"And you're telling me that guy's not gay?" - David Letterman on Vladimir Putin

[KeepItReal]

After showing a bunch of shirtless outdoor Putin pics

[RKP5637]

1. LOL! I've often thought the same seeing pics of him. n/t

[KeepItReal]

2. I just knew he hunted shirtless

But Putin also fishes and swims with dolphins shirtless

[Behind the Aegis]

3. I don't get it.

[KeepItReal]

4. Context was officials in Sochi, Russia saying anti-gay foolishness

like "there are no gays in Sochi".

Dave countered with lots of Putin propaganda pics of him shirtless doing outdoorsy things most dudes wear clothes doing (except for the swimming with dolphins stuff)

[Behind the Aegis]

5. I missed all of that, but it doesn't explain why Putin would be gay.

I would think the pics propaganda is just that, propaganda to make him look more "manly." I have seen many of the photos, they are far from being "gay looking" or even homoerotic.

[Jesus Malverde]

8. It's gay shaming.... There are some great pictures of him and meddy

[Luminous Animal]

13. Thank you.

[Jesus Malverde]

14. Sad habit we fall into sometimes.

[phleshdef]

21. The joke is "homophobic super macho guy is into stuff that sexualizes men".

[Behind the Aegis]

23. If that were the joke, then why imply he is gay?

[phleshdef]

25. I think I just explained it in the previous post.

Its like homophobic jocks slapping each other on the ass and having piss fights in the shower room. Its an irony thing. I can't really articulate it any better than that.

[Behind the Aegis]

29. So basically fighting homophobia with homophobia.

Never a good thing.

[Luminous Animal]

9. Nippleth! He mutht be gay! And being gay is totally hilariouth!

[Alamuti Lotus]

6. Calling somebody "gay" is what passes for a serious insult to some sections of this country

Since Pres. Putin is not serving American interests to some acceptable level, it's the "in thing" to make fun of him now. Calling him gay is doubly-ironic, given a few laws that Russian legislators have passed. It turns that Russians have always been the enemy, and it also turns out that they're a bunch of...*hush*hush*queers*hush* as well.

Actually, I don't get it either--and I'm kind of fine with that.

[Luminous Animal]

7. HEY STRAIGHT PEOPLE! TAKE RESPONSIBILITY OF YOUR OWN ASSHOLES.

Letterman's remark was depressingly homophobic. It might be time for Letterman to toddle off into the woods in his pajamas.

[Jesus Malverde]

10. Letterman is way overdue...nt

[KeepItReal]

11. Letterman clowning the homophobic head of Russia is bad?

Maybe Letterman joking and insinuating that Putin is overcompensating in his publicity shots is insensitive, but it is a thumb in the eye to the crap that is the official stances of officials in the Sochi, Russia.

[Luminous Animal]

12. What would Putin be overcompensating for?

[Egnever]

47. The idea they are persecuting gays while he is gay himself?

just guessing.

[Behind the Aegis]

15. If that were all it was, it wouldn't be bad.

However, it appears Letterman, along with numerous others, seems to think the best way to combat homophobia is by calling the other guy a "fag." Trust me, it doesn't help. The concept that homophobes are "secretly" gay themselves is really nothing more than a bullshit meme, which continues to this day. While there are certainly some homophobes who are "overcompensating", most homophobes are nothing more than bigoted assholes who hate gay people, especially gay men.

[KeepItReal]

17. I see your point.

Letterman's joke is neither constructive nor PC. But his whole dialog gave some pushback to what's going on in Sochi.

[Luminous Animal]

19. At the expense of gay people.

[UTUSN]

20. wanda sykes did the same joke with one of the same pics on the leno show

And with the same premise of skewering putin.s homophobia, not her or Dave equating bad with gay. The o.p. gave the context of Dave.s joke.

[MisterP]

16. wait, isn't that making fun of him for being old?

[Luminous Animal]

18. No. It is making fun of him for being irrelevant.

[phleshdef]

22. It wasn't fucking homophobic.

It was pointing out the ironies of a homophobe being all into imagery of sexualized males.

[Gravitycollapse]

26. That's only ironic if you only think of gay men as hypersexual.

Which is itself a homophobic idea.

[phleshdef]

27. No, because its not saying that gay men are hypersexual.

For one thing, as a man myself, I tend to think most men are hypersexual in general, straight, bi or gay, but that's another topic altogether. That's not the point.

The point is that Putin seems to have some fetish for sexualized imagery of men while oppressing people who are openly attracted to men.

[Gravitycollapse]

30. "No, because its not saying that gay men are hypersexual." - Well, actually you're wrong.

This is the long running joke in liberal circles. To call every homophobe a secret gay man. Which is in essence to attach homosexuality to dysfunction.

People overgeneralize what it means to be homoerotic. Being shirtless or, gasp, holding hands is not necessarily homoerotic. Especially not in cultures that have different standards for public expression of friendship.

Moreover, to express homoeroticism is not the same as being gay. In the same way that to express a cisgendered identity as a gay man doesn't mean you're straight.

But, really, if one sees a shirtless man as homoerotic, that's a personal problem that needs to be worked out, not made into an endless array of jokes that aren't the least bit funny. And such ignorance and stupidity is sourced from exactly the same pool of homophobia these jokes claim to refute.

[phleshdef]

34. Blah, too much sociological thought.

I'm all for that if we are talking about something serious. But comedy doesn't and shouldn't need to adhere to THAT much thought. Everyone with an ounce of common sense knows the message behind the joke is to rip on Putin for being a bigoted ass and nothing more and nothing less.

At some point, you are crossing the line between being sensitive to other people's sexuality vs just taking the world entirely too fucking serious.

[Gravitycollapse]

38. Ah, yes, the "lighten up" trope. Thanks for playing.

All this book learn'n sociology gobbledygook gets in the way of a really good one liner.

[phleshdef]

40. My point is, this is a nonissue.

And it gets in the way of serious LGBT rights issues, like Russia's draconic law, that Letterman is obviously against. But instead of spending this time talking about that, you and other folks are ripping into Letterman because you are overthinking a god damn joke.

[Gravitycollapse]

41. I'm multitalented. I can criticize both Putin and Letterman.

I expect only the same level of critical thinking from the rest of the adult population.

[phleshdef]

42. Right I get it, you can care about the important stuff and make a mountain out of a molehill.

Congratulations for having the personality of a set of a stereo instructions.

[Egnever]

49. Well that likely wont last but it was funny.

I will try to remember that one.

[Gravitycollapse]

52. This, gentlepersons, is called ad hominem.

Textbook, really.

[Luminous Animal]

48. ! Excellent response.

[Luminous Animal]

28. As if straight men don't show their nipples. Ooooh and if the do? They must be gay!

Snort! Nipple! Gay!

Grow up.

[Gravitycollapse]

31. Thank you. Apparently grade school sexual humor is now in vogue on the left.

[phleshdef]

32. Some of Putin's photos seem to indicate a guy who is really into the male physique.

Cmon, these are glamour photos meant to make him look sexy. In reality, of course there is nothing wrong with it if he is into the male physique. And it doesn't mean he is gay if he is. But in the world of sarcasm and comedy, there is nothing wrong with pointing that out and saying "hmmm" to a homophobic bigot. Its a brand of comedy that's existed probably since the advent of comedy. Comedy isn't meant to be totally mature. But the joke being made does not degrade gay people. It degrades Putin for being a bigoted dickhead who prances around shirtless in the forest like an action hero and has people take photos of it. Many gay comedians use this comedic tactic against homophobes as well. Are they all self hating gay bigots too?

[Gravitycollapse]

33. You realize gay people can be homophobic, right?

[phleshdef]

36. Of course. Larry Craig would be a good example.

But not the slew of gay comedians who I've heard make similar jokes.

[Luminous Animal]

35. "It degrades Putin for being a bigoted dickhead who prances around shirtless in the forest like"

a gay man?

[phleshdef]

39. You seem to be one wanting to insert that into my sentence, not me.

[Luminous Animal]

43. You are the one who is on the since he is homophobic he must be gay train.

So so sick and tired of that trope.

Racists are not secretly black. Homophobes are not secretly gay.

[Gravitycollapse]

44. It's a misapplication of theory.

I remember reading a very good argument by a 1960s black radical that the foundation of homophobia is the fear of being gay. Much in the same way that racism is the fear of being a racial minority. It is a fear of being an abject identity and I think there is something to that argument. However, too many people confuse such theory with the false claim that you are what you fear. Which is quite obviously false in the case of racists and less visually obvious in the case of homophobes.

[phleshdef]

45. I don't think he is secretly gay.

But I do think its funny that he is oppressing people for "spreading homosexual propaganda" and doing something that, by mainstream standards, comes off as an attempt to be a sex symbol.

If you can't get that, stop watching comedians. As I said to another poster, if we are talking about serious LGBT rights issues, then I have some very serious, thoughtful, passionate things to say. But in the case of humor like this, I don't overthink it like you apparently do.

[Luminous Animal]

46. Really. Men showing their nipples is a gay thing? Are you aware that women are attracted

to shirtless men?

[phleshdef]

50. Are you aware that gay men are as well?

It doesn't really matter if he is gay or not. The fact is, he is pushing his shitty idea of sexual purity on LGBT Russians while doing his best Fabio impression. Its funny in a "wow you are a ridiculous asshole Vlad" sort of way. Well at least it was, until the anti-fun patrol decided to overanalyze it and turn it into one of the most meaningless, unimportant debates I've seen today.

[Luminous Animal]

51. Ya know what? I am sick and tired of right wing homophobes of being accused of being

secretly gay. Hello. They are straight and they are bigots. And it is not funny to expect an already marginalized community to take responsibility for straight peoples bigotry.

[Gravitycollapse]

24. I'm going to file this under "not funny."

[Luminous Animal]

37. I concur.