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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsFla. teacher suspended for forcing 4th-grader to participate in Pledge of Allegiance
Anne Daigle-McDonald, a teacher at Explorer K-8 School in Spring Hill, Fla., made the student, a Jehovah's Witness, place his hand over his heart during the Sept. 11 pledge, according to a report by the Tampa Bay Times. (Jehovah's Witnesses are forbidden from worshiping objects including the American flag.) When he resisted, she said, "You are an American, and you are supposed to salute the flag," the boy told a school administrator.
According to several students, Daigle-McDonald admonished the class the following day. "In my classroom, everyone will do the pledge; no religion says that you can't do the pledge," she said. "If you can't put your hand on your heart, then you need to move out of the country."
It's not the first time the Pledge of Allegiance has been at the center of a controversy in Hernando County. Last year, a high school student was suspended for three days for confronting a classmate wearing a traditional Muslim headscarf who she said did not stand for the pledge.
"Take that thing off your head and act like you're proud to be an American," the girl said, according to a teacher who witnessed the confrontation.
Florida teabaggery in all its glory.
http://news.yahoo.com/teacher-pledge-of-allegiance-us-160820504.html
ProudToBeBlueInRhody
(16,399 posts)Teabagging nut.
earthside
(6,960 posts)joeybee12
(56,177 posts)with teabagging asshat rhethoric!
giftedgirl77
(4,713 posts)He refused to stand, when his teacher asked him why he told her my mother & I talked about it & since we don't believe in god I have decided I don't want to participate. She then told my son he should be ashamed of himself & that he is disrespecting the country & the principl's rules.
Needless to say the next morning I was in the principal's office. The teacher had sent & email to her saying she was going to force him to stand, instead she ended up apologizing in front of the entire class.
okaawhatever
(9,457 posts)God portion in the pledge of allegiance. (for schools) Have the school systems started saying that again?
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)okaawhatever
(9,457 posts)was living in California (around 1971-1972 my dad was Air Force) they dropped the "under God" and we said "one nation, indivisible".
The pledge was initially written by a Baptist preacher and it didn't include under God. That wasn't added until the 1950's. Dropping it makes sense anyway.
giftedgirl77
(4,713 posts)Mind you we live in SC. Apparently he has started his own little revolution, as of today number 4 has refused to stand.
The first couple of days weren't easy for him but he doesn't take shit from anyone so he took it in stride.
sinkingfeeling
(51,436 posts)penultimate
(1,110 posts)Last edited Wed Nov 6, 2013, 06:19 PM - Edit history (1)
It's like those people who get all pissy about the right to burn the flag. You don't have want to burn the flag or even support it being (I personally think burning flags is teh dumb), but trying outlaw it goes against what this country is supposed to stand for. Same goes for not wanting to say the pledge of allegiance. Instead of trying to force the girl to say it, she could have explained why she feels the need to say the pledge and then asked the girl to explain why she doesn't want to say it. It could have been an interesting learning opportunity on both sides.
Warpy
(111,124 posts)during an antiwar demonstration since it was such a fucking stupid tactic that drew nothing but blowback. I wondered audibly if he was the government stooge sent to spy on us and discredit us. He slunk away, never to be seen again, so I guess I outed him.
duffyduff
(3,251 posts)They teach about this USSC case, which overruled a previous ruling, in introductory education courses:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Virginia_State_Board_of_Education_v._Barnette#Subsequent_history
We are talking about a case 70 YEARS old.
Peregrine
(992 posts)State law requires it. Only the parent can opt the kid out.
hunter
(38,301 posts)My mom was a Jehovah's Witness until they kicked her out because she couldn't stay out of politics. (This wasn't the first or last church my mom's been in trouble with. It's not in my mom's blood to "respect authority." That's how her ancestors ended up as ranchers in the Wild West where certain authorities couldn't imprison them or shun them for thought crimes and heresies.)
Anyways, I already had the aura of a "weird" little kid. Me not standing up or saying the pledge was just another one of my oddities.
One embarrassing incident was a teacher who used me as an example of religious freedom in the U.S.A.. She may have meant well but everyone in the class was looking at me and it made me want to disappear. Usually I just ran off in situations like that, right out the door, but I managed to stay in my seat long enough that she recognized my discomfort, distracted the class with something else, and that was the end of it.
I hope this teacher in Florida learns something. If not she should be fired. Getting fired under those circumstances would probably greatly increase her chances for getting hired at some horrible "tea party" private school where she might be happier.
Rex
(65,616 posts)DON'T do what they say and you might get killed! This kid is lucky.
dballance
(5,756 posts)"I was talking about pledging allegiance to our country," Daigle-McDonald told a district official. "And if you don't want to pledge to our country, you should go to your home country."
Well that makes it so much better.
Did she get her "values" from a Hitler Youth campaign and what if the US IS my home country and I don't want to recite a stupid pledge? Where should I be going home to?
starroute
(12,977 posts)West Virginia State Board of Education v. Barnette, 319 U.S. 624 (1943), is a decision by the Supreme Court of the United States holding that the Free Speech Clause of the First Amendment to the United States Constitution protected students from being forced to salute the American flag and say the Pledge of Allegiance in school. The Court's 6-3 opinion, delivered by Justice Robert H. Jackson, is remembered for its forceful defense of free speech and constitutional rights generally as being placed "beyond the reach of majorities and officials."
It was a significant court victory won by Jehovah's Witnesses, whose religion forbade them from saluting or pledging to symbols, including symbols of political institutions. However, the Court did not address the effect the compelled salutation and recital ruling had upon their particular religious beliefs, but instead ruled that the state did not have the power to compel speech in that manner for anyone. . . .
The Board of Education on January 9, 1942, adopted a resolution containing recitals taken largely from the Court's Gobitis opinion and ordering that the salute to the flag become "a regular part of the program of activities in the public schools," that all teachers and pupils "shall be required to participate in the salute honoring the Nation represented by the Flag; provided, however, that refusal to salute the Flag be regarded as an Act of insubordination, and shall be dealt with accordingly." The resolution originally required the "commonly accepted salute to the Flag" which it defined. Objections to the salute as "being too much like Hitler's" were raised by the Parent and Teachers Association, the Boy and Girl Scouts, the Red Cross, and the General Federation of Women's Clubs. Some modification appears to have been made in deference to these objections, but no concession was made to Jehovah's Witnesses. What was required after the modification was a "stiff-arm" salute, the saluter to keep the right hand raised with palm turned up while the following is repeated: "I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands; one Nation indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."
Failure to comply was considered "insubordination" and dealt with by expulsion. Readmission was denied by statute until the student complied. This expulsion, in turn, automatically exposed the child and their parents to criminal prosecution; the expelled child was considered "unlawfully absent" and could be proceeded against as a delinquent, and their parents or guardians could be fined as much as $50 and jailed up to thirty days.
louis-t
(23,266 posts)to require "under God" be inserted.
duffyduff
(3,251 posts)It has been the law for DECADES.
However, I have known teachers to actually pull this garbage.
I have also seen teachers violate Title IX repeatedly.
Dash87
(3,220 posts)pledge allegiance to its people.
We shouldn't be forcing kids to recite words they don't know the meaning of, and we certainly shouldn't use it as an indirect way to demand that everybody be a Christian.
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)Dash87
(3,220 posts)There's nothing "American" about the pledge of allegiance.
1 - It promotes a religion, contradictory to the Constitution.
2 - It is an oath of blind allegiance
3 - We make kids who are too young to question the pledge say it, and it's implied in most schools that they have to. Doesn't matter if it's illegal or not - most schools quietly make it a mandatory activity.
louis-t
(23,266 posts)The religious wackos forced adding "under God" in the '50s. It also asks you to pledge allegiance to your country. Nothing wrong with that. It doesn't say "blind allegiance", you added that part. It also should be required that teachers discuss what it means with their classes.
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)scheming daemons
(25,487 posts)Posteritatis
(18,807 posts)Tikki
(14,549 posts)Pledge of Allegiance. No one ever called me on it and I never really felt like I should make
people around me aware of it either.
I keep the cadence and tone and volume with the crowd and just skip over those words
and get back into it to finish the pledge
Maybe it's just where I have lived but no one seems worried about how others express
their degree of patriotism.
Tikki
duffyduff
(3,251 posts)Peregrine
(992 posts)FL requires it.
Posteritatis
(18,807 posts)WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)Not only is it responsible for all the nekkid boobeez on teh internet (and the subsequent, dangerous erotoxin levels) but now this.
NuclearDem
(16,184 posts)Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)I knew I was an Atheist.
Didn't discover I liked teh nekkind booberz until a few years later, though.
Somehow I still haven't repented for either of those sins. Many Haz Sad
prole_for_peace
(2,064 posts)and she used to leave the room and stand in the hall when we said the pledge each morning. I never found out if the school made her do it so it wouldn't give the rest of use ideas if she sat through it or if it was her family's decision.
teenagebambam
(1,592 posts)and I was wondering the same thing.
longship
(40,416 posts)I am an atheist, but forcing a JW to say the pledge is just plain wrong headed from any perspective.
She should have been suspended. The school did the right thing here.
As a HS teacher in CA, I never once said the pledge. Nobody said a word about it. Nor should they have. The only thing I required was that students could stand and say it if they wanted or could sit quietly. I stood silently.
yellerpup
(12,252 posts)when I was in the 5th grade. Grades 4-8 were all taught in the same room. An eighth grade boy refused to say the pledge and the teacher berated him, called him Communist, and ridiculed him down to nothing. He never came back to school; he just worked the farm with his dad.
Peregrine
(992 posts)Only the parent, not the student, can opt out.
And remember the JWs lost the last time they took it to the Supreme Court.
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)davidpdx
(22,000 posts)But as someone pointed out, it is possible to say it without "under God"
Maybe you could just add the words "underwear".