013 #6
Jesus H. Christ. So who's Chamberlain in this scenario? WTF???? - nt HardTimes99 Sep 2013 #7
This constant over-use of Nazi comparisons 99th_Monkey Sep 2013 #8
Assad's forces are losing. They are defecting. They only have a few air fields for supply KittyWampus Sep 2013 #9
So then you would agree that the Munich analogy is utter bullshit. Warren Stupidity Sep 2013 #29
justice?? Supersedeas Sep 2013 #35
The poster claims the Assad regime is about to fall to the democratic forces of the rebels Warren Stupidity Sep 2013 #36
so? this is like the 16th Reichstag moment we've had since 00's paper coup MisterP Sep 2013 #11
About time Kerry takes a stand. 9 years too late. Better late than never, no? blkmusclmachine Sep 2013 #15
kerry is still looking for sadaams mwds nt msongs Sep 2013 #16
There can be analogies made to the Nazi regime, but that sure as hell wasn't one of them 1-Old-Man Sep 2013 #17
Come on, if you gotta use analogies say "Kaiser Moment" n2doc Sep 2013 #18
Every situation is different treestar Sep 2013 #19
This is tremendously embarrassing. David__77 Sep 2013 #20
Standard neocon rhetoric. JackRiddler Sep 2013 #21
Politicians say whatever it takes to get what they want, no surprise. Jefferson23 Sep 2013 #23
Perhaps a chorus or two of, "Springtime for Assad," to follow up? Alkene Sep 2013 #24
Oh lord Cali_Democrat Sep 2013 #25
As stated several times, this is embarrassing. last1standing Sep 2013 #26
At this time, Kerry is an embarassment. Dawson Leery Sep 2013 #27
Please Sec. Kerry. You've got more sense than that. nt ladjf Sep 2013 #28
Bullshit n/t malaise Sep 2013 #30
Don't agree with this sort of rhetoric. tritsofme Sep 2013 #31
Assad is going to invade Hitlerlslovakia or something neverforget Sep 2013 #32
Hmm... How Come Nobody Has Brought Up Godwin's Law In This Thread ??? WillyT Sep 2013 #34
I'm embarrassed for Kerry now. This proves all he ever wanted was a podium and a microphone. reformist2 Sep 2013 #38
Kerry LOL n/t KG Sep 2013 #40
 

Tierra_y_Libertad

(50,414 posts)
1. Wow! Assad is going to invade Czechoslovakia!! Oh, wait, it doesn't exist anymore.
Mon Sep 2, 2013, 03:59 PM
Sep 2013

Kerry needs a new PR team.

JHB

(37,157 posts)
33. Well, to be fair, Republicans aren't too clear on that either...
Mon Sep 2, 2013, 07:39 PM
Sep 2013
Liz Cheney Claims Obama Has "Abandoned" Czechoslovakia (Which Hasn't Existed Since The Early '90s)
http://mediamatters.org/video/2012/09/16/liz-cheney-claims-obama-has-abandoned-czechoslo/189922


Romney Foreign Policy Adviser Attacks Obama’s ‘Czechoslovakia’ Policy
http://thinkprogress.org/security/2012/04/26/471692/romney-adviser-czechoslovakia/

McCain Keeps Mentioning Country That Hasn’t Existed Since 1992
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2008/07/mccain-keeps-me/

dipsydoodle

(42,239 posts)
37. Its still there - hasn't gone anywhere.
Tue Sep 3, 2013, 07:16 AM
Sep 2013

Its in the form of two states : Czech And Slovak Republics.

Aside from that we still use the expression "there's a Czech in the post"

cthulu2016

(10,960 posts)
2. Kerry is an embarrassment at this point
Mon Sep 2, 2013, 04:01 PM
Sep 2013

He should be relieved of his position.

I said the same about Powell and Rice.

A SecState invoking Hitler at every turn is not acceptable.

ProSense

(116,464 posts)
14. Not only that,
Mon Sep 2, 2013, 04:17 PM
Sep 2013

it seems people were desperate to prove that this wasn't done by Assad and now the use of chemical weapons are being used to absolve him. The false equivalencies ignore that the chemical weapons treaty bans specific agents. This is why it's critical to determine the agent used. The use of any toxic agent on civilians is egregious. The use of specific toxic agents violates the chemical weapons ban and is a serious violation of international law. This is why the specific uses are being cited.

dipsydoodle

(42,239 posts)
39. Its not that people are / were desperate to prove that this wasn't done by Assad.
Tue Sep 3, 2013, 07:22 AM
Sep 2013

Its a preference for proof as opposed to WH and media spin.

Few of us have forgotten the Kuwaiti incubators lie where the Kuwaiti Ambassador to the United States daughter's scammed Congress into believing she was a nurse who'd witnessed such an event.

malletgirl02

(1,523 posts)
5. Low Point
Mon Sep 2, 2013, 04:03 PM
Sep 2013

Secretary Kerry this is a low point. If you want Congress to vote for military strikes use a real argument. Even Congress doesn't deserve lazy Hitler arguments.

QC

(26,371 posts)
6. He is really taking to his new role as Condoleezza.
Mon Sep 2, 2013, 04:03 PM
Sep 2013

It's hard to see how he can get much lower than this, though I'm sure he will manage.

 

KittyWampus

(55,894 posts)
9. Assad's forces are losing. They are defecting. They only have a few air fields for supply
Mon Sep 2, 2013, 04:04 PM
Sep 2013

Because the rebels hold most of the ground.

They are getting desperate.

Hence, the use of chemical weapons in Damascus where they should not have needed to use them.

Assad has shelled refugee camps.

It will get even more heinous.

There WILL be large scale civilian atrocities in the relatively near future.




From Der Spiegel today:
http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/situation-in-syria-deteriorates-as-west-looks-for-answers-a-919733-2.html


Yet, it is perhaps irrelevant who gave the order since the entire Syrian leadership is reportedly afraid that the defense lines will collapse. These fears have been fanned by a number of developments over the past few weeks: the unauthorized withdrawal of previously Assad-loyal militias to their Alawite villages; the feared rebel offensive; the declining morale of the regular troops; and the rising losses without military victories to show for them.

The poison gas attack was probably carried out by the 4th division of Assad's army. Experts and defectors agree that this is the only unit that possesses launching devices for chemical weapons. Immediately following the chemical attack, it shelled rebel positions with conventional artillery -- but was unable to take a single location.

Instead, the division lost at least seven tanks in the Damascus neighborhood of Harasta alone. A rebel video provides an insight into the lack of personnel among the elite division: Two crew members flee a burning tank -- but they are wearing no uniforms, no helmets and no radio gear. Shabiha militia members have apparently been forced to fill the gaps in the ranks of the army.

The images are highly significant and don't correspond with reports that Assad has strengthened his military position. Military experts and intelligence agents had been circulating this theory for months, ever since the battle for control of the small town of Qusayr in early summer. Under the leadership of over 1,000 fighters from the Shiite Hezbollah militia from Lebanon, Assad's troops were able to recapture Qusayr.


Snip
Nevertheless, the myth of a military turning point in the regime's favor has persisted since June. This has also hampered the search for motives for the poison gas attack: Many observers wondered why Assad should use chemical weapons if he is winning the war already. In actual fact, the situation has been difficult for the regime's troops for quite some time now. Since the spring of 2012, many of the army's positions have only been supplied from the air because all land routes are under the control the rebels.

 

Warren Stupidity

(48,181 posts)
29. So then you would agree that the Munich analogy is utter bullshit.
Mon Sep 2, 2013, 07:32 PM
Sep 2013

Anyway, as you say, whatever we do, Assad wil soon be brought to justice.

 

Warren Stupidity

(48,181 posts)
36. The poster claims the Assad regime is about to fall to the democratic forces of the rebels
Tue Sep 3, 2013, 07:12 AM
Sep 2013

Who will of course bring him to justice for war crimes rather than, for example, stick a pole up his butt and slaughter him like a pig.

1-Old-Man

(2,667 posts)
17. There can be analogies made to the Nazi regime, but that sure as hell wasn't one of them
Mon Sep 2, 2013, 04:59 PM
Sep 2013

There is nothing wrong with looking to the past for situations analogous to today's events, that but sure as hell isn't one of them. If on the other hand he had said that this was just like the US ignoring reports of what was happening to the Gypsies, homosexuals, and jews in Nazi Germany prior to and during the way then he would have been at least a little bit close.

n2doc

(47,953 posts)
18. Come on, if you gotta use analogies say "Kaiser Moment"
Mon Sep 2, 2013, 05:40 PM
Sep 2013

It's WWI you want to reference, not WWII. Kerry is a completely owned tool of the MIC. The bravery he once had is long gone, burned off by years of service to the 1%.

treestar

(82,383 posts)
19. Every situation is different
Mon Sep 2, 2013, 05:42 PM
Sep 2013

Merely because Vietnam was wrong does not make every war wrong. One can feel Vietnam was wrong and still consistently think some other war might be right.



 

JackRiddler

(24,979 posts)
21. Standard neocon rhetoric.
Mon Sep 2, 2013, 06:02 PM
Sep 2013

History is so rich, and especially rich in showing the insanity and evil of war, but you can reduce the neocon repertoire (neocons, humanitarian imperialists, whatever, same shit) to maybe five or six events that ever count. "Appeasement" and "Rwanda" are two of the big ones and especially mythologized.

Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
23. Politicians say whatever it takes to get what they want, no surprise.
Mon Sep 2, 2013, 06:09 PM
Sep 2013

If Kerry sounds credible to you, then he'll persuade you. I am embarrassed for him but not
shocked.

Alkene

(752 posts)
24. Perhaps a chorus or two of, "Springtime for Assad," to follow up?
Mon Sep 2, 2013, 06:10 PM
Sep 2013

Seriously though, enough with the Hitler card, Mr. Kerry.

last1standing

(11,709 posts)
26. As stated several times, this is embarrassing.
Mon Sep 2, 2013, 06:28 PM
Sep 2013

Any secretary of state this incompetent needs to be replaced. We can only lose credibility in the world if he continues these stupidities.

It is also likely to make other nations react the same way I did by questioning the veracity of his other remarks regarding the conflict.

tritsofme

(17,371 posts)
31. Don't agree with this sort of rhetoric.
Mon Sep 2, 2013, 07:34 PM
Sep 2013

Not the sort of thoughtful and measured rhetoric you expect from this administration.

 

WillyT

(72,631 posts)
34. Hmm... How Come Nobody Has Brought Up Godwin's Law In This Thread ???
Mon Sep 2, 2013, 08:39 PM
Sep 2013
The law is sometimes invoked, as a rule, to mark the end of a discussion when a Nazi analogy is made, with the writer who made the analogy being considered to have lost the argument.


From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law


reformist2

(9,841 posts)
38. I'm embarrassed for Kerry now. This proves all he ever wanted was a podium and a microphone.
Tue Sep 3, 2013, 07:22 AM
Sep 2013

He'll read whatever's in the script.
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