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madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 02:57 PM Dec 2013

Repost from 3 years ago about Dem's rightward trend. Note how little has changed.

I posted this here in 2010. I happened upon it again today, and I was really stunned at how many things remain the same. The post was about how a nation can change drastically if there is too much bipartisanship, if there is not a party voicing opposition when things go wrong.

It was a post about how much things changed from 2000 when our party did not realize in time that the election was being snatched out from under them.

It had been a drastic change from the year 2000.

I came to DU in 2002, and I really got a good understanding beyond my own little conservative area. I came here as a moderate, but I have grown more liberal since then.

In 2000 we saw a side of our neighbors and friends we had never seen before. The election was divisive enough to bring out the radical side of people we had known for years. In 2003 it was a nightmare.

I grew up in this conservative religious area, and I had never seen it come out like this into the public venue. It got awkward and uncomfortable, and sometimes downright ugly. Our neighbors had signs in their yards supporting the president and the war. We found out local churches were providing many of those signs. Hubby and I realized our neighbors were conservatives, we were not. It had never mattered before.

It had not come up in all my years of teaching. No one threw their religion in our faces, it was a private thing usually. In 2003 the Southern Baptist churches in our area came out for the holy war in Iraq...the war between good and evil they called it. They called us unpatriotic, and we took our names off the roll then.


(UPDATE: Nothing in the above 4 paragraphs has changed. Most of our neighbors now call themselves Tea Party Patriots.)

More:
This section is about Howard Dean, and why we supported his campaign.

In 2003 we got excited because someone in our party was speaking out and saying that it was wrong to go to war when the truth was not being told. He wondered out loud why out Democratic leaders were voting for Bush's unilateral war on Iraq.

He wondered why we were supported Bush's tax cuts, wondered how we could afford them with our huge deficit. In fact that guy was on Rachel Maddow tonight saying the same thing.

He said something else tonight also on her show. He said that President Obama needed to be a leader, that he needed to stand up and take firm stands...that he was the only one who could do it because he has the bully pulpit.

He said we would lose the House and the White House if we did not start taking stands. Hubby and I both got tears at that because we know he is right.

He tried to change the system, and was chair when we took back the House, the Senate, and the White House. Then the party leaders made sure there was no place for him among them. The cut off started at once, and it was swift and to the point.


UPDATE: Hard to forget Dean was in American Samoa when Tim Kaine was announced as the new DNC chair. Dean had not even been informed of the announcement.

UPDATE 2: Dean is now sometimes sounding like he did back then. Just not often enough. I guess that happens when your own party nearly shuts you out.

UPDATE 3: Most of those paragraphs still remain true, but I think most of us detect a little uptick or perhaps a heads up to liberals....that they are hearing us on some issues.

More:

Now we are seeing the wobbly words on the tax cuts. There is no one saying let's stop giving in to the religious zealots on faith-based initiatives, on gay rights, on women's reproductive rights. There is no clear message. There is a fear of the right wing that seems to be paralyzing our party and our president.

There has been a movement by our party to continue the education policies of George Bush which amount to turning our schools over to private companies...while giving them our taxpayer money to make them richer. Teachers have spoken out, but they are not being heard, not even being listened to by this administration.

I used to feel safe and secure that Americans would fight back when certain things like Social Security and Medicare were threatened. I always felt comfortable that things would not get too bad here, that our leaders would step in and stop things from going too far in any directions.

I never thought our nation would get to the point that teachers were made to feel ashamed, that seniors would be called "the greediest generation" by a man appointed by our Democratic president. Or worse, that not a single Democratic leader would speak up for them and point out how they had paid into the system during their lifetimes. I never thought that two men who had such contempt for seniors would be put in charge of a commission to "fix" Social Security.


UPDATE: There has been advancement on the gay rights issues, and that is encouraging. As to teachers, Social Security, Medicare....those paragraphs are as true now as they were then. In fact teachers are treated with even more disdain. Still no one in leadership really taking a stand for public education versus privatization.

More:

I always felt that our senior safety nets were untouchable. Now I realize they are not. I always felt our country would have the public school system that helped make it great...but we won't. It never occurred to me that the unions who helped build the middle class in this country would be treated badly by a Democratic administration.

I see that the very same centrists who helped run the DLC and the Third Way are forming a new party. They are calling it a centrist party, and the official name is the No Labels party. That is the bipartisanship they want. They think the Democratic party as it exists now has been taken over by liberals, I guess.

It just shows how what was once the right, a normal fairly moderate right....has kept moving to the extremes. And our party, instead of standing with its so-called liberals...has denounced them and moved right as well. They have twisted meanings and words until there is no longer any understanding of them.

We have kept going along with them, fearful of bucking the rightward trend, not wanting to hurt the feelings of the ones who took this country down in the Bush years.

There should have been someone to stop it. There has not been.


UPDATE: The DLC declared itself defunct, the Third Way claimed to have taken its place, the No Labels party seems to be a website with lots of pictures. Haven't heard much about them.

UPDATE: There is an occasional moment now from the president and from other Democrats that they recognize they must stand up to the extremists. I am happy for that. I hope they continue.

Words don't matter much anymore, actions do.

In 1985 Al From, a founder of the DLC, wrote of the new agenda for the party. They have scrubbed all the articles, but I still have excerpts.

In his "Saving the Democratic Party" memo of January 1985, From advocated the formation of a "governing council" that would draft a "blueprint" for reforming the party. According to From, the new leadership should aim to create distance from "the new bosses"-organized labor, feminists, and other progressive constituency groups-that were keeping the party from modernizing. From's memo sparked the formation of the Democratic Leadership Council in early 1985. According to Balz and Brownstein, "Within a few weeks, it counted 75 members, primarily governors and members of Congress, most of them from the Sunbelt, and almost all of them white; liberal critics instantly dubbed the group 'the white male caucus.'"


For several decades many in the party adopted the policy of distancing themselves from the traditional constituents. I think we are making ourselves heard, but still not loudly enough.


51 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Repost from 3 years ago about Dem's rightward trend. Note how little has changed. (Original Post) madfloridian Dec 2013 OP
Seems to me that it really accelerated marsis Dec 2013 #1
Does seem that way - although everything has accelerated recently. polichick Dec 2013 #3
Thanks for this post... polichick Dec 2013 #2
Using their own words. madfloridian Dec 2013 #5
It certainly was clear - I feel like a big fool having worked for the party... polichick Dec 2013 #6
Which is why I vote policies and principles over party. Tierra_y_Libertad Dec 2013 #4
When people are constantly voting AGAINST something, they don't get the chance to vote FOR sabrina 1 Dec 2013 #7
Sure hope that enough of us are done voting AGAINST something... polichick Dec 2013 #10
Same here. We've seen the results and it's time for a change in tactics by the PEOPLE. sabrina 1 Dec 2013 #11
Very well said sabrina 1.. blue14u Dec 2013 #24
You are far from alone. People gave this Third Way a chance, and sabrina 1 Dec 2013 #36
People "don't get the chance to vote FOR what they need." Good point. madfloridian Dec 2013 #35
Dean really got screwed. progressoid Dec 2013 #8
Straight Drift Right Since Carter colsohlibgal Dec 2013 #9
The repuglicans are just a lot smarter than the Democrats marsis Dec 2013 #15
The Republican Noise Machine. madfloridian Dec 2013 #31
Having LOTS of trouble with his support of the TPP. madfloridian Dec 2013 #23
Here's a great article to start with. The people that run the Democratic Party are not what Egalitarian Thug Dec 2013 #12
K&R Cleita Dec 2013 #13
..... madfloridian Dec 2013 #17
Thank You, Mad. bvar22 Dec 2013 #14
"The TRUTH has no expiration date." Amen. madfloridian Dec 2013 #16
Modernizing - that's some repub-speak for you. CrispyQ Dec 2013 #18
Yeh, that word "modernizing".... madfloridian Dec 2013 #19
Always good to see you! CrispyQ Dec 2013 #20
You too. madfloridian Dec 2013 #21
"Words don't matter much anymore, actions do." dotymed Dec 2013 #22
..... madfloridian Dec 2013 #32
thank you for this post. You are sooooo correct. k and r bbgrunt Dec 2013 #25
We need to remember that the left was deliberately excluded from the party in the 80s. madfloridian Dec 2013 #48
What the Third Way says about liberals.... madfloridian Dec 2013 #26
Maybe they need to see what would happen to them if the Liberals they so despise, decided sabrina 1 Dec 2013 #37
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2013 #27
k&r Starry Messenger Dec 2013 #28
K & R !!! WillyT Dec 2013 #29
Du rec. Nt xchrom Dec 2013 #30
I could be wrong, but Jamaal510 Dec 2013 #33
On 2 ssues very important to me... madfloridian Dec 2013 #34
Everything is relative. The Republican Party as become so extremely far Right, unlike a few sabrina 1 Dec 2013 #38
Excellent post as usual. Logical. Worded well. madfloridian Dec 2013 #40
I believe that your blue14u Dec 2013 #43
knr Douglas Carpenter Dec 2013 #39
that's all true - but when we have somewhere around 40% of Americans thinking the Democratic Party Douglas Carpenter Dec 2013 #41
As more and more people abandon the Corporate Media, especially the younger generation sabrina 1 Dec 2013 #42
We keep talking and blue14u Dec 2013 #44
Our side needs more passion and better public relations. madfloridian Dec 2013 #46
The DLC by any other name will still reek of sheet. Kurovski Dec 2013 #45
Love it when mstinamotorcity2 Dec 2013 #47
...... madfloridian Dec 2013 #49
I come from NYC. aquart Dec 2013 #50
K&R orpupilofnature57 Dec 2013 #51
 

marsis

(301 posts)
1. Seems to me that it really accelerated
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 03:02 PM
Dec 2013

after Paul Wellstone was assassinated. He was the conscience of the Democratic party. Now all seems lost as these Democrats in Washington only seem to worship the monied elite.

polichick

(37,152 posts)
2. Thanks for this post...
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 03:03 PM
Dec 2013

Your bold paragraph tells us when the Dem Party stopped representing the people and began to wholeheartedly whore for corporations and the 1%.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
5. Using their own words.
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 03:17 PM
Dec 2013

They were brazen enough to put it in writing often.

Note what Simon Rosenberg, a DLC founder said about the new divide in the party, in his own words.

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/2007

If there's a battle for the soul of the Democratic Party, predicts Simon Rosenberg, president of the New Democrat Network, a moderate advocacy group, it won't be the usual skirmish between the liberals and moderates of the professional political class in Washington but one between the Washington insiders on one side and the rank-and-file activists spread out across the country on the other. "What's changed over the past two years is that activist Democrats believe that Republicans are venal people," says Rosenberg. These activists "are going to be very intolerant of Democrats in Washington who cooperate with the Republicans. There's going to be tremendous pressure to stand up and fight and not roll over and play dead."


He also reiterated the words of AL From:

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1365

"Simon Rosenberg, the former field director for the DLC who directs the New Democrat Network, a spin-off political action committee, says, "We're trying to raise money to help them lessen their reliance on traditional interest groups in the Democratic Party. In that way," he adds, "they are ideologically freed, frankly, from taking positions that make it difficult for Democrats to win."


At least they were honest about what they were doing.

polichick

(37,152 posts)
6. It certainly was clear - I feel like a big fool having worked for the party...
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 03:21 PM
Dec 2013

as long as I did. Easy to get caught up in the "Republicans are worse" argument.

 

Tierra_y_Libertad

(50,414 posts)
4. Which is why I vote policies and principles over party.
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 03:13 PM
Dec 2013

I've been, and remain, a Democrat since 1965 and have seen the party drift rightward ever since. Until it has really become the "lesser of two evils" and "not as bad". Greediness for office has replaced what it once stood for with winning at any cost, including supporting clearly anti-democratic policies for political expediency.

Injury to my nose has its limits.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
7. When people are constantly voting AGAINST something, they don't get the chance to vote FOR
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 03:22 PM
Dec 2013

what they need.

The tactic right in our own party now, when we say we cannot vote against our conscience, for candidates who do not represent our interests according to their records even if they have a D after their names, the response is 'well do you think that Christie/Santorum/Ryan et al would be better?

This has worked for over a decade now and we have a party that the very same people telling us we have to for anyone with a D after their names, have the gall to DEFEND Dems not doing what they ought to do, by pointing at the very same 'D's we warned would not help any significant and necessary changes that are needed.

I think finally that is about to change now that we've seen the results.

It changed in 2010 with Independents and young people deciding they didn't want Republican Lite any more than they wanted Republicans.

Now progressives may be moving in the same direction as coalitions have formed to try to get the party to provide ACTUAL Dem candidates that people can vote FOR instead of out of fear of Republicans.

polichick

(37,152 posts)
10. Sure hope that enough of us are done voting AGAINST something...
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 03:31 PM
Dec 2013

I know that I'm voting FOR something from now on - classic Democratic principles.

blue14u

(575 posts)
24. Very well said sabrina 1..
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 04:49 PM
Dec 2013

Last edited Sat Dec 7, 2013, 03:00 AM - Edit history (1)

The third way HRC foot soilders are out in force everyday insulting and diminishing

every word I post that speaks to change from the Wall street candidate.. They have talking points down, (even if false), insults, disparaging and belittling any work

I have done in campaign past, and any votes I could bring to the polls. It's astonishing. It is "there way" and "they know it all" and I know nothing..

Hard to believe our candidate for POTUS has been bought and paid for and I have no other choice, along with the others who want a different candidate that is not paid for by third way Wall Street, but again, they know it all, and I know nothing.

Even with 30 years under my belt of campaigning, and being the child of a Politician. I am to be dismissed, for not caving to "their" only choice for me...

The more I see and read here, the more I feel I would rather not vote. No WS, and I will ask my friends and family to do the same. If they want a center right, bought WS hack then let them live with the consequences of their dogged approach, and not bring this party together again. Their inability to find another candidate for us who want a progressive and that speaks to the issues we care about will be their demise once again, like 2010 all over again..
I can vote republican, or I can vote republican center right.

NO thank you.




sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
36. You are far from alone. People gave this Third Way a chance, and
Sat Dec 7, 2013, 12:03 AM
Dec 2013

voted reluctantly for candidates they would not have chosen themselves, knowing they would be unlikely to fight hard for their interests, simply to stop the Republicans. Since that hasn't worked out so well for the people after so many election cycles, I believe the time has finally come when enough people have decided they won't keep repeating the same mistake, again and again and again.

The Leadership needs to ASK THE PEOPLE who they want, what kind of candidate, rather than TELLING us 'this is it, it is either this candidate or the Republican'. IF they think this is a good strategy they are badly mistaken. Each time I hear that argument all it does now is to say to me that we have been far too tolerant for far too long and it's way past time for a change.

I have a feeling that change has already begun. And I hope the Dem Party doesn't make the mistake of not taking the bull by horns and moving forward instead of thinking they run another Corporate Candidate and expect us, once again, to just go along. I don't think that will happen this time.

Time for them to start LISTENING, instead of ignoring the voters.

colsohlibgal

(5,275 posts)
9. Straight Drift Right Since Carter
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 03:25 PM
Dec 2013

It was so fascinating to hear Barack talking all socialist the other day. His actions have been anything but. How Obama can spout that stuff while trying to cram the TPP down our throats is beyond me. Talk can be cheap, let's see what he does, color me a skeptic.

I do without a doubt believe Pope Frank was sincere with his indictment of trickle down supply side economics - he sure struck a nerve at Fox and CNBC. BTW, Jon Stewart eviscerated Fox and CNBC last night over this flap.

I agree about Paul Wellstone, his death was beyond suspicious particularly at the time it happened.

 

marsis

(301 posts)
15. The repuglicans are just a lot smarter than the Democrats
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 03:48 PM
Dec 2013

on this issue.

They have successfully swayed the average person to vote against his/her best interests. The own am radio (and most all other media) and they seem to study and use Joseph Goebbels' playbook. While the Democrats wring their hands, consider whether something is right or wrong, it will piss off their monied base, will it save the children etc., the repugs just do it and try to control the message.

Add in a very compliant corporate international media conglomerate and voila, everything shifts to the right. So now we can wring our hands about that and wonder what the pollitically correct thing to do about that would be.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
23. Having LOTS of trouble with his support of the TPP.
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 04:41 PM
Dec 2013

It will change our country even more drastically.. How did we come to this point?

 

Egalitarian Thug

(12,448 posts)
12. Here's a great article to start with. The people that run the Democratic Party are not what
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 03:42 PM
Dec 2013

they want us to believe they are. I'm not talking about democrats, rather the people that actually run the party. The people that decide who gets money and who is going to be the next choice made available to the little people.

The Reich-wing bought the party leadership.

Bill Berkowitz spent years trying to get the information he was finally able to report, and there is much more that has not been uncovered yet. These parasites go to great lengths to protect the privacy they feel you don't need.

bvar22

(39,909 posts)
14. Thank You, Mad.
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 03:48 PM
Dec 2013

The TRUTH has no expiration date.


Always good to see you here.




[font color=firebrick][center]"There are forces within the Democratic Party who want us to sound like kinder, gentler Republicans.
I want a party that will STAND UP for Working Americans."
---Paul Wellstone [/font]
[/center] [center] [/font]
[font size=1]photo by bvar22
Shortly before Sen Wellstone was killed[/center]
[/font]


You will know them by their [font size=3]WORKS.[/font]

CrispyQ

(36,221 posts)
18. Modernizing - that's some repub-speak for you.
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 04:07 PM
Dec 2013
According to From, the new leadership should aim to create distance from "the new bosses"-organized labor, feminists, and other progressive constituency groups-that were keeping the party from modernizing.


Should read: "...other progressive constituency groups-that were keeping the party from profiting."


Excellent post.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
32. .....
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 07:15 PM
Dec 2013

Actions needed for sure. Stop mistreating teachers, stop trying to cut the seniors' safety nets.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
48. We need to remember that the left was deliberately excluded from the party in the 80s.
Sat Dec 7, 2013, 11:48 AM
Dec 2013

We can't forget that. It reminds us that we have work to do to be part of the party again.

Those of us who were against an unjust war were called fringe. Those who are against cutting Social Security, who are against turning public schools over to private companies....we are often uncomfortable here and at other forums that should be accepting.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
26. What the Third Way says about liberals....
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 04:56 PM
Dec 2013

This is one of the kinder things they have said.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/08/22/1009417/-Why-Liberals-Sit-At-The-Kiddies-Table-at-Democratic-Party-Events

In those nine pages the Third Way clearly spells out that the only way to win elections is to appeal to moderates and that a move leftward is not happening and will never happen because of the simple mathematical fact that there are more self identified Moderates than there are Liberals and that the self identified Moderates are the swing voters that must be captured for any candidate to win in any national 2 Party race. This point is re-iterated in numerous ways over the course of the nine pages.

1.Moderates are big and influential. They represented the largest share of the electorate in 13 of the last 14 congressional election cycles.

2. Democrats need to win a supermajority of moderates in order to win a
presidential or typical Senate race.


3. Liberals are not the numerical base of the Democratic Party. Most people
who vote for Democrats call themselves moderates. By contrast, most people
who vote for Republicans call themselves conservative.


(On surveys most people call themselves moderate because folks like Coulter and Limbaugh and also the DLC have contaminated the word "liberal". )

On page 4 we have the Democrats dilemma in a nutshell:

The Democratic base is different and contradictory. On the one hand, the donor and organizing base is liberal. On the other, the numbers show that moderates form a larger portion of the Democratic Party than liberals. Perhaps that is why there is a constant battle over which ideas will dominate the Party—liberal or moderate


Well, we know whose ideas have dominated for years, time for a change.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
37. Maybe they need to see what would happen to them if the Liberals they so despise, decided
Sat Dec 7, 2013, 12:14 AM
Dec 2013

they don't need them either. What utter nonsense to claim that the Dem Party is 'not left'. Otoh, strike that, they have apparently succeeded in changing that. And if that IS the case, then it's time for the Left that they take so granted, 'you have nowhere else to go', to start doing something about it. The best time to do that is BEFORE elections, to let them know that they better start rethinking their 'strategy'. Or they will be doing it from a losing position.

You should never allow anyone to think that they own your vote, and that is what Liberals have done, they have complained, but then gone out, held their noses, and made victories possible for these people. In doing that, we get NOTHING.

But you tend to get more when you make it clear you are going to use the power you have from now on instead of allowing them to take it for granted.

Response to madfloridian (Original post)

Jamaal510

(10,893 posts)
33. I could be wrong, but
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 07:21 PM
Dec 2013

to me, it seems like the 2 parties are more further apart today than they have ever been. Though some say that the Democratic Party has moved rightward, it is very rare that they and the GOP can agree on anything nowadays and get stuff passed. They can't agree on taxes, they can't agree on health care, gay rights, fair pay for women, voting rights, military spending, etc. Even my professor from my Political Theory class at Humboldt said the same thing.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
34. On 2 ssues very important to me...
Fri Dec 6, 2013, 08:26 PM
Dec 2013

the parties do agree. Both parties are pushing the corporate reform agenda for public schools. Actively pursuing GWB's education policies, actually.

Both parties seem to agree that they must get cuts to the social safety nets for seniors and the needy...Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
38. Everything is relative. The Republican Party as become so extremely far Right, unlike a few
Sat Dec 7, 2013, 12:20 AM
Dec 2013

Last edited Sat Dec 7, 2013, 02:36 AM - Edit history (1)

decades ago when they were far more moderate, that when the Dem Party began to move to the Right, we compared them to the Extremists and by comparison, they looked better.

And that seems to have been the plan.

When EVERYONE moves Right, you think the ones who are only moderately to the Right are 'left'.

Today's Dems, especially the leadership, are more like yesterday's Republicans.

There is no 'Left' in power anymore.

We have Republicans on the far, extreme right, and Dems moving into their former more moderate position.

We NEED a Labor Party which is what the Dem Party WAS, until the Third Way/DLC moved in and dragged it to the right, which they like to call the Center. There is no Center, there is Republican and Republican Lite with some Progressives in Congress who have been totally marginalized and have no power.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
40. Excellent post as usual. Logical. Worded well.
Sat Dec 7, 2013, 12:52 AM
Dec 2013

Reminds me of the Republicans in my family. The Democratic Party leaders appear to be where those moderate Republicans have been for years. So the far right and mostly moderate center are filled. There is no left.

blue14u

(575 posts)
43. I believe that your
Sat Dec 7, 2013, 03:34 AM
Dec 2013

post speaks more to the fact that the repuks are split in their own party. The

Tea Beggars are what makes the parties not be able to agree anymore imo..

If and when they can be voted out, we will see things come back to a

more agreeable working atmosphere.

Lately, I am seeing a split in our own party over POTUS candidates. We have

some work to do also, in our party. Center left, against centrist, third way

is making for some tension, and outright anger. btw, I'm center left, and not

new to politics. It will be a bitter fight going forward.

Douglas Carpenter

(20,226 posts)
41. that's all true - but when we have somewhere around 40% of Americans thinking the Democratic Party
Sat Dec 7, 2013, 01:22 AM
Dec 2013

has moved way to the radical, far left - with large elements of the media reinforcing that view - how do we cope with a national body politic that is so grossly misinformed?

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
42. As more and more people abandon the Corporate Media, especially the younger generation
Sat Dec 7, 2013, 02:45 AM
Dec 2013

and become informed by the New Media, I think there is likely to be some changes in how people view both parties.

The suppression of facts and the smearing of those who provide them is pretty terrifying from the pov of this country continuing to be a Democratic Nation.

Even on the Left now there is a huge effort to silence journalists and whistle blowers.

But you are right regarding the ignorance that exists in this country regarding our political system.

blue14u

(575 posts)
44. We keep talking and
Sat Dec 7, 2013, 03:52 AM
Dec 2013

make sure we put someone who is able to connect with people, someone

who speaks to the issues that matter to the voters, and someone who can help people understand, "Liberal" is not a dirty word. Its been mis-characterized and made out to be something, or someone who is going to take from you.

We can fix that by being clear, concise, and direct about what Liberal really means,
and who we really are. Third way centrist are not the answer we have been
led to believe they are.

Examples of who these candidates look like or are, would be Elizabeth Warren or Bernie Sanders. Both of these are great examples of who the Democratic party used to be. Bernie just need to change his letter to "D". He sure talks and walks and acts like a Dem...they are far from radical..

peace

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
46. Our side needs more passion and better public relations.
Sat Dec 7, 2013, 08:36 AM
Dec 2013

That would go a long way toward fixing that problem. We need to get off the defensive, and do some great offense.

aquart

(69,014 posts)
50. I come from NYC.
Sat Dec 7, 2013, 03:58 PM
Dec 2013

I have no virginity to lose as regards my beloved party. In NYC, my beloved party became so rotten and corrupt (due to being a virtually one-party town) that we casually forgot to open the schools on time. I may be the only one still stunned by that, and I never read a word linking that careless slovenliness to the succession of Republican mayors that occurred afterwards. But I link it. (Not every school. Just more than reasonable coincidence.)

I remember being told I had to vote for a no-show jobs creep because he voted the right way in the legislature.

No illusions. I used to say that the difference between Democrats and Republicans is that Democrats steal with one hand and give with the other. Republicans steal with both hands.

So I can't clutch my pearls over any of this.

Actually, granting more than a modicum of truth to everything you say above, the Democrats in Congress have fought damned hard for our interests (and their own).

But somebody does need to come out with the definitive exposure of the ghastly mistake that privatization is. Won't hold my breath. I want a temporary war/shutdown tax of 85% from all sources from the .01%. I want the same in death duties after first ten million. I don't expect anyone to start writing that bill.

But none of it worries me much. We are misdirecting our resources from climate change where they are desperately needed to wars and pipelines and multitudes of other bad ideas. My only real curiosity is who will we be when faced with millions of deaths on our own soil.

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