I hear quite often about domestic abusers... (Update)

[Archae]

Last edited Thu Nov 7, 2013, 08:56 PM - Edit history (1)

I just heard from a friend that a woman I had gone out with once, is in jail for beating up her boyfriend.
Severely beaten.

I don't know what the percentage is of men to women, being the abusers.

But women can, and do abuse their boyfriends/husbands.

Yet men who are abused by women are pretty much ignored. Or ridiculed.

Update as of tonight: The woman is being charged with first-degree murder, the guy died of his beating.

[moriah]

1. A dear friend had to get a restraining order against his stalker psycho ex-GF.

And when I mean psycho stalker, I mean dead animals on his doorstep, showing up EVERYWHERE he was...

And she was horrifically emotionally abusive.

Men aren't the only ones capable of domestic abuse, and it isn't always just physical violence.

[boston bean]

2. They are? By who?

[Pab Sungenis]

60. Their romantic partners.

Women do abuse men. Physically and emotionally.

Gay men are abused by other gay men and lesbians by other lesbians.

Domestic violence crosses all gender and orientation lines.

[boston bean]

73. You answered something that I wasn't inquiring about.

[Pab Sungenis]

74. A post is made about men being victims of domestic abuse.

You replied "They are? By whom?"

I answered it.

Your misandry is showing.

[boston bean]

76. You are imagining things. But, I know go with what you feel versus what I actually say.

[Pab Sungenis]

77. What you actually say?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=3985050

The entire text of your post is:

Star Member boston bean (18,073 posts)
2. They are? By who?

Remember there is no "i" in teamwork.... (but there is an M and an E)
Reply to this post
Back to OP Alert abuse Link to post in-thread

Okay, I admit, I cleaned up your grammar. I'm nice that way.

Actually, though, it's still not quite my favorite quote from you, back when you posted http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=7164111&mesg_id=7164222

4. It's gonna get ugly when us wimminz finally decide to tell men what they can't do with their penises

And of course http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=7164111&mesg_id=7164340

God doesn't want impotent men having erections. It's as simple as that! He made them impotent for reasons we cannot comprehend and we should not screw with god's divine interventions and wishes.

I just happened to have those two links handy.

Go away now.

[boston bean]

79. LOL.

[Scout]

124. LOL ... a person reading your post, (without bias

and a bug up their ass), knows EXACTLY what you were talking about!!

...last line of the OP:
"Yet men who are abused by women are pretty much ignored. Or ridiculed."

and then you ask "they are? by who?"

and off someone goes with their bias showing... you'd think they would be embarrassed by now.

for those very few who lack comprehension:
... men who are abused by women are ignored or ridiculed? by whom?

was the question asked, certainly wasn't the question that was answered though, now was it. MISANDRY!! SQUAWK!

[Tuesday Afternoon]

129. +1

[EOTE]

135. I had a HOFer make a joke to me about me getting abused by my mom.

A real knee-slapper that was. But I guess that's the risk you take being a man going into HoF.

[ismnotwasm]

138. Dude, That's totally not what I meant

But what DID YOU mean by mentioning my "Father" and my Uncle"? I don't even have an uncle.

Besides, you were there to cause dissension and pain, and now you want to take a moral high road?

That's a knee-slapper

[EOTE]

139. Yeah, that's TOTALLY not what you meant.

You just go around asking if people if their moms hurt them when they were young as an ice breaker, just shooting the shit, right? You can shove your offensive bullshit. I'm nowhere near as stupid as you think I am.

[ismnotwasm]

142. I don't think you're stupid, but I'm starting to thing you are younger than your chronological age

[EOTE]

145. You have a knack of following up indefensible shit with more of the same.

I'm offended by child abuse jokes? Must be that I'm immature, right? Christ you write some disgusting, offensive crap.

[BainsBane]

157. You Don't appear to be interested in what anyone says

You have your own dialogue going on in your head that takes the place of what people actually say.

[EOTE]

163. Yeah, it's me who isn't interested in anyone says.

And not the dim ones who insist when I'm asked if my mom abused me it was a question designed to further dialog and not an idiotic child abuse joke the likes of which would have gotten any man kicked out immediately. Pure and utter idiocy.

[EOTE]

140. I was there to cause dissension and pain says the one making child abuse jokes.

It's quite clear the agenda of your echo chamber. Horrifically insult all those who don't agree with you and when they have the nerve to fight back, ban them. I'm sure you all had a fantastic time patting each other on the back after that. Sickening.

[ismnotwasm]

141. You do remind me of my brother

He uses the same circular logic. Of course he's a Libertarian.

"Horrifically insult" Carl is that you?

[EOTE]

143. Do you throw child abuse insults at him as well?

It seems that insults are pretty much the only thing you're adept at. Fuck the content of my argument, I'm sure you've got some more slams you can get in. Perhaps a holocaust joke or something?

[ismnotwasm]

146. Look if I'm really hurting you I'll just stop

There's no percentage in this. If you were abused as a child, and I hurt your feelings, or triggered you, I genuinely apologize. If you are just a shit stirrer--which was the impression you gave off, I don't give a shit.

Up to you.

[EOTE]

148. Yeah, who could have guessed I'd be offended by a child abuse joke?

Usually it's just best to assume the person you're speaking to WON'T be offended by a child abuse joke, right? I mean, wouldn't want to miss out on a few yucks just because some people are so easily offended. And I'M the one who got kicked out of that group. Kind of shows you the priorities there.

[ismnotwasm]

150. Ok you've made your decision and I've made mine

I retract the apology.

I was making maturation snark in response to you being extremely rude to someone else. Now you come out here and confabulate. That's fine, amusing even.
I didn't realize you were kicked out, but honestly, you seem so angry and bitter why would you go there in the first place?


Ah yes, I had forgotten


http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=3943165

[EOTE]

162. Of course you retract the apology.

Of course it was never genuine to begin with. You did, after all, have weeks to offer it but were happier putting a mean old man in his place. It must have hurt trying to be decent a few minutes. What kind of sorry excuse for a human being offers an apology for making a child abuse joke at his expense and takes it back? Rhetorical question, of course, we both know the answer to that question. So, in response to me asking why men are attacked so frequently on your board, you throw a child abuse joke at me and I'M the angry and bitter one? You guys are hilarious.

[BainsBane]

158. You appear to be offended

By the horror of having to share the planet with women. She told you she did not say what you thought she did, but you don't care what she actually said. You instead are focused on nurturing your own anger.

[EOTE]

161. Silly me for thinking that words mean things.

And silly me for thinking an idiot might simply want to save face when exposed in a public forum. She had weeks to offer an apology and didn't see fit. It's YOU and she who don't care what was actually said. Could you imagine if I went into HoF and started asking the people around there if the reason they're all so angry is because their fathers abused them? Are you fucking kidding me? What a fucking joke, I'd be gone before I could make the post. The hypocrisy is mind numbing.

[quinnox]

3. ok, but come on, in the vast majority it is the men doing the beating

it is a small percentage of women who are the aggressors, probably a tiny percentage.

[moriah]

5. Doesn't make it any better to shame the victim, no matter what the gender.

My friend had a *very* difficult time getting the RO, and felt like he was being laughed at the entire time. Not kosher. He had a lot of evidence and witnesses, too.

[quinnox]

8. whatever, we both know the main problem is men beating up their spouses/girlfriends

the reverse is rare. I think it is a red herring to even bring this up, to tell the truth.

[moriah]

9. And the majority of sexual abuse victims willing to come forward are women, too.

How often is it underreported, just as assaults against men are routinely underreported?

[tammywammy]

13. The problem is any partner beating up their partner. Regardless of sex.

No victim should face ridicule.

[quinnox]

15. right, anyway, I maintain it is a red herring to bring this up

The men are the ones with the superior physical strength most of the time, and they are the ones who tend to beat up their women. I consider this other issue to be a distraction.

[moriah]

18. Again, I do hope you don't see expanding acceptance for male survivors of sexual abuse...

... to also be a "red herring".

And I also hold that abuse by women against men is dramatically underreported because of stigma. And not all abuse is physical -- mental abuse is far more common even used against women (that's usually how it starts).

Abuse is abuse, and if we don't make a stand for ALL victims, we are being extremely hypocritical.

[quinnox]

20. wow, so you are a woman and you are saying you think

men are often the victims of this, that blows my mind. I must say.

Would you admit that women are, percentage wise, much more likely to be the victim of men in this area?

[moriah]

23. More likely, yes. And yes, I'm a woman who has been sexually and mentally abused.

Though fortunately I left before the coming physical abuse.

I just think that it's very wrong that we ignore or excuse abusive women and blame the men who stay with them or who don't want to deal with a biased legal system, acting like they are somehow less of men because a "girl" hurt them -- any more than women should have to deal with the biased system that's in place for us, too. I'm not saying it's a walk in the park to get an order of protection even if you're a woman -- but it's a hell of a lot easier than if you're male and have documented evidence of the same type of abuse.

[IdaBriggs]

117. You consider it a distraction; I consider your comment OFFENSIVE.

(And I'm a woman.)

Crime is crime, and NO ONE should get a free pass to assault their partner because of gender.

The reality is that men do get assaulted, and comments minimizing it are HORRIBLE.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

164. Here's the problem --> "The men are the ones with the superior physical strength"

If he doesn't use his superior strength you victim-blame him and ridicule him. If he does use his superior strength he becomes the abuser and you prosecute him.

Abuse is abuse. We don't confront crime based on the statistical significance of the victim, we confront it on an individual basis according to its merits. That is the very definition of equality under the law and that is what we should, as a society, strive to achieve.

[justabob]

12. exactly

It *does* happen... Happened to a coworker of mine too. Nice guy, wouldn't hurt a fly, but his girlfriend was a horrible, mean and violent woman. Yes, it is usually the other way around, but I suspect there are a lot of guys who haven't disclosed because of how they will be treated by the system, friends etc.

[Xithras]

37. According to the CDC, about 40% of domestic violence victims are men.

Overall, 35.6% of women, and 28.5% of men, are the victims of domestic violence perpetrated by an intimate partner at some point in their life. 24.3% of women, and 13.8% of men are victims of severe domestic violence resulting in injuries requiring medical attention or legal intervention.

http://www.cdc.gov/ViolencePrevention/pdf/NISVS_Report2010-a.pdf


Women are unquestionably victims more often than men are, and statistically they are more likely to sustain severe injuries in the violence, but the assumption that only a "tiny percentage" of the aggressors are women is blatantly false.

There are actually a few government studies suggesting that up to 70% of domestic violence may actually be perpetrated by women, and that it's simply under-reported because a man who calls the police over a slap from his wife would be treated as a laughingstock in our society. These surveys suggest that women are more likely to strike first, but are less likely to cause damage. (http://ajph.aphapublications.org/doi/abs/10.2105/AJPH.2005.079020)

[VanillaRhapsody]

151. Most abused women are not reporting because of a single "slap" either...

[BainsBane]

159. Wow. Thanks for that info

I had no idea.

[mythology]

105. Not so much actually

Women commit a substantial percentage of domestic violence. Men can cause more physical damage, but that's a function of average size/muscle mass. Even if you're talking about being killed by a domestic partner, the numbers are far closer than "a tiny percentage."

http://www.law.fsu.edu/journals/lawreview/downloads/304/kelly.pdf

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2010/sep/05/men-victims-domestic-violence

http://jezebel.com/5509717/domestic-violence-are-women-as-abusive-as-men

http://www.webmd.com/balance/features/help-for-battered-men

http://www.csulb.edu/~mfiebert/assault.htm

http://ajph.aphapublications.org/doi/abs/10.2105/AJPH.2005.079020

[Sheldon Cooper]

4. Who is ignoring these men?

And ridiculing them? Be specific, please.

[moriah]

6. Police, mainly. People who hear of it and wonder how a man can't defend himself.

If a man does, HE's the one who gets the DV cite quite often.

[Sheldon Cooper]

7. Thanks, but I'd like to hear from the OP.

There's a habit of tossing out flamebait and then not responding. So, I'd like his input.

[anneboleyn]

153. I actually saw this happen on "Cops"

I happened to see an episode of "Cops" a long time ago (late 90s/early 2000s I think). A neighbor called to report a domestic disturbance, and the officers showed up at the house. I was expecting to see a woman being attacked by a boyfriend or husband. Instead there was a husband being beaten repeatedly by the wife in front of their screaming young children. She had chased him out of the house and down the street.

She was using various objects to attack him, and he seemed to be genuinely terrified of her (and for the kids). Unfortunately the police seemed to think of him as a bit of a joke, asking him questions that had a slightly sarcastic tone. Too bad -- as ALL domestic violence is very serious and of course horrible for the children.

[Archae]

10. The boyfirend of the woman I once knew...

And Moriah, above.

Dismissing this very real problem can be just as lethal and destructive as dismissing men beating up women.

Oh, I only went out with the woman I knew once, because I saw one of her tantrums in a store, and I walked away from her.

[Sheldon Cooper]

14. So, two people. Got it.

What would you estimate are the statistics for this in the general population? What percentage of men are abused by women?

[Archae]

25. According to the article below, it's higher than I thought.

Over 40%.

[kcr]

30. That 40% is from a BS study

From an MRA group.

[msanthrope]

46. the CDC? nt

[kcr]

48. No. nt

[msanthrope]

50. The CDC figures above--are you disputing them? nt

[kcr]

53. No

Edit no as in I haven't even read your ppost. I wasn't talking about you

[polly7]

11. What I believe, is that if women had the physical strength and

confidence in their ability to do physical damage to a man, the numbers for female violence against men and other women would be far higher. And I say this as someone who was abused many times, so badly my nose had to be put back into the middle of my face, among other broken bones and horrible crap. I have friends who've talked about how they wish they could shove someone's (the man they're with at the time) face into the pavement .... all sorts of things. I could never hurt any living thing other than a fly, except in self-defense or defending someone else, and I don't understand the attitude that rage entitles anyone to violence. But for many women, the wish is there.

[Archae]

17. Unfortunately the wish is there, and so is the action, at times

A few women can, and do get violent.

If a guy is getting beaten by a girlfriend, he gets ridiculed as "wussy" or "wimpy."

Yet if a guy fights back, then the violent woman can go to the cops and get him busted.

[polly7]

19. Yes, that's absolutely right.

I worked bars in different places for years and now I help out at my friend's bar just once in a while, but I can't even begin to say how many times I've seen the male slapped, or punched, or a drink thrown in his face ... and it's all in good fun. He wouldn't dare do anything back physically because here, at least in this town, he'd be pulverized by probably everyone in the bar. I know with these couples it happens at home, and probably much worse, with the children watching. It isn't taken as seriously as it should be, by any means.

[LittleBlue]

82. That's terrible

so badly my nose had to be put back into the middle of my face

It is astonishing to me that people beat one another senseless. And especially someone who isn't violent and doesn't fight back. I just assume those people are mentally ill. How could a rational, sane person do something like that?

I hope he got justice.

[polly7]

85. Oh, I fought back, all right.

That's probably what made it so much worse. He's now a well-respected, successful business owner.

[LittleBlue]

90. Of course he is

What else should I have expected?

Sorry to hear it

[polly7]

93. The funny thing is ...... I don't want him to do badly because he does have people

that love and care for him. What happened is done, and I know he doesn't have the empathy or understanding to know how it's affected me (it went on for a long time, I was young and stupid and had no support), so really, there's no use in wishing him harm now. If I ever see him do it to someone else though ..... I will help her be his worst nightmare.

[LittleBlue]

95. Must be hard

to forgive someone like that. Takes a strong character.

[polly7]

100. Thanks LB, I'm not sure if that's forgiving, and it took me a long time to get there. nt.

[ZombieHorde]

16. More than 40% of domestic violence victims are male, report reveals

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2010/sep/05/men-victims-domestic-violence

About two in five of all victims of domestic violence are men, contradicting the widespread impression that it is almost always women who are left battered and bruised, a new report claims.

Men assaulted by their partners are often ignored by police, see their attacker go free and have far fewer refuges to flee to than women, says a study by the men's rights campaign group Parity.

The charity's analysis of statistics on domestic violence shows the number of men attacked by wives or girlfriends is much higher than thought. Its report, Domestic Violence: The Male Perspective, states: "Domestic violence is often seen as a female victim/male perpetrator problem, but the evidence demonstrates that this is a false picture."

Data from Home Office statistical bulletins and the British Crime Survey show that men made up about 40% of domestic violence victims each year between 2004-05 and 2008-09, the last year for which figures are available. In 2006-07 men made up 43.4% of all those who had suffered partner abuse in the previous year, which rose to 45.5% in 2007-08 but fell to 37.7% in 2008-09.

~snip~

[kcr]

21. That was a study done by an MRA group

Highly suspect, to say the least.

[ZombieHorde]

33. The data comes from the British Crime Survey. nt

[kcr]

39. It's a survey

For one thing, it doesn't include victims of murder. It's also not based on crimes reported to the police. It also excludes residences of communal establishments.

[sibelian]

119. What is the value to you in delegitimising the survey?

Why do you prefer that it be false?

[kcr]

121. I could ask you the same question

Why do you prefer that it be true? In other words, what a useless question.

Read Recursions thread he posted today.

[sibelian]

122. "I could ask you the same question"

Meaning you haven't answered it.

Recursion is on my ignore list and will not be removed.

Why do you prefer the survey to be false? What is the nature of the competition between perceptions of abuse of men and women that you have clearly indicated you are participating in? Why does it exist? Why do you choose a stance on how the abuse of men is perceived at all?

[kcr]

123. I didn't answer it because it's a useless question

Either something is factual or it isn't. I don't prefer things to be true. They either are or they aren't.

[sibelian]

130. That's clearly not the case. You choose to believe that the survey is false.

This is not in question.

[kcr]

131. The way people who believe in evolution just choose to believe it

The way people who believe the earth is round just choose to believe it. The way people believe vaccinations work choose to believe it. The way people believe in gravity... You get the idea.

[kcr]

133. To make it clear

I'm not disputing that an actual survey was done and yielded those results. I'm not saying data was fudged or anything like that. I'm saying that an MRA group cherry picking this particular survey, holding it up without context and stating that this is evidence that their claim that men are abused just as often, is the BS.

[Major Nikon]

125. The US NCVS is one of the best data sets for crime victimization anywhere

RAINN and countless other victim advocacy organizations reference it routinely.

If you want to dismiss a data set just because "it's a survey" you're going to have to do a lot better.

[kcr]

134. I clarified in another post.

I'm dismissing the interpretation by the MRA of the data, not necessarily the data itself. Holding it up out of context as proof that men are abused as often as women is BS.

[Major Nikon]

136. What's the difference?

Parity says 40% of domestic violence victims are men.

Survey says 40% of domestic violence victims are men.

Not much to interpret really. If you're going to try and contradict something, you may wish to do better than just repeating "it's BS" when repeatedly asked for clarification. If you don't think the 40% number is inaccurate, then tell us what you think it is and why.

[kcr]

137. Well yes, there is.

Plenty of research says otherwise. Pointing to a data set and saying "See!? We're right!" does not the truth make. Maybe I could have been more precise in saying why I thought it was BS, I'll concede. But, yes. The MRA movement and any claim they make is bullshit.

[Major Nikon]

144. Beats not pointing to a data set and saying, "See!? We're right!"

Just sayin'

[kcr]

147. Not seeing how that works, actually.

Seeing as they're wrong. Unless you mean they get points for trying? Well, okay, I guess.

[Major Nikon]

152. Just because you believe they are wrong, doesn't mean they are wrong

That's how it works.

Just sayin'

[cali]

27. absolute bullshit study.

interesting that you chose to push it.

And women are far far more often the victims in lethal abuse cases.

[ZombieHorde]

32. The data comes from the British Crime Survey. nt

[sibelian]

120. Why do you say that?

What is this competition between perceptions of abuse of men and women?

[quinnox]

22. Here are some real stats...

One in four women (25%) has experienced domestic violence in her lifetime.
(The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and The National Institute of Justice, Extent, Nature, and Consequences of Intimate Partner Violence, July 2000. The Commonwealth Fund, Health Concerns Across a Woman’s Lifespan: 1998 Survey of Women’s Health, 1999)

Estimates range from 960,000 incidents of violence against a current or former spouse, boyfriend, or girlfriend to 3 million women who are physically abused by their husband or boyfriend per year.
(U.S. Department of Justice, Violence by Intimates: Analysis of Data on Crimes by Current or Former Spouses, Boyfriends, and Girlfriends, March 1998. The Commonwealth Fund, Health Concerns Across a Woman’s Lifespan: 1998 Survey of Women’s Health, 1999)

Women accounted for 85% of the victims of intimate partner violence, men for approximately 15%.
(Bureau of Justice Statistics Crime Data Brief, Intimate Partner Violence, 1993-2001, February 2003)

http://dvrc-or.org/domestic/violence/resources/C61/

[moriah]

26. If the rights of 15% of the population are to be ignored....

... why do we advocate for LGBT causes? Anti-discrimination laws to protect other smaller minorities? But feel that it's a red herring to mention that a not insignificant number of men experience domestic violence?

[kcr]

28. The point is, who is saying they should be ignored?

It certainly isn't those who advocate against domestic abuse. But that seems to be the implication.

[quinnox]

31. I just think that it is not the most pressing issue

I am not saying there aren't women who abuse their men, just that it is not a gigantic problem like the reverse is.

I would put all resources to stopping these cowardly men from abusing their women, first, and then worry about the women doing the same.

[Archae]

35. Thanks for just dumping us guys in the garbage.

So that 15% or 40%, whatever it is, is just supposed to be ignored?

"Put all resources" into stopping male on female abuse?

Nothing to stop female on male?

And what about the very few, but growing numbers of gays and lesbian abuse?
Should all of them be ignored too?

[quinnox]

36. oh, give me a break

the men are not the victims most of the time. Women are often punching bags for these cowards, these men who want to beat up their women because they are too afraid to take on another man.

I am not buying your spin, in other words.

[Archae]

38. Thank you for your "women can do no wrong."

Us guys should just buck up and take any abuse women do cause.

[1000words]

47. You're doing it all wrong

Really ratchet up the hyperbole and innuendo to an irrational level. Next, gather a posse, trundle around these forums and pounce on folks who won't conform to your perspective.

Seems to be the way it is done here at DU.

[moriah]

41. Do you honestly think the effectiveness of programs that try to address domestic violence...

... is somehow lessened by including the mention in training for domestic violence case workers and police that men can be victims of domestic violence, saying that they have just as much right to help and are no more at fault than a woman who is abused -- that ALL abuse is wrong -- and trying to gain funding/cooperation from other agencies to accommodate male victims of extreme domestic violence who need to flee their homes (even if those beds had to be in homeless shelters, which have more male-only space, it's unlikely someone's going to go looking there)?

Or by public awareness campaigns that remind women that they, too, can have anger issues and may need to learn to control them, and that help is available? Most anger management PSAs are directed to men.

Those are changes I'd advocate for, and similar ones for police officers and sexual assault responders when it comes to male victims of sexual violence.

[tammywammy]

42. Good post. n/t

[quinnox]

44. Fine. I am starting to get annoyed, so

I am going to bow out of this thread. You seem very persistent and almost like you are nagging me or something.

[moriah]

45. I apologiize, I'm a somewhat aggressive debater when I feel I see injustice, no matter to whom. n/t

[1-Old-Man]

24. Sometimes it would just be better if she beat on me instead.

You can beat the life out of a person and never leave a bruise. Have no doubt.

[stillcool]

29. I've heard of it...

at AA meetings. It's not easy in any case to report abuse or rape. I don't know that the humiliation and shame are that different.

[Archae]

34. I was reminded of this woman I knew of, after seeing an abuse video here.

I have yet to see an anti-domestic abuse ad or video that shows a man who was or is being abused.

Maybe a young boy say 10 or so, but men do get abused. And they should be counted.

[boston bean]

40. Did the video posted in HoF prompt this thread.

This is a response to that?

[seabeyond]

114. see. i thought that was the reason, and the turn off for the thread. but i saw a poster down below

and i got kinda excited that we could do something on du about this silenced issue for men. ignoring what i felt was a jab/dismissal toward abused women. though the poster said something about it. so looking further at the thread, i see this. jsut sad. truly.... fuckin sad having to de-legitimize violence against women when there is a real issue for both genders.

sick....

[polly7]

43. Was it this video?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017156655

I couldn't watch it because it reminds me of me .... but here in Canada, I'm starting to see a few PSA's (or whatever they're called) on domestic violence against not only women, but men and especially the results for children. ALL domestic violence has to be addressed much more, publicly.

[Archae]

49. Yes, that was the one.

And you're 100% correct.

But to one poster above, men don't count. Only abused women do.

I don't know all the details of the woman I once knew, except for a couple facts:

He is in the hospital.

She is in a jail cell.

[kcr]

51. Nice set up

And text book. See? See! THey don't care about men. Bravo.

[polly7]

56. You know what?

Many / most women DO care about violence against EVERYONE. This isn't, and shouldn't be a pissing contest, although I see some trying hard to make it one.

Carry on.

[moriah]

59. I think they do care. They just don't want to see the plight of women to be disregarded either.

And worry that when there are still so many women stuck in domestic violence situations, that if we lose that focus, we will not be able to help these women get the courage to leave.

I think getting the message out that abuse, no matter what or to whom, is wrong, will help give women the courage to get out. It might even help them to know that men get hit, too -- it's not just them, it's not because they are weak, it's because their ABUSER is a worthless piece of crap who feels he has to prove his power by physical, mental, emotional, and/or sexual violence against another. That it is TRULY the abuser's fault, not anything to do with the targeted victim.

[kcr]

67. I agree completely.

I just don't think listening to MRAs and their phony statistics will help. Framing it in Because Feminism, They Don't Care certainly doesn't help, then pointing Nya nya, see?! They don't! When they react defensively? This isn't anything to support. It doesn't help either side at all. I need to find a really good article I read recently about how MRAs actually hurt men more than they help. This is a good example of that.

[boston bean]

54. Are you saying that I don't think men count?

[tammywammy]

62. See post 31. I think that's what he's referring to. n/t

[Pab Sungenis]

63. Yes.

You have many times in the past. Maybe not directly, but obliquely, yes, you have.

[boston bean]

65. This is comical. Yes you have but we got nothing to really show you feel that way.

We just say you do. LOL

[Pab Sungenis]

68. Your misandry is well known around here

and that you can't see it says more about you than it could any of us.

[boston bean]

71. Oh please do link to it.

[chervilant]

108. Oh, so, taking a stand in support

of Feminists' issues, and addressing sexism and misogyny is "misandry"? I would encourage you to read Dinnerstein and Thorne-Finch, and a host of other resources, were it not obvious from your broad-brush character assassination of a fellow DUer that your Pinnacle of Absolute Authority is well guarded.

[LanternWaste]

155. I think you're confusing "infer" and "imply"

I think you're confusing "infer" and "imply".

[boston bean]

52. Yeah that's the one posted in HoF about an hour before that one.

[polly7]

57. So fucking WHAT??? nt.

[boston bean]

58. Wow! Angry. Sorry for mentioning it. LOL

[polly7]

61. So damned lame. Jeesus. nt.

[boston bean]

66. See my response to you prior.

[polly7]

70. nah. nt

[boston bean]

72. Ok.

[msanthrope]

55. I see it in the courts--

I see a great deal of 'mutual combat' situations with alcohol or drugs involved. Lots of male on female, some male on male, some female on female, and some female on male. Domestic violence isn't confined to any one victim type.

[cynatnite]

64. Maybe you should research the stats...

More attention is focused on those where the men is the abuser and the woman is the victim for a very good reason.

http://domesticviolencestatistics.org/domestic-violence-statistics/

There is far more than women being the abuser.

No one is suggesting to ignore it or even ridicule it when the man is the victim.

Just understand why the focus is mostly on the women who are victims. There are a lot of us.

[riderinthestorm]

69. Its wrong for either sex to abuse. Period. nt

[In_The_Wind]

132. I agree.

I watched my stepmothers start physical fights with my father. Then I watched him fight back.

[Texasgal]

75. How's that?

You have any links or data?

[boston bean]

78. A very graphic public service domestic violence video of a woman beaten,

Prompted this thread. It made this poster feel that domestic violence against men is not cared about. Then come the accusations of not caring about men or hating men if people discuss how it effects women.

Blame others for something one is doing themselves comes to mind.

Bottom line a all victims of DV deserve protections and understanding.

[polly7]

80. Your post is quite a leap. A little more practice and you can jump the grand canyon.

edit - I *'d up and read too quickly. The OP was obviously trying to illustrate that domestic violence is horrible, and why do we never see the results of it against men? It's a valid question, and one that needs to be dealt with, whether people want to admit it's happening, or not.

[boston bean]

81. Ah no, I am not. Boy you folks sure got some imaginations going on and always

Thinking the worst of me. No, I did not say nor imply what you are saying I said.

[Texasgal]

86. We do see results of men.

I see it in my local news etc.

Please do not say that I do not care about it because I do. I am not anti-man by any stretch.

Women are generally the brunt of domestic violence, is that okay to understand?

[polly7]

87. Did I say you don't care?

I don't see that anywhere ......... I said right on this thread that MOST women care about EVERYONE who is a victim of domestic or any other kind of abuse.

Did I say anyone was 'anti-man'? Nope. Can't find that either.

Did I say women are generally not the main recipients of DV? Not anywhere here either.

Can you ask me about something I actually DID say?

[Texasgal]

89. Simply by being pro woman

It happens alot.

I wasn't talking about YOU... i was referring to generic YOU.

I apologize for not getting my point across well.

[polly7]

91. I'm pro human. Sorry you got mixed up with your pronouns. Shit happens. nt.

[Texasgal]

92. Seriously.

Are you insinuating that I am not pro-human?

Please explain so that I do not make this mistake again.

[polly7]

94. Make up what you like, it seems to entertain you. nt.

[Texasgal]

96. wow.

Okay. You are pretty rude.

No need to continue here I see.

Take care.

[polly7]

98. What did you expect with those bullshit accusations? Buh bye though.

[Texasgal]

103. Do you not get

the generic YOU?

Geez oh' peat!

DU has fallen!

Oh well, I had you ignore before for a reason. Guess it's time again.

[chervilant]

166. Same here,

same reasons, I'm sure. (And, if true to form, will post some response -- despite being made aware of IL status.)

[Mariana]

83. The woman is in jail, right?

Sounds like the police did their jobs in this instance. The victims wasn't ignored.

edited for clarity

[boston bean]

84. Exactly.

[davidn3600]

88. We'll see for how long

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/11/men-women-prison-sentence-length-gender-gap_n_1874742.html

[etherealtruth]

97. Abuse is ALWAYS wrong; however, we hear far more about women because women are far more likely

... to be abused.


http://www.prweb.com/releases/2012/10/prweb10041870.htm

"The American Bar Association and the Department of Justice provide the following statistics about domestic violence:

"about 25 percent of women and 7.6 percent of men are raped or physically assaulted by their spouse, partner, or dating partner in their lifetime"

The following statistics were provided by the Safe Horizon Organization:

women between the ages of 20 and 24 are the most likely to become victims of domestic violence
1 in 3 women killed by homicide are murdered by their current or former partner
3 million children in the United States witness domestic violence every year
25% of now homeless and former heads of households in New York City were the victim of domestic violence"

Violence, rape and abuse are always wrong regardless of the gender of the abuser or the abused. We will hear far more about the female victims of domestic because the victims of domestic abuse are twice as likely to be women. The perpetrators are three times as likely to be men.

[Texasgal]

99. Don't say that you MAN HATER!!

[etherealtruth]

101. Oh, man you caught me

i said it was always wrong ... should I have said that it is worse to abuse a man

[seabeyond]

102. ridiculed? by who? other men? cause you are not gonna be hearing that shit from women. abuse is

WRONG. that simple

[moriah]

104. Yes, often, by men. Men are the majority of police officers, at least in my state.

When I reported, there were no female officers who could interview me, which made things very hard to talk about and I'm afraid I just came across as a hysterical female.

Also, by their own internalized views that men are somehow supposed to be able to stop abuse. They are, after all, theoreitcally the stronger sex. But even if a guy tried to physcially restrain an enraged, abusive woman, if she fought back hard enough she could end up with bruised wrists. Or at least, I know I would, I bruise at the drop of a hat.

[lumberjack_jeff]

106. It is a cycle of violence.

We have made great progress in the last 30 years by focusing on men's role. To make the next leap of progress we'll need to focus on women too.

Of all domestic violence, 15% is unilateral violence by men, 35% is unilateral violence by women and 50% is reciprocal.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1854883/?tool=pubmed

[bettyellen]

126. I agree, men (especially LEOs) need to take this more seriously and stop shaming men

and using peer pressure to silence them on this issue.

[Rex]

107. Bored much?

nt.

[Recursion]

109. I'm a male who has been abused by women (parents and partners).

We face a unique set of challenges, and it's not really at all the same as abused women.

Abused men have a sort of "code of silence" that tells us our abuse didn't happen, and that's bad. Abused women have a code that tells them the abuse did happen, but was their fault. And that goes beyond "bad" to "nightmare".

Honestly, conflating the two doesn't help anything. They are two different wounds, IMO.

Incidentally, any male survivors of physical or sexual abuse may wish to look up the website http://www.malesurvivor.org

It's a good and safe place.

[seabeyond]

110. thanks for this info. your info is important. there is a mens forum. since it is about silence,

i would love the mens group to think about posting a sticky (if they do not already have one) about places and orgs to contact if a man is being abused. i think that would be very very important. in ways, more so than a womans group, cause it is so silenced. we have a sticky in our forum for women.

it is interesting seeing the difference how the two genders absorbed.

[Recursion]

111. I was irked enough to do an OP on this

I can't imagine a male survivor of abuse ever using that fact to de-legitimize a female survivor of abuse. It appalls me.

[seabeyond]

112. it simply cannot be allowed to be. we cannot do that. bUT... this is important enough mens issue,

now that i think about it, for a true progressive board, i would really like that info available for men and the mens group would be an excellent place to have it. gonna check out your OP.

[Recursion]

113. Thanks, seabeyond

This is it: http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023988262

I hate that recovery has become politicized. That's a poison we need to remove.

[Orrex]

118. :thumbsup:

[HappyMe]

115. I'm sorry that this happened.

I figured that men don't say much about this because maybe nobody would believe them.

[Recursion]

116. That's a separate question, and still not really comparable

See my OP on this if you're interested.

[anneboleyn]

160. My stepfather endured vicious slaps, punches (face), dishes smashed over his head

for years. His children witnessed it (and were later abused by the wife also). This happened many years ago, and he believed that men should not complain of such things. The marriage crumbled entirely when the wife started to hit the children (when they became teenagers).

My husband had a physically abusive mother. He used to believe it was not something that "men" should complain about or even discuss. She stopped when he hit his teenage years and grew well over six feet but not before. His older sibling observed the abuse and tried to intervene. It was very traumatic for both of them.

Thank you for your post -- because the shame and silence on these topics are profound -- and for recommending the website.

[ismnotwasm]

127. In my state both parties get arrested if there is not a clear victim.

So it depends on where you live.

I have a female friend who was killed by a serial killer running to Alaska trying to escape a very abusive partner

I have a female friend who had her throat cut and lived

My sister had the shit beaten out of her on a regular basis.

I have a friend who works as a court advocate and has a ready made "packet" for abused women, which she sees an a alarming basis

My husband served on a jury and was instrumental in getting a conviction for a man who had been abusing his wife for 20 years.

I have a hundred stories about abused women. And that's limited to the USA.

And yes, it's very true men get abused

But this is not a fucking contest.

We need to change the culture that produces the violence.

[Beringia]

128. Comedian Louie CK on women vs men

"A man will cut your arm off and throw it in a river, but he'll leave you as a human being intact. He won't fuck with who you are. Women are non-violent, but they will shit inside of your heart."



At 0:44:00

I know this is beside the point. I do agree with other posters that the majority of violence is committed by men on women. However any violence is abhorrent, and it does happen to men by women.

[madville]

149. I've been in a relationship with an abusive woman

She would get very angry and violent when she drank to much, make accusations, throw punches, etc. She was an elementary school teacher and her personality was like Jekyll and Hyde between public and home (didn't realize that until she started living with me). Had my nose/lip busted a couple of times by her, stuff thrown, broken glass, etc.

I never fought back and would try to stay as calm as possible, that would enrage her more because "I didn't care enough about her". When I finally did get her to move out of my house she took all the light bulbs, toilet paper and the little spring loaded toilet paper roll holders.

It was actually terrifying because she was crazy enough to fabricate anything, especially if law enforcement had ever been involved, she probably could have lied and had me arrested.

[no_hypocrisy]

165. I know a man with a similar situation.

He was dating a girl 40+ years ago. She insisted they get married. He tried to break off the engagement but she threatened to kill herself. Even the priest who did their Catholic premarital counseling told both of them they shouldn't married. She was bound and determined to marry him.

After they married, she suddenly demonstrated violent rages. She screamed at him, swore at him. She threw large carving knives at him and a large heavy glass vase at his head.

They had two children. That didn't affect her behavior. If anything, she now had leverage against him to prevent him from leaving her.

After 40 years of marriage, she still will surprise him with sudden rages that are not appropriate responses to average frustrations or complaints. While she is not physically violent anymore, she still screams and curses, and insults him every chance she has. An unfortunate byproduct is that their daughter has now emulated her mother and is a clone with her husband, criticizing him and screaming about nothing.

My friend doesn't sit there and take the abuse. He quickly leaves the home whenever his wife "acts up". He finds excuses to avoid living with her. He still takes responsibility for taking care of her as a husband, but he refuses to be a victim.

[LanternWaste]

154. Women accounted for 85% of the victims of intimate partner violence, men for approximately 15%.

"I don't know what the percentage is of men to women, being the abusers...."

Women accounted for 85% of the victims of intimate partner violence, men for approximately 15%.
(Bureau of Justice Statistics Crime Data Brief, Intimate Partner Violence, 1993-2001, February 2003)

Between 600,000 and 6 million women are victims of domestic violence each year, and between 100,000 and 6 million men, depending on the type of survey used to obtain the data.

Women ages 20-24 are at the greatest risk of nonfatal intimate partner violence.

Between 1993 and 2004, intimate partner violence on average made up 22% of nonfatal intimate partner victimizations against women. The same year, intimate partners committed 3% of all violent crime against men.

http://dvrc-or.org/domestic/violence/resources/C61/#dom

[BainsBane]

156. I expect female abuse of men is more common than we realize

The stigma you speak of likely keeps men from reporting the abuse. Stigma is powerful in cases of male on female violence, but I imagine gender conventions make it even harder for men abused by women to come forward. I'm sure there are studies on this we could read to better inform ourselves.