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question everything

(47,470 posts)
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 09:49 PM Jan 2014

Just curious: why not delay the NFL playoff tomorrow?

It is supposed to be -2 in Green Bay. And while the Packers may have had time for their blood to thicken, it will be a real shock to their guests from San Francisco.

Do NFL games ever get postponed for extreme weather?



87 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Just curious: why not delay the NFL playoff tomorrow? (Original Post) question everything Jan 2014 OP
Because it's a sport meant to be played in all conditions. ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #1
No doubt, some fans will end with frost bites question everything Jan 2014 #4
They do... but they pack (no pun intended) us in there at Lambeau... ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #7
The Packers plan to pass out 70,000 hand warmers, and free hot coffee and hot chocolate too Electric Monk Jan 2014 #9
What about hot beer? Cali_Democrat Jan 2014 #12
My grandmother (a German from Milwaukee) ate beer soup every day for lunch... ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #36
Beer Soup...you wouldn't happen to have the recipe? GReedDiamond Jan 2014 #57
I do! I do! I just have to hunt for it. ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #61
Please do! zappaman Jan 2014 #64
What zappman said...nt GReedDiamond Jan 2014 #76
The hand-warmers were donated by Mills Fleet Farm, a local farm supplier. postulater Jan 2014 #68
Exposed skin? If I were going I certainly would be dressed without exposed skin. Jenoch Jan 2014 #13
This is a logical thought when you are in a warm place now question everything Jan 2014 #75
Naw, I'd be dressed for it and inside a Jenoch Jan 2014 #77
Only thunderstorms and hurricanes or tornadoes ProudToBeBlueInRhody Jan 2014 #2
A Vikings-Eagles game was postponed due to snow ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #3
I didn't even remember that ProudToBeBlueInRhody Jan 2014 #8
Agreed. ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #16
And there was this time........... thelordofhell Jan 2014 #78
If they postpone this game, the winner of it will have one less day to prepare for their next game. Captain Stern Jan 2014 #5
Two words. FROZEN TUNDRA! Packer fans would riot if they pulled something like that. brewens Jan 2014 #6
Lambeau Field has a heating system buried beneath the turf to keep the field from freezing Electric Monk Jan 2014 #11
and the field will be "hard as cement" again..... a kennedy Jan 2014 #86
Eh, you could make an arguement that the weather favors the Niners. LeftyMom Jan 2014 #10
No snow, just cold. Bitter bitter cold. PeaceNikki Jan 2014 #18
Yep. In the words of Aaron Rodgers,"It does 'things' to the ball..." ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #19
The biggest issue is the kicking. But the pack have been practicing all week in it. PeaceNikki Jan 2014 #22
I just hope the wind doesn't kick up. ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #23
lol, as homage to the Pack. I like it. PeaceNikki Jan 2014 #24
The last game I went to, I couldn't feel my cheeks for like 6 hours afterward. ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #26
Yeah, I've been to a couple really cold opening day Brewers games. PeaceNikki Jan 2014 #28
I loved the rowdy bleachers of County Stadium. ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #29
Miller Park is nice PeaceNikki Jan 2014 #32
Postpone the game until when? Jenoch Jan 2014 #14
*gasp* ... Blasphemy! You anger the football gods. 1000words Jan 2014 #15
Postpone until when? June? PeaceNikki Jan 2014 #17
Why ruin our fun? whistler162 Jan 2014 #20
You just know someone will be drunk and shirtless 1000words Jan 2014 #25
Yes, until it's -25 TheCowsCameHome Jan 2014 #21
Because adhering to common sense and safety concerns isn't macho. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #27
I'm pretty sure the thousands of women who will be attending aren't worried ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #33
The NFL's chief audience is men. Its chief concern is utilizing the macho image for profit. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #37
Ummmmm...no. ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #40
Is it somehow not possible for the town to rally around... Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #53
I give you this, you who likes to focus on the negative... ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #54
And your point is what, exactly? Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #59
My point is, I don't really care what you think. ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #60
Yes!!! Sissyk Jan 2014 #70
That you think my disdain for football means I'm a hermit is strange. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #73
Hehehehehehe. ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #74
The cheerleaders, dude! 1000words Jan 2014 #55
Yes, one must never forget the cheerleaders. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #62
Oh yes, Green Bay's cheerleaders... ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #65
So controversy is what you're after, huh? 1000words Jan 2014 #66
proper care can be taken Niceguy1 Jan 2014 #34
If people were concerned with safety, they wouldn't be playing full contact football. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #38
then don't watch it Niceguy1 Jan 2014 #42
I know, right? ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #43
I think the harsh Niceguy1 Jan 2014 #45
Me too! ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #49
nah, I'd keep it... Niceguy1 Jan 2014 #50
"And let people enjoy themselves." - No. Reality is often very difficult to stomach. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #51
Oy! yeoman6987 Jan 2014 #80
I'm happy about many things. Gravitycollapse Jan 2014 #87
Thank you for this subthread ProudToBeBlueInRhody Jan 2014 #71
That's all part of fighting for home field advantage. Packerowner740 Jan 2014 #30
I was at the Ice Bowl. Didn't have Sorels back then. postulater Jan 2014 #31
That's how I felt when NFC Championship game in 2008 vs Giants went into OT. PeaceNikki Jan 2014 #35
It's been a fun year. Tomorrow is a bonus. postulater Jan 2014 #48
I seem to recall a Super cold game the 49ers played in and won yuiyoshida Jan 2014 #39
I saw a football game on TV that was completely fogged in. lob1 Jan 2014 #41
Fog Bowl 1988 Eagles-Bears ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #46
That's it. Thanks, ScreemingMeemie. lob1 Jan 2014 #69
If Lombardi were still coach indie9197 Jan 2014 #44
Lombardi to Starr (Ice Bowl) "Run it and let's get the hell out of here..." ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #47
My 88 year old mother has the photo on the wall in her dining room. postulater Jan 2014 #63
As my dad says,"If Fuzzy's still not okay with it, I'm still not okay with it..." ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #67
The players will be fine. There are going to be fans who get injured trying this though. JVS Jan 2014 #52
Believe it or not, only one fan died at the Ice Bowl, an elderly person. ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #58
Because they have to be tough! babylonsister Jan 2014 #56
Have the Phil game on in lower volume in background and really thought I heard elfin Jan 2014 #72
As Phil Robertson would say. Lifelong One Jan 2014 #79
I would imagine that the women who will be there watching aren't girly men either then? ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #81
I'd take a trailer over the apartment I'm living in right now Lifelong One Jan 2014 #84
We're complaining because a bunch of overpaid athletes have to play in the cold? Vashta Nerada Jan 2014 #82
No. Most of us are super excited about the game tomorrow! ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #83
only time they get delayed is sabbat hunter Jan 2014 #85

ScreamingMeemie

(68,918 posts)
1. Because it's a sport meant to be played in all conditions.
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 09:51 PM
Jan 2014

It's bracing. They'll have heaters on the sidelines and the majority of fans know what they're getting into.

The news just likes to make a big story of it because it's fun... thinking back on the Ice Bowl, etc.

They could have played it earlier in the day, but them's the breaks. Any given Sunday and whatnot.

On edit: There have been a handful of games delayed/postponed due to Acts of God but it's not typical. Only in extremes like earthquakes, hurricanes, and tornadoes.

question everything

(47,470 posts)
4. No doubt, some fans will end with frost bites
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 09:57 PM
Jan 2014

on exposed skin. This, too, can later be told like stories from the battle field..

ScreamingMeemie

(68,918 posts)
7. They do... but they pack (no pun intended) us in there at Lambeau...
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 09:58 PM
Jan 2014

and it's not really that bad. Unless the wind kicks up. The wind can be really painful.

ScreamingMeemie

(68,918 posts)
36. My grandmother (a German from Milwaukee) ate beer soup every day for lunch...
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 10:44 PM
Jan 2014

...even when she was preggers.

GReedDiamond

(5,311 posts)
57. Beer Soup...you wouldn't happen to have the recipe?
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 11:10 PM
Jan 2014

...I didn't know that there was such a thing as beer soup!

I guess I should googler it.

question everything

(47,470 posts)
75. This is a logical thought when you are in a warm place now
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 11:51 PM
Jan 2014

You are, right?

But when you are surrounding by screaming fans, full of beer - hot or cold - logic often is left behind.

And, no doubt, at some point it becomes a badge of honor to show a frost bite.

 

Jenoch

(7,720 posts)
77. Naw, I'd be dressed for it and inside a
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 11:58 PM
Jan 2014

0° sleeping bag as well. Neoprene face mask, plenty of Thinsulate, and no beer. Watch out for a lot of orange in the stands tomorrow. There will be more orange than green and gold.

ProudToBeBlueInRhody

(16,399 posts)
2. Only thunderstorms and hurricanes or tornadoes
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 09:54 PM
Jan 2014

Snow and ice has never been considered an imminent threat to players or fans. Instead it is glorified as part of the game.

ScreamingMeemie

(68,918 posts)
3. A Vikings-Eagles game was postponed due to snow
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 09:56 PM
Jan 2014

and was the only Monday Night Football game played on a Tuesday.

ProudToBeBlueInRhody

(16,399 posts)
8. I didn't even remember that
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 10:01 PM
Jan 2014

And it was 3 years ago.

My guess is it was because Mayor Rendell had put a ban on movement in the city. The NFL probably would have played it if they had a choice.

Captain Stern

(2,201 posts)
5. If they postpone this game, the winner of it will have one less day to prepare for their next game.
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 09:57 PM
Jan 2014

The team that the winner of this game plays isn't playing this week.

brewens

(13,574 posts)
6. Two words. FROZEN TUNDRA! Packer fans would riot if they pulled something like that.
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 09:57 PM
Jan 2014

That's why it's critical to get the home field in the playoffs. I remember when the Rams got beat at Minnesota a couple times in the 70's. Playing in the cold was a huge advantage for the Vikings. The the one time the Rams had home field it rained for a week and there was mud up to your ass and they lost to them again! Gotta love old school football! LOL

 

Electric Monk

(13,869 posts)
11. Lambeau Field has a heating system buried beneath the turf to keep the field from freezing
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 10:03 PM
Jan 2014
but it failed during the Ice Bowl, leaving the field hard as cement. The system was upgraded in 1997 to include 30 miles of heating pipes, so players on Sunday can expect softer landings.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs/2013/story/_/id/10239011/green-bay-packers-philadelphia-eagles-take-steps-battle-cold-snow

a kennedy

(29,647 posts)
86. and the field will be "hard as cement" again.....
Sun Jan 5, 2014, 12:54 AM
Jan 2014

this is nuts......there is no such thing as a "softer landing". It's gonna be dark, the sun, what little there is of it will be long since settled....and the' Polar vortex' could send wind chills to 65 below zero in Midwest.



per: Ellipsis

It will kill some folks..... Just postpone the game. Ugh..... players, coaches, staff, and fans can not live through this sh*t. CALL OFF THE GAME. (and just let the Packers win)

LeftyMom

(49,212 posts)
10. Eh, you could make an arguement that the weather favors the Niners.
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 10:02 PM
Jan 2014

Their run-first, physical style would be less impacted by the snow than the Aaron Rodgers aerial bombardment that drives Green Bay.

And while Rodgers and Kap were both raised in Northern California, Kap went to UNR and spent his college career playing in the intermountain West while Rodgers played at Cal. And of course Kap's actually from Wisconsin and goes back to visit family all the time, so he's really no stranger to the weather.

Frank Gore, on the other hand, is a Florida native and looks like he's about to freeze (and lives in an ankle length stadium jacket he wears like a cape in between plays) if the temperature drops below 50. So if anybody's going to be impacted it's probably him and that's the thing to look out for.

ScreamingMeemie

(68,918 posts)
19. Yep. In the words of Aaron Rodgers,"It does 'things' to the ball..."
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 10:22 PM
Jan 2014

and it's about which team can adapt to those things and the weather.

PeaceNikki

(27,985 posts)
22. The biggest issue is the kicking. But the pack have been practicing all week in it.
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 10:23 PM
Jan 2014

That cold will fuck up a kick.

PeaceNikki

(27,985 posts)
24. lol, as homage to the Pack. I like it.
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 10:27 PM
Jan 2014

Stay warm!!!

The wind in there is a lot less of an issue since they put the new skyboxes in. Obviously, I cannot speak for the field, but it's crazy different in the stands.

ScreamingMeemie

(68,918 posts)
26. The last game I went to, I couldn't feel my cheeks for like 6 hours afterward.
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 10:31 PM
Jan 2014

It would be heaven not to feel that at a game.

The most bone-chilled I've ever felt at a game was a Tigers game in 2007. It was 18 degrees on opening day and we were sitting in right field. We got on camera because we were the only people there by the 7th inning. Michigan peeps didn't know how to dress for extreme cold.

PeaceNikki

(27,985 posts)
28. Yeah, I've been to a couple really cold opening day Brewers games.
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 10:33 PM
Jan 2014

Baseball games and fans are much more persnickety when it comes to weather so we have that retractable roof now but that's no help when you're tailgating.

ScreamingMeemie

(68,918 posts)
29. I loved the rowdy bleachers of County Stadium.
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 10:35 PM
Jan 2014

My dad has been to Miller Park. I have not. He says it's a lot like Minute Maid. They don't open the roof much here after April which is a bummer.

PeaceNikki

(27,985 posts)
32. Miller Park is nice
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 10:39 PM
Jan 2014

(except the high seats :puke They try to keep the roof open as much as possible there. We went to County Stadium a lot growing up when it was a cheap thing to do as a family. And we were in the bleachers most often. Good times.

 

Jenoch

(7,720 posts)
14. Postpone the game until when?
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 10:15 PM
Jan 2014

It is supposed to be -13° Monday afternoon and -15° Tuesday afternoon in Green Bay.

 

whistler162

(11,155 posts)
20. Why ruin our fun?
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 10:22 PM
Jan 2014

Don't you want to join us as we sit back and mock people who are sitting out in sub-zero weather?

ScreamingMeemie

(68,918 posts)
33. I'm pretty sure the thousands of women who will be attending aren't worried
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 10:41 PM
Jan 2014

about appearing "macho." I'd be there if the round trip flight hadn't been $1195.

Gravitycollapse

(8,155 posts)
37. The NFL's chief audience is men. Its chief concern is utilizing the macho image for profit.
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 10:48 PM
Jan 2014

Hence, the single largest utilization of human trafficking and prostitution in the United States is the Super Bowl. Want more evidence? Watch the Super Bowl ads (hell, watch any ads during NFL games). Need yet more evidence? Consider the level of violence displayed and the physical consequences on the player's bodies. It's macho, sexist, often homophobic, bullshit.

Women are an afterthought.

Gravitycollapse

(8,155 posts)
53. Is it somehow not possible for the town to rally around...
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 11:06 PM
Jan 2014

and inherently violent, sexist sport? I wasn't aware of such a logical contradiction.

ScreamingMeemie

(68,918 posts)
54. I give you this, you who likes to focus on the negative...
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 11:07 PM
Jan 2014

with a hearty and happy Go Pack, GO! As a stock owner, the team and the town that loves them give me great pride and happiness.

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2011/10/14/no-surprise-64-americans-watch-nfl-football-73-of-men-55-of-women/107308/



Gravitycollapse

(8,155 posts)
59. And your point is what, exactly?
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 11:12 PM
Jan 2014

That women can be socialized to participate in the spectacle of overt physical violence and misogyny? I already know this.

Popular full-contact football, from grade school up to professional leagues, has taken the idea of sport, of friendly competition, and morphed it into an outlet for unadulterated violence and greed. It is an absurd display of how devotion and dedication can be exploited for all the wrong reasons.

ScreamingMeemie

(68,918 posts)
60. My point is, I don't really care what you think.
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 11:14 PM
Jan 2014

It's amazing to me how beer snobs think home brews taste better than MGD.
It's amazing to me that people think Olive Garden is inexpensive crap when I tend not to eat there because of the prices.

My point is, be as purist as you wish, but football is a sport loved by people of all races, sexes, religions and backgrounds and there is no shame in that. I have yet to feel oppressed as a woman either watching or going to a game with my fellow female fans.

Sorry, but your argument is rather silly.

Sissyk

(12,665 posts)
70. Yes!!!
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 11:30 PM
Jan 2014

This. Some people apparantly sit in a room and let the world pass them by because everything is.....well, something!!!!

Don't get between me and my football. Hubby tried vacuuming once on Sunday during the early game. Didn't happen but once. Lol.

ScreamingMeemie

(68,918 posts)
74. Hehehehehehe.
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 11:44 PM
Jan 2014

My family sort of got MrG hooked on football. He was a big Packers fan and then (Michigan boy that he was) he started following the Lions. That almost got him disowned.

 

1000words

(7,051 posts)
55. The cheerleaders, dude!
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 11:08 PM
Jan 2014

Why, oh why have you excluded the cheerleaders?

You looked right past the most egregious display of oppression that defines this evil expression of male privilege and sexist debauchery.

Gravitycollapse

(8,155 posts)
62. Yes, one must never forget the cheerleaders.
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 11:16 PM
Jan 2014

Although, that the cheerleaders are on display like pieces of meat for men to consume isn't exactly a controversial claim.

 

1000words

(7,051 posts)
66. So controversy is what you're after, huh?
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 11:19 PM
Jan 2014

Last edited Sun Jan 5, 2014, 12:51 AM - Edit history (1)

My apologies, I see your posts as comedy.

Gravitycollapse

(8,155 posts)
38. If people were concerned with safety, they wouldn't be playing full contact football.
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 10:49 PM
Jan 2014

It's good for two things: Affirmation of the idealized male image and nervous system injuries.

Niceguy1

(2,467 posts)
45. I think the harsh
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 10:57 PM
Jan 2014

environment only makes the game that much better. Hope its the same for the Super Bowl

ScreamingMeemie

(68,918 posts)
49. Me too!
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 11:01 PM
Jan 2014

The Lions-Eagles game this year was my favorite to watch, with Calvin ending up with a helmet full of snow.

I guess I should turn in my girl card now.

Gravitycollapse

(8,155 posts)
51. "And let people enjoy themselves." - No. Reality is often very difficult to stomach.
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 11:04 PM
Jan 2014

Last edited Sat Jan 4, 2014, 11:44 PM - Edit history (1)

For instance, as I've said, Super Bowl attendees seem to have a penchant for sex slavery.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/03/super-bowl-sex-trafficking_n_2607871.html

postulater

(5,075 posts)
31. I was at the Ice Bowl. Didn't have Sorels back then.
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 10:39 PM
Jan 2014

By the end of the game I was so frozen I was just happy that the game was over. I couldn't tell what happened on the last play since I was sitting in the opposite endzone. My sister was so cold she fell down when she stood up.

My daughter is going tomorrow. She will be better prepared - hand and foot warmers, down coat, two blankets and good socks.

Go Pack!

PeaceNikki

(27,985 posts)
35. That's how I felt when NFC Championship game in 2008 vs Giants went into OT.
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 10:43 PM
Jan 2014

Then Favre's threw in interception and ended it quickly.

:/

I'll be there tomorrow, too!

yuiyoshida

(41,831 posts)
39. I seem to recall a Super cold game the 49ers played in and won
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 10:50 PM
Jan 2014

I forget where that was. It was back when Joe Montana was playing. He was used that kind of weather. Anyway... I don't have a dog in this race...

The Raiders will have to wait till next year to start down a victory road.

lob1

(3,820 posts)
41. I saw a football game on TV that was completely fogged in.
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 10:54 PM
Jan 2014

You couldn't see the field, much less the players on it. The announcers couldn't see anything and were stumbling around trying to think of things to talk about. I don't remember who was playing, but I think it's kinda famous. I've heard other people talking about it in the past.

postulater

(5,075 posts)
63. My 88 year old mother has the photo on the wall in her dining room.
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 11:17 PM
Jan 2014

Huge Packer fan, she doesn't like anyone around her while she is watching the game. she gets too nervous and doesn't like to be distracted.

Purged her basement Packer shrine of Brett Favre stuff and still hasn't forgiven him.

ScreamingMeemie

(68,918 posts)
67. As my dad says,"If Fuzzy's still not okay with it, I'm still not okay with it..."
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 11:20 PM
Jan 2014


I don't like too many people around me either, and my brother has actually asked people to leave his place at halftime. I made the mistake of letting people come over for Super Bowl 45 and spent the evening watching the game through the blinds from the back porch. I think I would love your mother.

JVS

(61,935 posts)
52. The players will be fine. There are going to be fans who get injured trying this though.
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 11:05 PM
Jan 2014

The players will most likely have an 80 degree fan blowing on them at the sideline.

ScreamingMeemie

(68,918 posts)
58. Believe it or not, only one fan died at the Ice Bowl, an elderly person.
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 11:11 PM
Jan 2014

That said, there are concourses galor, fans are tightly packed and tend to stay in their seats (at least they did the last time we were there). I think the fans will be fine too.

babylonsister

(171,056 posts)
56. Because they have to be tough!
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 11:09 PM
Jan 2014

Best game I ever saw in Green Bay was against the NY Giants, near a white-out from snow, and it was cold. Naturally, my team won, or surprisingly.

elfin

(6,262 posts)
72. Have the Phil game on in lower volume in background and really thought I heard
Sat Jan 4, 2014, 11:36 PM
Jan 2014

One of the commentators say something like "that game won't be played" in a soft spoken side comment when they were talking about the weather and Green Bay.

Don't know which one said it, but conversation quickly changed.

I can't believe it will be called, but wonder if some plans are being made behind the scenes if the weather is even much worse than expected.

 

Lifelong One

(23 posts)
79. As Phil Robertson would say.
Sun Jan 5, 2014, 12:03 AM
Jan 2014

Because football players are not girly men. Robertson once said, men who like to cook are girly men. I took offense to that because my girl doesn't cook and I either cook or we go out to eat. No offense all.

ScreamingMeemie

(68,918 posts)
81. I would imagine that the women who will be there watching aren't girly men either then?
Sun Jan 5, 2014, 12:08 AM
Jan 2014


I think we've met before, haven't we?

Perhaps you were my neighbor in the mobile home park?
 

Lifelong One

(23 posts)
84. I'd take a trailer over the apartment I'm living in right now
Sun Jan 5, 2014, 12:12 AM
Jan 2014

But I don't live in a trailer right now. I'd actually take a van down by the river if I could stay warm in the van.

 

Vashta Nerada

(3,922 posts)
82. We're complaining because a bunch of overpaid athletes have to play in the cold?
Sun Jan 5, 2014, 12:09 AM
Jan 2014

Oh boo hoo.

They're millionaires. They can deal with it.

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