Video Depicts Horrific Attack on Gay Man in Russia

[William769]

A video making the rounds on social media shows a gay man in Russia being beaten and raped with a bottle, by a group of men who wanted him to “repent for his sins,” reports Radio Free Europe/Radio Liberty.

Reporters for the radio service said they had seen the video, which is on a mobile phone application called WhatsApp, and while they could not verify its authenticity, they did speak to a man who claimed to have participated in the assault.

The attackers stripped the man of his clothes, which they later burned, then handcuffed and beat him, held a gun on him, and forced him to sodomize himself by sitting on a bottle, which they then forced in farther by using a baseball bat. In the video, he is weeping and obviously terrified.

The assault reportedly took place Wednesday in the city of Novosibirsk, although police there told RFE/RL they were not aware of any such attack. The victim and the perpetrators were all ethnic Uzbeks.

http://www.advocate.com/society/hate-crimes/2013/09/14/video-depicts-horrific-attack-gay-man-russia

Putin's Russia.

[maddezmom]

1. No words

[DevonRex]

2. OMG.

If the glass broke he could die. That's the most horrifying thing I have ever read. I am so sorry for that man. It breaks my heart what he went through. Putin's Russia indeed. If I see one more post glorifying that evil man I'll puke.

[stevenleser]

3. Russian clergy have been known to participate in some of these. That's what I

Thought of when I saw the reference to "repent".

With the state providing the legal cover, and the Russian Orthodox Church providing the moral cover, this really has the potential to result in mass killings.

[William769]

5. I think we are closer than any one thinks.

[Rex]

4. Dictatorships are like that.

Cold and brutal. The farce of Putin running around with the title 'president' does a disservice to all freely elected governments. I think Putin is a coward. Hiding behind his freedom sounding title.

[William769]

7. ...

[HappyMe]

16. I agree.

Trying to project an image of something he isn't even close to being. He's a brutal asshole.

[Rex]

17. I don't see him any different then Saddam Hussein.

As a matter of fact, Hussein might have been more secular then Putin. This rise of religious figures participating, should be very worrisome to people that read history.

[HappyMe]

22. The rise of crazy religious leaders is very scary.

Cruelty and brutality isn't limited to religion alone.

[Rex]

23. Well when I think about those two words

'cruelty' and 'brutality', the next word that pops into my head is dictatorship.

[HappyMe]

27. Exactly.

A dictatorship is never associated with the words 'peaceful' or 'freedom'. The only time you see people living under a dictatorship say that it's not so bad is when their families or they themselves have been threatened. The thought of living under those conditions is very chilling.

[Rex]

29. I thank my lucky stars to be born in America.

At least we don't have to worry about starving to death as political prisoners in a gulag.

[HappyMe]

32. No kidding.

The US has a bunch of flaws. We have done and will probably do more dumbass things, but I'm glad to be here.

[LittleBlue]

56. Putin is overwhelmingly popular in Russa

He hovers between 60-70% approval in independent polling.

Don't fool yourself into thinking he is like Hussein, a dictator without popular support. Russia was homophobic long before Putin.

[William769]

58. His approval rating is so high because birds of a feather flock together.

Or it could be he uses the same tactics Husein did. Just saying.

[ocpagu]

66. Oh, so Russians are all a bunch of homophobics...

I see, it does make sense to use anti-homophobic activism to reinforce russophobia...

[William769]

70. If the shoe fits....

[ocpagu]

92. Hey, I'm not the altruist LGBT russophobic activist here, sir. n/t

[William769]

94. Could have fooled me.

[morningfog]

8. Reccing for exposure. This is disgusting.

[Rex]

9. The Olympics should boycott Russia.

There, I said it.

[morningfog]

10. I support that. I have general disdain for the Olympics anyway.

[Rex]

11. They should never be held in a dictatorship imo.

I am hot and cold with the Olympics, but there should be standards and that should be one.

[backscatter712]

21. Since they're not going to, I'm boycotting the Olympics and their sponsors.

Do not do business with any of the companies sponsoring the Olympics, listed on this page:

http://www.sochi2014.com/en/team/partners/

[Iliyah]

12. And it been in continuance

while Russia's higher ups turn a blind eye. Sometime I feel they are encouraging it. Ugh.

[MineralMan]

13. And such atrocities are neither investigated nor prosecuted

in Putin's Russia. It is a shame on them. Here is my comment to Putin:

У тебя нет стыда? (Have you no shame?)

[William769]

14. It's a shame on the rest of the world also turning a blind eye.

Not to mention certain DU posters.

[MineralMan]

15. Yes. Holding up Putin as some sort of hero,

while he supports homophobic laws and policies is not my idea of being progressive.

[ocpagu]

18. It's really horrible.

Too bad US media and Obama don't seem to be so outraged at the situation of the gay community in Saudi Arabia, which is far, far worse, since violence is enacted by the government itself...



Quite the contrary, right?

[Turborama]

131. Using a photo of hanged gay men in IRAN to try & make President Obama look worse than Putin is SICK!

A) this is a graphic picture of people being hanged which should come with a *GRAPHIC* warning

B) This poster found the image on Atlas Shrugs, a vile bigoted site that no DUers use as a source.

gayshungshariaviaatlasshrugsaug112013.jpg

This is where it was originally posted on Atlas Shrugs: http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/2008/07/ahmadinejad-fav.html

And they used it again on August 11 this year (same date in the image link above) to try and besmirch President Obama: http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/2013/08/exploitation-obamas-hypocrisy-on-the-gays-in-russia-vs-gays-slaughtered-under-the-sharia.html

C) The picture is actually of a hanging in Iran, not Saudi Arabia, and is posted here in a disturbing attempt to use hanged gay men to try and make President Obama look worse than Putin.

[Cali_Democrat]

147. Great detective work, Turborama

[SidDithers]

150. I'm glad you got pizza for this shit...nt

Sid

[Spitfire of ATJ]

19. The Russian people are not happy with Putin's encouraging of this stuff.

[Sand Wind]

20. Disgusting....I hope we succeed in ruining their Olympic !

[closeupready]

24. Cher is publicly declining an Olympic invitation in protest

of Russian homophobia.

God bless her. K&R

>>Count Cher among the entertainers not planning a trip to Russia anytime soon.

"I can't name names but my friend called who is a big oligarch over there, and asked me if I'd like to be an ambassador for the Olympics and open the show. I immediately said no," the pop icon revealed in an interview with Canadian magazine Maclean's.

"I want to know why all of this gay hate just exploded over there," she added. "He said the Russian people don't feel the way the government does."<<

http://www.eonline.com/news/458982/cher-said-no-to-performing-at-olympics-in-russia-due-to-anti-gay-law

[William769]

36. GTMA!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023661960

[ocpagu]

25. Because hate crimes are exclusive to Russia and Putin should be made responsible for all of them.

US? Nope. Too exceptional for that.

The Military's Secret Shame

Greg Jeloudov was 35 and new to America when he decided to join the Army. Like most soldiers, he was driven by both patriotism for his adopted homeland and the pragmatic notion that the military could be a first step in a career that would enable him to provide for his new family. Instead, Jeloudov arrived at Fort Benning, Ga., for basic training in May 2009, in the middle of the economic crisis and rising xenophobia. The soldiers in his unit, responding to his Russian accent and New York City address, called him a “champagne socialist” and a “commie faggot.” He was, he told NEWSWEEK, “in the middle of the viper’s pit.” Less than two weeks after arriving on base, he was gang-raped in the barracks by men who said they were showing him who was in charge of the United States. When he reported the attack to unit commanders, he says they told him, “It must have been your fault. You must have provoked them.”

Read more:
http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2011/04/03/the-military-s-secret-shame.html

Drugged and raped: A soldier tells his story

http://sdgln.com/news/2013/06/11/drugged-and-raped-army-soldier-tells-his-story

Which US event are we going to boycott?

[closeupready]

26. Because nobody anywhere ever can chew gum and walk simultaneously.

Wow. Do you live in Dumb-dumb land, or what?

[ocpagu]

30. The kind of abuse related in the OP...

... happens in the US as well.

So what's the point of "boycotting Russia"?

I really don't understand why so much outrage directed against Russia while US allies in the Middle East are treating their gay communities a thousand times worse...

Exceptionalism extends to allies as well?

[William769]

35. Please quote the laws in the U.S. that relate to the OP

If you can't and we all know you can't, your just trying to blow smoke up everyone's ass and I might add not doing a very good job of it.

[ocpagu]

39. ?

I'm not talking about laws. I'm talking about crimes.

What about US allied governments executing homosexuals in the Middle East? When does the public pressure start?

[William769]

40. Deflection doesn't help either.

Compare the laws passed in Russia this year alone against the LGBT people. Or the police that stand by & watch these "crimes" committed because of the laws.

Yes smoke ass.

[ocpagu]

44. I'm aware of the law. It's awful, but it doesn't authorize torturing or raping.

The laws of the US-allied governments, on the other hand, authorize KILLING homosexuals for being homosexuals.

And we don't see significant outrage in the US media and government.

And the fact that you are ignoring this point reinforces there's no rational justification for that, or you'd have answered already.

[William769]

45. Ignoring the fact? Guess again.

I even went up against the Administrators of this site over Uganda. My record is perfectly clear on this subject that where ever it is no matter who it is I am there. I will continue to be there and you trying to make this about something other than what it really is, is appalling to say the least.

Why can't you just admit it's wrong what is happening in Russia and if you know of other places it is happening start an OP I promise you I will there also. But it's safe to say that not going to happen with you because you motives are as plain as day.

Have a nice day.

[ocpagu]

96. Well...

... why don't you just show me your threads about the LGBT issues in Saudi Arabia then?

[William769]

98. See here.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=3668520

Don't worry I don't expect a response.

[ocpagu]

108. Neither do I. n/t

[William769]

97. Posted wrong place.

[stevenleser]

143. That's ridiculous. Crimes happen against all people everywhere.That is a completely irrelevant point

The point is government passing laws that sanction violence against a group of people and standing by while that violence happens.

Your twisting into knots trying to justify Putin's and Russia's behavior here is completely disgusting and indefensible.

[Behind the Aegis]

148. And s/he paid the price for it....

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=profile&uid=274697&sub=trans

[stevenleser]

152. And some are still trying to defend her...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=3672379

[HappyMe]

28. Nobody is saying that.

[FreeState]

33. There is no excuse for violence of this type anywhere

I find the continual "but look over here" posts verging on subtle homophobia myself. We can walk and chew gum at the same time - we can not excuse behavior like that in the OP for any reason, yet alone diminishing it because its not unique.

[Behind the Aegis]

37. +1

[ocpagu]

41. But we're not actually "walking and chewing gum", are we?

You highlighted in you own OP: "Putin's Russia".

What I'm questioning is: this crime happens in several places, including the US. Why did you chose to highlight this case from Russia?

Are you attacking violence on gays? Or Putin?

[FreeState]

43. This isn't my OP - the OP is about Russia and whats going on there

its you post thats trying to diminish that. I find your reaction disturbing to say the least.

(By the way I am a long time activist and have worked on LGBT issues all over the place, but please continue to try and peg me as what ever you want in an effort to allow homophobic attacks, because that is what excusing this type of behavior, which is a direct result of laws in Russia does.)

[HappyMe]

42. Very true.

[treestar]

55. But in the US it is a crime that will be prosecuted

And there are no laws limiting freedom of speech.

[maddezmom]

126. What? Where in the OP was Putin even mentioned?

[Behind the Aegis]

31. But...but..but...what about the US?! France? Israel? Mars?

Why are you picking on Russia?!

(Bill knows this is sarcasm, but for future jurors, it is :sarcasm

The pogroms have started, how long until the Russian Kristallnact? I don't care much for making Holocaust references, but the parallels are getting too much to ignore!

[FreeState]

34. That subtle homophobia is already happening in this thread n/t

[Behind the Aegis]

38. Like flypaper, these types of threads are.

Sorry, was having a Yiddish moment. LOL!

[Behind the Aegis]

49. And it continues to attract key-jinnglers.

Amazing that an attack on a gay man is disrespected in such a way by so-called progressives. Anything to protect their own interests and basically a "fuck you" to gays. Disgusting.

[Posteritatis]

62. Subtle? (nt)

[FreeState]

65. Good point

Subtle as in "its just not homophobic enough" to get the poster in trouble by community standards (because the community here, while gay friendly, lets a lot of crap pass because of their own subtle biases.)

[Posteritatis]

68. The biases generally stop being subtle once it involves international politics

A lot of people are dismissive of this - or of the growing legislation and state-encouraged attacks on gay people in Russia - more or less entirely because Russia's a rival to the US on a number of issues these days. If Putin was supporting, say, the American stance on Syria, the forum would probably be united in condemning him for Russia's him-endorsed stances on gay rights.

It's simplistic and pathetic in equal measure, and that's even before the general "but not too uppity" attitudes towards even gay rights activism in American politics that we'll start seeing around here after the new year.

[ocpagu]

81. But that is exactly my point.

If Saudi Arabia was not an US-allied dictatorship and was siding with Russia and other US antagonists, I'm 100% sure there would be several threads highlighting pictures like this:



So, the criticism is precisely ignoring tragedies in certain countries and highlighting tragedies in other countries according to their political and diplomatic position. How's that homophobia?

[Posteritatis]

82. Saudi excesses do come up here. They don't get defended nearly as actively as Russian ones do. (nt)

[Behind the Aegis]

69. Now we are all Russiophobes!

Oh dear!

[ocpagu]

71. Bullshit.

The same "if you don't agree with Obama you're racist" crap.

Before accusing anyone of being homophobic you should present proofs or evidences that such criticism is generated by hate. My criticism is related to double standards and hipocrisy on US actions regarding homophobia. If anyone felt personally offended by that, well, grow a thicker skin.

[Behind the Aegis]

74. Oh but any gays speaking out against this are Russiophobic?

Bullshit indeed!

[FreeState]

76. No, trying to diminishing what is happening is homophobic n/t

[ocpagu]

83. I agree.

Too bad so many activists of LGBT rights are ignoring what's happening in Saudi Arabia.

[William769]

91. You keep bringing up Saudi Arabia in this thread.

Heres a question for you, where are your OP's showing your outrage for the LGBT people in Saudi Arabia? Or any Country for that matter? I would even like to see your posts in favor of the LGBT community in general.

Nows your chance. Show us what you got! Inquiring minds want to know!

[ocpagu]

111. My focus is Latin America. I've made some threads already.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/110812871

http://www.democraticunderground.com/110817264

http://www.democraticunderground.com/110818800

http://www.democraticunderground.com/110815392

[Behind the Aegis]

90. Thankfully we have non-gay people to tell us this is all really about something else.

We are such silly creatures. We couldn't possible be angry about the pogrom-like shit happening in Russia.

[totodeinhere]

133. Some people are not sophisticated enough to recognize subtle homophobia.

It's not an anti-gay conspiracy with everyone. Those are the people who deserve to be educated and hopefully they can be turned into allies.

[Junkdrawer]

46. Video Depicts Horrific Attack on Gay Man in Obama's America....

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/09/03/cleveland-gay-hate-crime-_n_3860763.html

Obama's America

Just as (dis)honest as the OP's comment.

Now, if you could tie Putin in any direct way to this crime....

[William769]

48. What laws has President Obama passed to incite that crime?

Your headline is disingenuous in fact your whole post is.

Have a nice day.

[ocpagu]

57. Obama signed NDAA law...

... which allows the military to indefinitely detain American citizens on suspicions of supporting terrorism. An attack on the civil rights of some 300 million people.

That's one of several misguided actions of the US president.

But we don't see him being considered personally responsible for police abuses, etc.

Exceptionalism again?

[William769]

59. Grasping at straws! Well at least your trying.

[ocpagu]

64. You got no answer right? I assumed that. n/t

[William769]

72. That was the only answer. It 's just not what you wanted to hear.

[ocpagu]

85. No answer there.

And there won't be any, because your assumption lacks logic in first place.

[Junkdrawer]

87. Just asked Mrs. Junkdrawer(a BIG gay rights friend for the 22 yrs. I've known her):

"Am I the only one who sees how cynically this issue is being used in the runup to the Syrian War?"

She said: "No, and don't think that those in the Gay community don't see that too. Well, many in the gay community."

[FreeState]

99. It has nothing to do with Syria, we've been posting about this all year

it has nothing to do with Syria. Do a search on my username and Syria. You will come up with one match, this one. Do a search for Gay and Russia and you will find many many posts going back years about this. Many of us trying to stop it before it gets worse. Trying to convolute the two together does nothing but diminish the personhood of the victims in Russia.

[Violet_Crumble]

106. There's one big problem with that logic...

People were talking about this issue (anti-gay laws and discrimination in Russia) long before Syria or even Snowden. And people are going to continue to talk about it, despite attempts by some to get us to stop talking about it. I was told by someone here at DU only a few weeks ago that talking about it put gays in Russia in danger and that they'd asked that people stop talking about it. As I doubt any Russian authorities read DU, I'm a polite but firm 'fuck off' to that call for silence.

Russia deserves loud and unanimous condemnation for its treatment of LGBT Russians. I don't see people playing the 'Look! Over There! They're doing something worse!' card when it comes to other countries with appalling human rights records towards their gay communities like some countries in the Middle East or Africa. But I do see it a lot when it comes to Russia.

[Junkdrawer]

113. It's a stats thing. Here's a DU Goggle search. See the time trend?

http://www.google.com/search?q=russia+gay+rights&sitesearch=democraticunderground.com

[Violet_Crumble]

118. I saw that there were threads from January and May in there.

That supports what I say...

I'm not sure why some people struggle to separate Russia's anti-gay discrimination from what's currently happening with Syria. To me they're two different things...

[Junkdrawer]

121. Some. Very few. Look, I've been on DU a LONG time...

And "Gay rights in Russia" threads were few and far between. Until Syria, and suddenly there are many every day. All blaming Putin.

I'm neither homophobic nor desperately stupid.

[Violet_Crumble]

127. I've also been on DU a LONG time....

The anti-gay laws were proposed earlier this year, so I wouldn't have expected to see much before that. Also, the Olympics are next year, so that'd be why attention is ramping up. I suspect there'd also be some which is a reaction to what I've been noticing at DU lately - a contingent of people who are overly effusive in their praise of Putin and cannot admit that Russia does anything wrong, because to do so would be a sign of weakness. I know the logic, what with having resided in the I/P forum since I arrived at DU long ago.

For the record, I don't believe you are a homophobe or desperately stupid. But the real question here is whether we should be discussing the treatment of gays in Russia. I certainly think we should be, which is why I'm about to go and rec William769's OP...

[MADem]

128. You are "minimizing" though.

Look, this IS an issue. It might not be so noticeable were it not for our intersection with Pootie on other matters, or--most importantly, since we DO have gay Olympic athletes--the fact that Sochi is on the horizon, but we are going over there, and our folks are going to have to compete with a sword of intolerance over their heads.

I am sure you aren't homophobic, but you just might want to sharpen up on this topic, and start to get a sense of how this issue affects a large percentage of our population. Our reaction to it, as a nation, shouldn't be "Oh, well" it should be "That's not acceptable to us."

And you need to recognize that Pootie could shut this shit down, wipe that law off the books, yet he doesn't. In fact, he's sitting back while more anti-gay laws are crafted.

Again--you need to stop minimizing. When gay Russian kids and young adults are being brutalized because the Poot regime has essentially given permission for them to be bullied, attacked, or worse, that IS a problem.

The only appropriate response is "That is unacceptable."

[William769]

129. The laws were not passed until June of this year.

As to your second sentence, that debatable.

ETA: The law was passed unanimously.

[Turborama]

141. The straws broke and they drowned....

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=profile&uid=274697&sub=trans

до свидания тролль!

[William769]

142. ...

[HappyMe]

51. Oh please.

What laws has Obama or Congress passed that are like the ones recently enacted in Russia?


Defend that fucking dictator Putin all you want, just NOT OVER THIS ISSUE.

[MADem]

52. Putin's thug-dictatorship has laws on the books that make it "OK" to hate on gays.

At least try to keep up.

[Junkdrawer]

53. I was under the impression that the law in question makes...

things like Gay Pride parades illegal. Not to say I approve of such legislation, but to say "it make it "OK" to hate on gays." seems just a bit of a stretch.

[Posteritatis]

63. Oh, so it's not okay to hate on them, just to proscribe their activities and existence. Got it. (nt)

[Junkdrawer]

67. No, you don't Got it. n/t

[MADem]

84. 'Propagandizing gay culture' to anyone under eighteen

is a crime. Do it and you will go to jail for up to two weeks and pay a fine.

These laws are perceived in Russia as "carte blanche" to go after gays. It's the same as Putin saying "It's open season, haters--go to town!"

I'm not sure if you're just genuinely unaware, or playing the "too clever by half" devil's advocate.

Here's some light reading to help you along your path to knowledge:

Russia's Anti-Gay Law, Spelled Out in Plain English
http://www.policymic.com/articles/58649/russia-s-anti-gay-law-spelled-out-in-plain-english

...The violations of fundamental, constitutionally protected rights of Russia’s gay citizens have included multiple bans on gay pride parades in Moscow and other cities, hefty fines to gay rights groups accused of acting as a “foreign agent,” denial of registration to nongovernmental organizations, and regional laws banning the propaganda of homosexuality to minors, which served as a basis for the federal law enacted by Mr. Putin and unanimously passed by the State Duma. Against this backdrop, violent attacks on gays or “suspect gays” are becoming commonplace.

The state-sponsored initiatives relied on ludicrous assumptions. For example, the regional bans on propaganda of homosexuality equated same-sex relations with pedophilia even though the former has been legal since 1993 and the latter is, of course, a serious crime. The court decision denying registration to Sochi Pride House states that “propaganda of nontraditional sexual orientation” is a direct threat to Russian society, while calling attempts to confront homophobia “extremist” because they inherently “incite social and religious hatred.” Essentially, the court ruled that gays incite hatred toward themselves and should be “protected” from doing so. The court went on to argue that such extremist activities present a threat to “Russia’s sovereignty and territorial integrity.” The Russian government uses these flawed arguments when it defends its discriminatory ways to an international audience. Russian diplomats are fond of saying that discrimination does not exist in Russia because the country’s constitution forbids it. Some logic! ......

And here:

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/sep/01/russia-rise-homophobic-violence

Russian anti-gay law prompts rise in homophobic violence
Activists say legislation outlawing 'homosexual propaganda' has emboldened rightwing groups to step up attacks on gay people

Activists say the legislation has emboldened rightwing groups who use social media to "ambush" gay people, luring them to meetings and then humiliating them on camera – sometimes pouring urine on them. These groups often act against gay teenagers, several of whom told the Guardian that rising homophobia and vigilante activity force them to lead lives of secrecy.

The Russian LGBT Network said the harassment of gay people was being organised nationally for the first time through groups known as Occupy Gerontophilia and Occupy Paedophilia, who claim to be trying to "reform" homosexuals.

Igor Kochetkov, the head of the network, said Occupy Paedophilia – which focuses on gay adults – had uploaded hundreds of videos and garnered hundreds of thousands views on social media sites. Occupy Gerontophilia, which focuses on teenagers, had uploaded dozens of videos to the social network VKontakte before its page, which had 170,000 subscribers, was shut down for invading the privacy of minors.

"The latest laws against so-called gay propaganda, first in the regions and then on the federal level, have essentially legalised violence against LGBT people, because these groups of hooligans justify their actions with these laws," Kochetkov said. "With this legislation, the government said that, yes, gays and lesbians are not valued as a social group.
....

See? Not a "bit of a stretch." The laws are making the hatred and violence not just acceptable, but encouraged.

Don't minimize this. It's a real problem and people are being harmed.

[William769]

54. He knows very well what going on.

Which is saying quite a bit.

[MADem]

86. Well, all I can say is, he's certainly

given himself plenty of rope.

I provided him with some reading material. He can't pretend that he doesn't comprehend the issue anymore. The articles are written in sufficiently simple language that a conversational speaker of English can understand them.

As I've noted, this isn't an issue to be minimized. It's also not one where anyone who claims to be progressive or give a half shit about issues of equality can play the OBTUSE card.

There's a definite, definable, observable and documented cause-and-effect action happening in terms of hate crime as a consequence of these new laws.

[FreeState]

60. Didnt know Obama was looking into taking children away from Gay parents

or make it illegal to talk about gay rights in public, but thanks for the heads up - I'll be sure to contact my congresswoman to ask her to vote no.

Russia has stopped letting LGBT persons, or persons from countries that allow gay marriage from adopting Russian orphans. They are currently working on draft legislation to take kids away from gay parents in Russia. If you want to diminish whats going on there fine, but genocide is not something history will look fondly upon, and I imagine attitudes expressed in your post won't fair much better.

[Rebellious Republican]

47. Here is great read from Cher......

Cher Turned Down Olympics Gig Because of Russia's 'Gay Hate'
She 'immediately said no' to a Russian official who asked to perform, she says.

"In the wide-ranging interview, she discussed how the treatment she and former husband Sonny Bono received made her empathize with other outsiders, and she also noted her support for her transgender son, Chaz Bono."

http://www.advocate.com/politics/2013/09/13/cher-turned-down-olympics-gig-because-russias-gay-hate

[Stupefacto]

50. Gay rights must be universal

We should continue the fight to make these rights world-wide.

[gtar100]

61. Just sick. These attackers are just insane.

Having grown up in a culture that made fun of gay people, I get so disgusted at even the slightest mockery because this is the end result of that attitude. It's no longer just a joke.

Putin and all those in Russia who supported his anti-gay law have opened the doors to this kind of insanity and stupidity from the standard homophobic male. Sadly, this homophobia is treated as normal and being gay is not; yet it's homophobia that leads to this kind of violence and repression... but homosexuality - how does that cause problems in a society except for the reactions of bigots? We can lay a considerable amount of blame on the major religions of this world who heap such horrific judgment on normal human behavior. The only ones getting hurt are gay people. The sooner we all recognize that the abnormal behavior is on the part of homophobic people, the better.

[Warren DeMontague]

73. Jesus.

Horrible.

[William769]

75. Look at some of the posts in this thread.

Thats how they get away with it. Apologists? Or Homophobia? You decide.

P.S. This is in no way directed at you Warren.

[Warren DeMontague]

78. Yeah, some people here seem chronically unable to get away from "my side-your side" type thinking.

Like if Putin makes a point in a direction they agree with, that must mean any criticism of Putin is on the "other" side.

Well, Putin is a dictator, and an asshole, and this particularly noxious anti-Gay crap going on in Russia is inexcusable and yes, leaders are responsible for setting the stage and the tone on things like these horrors. As a Jew I am well aware of how that kind of thing works.

I don't think Syria or Snowden or any of it alters that one whit.

[Violet_Crumble]

110. I agree wholeheartedly with everything but one thing you said there...

Putin isn't a dictator. Russia is a multi-party democracy, though from what I've seen democracy is taking some getting used to. If you change it to 'Well, Putin is a fucking wanker, and an asshole, and this particularly noxious anti-Gay crap going on in Russia is inexcusable' you'll get 110% agreement from me instead of 99%...

[Warren DeMontague]

112. I'm not an expert on Russia, by any means. Still I think there has been some anti-Democratic moves

coming from the Putin camp. Maybe "dictator" is too strong a word, but he does have an awful lot of power apparently.

[totodeinhere]

134. Impartial international observers gave mixed reviews to the last Russian presidential election.

It's probably an overstatement to call the election rigged, but there were problems. But in fairness it should be noted that international observers have also had problems with some of the elections in this country.

http://www.osce.org/odihr/elections/88661

[ismnotwasm]

93. It's a blatant attempt

To use a horrible human rights violation against Gay people to promote a personal political agenda. I see no actual concern or care for the many many Gay people who are suffering. Just a cynical use of the word 'Gay' to attempt to get brownie points WITHOUT having to actually care about Gay rights-- anywhere.

Which is what these derailing tactics are all about.

[William769]

95. Exactly!

[ocpagu]

100. Exactly!

"It's a blatant attempt to use a horrible human rights violation against Gay people to promote a personal political agenda."

[ismnotwasm]

105. Who started this thread, you?

Oh, wait-- no you didn't.

If you'd like to discuss homophobia in Saudi Arabia feel free to start your own thread to do so. In the meantime stop derailing the thread which is addressing a specific situation in a specific Country.

[ocpagu]

107. Don't see any kind of relevance about starting the thread or not.

The fact that I agree or disagree with the thread does not determine where I'm allowed to post or not.

Now, this is what you said:

"To use a horrible human rights violation against Gay people to promote a personal political agenda. I see no actual concern or care for the many many Gay people who are suffering. Just a cynical use of the word 'Gay' to attempt to get brownie points WITHOUT having to actually care about Gay rights-- anywhere."

And I do agree with you.

That's exactly what I think when I remember Obama criticizing Russia's government for its homophobic law while remaining in absolute silence about Saudi Arabia and other dictatorships which are still practicing actual KILLING of homosexuals.

But, if I understand, you don't want me to bother you with the gay victims of Arab dictatorships "because I didn't start the thread". Nice.

[ismnotwasm]

109. Oh bullshit

You are derailing the thread to fit your personal political views that has nothing to do with actual homophobia in Saudi Arabia.

Nice.

[ocpagu]

114. I'm trying to bring the subject to discussion.

I've seen several threads criticizing Russia's homophobic law. Judging by them, one could have the impression that Russia is the worst offender of gays rights.

But they aren't. Far from that. The worst offenders of gays rights, such as Saudi Arabia, are rarely criticized on DU.

I'm just pointing to a fact. If you don't want to discuss this as an adult, ok, no problem, you can simply ignore. But don't come with a childish argument such as I'm "derailing the thread" as a response to valid, honest criticism on hypocrisy.

[ismnotwasm]

117. Derailment is only childish for the one doing it.

Which would be you.

[ocpagu]

119. Your answer is empty. Your only "argument" is name-calling.

Even though I've been treating you with all due respect and presenting ARGUMENTS that have nothing to do with your person.

And I am being childish?

Ok.

[ismnotwasm]

122. Yup

A bit pugnacious going from person to person to anyone who is willing to take you on in argument. Perhaps it's your "inner" child that's acting up.

[ocpagu]

124. Again, nothing but name calling. n/t

[stevenleser]

144. Yes, a classic case of trollish thread derailment. And for the purpose of bigot apologia no less.

That person should be Tombstoned.

[MADem]

130. Saudi Arabia isn't hosting the world--including the Big Gay World--for the Olympics next year.

You are minimizing the impact of this issue by making a false comparison. That may not be a full-on "derail" but it is an obvious deflection.

Americans don't stream by the thousands as tourists to SA; with the exception of the Hajj (and that's a different type of tourist, to be blunt). People from other countries, including USA, will go to Russia and have their pic taken in front of the Kremlin, in front of St. Basil's, etc., and see the sights, drink the vodka, go to the nightclubs, try to read Cyrillic, but that kind of tourism and cultural exchange just doesn't happen in SA.

We have a business relationship with SA. We do very little "people-to-people" interaction outside MIC stuff. Our relationship with Russia is much deeper, and much more complex.

So you are if not derailing the thread, you are minimizing the issue, because you are pretending that SA and Russia are somehow "equal" in the way that we relate to them. They aren't.

The day Saudi Arabia puts in a successful bid for the Olympics, and expects the women athletes to compete in full hijab, then you're free to make some comparisons. Until then, I think you need to acknowledge that the supposedly "modern" Russia is a half century behind the times when it comes to equality.

[Starry Messenger]

77. Why can't we grant political asylum to all of Russia's gay people?

Jesus, this is awful and I'm afraid it's going to get even more horrible.

And the people defending Russia (with "look over there&quot here can ESAD. I'm a Red and I condemn Russia for the travesty it is perpetrating on the most vulnerable of people.

[William769]

79. Your right it's all about what's happening to a group of people

And not because of something else.

Three cheers to you.

[Behind the Aegis]

80. There are countries that do include sexual orientation as a reason for asylum.

I think the US has even done it once, but it was way back during the Clinton years (I remember it being between being at my first job or the last year of grad school). I believe Sweden has allowed it, and France(?). But it isn't very common at all. Israel has been called upon to do it several times (they have at least once), and the UK had a big case about in the news a few years back (one a gay man going back to Iran, the other were lesbians going to Pakistan (?).

Given what is happening there, I agree, asylum should be allowed.

[ismnotwasm]

102. That is an excellent idea

It would send a strong message

[DevonRex]

149. The State Department eased the rules for Russian LGBTs in 2012.

Requesting asylum, I mean. We were actually ahead of the curve on this. I'm assuming they knew what was coming. But I did run across a petition the other day when I was searching for this information. It only had a couple of signatures. Don't remember where it was. I assume on the WH site. I was searching for blanket asylum for LGBT parents in Russia since they're considering taking children away now. Of course they are. Having children would be promotion in their eyes, right? Oh, so terrible for children to see loving parents of the same gender. The horror!

[Starry Messenger]

151. Good on the State Department, I'm happy to hear this.

Yes, this situation has been brewing for a few years. These dehumanizing laws are a travesty. They are trying to legislate genocide.

I wish I had millions of dollars and could help people leave to come here.

[Jfico89]

88. Ugh

makes me sick

[uppityperson]

89. Welcome to DU and FRP.

[gopiscrap]

125. Welcome to DU

[Violet_Crumble]

101. Sign the Human Rights Watch petition to the IOC...

Sorry, you may have already done it, but for any DUers who haven't, there's a pop-up on the HRW homepage that takes you to the petition, and here's the direct link.

http://secure.hrw.org/site/c.nlIWIgN2JwE/b.8781943/k.8A40/Sochi_2014_Sign_the_Petition/apps/ka/ct/contactus.asp?c=nlIWIgN2JwE&b=8781943&msource=SEA201309lb

In February, the Winter Olympics will open in Sochi, Russia. They will give a world stage and sanction to a country that is repressing the rights of its own citizens. Russian laws passed this year punish LGBT persons, and anyone who speaks on their behalf in front of children.

The International Olympic Committee (IOC) - the multi-billion dollar organization that runs the Olympics has the ability to speak out against these laws. Not only that, it has a duty to do so. Its own charter swears to uphold human dignity and reject discrimination.

Until now the International Olympic Committee has lacked the spine to take the necessary actions. It has hid behind vague assurances from the Russian government, and refused to stand up for its own values. But if the fans speak out, the International Olympic Committee - and its vital commercial sponsors - will be forced to listen, and forced to stand up for what is right.

Join Human Rights Watch in demanding that 2014 are not the Olympics of hate.

Dear IOC President Thomas Bach,

The Olympic Charter dedicates itself to "promoting a peaceful society concerned with the preservation of human dignity," and rejects discrimination of any kind.

Recent actions on the part of the Russian government have betrayed that charter. Banning speech that advocates for the rights and equality of LGBT citizens is discrimination - and it undermines human dignity.

As the new president, we call on you to uphold these most basic tenets of your charter, and demand the repeal of this repugnant law.

[Behind the Aegis]

103. Thank you! Many may not have seen this yet.

[Violet_Crumble]

123. I hate to admit that I hadn't been paying much attention to the Olympics thing...

When people here were talking about the Olympics, I was 'huh? but the next Olympics is in Rio, isn't it?' I come from a country where our first ever gold medal in the winter Olympics happened because all the skaters in front got into a massive pile-up and our slow guy slowly skated past them and got the gold There just isn't much interest here for the winter stuff.

But when I went to HRW last night to read something else, I saw the petition and started reading and thought this petition needs wide exposure as it's a no-brainer to me that no Olympics should be held in a country that discriminates against its LGBT community...

[William769]

104. Thanks for posting.

Yes already signed.

[ismnotwasm]

115. I hadn't signed this

Now I have--Thank you for posting!

[Bluenorthwest]

116. It needs to call for boycott OF the IOC, whose history is vicious and dank

The 1936 Olympics, well, the IOC sent a Mr Brundage to Germany to check things out because of the outcry and demands for boycott. Brundage returned saying there was not any discrimination against Jews or anyone in Germany and he added that the rumors were a conspiracy among Jews and the Press to destroy the reputation of the Reich. So the Games went to Berlin. The US Team which always highlight Jessie Owens, dumped the two Jewish members from competition to avoid any embarrassment for Hitler.
So this is the Olympics. That is what the Olympic Committee is, to petition them to do they right thing while saying 'we will support you anyway' is folly.

Only boycott of Sochi and of the Olympics and Olympians will even begin to address what's going on.

[MNBrewer]

120. Don't forget Uzbeckistan

The whole of the former Soviet Union is seeming to fall under this new anti-gay genocidal mania.

[JI7]

132. the problem is that nothing is being done to those who commit these acts

it's a crime to be gay. but it's not a crime to commit violence against gays.

this is how it is there.

[MADem]

137. Worse, they're getting "liked" by haters on Russian facebook-equivalent.

It's fucking reprehensible and should not be allowed to stand.

[flvegan]

135. flvegan's Blackwater is just one Powerball win or serious donor away.

Mmmmm...sweet sweet punishment.

[Liberal_in_LA]

136. horrible

[davidpdx]

138. I've said it once and I'll keep saying it

The Olympic Committee made a huge mistake giving Russia the Winter Olympics.

[Zorra]

139. I doubt Russia will ever get over Stalin killing off most of the smart people that lived there. nt

[Dash87]

140. Putin silently condones this. He's a coward.

[stevenleser]

145. It's worse than that. He's deliberately using this to increase his power and prestige.

He's scapegoating the LGBT community in an effort to get the Russian Orthodox Church and their parishioners more firmly behind him.

I doubt he really cares about anything other than power and similar base desires.

[William769]

146. Heres a great piece you'll find interesting.

http://americablog.com/2013/09/syria-putin-nyt-op-ed-gay.html